Graham - Obama no Christian - didn't hear it from me

[Avatar4321]

Do you have to follow the teachings of Jesus Christ to be a Christian? Where did Graham get that idea?

Where does Obama fall short in that regard? Doesn't he love his enemies enough? That was one of Christ's teachings.

Doesn't he love the terrorists as much as all the good Conservative Christians do?

You think you can be a disciple of Christ and not follow Christ?

 

[Avatar4321]

Well, if 'following the teachings of Christ, is the criteria, then neither he nor very many Americans are christians. Because he doesn't follow the teachings of Christ, neither do most Americans.

There are, indeed, many people in this nation that have to repent of their sins and be born of the Spirit.

 

[Quantum Windbag]

You know how to read? When did you learn? You should try reading more. Barrack Sr was raised a Muslim. That, by the definition of some Muslims, makes him Muslim, even if he no longer practiced. That, again by the definition of some Muslims, makes Barrack Jr Muslim. You have a problem with that argue with the Muslims who believe it, not me.

Can you name a Muslim with scholarly credentials who believes that?

Are you denying that some Muslims believe it? Or that some muslims believe the world was created in 6 days.Or that some Muslims believe that djinns exist? Why should I find names of idiots with degrees when all I am pointing out is that Muslims have diverse beliefs that conflict with the OP's idiotic view of the world?

 

[Quantum Windbag]

Hey guys...

Is going to bars frequently part of the Christian experience?

Is eating pork a part of the Christian experience?

Is drinking a beer every day after a work a part of the Christian experience?

Is being obsessed with the politics of the day a part of the Christian experience?

Why/why not?

Just curious.

Is being a racist idiot a normal part of the atheist experience? My guess is no, bit I bet you think it is perfectly acceptable.

 

[MarcATL]

Hey guys...

Is going to bars frequently part of the Christian experience?

Is eating pork a part of the Christian experience?

Is drinking a beer every day after a work a part of the Christian experience?

Is being obsessed with the politics of the day a part of the Christian experience?

Why/why not?

Just curious.

Is being a racist idiot a normal part of the atheist experience? My guess is no, bit I bet you think it is perfectly acceptable.

I patiently await your answers deflector.

 

[Bosun]

When Michael Savage returned to the air on Wednesday, he mocked Obama's address about Easter and the Resurrection.

"He claims to be a practicing Christian," Savage joked about the president. "For a man with two Muslim fathers, he's doing a pretty good job of being a practicing Christian."

Comparing Obama to a criminal who "finds Jesus" in prison, Savage added, "You can't pee on our backs and call it rain..... YouTube - Michael Savage-Abuse of Power!-April 20, 2011 hour 1 all segments

I'm not defending Obama I think the whole christian thing is a political game, but I have a catholic mom and stepdad and a methodist dad, and I'm an unapologetic atheist.

I know most people just believe whatever their parents do and don't really think about it, but not everyone so you can't just assume it based on parents religion.

so, exactly what are you sayin it must have went over my head...

 

[Bosun]

I'm not defending Obama I think the whole christian thing is a political game, but I have a catholic mom and stepdad and a methodist dad, and I'm an unapologetic atheist.

I know most people just believe whatever their parents do and don't really think about it, but not everyone so you can't just assume it based on parents religion.

Funny thing, Islam believes that, if your father is a Muslim, you are automatically a Muslim. I am not saying they are right, but to dismiss their beliefs simply because you do not like them seems a touch arrogant and condescending.

Not to mention that it can actually get you killed.

I don't give a damn what the Q'uran says, if the son/daughter of muslims says he/she isn't a muslim then that person isn't a muslim.

mmm mmm mmmm a little senstive?

 

[Kalam]

Are you denying that some Muslims believe it?

I'm denying that it's a belief held by anyone who knows their religion. Islam describes a specific state of belief and is not something that can be inherited passively.

Or that some muslims believe the world was created in 6 days.

I doubt anyone interprets this literally; the word 'day' is used to describe various epochs that can be thousands of years in length. (32:5, 70:4, etc.)

Or that some Muslims believe that djinns exist?

All believing Muslims acknowledge that jinn exist, but there are differences in opinion over the precise nature of these entities.

Why should I find names of idiots with degrees when all I am pointing out is that Muslims have diverse beliefs that conflict with the OP's idiotic view of the world?

You don't have to. I just think that the claim is a bit disingenuous and that people are attempting to create an issue where there is none.

 

[Quantum Windbag]

I'm denying that it's a belief held by anyone who knows their religion. Islam describes a specific state of belief and is not something that can be inherited passively.

When did that happen?

The Prophet (PBUH) reported that Allah said, "I created my servants in the right religion but devils made them go astray". The Prophet (PBUH) also said, "Each child is born in a state of "Fitrah", then his parents make him a Jew, Christian or a Zoroastrian, the way an animal gives birth to a normal offspring. Have you noticed any that were born mutilated?" (Collected by Al-Bukhaaree and Muslim).

