Gas went from 3.61 to 3.99 withing minutes.

[bigrebnc1775]

No, it's not. The value of the dollar, relative to the Euro, is the same today as it was in late 2008. The dollar's value as risen relative to the Euro over the past year. The dollar has risen a significant amount against the Pound as well (a pound will by 25% fewer dollars than it would buy in 2008).

Which is the lower number?
March 2008 1.55202 USD

March 2012 1.31581 USD
2012

Key word: "late". The value is from March 2008 is higher than March 2012. You know what number is even higher? The value from March 2002.

All of that is beside the point though. The dollar is as strong against the Euro as it was when Obama took office, and is stronger against the pound.

That's right the value of the dollar was higher in 2008 meaning the dollar has been devalued in 2012. Do you understand what devalue means?

 

[Polk]

The value of the dollar wasn't higher in 2008. It was higher against one currency at some point in 2008. The dollar has gained a lot of ground against other currencies (British pound, Mexican peso, Indian rupee, Russian ruble) since 2008.

 

[bigrebnc1775]

The value of the dollar wasn't higher in 2008. It was higher against one currency at some point in 2008. The dollar has gained a lot of ground against other currencies (British pound, Mexican peso, Indian rupee, Russian ruble) since 2008.

You said the Euro now you're moving the goal post. The dollar value was higher in 2008 than it is now.

No, it's not. The value of the dollar, relative to the Euro, is the same today as it was in late 2008. The dollar's value as risen relative to the Euro over the past year. The dollar has risen a significant amount against the Pound as well (a pound will by 25% fewer dollars than it would buy in 2008).

 

[gallantwarrior]

There does not have to be an emergency for the executive order to be implemented

The question is, who decides what constitutes a "national emergency"? If the 2012 elections fail to result in certain outcomes, will that constitute a "national emergency"? If gas prices continue to skyrocket, will that be the "national emergency" that justifies opening the NPR to the government raiders, thereby depleting a stock of fuel that is intended for REAL emergencies?

I noticed one thing thats a tell all about obama from that executive order.

(d) The Secretary of Commerce, in cooperation with the Secretary of Defense, the Secretary of Homeland Security, and other agencies, shall:

(2) perform industry analyses to assess capabilities of the industrial base to support the national defense, and develop policy recommendations to improve the international competitiveness of specific domestic industries and their abilities to meet national defense program needs.

What does the government have to offer in the sense of competitiveness? This is obama's nationalization of America's industry.

As usual, true intent is (very thinly) disguised as something "for the common good". Government has absolutely nothing to offer competitively. But this Order is not about competition, it IS about nationalizing private industry and assets.

 

[Decepticon]

The question is, who decides what constitutes a "national emergency"? If the 2012 elections fail to result in certain outcomes, will that constitute a "national emergency"? If gas prices continue to skyrocket, will that be the "national emergency" that justifies opening the NPR to the government raiders, thereby depleting a stock of fuel that is intended for REAL emergencies?

I noticed one thing thats a tell all about obama from that executive order.

(d) The Secretary of Commerce, in cooperation with the Secretary of Defense, the Secretary of Homeland Security, and other agencies, shall:

(2) perform industry analyses to assess capabilities of the industrial base to support the national defense, and develop policy recommendations to improve the international competitiveness of specific domestic industries and their abilities to meet national defense program needs.

What does the government have to offer in the sense of competitiveness? This is obama's nationalization of America's industry.

As usual, true intent is (very thinly) disguised as something "for the common good". Government has absolutely nothing to offer competitively. But this Order is not about competition, it IS about nationalizing private industry and assets.

Yes, because the private sector built the hoover dam, the interstate system, won WW2 and landed a man on the moon.

Oh...wait.


Explain to me why people with no faith in government, would want to RUN it well?
Answer: They don't.


You get the government you deserve. If you let George Bush appoint a frickin HORSE SHOW JUDGE as head of FEMA, then that's what you deserve, isn't it?
On the other hand, if you put someone into office who BELIEVES that government has a role to play in making Americans' lives better, then you'll probably come a lot closer to achieving that goal than someone who doesn't huh?

All you're doing when you run down our government is show that you are fundamentally unfit to govern. Why should anyone listen to anything you have to say?

 

[Vast LWC]

As usual, true intent is (very thinly) disguised as something "for the common good". Government has absolutely nothing to offer competitively. But this Order is not about competition, it IS about nationalizing private industry and assets.

OK.

So if you could kindly point out the passage that says that, it'd be much appreciated. Because what was quoted certainly does not.

I read the order, and I'm not seeing it, so feel free to point it out, so I won't miss it again.

 

[gallantwarrior]

Leave it to left-wingers to ignore possible implications.

Well, that's not quite true...

If this document had been drawn up under a Republican administration, there would be plenty of black-helicopter left-wing conspiracy theorists crawling out of the woodwork.

So, I guess I have to retract the portion of my statement that referred to right-wingers only.

Fair enough, the tables would be turned if a different party were in power, certainly. I'll keep saying this, they're all cats. Some have stripes, some have spots, but skin 'em out and they are still cats. We are currently held hostage to a political system that feeds itself and ignores the "people" it is supposed to represent.

 

[bigrebnc1775]

I noticed one thing thats a tell all about obama from that executive order.

(d) The Secretary of Commerce, in cooperation with the Secretary of Defense, the Secretary of Homeland Security, and other agencies, shall:

(2) perform industry analyses to assess capabilities of the industrial base to support the national defense, and develop policy recommendations to improve the international competitiveness of specific domestic industries and their abilities to meet national defense program needs.

What does the government have to offer in the sense of competitiveness? This is obama's nationalization of America's industry.

As usual, true intent is (very thinly) disguised as something "for the common