Can you site a source that proves Muhammad didn't understand this, and that what he actually meant was everyone is born an infidel?

I doubt anyone interprets this literally; the word 'day' is used to describe various epochs that can be thousands of years in length. (32:5, 70:4, etc.)

I doubt you believe what you just typed.

All believing Muslims acknowledge that jinn exist, but there are differences in opinion over the precise nature of these entities.

Acceptable, if wishy washy.

You don't have to. I just think that the claim is a bit disingenuous and that people are attempting to create an issue where there is none.

I am not creating an issue, just pointing out that one idiot's view does not control the world. If you were an honest person you would be correcting him instead of trying to prove I do not know what I am talking about.

 

[Bosun]

I really did not want to get started on this but it appears to me that Muhammad was a narcissist, my brother... He has developed an intricate system of “abrogation” or substitution of verses to justify his contradictory actions; one verse for another.

 

[Bosun]

I'm denying that it's a belief held by anyone who knows their religion. Islam describes a specific state of belief and is not something that can be inherited passively.

When did that happen?

The Prophet (PBUH) reported that Allah said, "I created my servants in the right religion but devils made them go astray". The Prophet (PBUH) also said, "Each child is born in a state of "Fitrah", then his parents make him a Jew, Christian or a Zoroastrian, the way an animal gives birth to a normal offspring. Have you noticed any that were born mutilated?" (Collected by Al-Bukhaaree and Muslim).

Can you site a source that proves Muhammad didn't understand this, and that what he actually meant was everyone is born an infidel?



I doubt you believe what you just typed.



Acceptable, if wishy washy.

You don't have to. I just think that the claim is a bit disingenuous and that people are attempting to create an issue where there is none.

I am not creating an issue, just pointing out that one idiot's view does not control the world. If you were an honest person you would be correcting him instead of trying to prove I do not know what I am talking about.

I really did not want to get started on this but it appears to me that Muhammad was a narcissist, my brother, Kalam... He has developed an intricate system of “abrogation” or substitution of verses to justify his contradictory actions; one verse for another.

 

[Bosun]

I'm denying that it's a belief held by anyone who knows their religion. Islam describes a specific state of belief and is not something that can be inherited passively.

When did that happen?

Can you site a source that proves Muhammad didn't understand this, and that what he actually meant was everyone is born an infidel?



I doubt you believe what you just typed.



Acceptable, if wishy washy.



I am not creating an issue, just pointing out that one idiot's view does not control the world. If you were an honest person you would be correcting him instead of trying to prove I do not know what I am talking about.

I really did not want to get started on this but it appears to me that Muhammad was a narcissist, my brother, Kalam... He has developed an intricate system of “abrogation” or substitution of verses to justify his contradictory actions; one verse for another.

Perhaps we might discuss if the true God of Abraham and the allah of Muhammad is the same god, or if He is Muhammad's interpretation of God based on his introduction to Christianity and Judaism during his travels as a young man..... To me Muhammad was trying to reinvent the wheel for the Arabian mind....

 

[Seawytch]

So the son of Bill Graham is bearing false witness...and he did it on Easter Sunday? It don't get any better than that!

 

[Dr.Drock]

Funny thing, Islam believes that, if your father is a Muslim, you are automatically a Muslim. I am not saying they are right, but to dismiss their beliefs simply because you do not like them seems a touch arrogant and condescending.

Not to mention that it can actually get you killed.

I don't give a damn what the Q'uran says, if the son/daughter of muslims says he/she isn't a muslim then that person isn't a muslim.

mmm mmm mmmm a little senstive?

You came to the conclusion that I was being sensitive because I said a cuss word? Okie dokie.

My point was you can't assume a kid is the same religion as his/her parents, that's what Quantum did in his post that I responded to.

 

[kwc57]

So this woman interviewer with a Middle Eastern background, Christine A - something was interviewing the son of Billy Graham. She asked him if Obama was a Christian.

Graham said, "Obama told me he goes to a Christian Church so that PROVES he's a Christian. But to me, you have to follow the teachings of Christ which Obama clearly doesn't, and that is the ONLY way you can be a Christian, not just go to a church".

Then Christine said, "So then, is Obama a Christian?"

Then Graham said, "Well, he says he is. It's not for me to question another person's faith".

And yet, wasn't that just what he was doing? Not only did he question it, it "clearly" sounded as if he was saying Obama is not a Christian.

rdean, do not use quotations when you are paraphrasing something someone said. That is dishonest. And don't be so lazy that you can't look up the transcript. Here is what Franklin Graham ACTUALLY said.

'This Week' Transcript: God and Government - ABC News

AMANPOUR: Does it bother you that people ///like Donald Trump for instance right now, are making another huge big deal about birth certificates and whether he's a Muslim or a Christian and where he was born?

GRAHAM: Well, the president, I know, has some issues to deal with here. He can solve this whole birth certificate issue pretty quickly. I don't -- I was born in a hospital in Ashville, North Carolina, and I know that my records are there. You can probably even go and find out what room my mother was in when I was born.

I don't know why he can't produce that. So, I'm not -- I don't know, but it's an issue that looks like he could answer pretty quickly.

As it relates to Muslim, there are many people that do wonder where he really stands on that. Now, he has told me that he is a Christian. But the debate comes, what is a Christian?

For him, going to church means he's a Christian. For me, the definition of a Christian is whether we have given our life to Christ and are following him in faith, and we have trusted him as our Lord and Savior.

That's the definition of a Christian, it's not as to what church you're a member of. A membership doesn't make you a Christian.

AMANPOUR: Do you believe him when he tells you he's a Christian?

GRAHAM: Well, when he says that, of course. I can't -- I'm not going to say, "Well, no, you're not." God is the only one who knows his heart.

You're right. I paraphrased. I thought I made that clear when I said, "So this woman interviewer with a Middle Eastern background, Christine A - something was interviewing the son of Billy Graham. She asked him if Obama was a Christian." If I had the transcript, I would have known her name.

Let's continue:

I said, "Graham said, "Obama told me he goes to a Christian Church so that PROVES he's a Christian. But to me, you have to follow the teachings of Christ which Obama clearly doesn't, and that is the ONLY way you can be a Christian, not just go to a church".

But the transcript said, "For him, going to church means he's a Christian. For me, the definition of a Christian is whether we have given our life to Christ and are following him in faith, and we have trusted him as our Lord and Savior. That's the definition of a Christian, it's not as to what church you're a member of. A membership doesn't make you a Christian.

Pretty close, wouldn't you say?

And finally, I said, "Then Christine said, "So then, is Obama a Christian?"

Then Graham said, "Well, he says he is. It's not for me to question another person's faith".

But the transcript said, "AMANPOUR: Do you believe him when he tells you he's a Christian?

GRAHAM: Well, when he says that, of course. I can't -- I'm not going to say, "Well, no, you're not." God is the only one who knows his heart.

And then I summed it up with: And yet, wasn't that just what he was doing? Not only did he question it, it "clearly" sounded as if he was saying Obama is not a Christian.

What part of, "doesn't make you a Christian" isn't an accusation?

I stand by my reporting. Now, unbunch those panties. They'll liable to go off.

Close only counts in hand grenades and horse shoes. If this were school, you'd get a low grade.

 

[bodecea]

Obama is one of those baby killing homo supporting athiest Harvard marxist christians that doesnt pray or go to church and believes that Jesus is NOT the only way to the Father and many religions get you to heaven even though Jesus Himself stated "I am the truth, the Life and no one gets to the Father but though Me"........


see?

 

[Dr.Drock]

I really did not want to get started on this but it appears to me that Muhammad was a narcissist, my brother... He has developed an intricate system of “abrogation” or substitution of verses to justify his contradictory actions; one verse for another.

What religious book has man ever written that wasn't full of contradictions?

 

[Lonestar_logic]

Again, why does anyone in a Politics message board, care what "Bill Graham's son" said about our POTUS?

Obviously you care enough to enage.

 

[California Girl]

Do you have to follow the teachings of Jesus Christ to be a Christian? Where did Graham get that idea?

Where does Obama fall short in that regard? Doesn't he love his enemies enough? That was one of Christ's teachings.

Doesn't he love the terrorists as much as all the good Conservative Christians do?

Obama's problem is he loves our enemies more than he loves his own country.

And by the way, Christ had more than a few choice words about hypocrites. So libs in general, and especially Obama, will have a lot to answer for....

He loves our enemies more than he loves his own country?

Funny, I think Republicans hate Obama more than they love the country.

The 'funny' is you claiming to think. You are no more a thinker than Obama is a Christian. Attending a Christian Church does not make one a Christian. Believing in Christ makes one a Christian.

In my opinion, Obama is a 'jacket Christian'. One who thinks he has to display a faith for political expedience so he throws his jacket on and goes to church.

 

[Avatar4321]

Obama's problem is he loves our enemies more than he loves his own country.

And by the way, Christ had more than a few choice words about hypocrites. So libs in general, and especially Obama, will have a lot to answer for....

He loves our enemies more than he loves his own country?

Funny, I think Republicans hate Obama more than they love the country.

The 'funny' is you claiming to think. You are no more a thinker than Obama is a Christian. Attending a Christian Church does not make one a Christian. Believing in Christ makes one a Christian.

In my opinion, Obama is a 'jacket Christian'. One who thinks he has to display a faith for political expedience so he throws his jacket on and goes to church.

He believes in Liberation theology. I'm honestly not even sure that's a legitimate branch of Christianity. But hey, the Lord is the one who judges men's souls. It be nice if more people who expressed faith in God actually did what He asks us to do or atleast tried to.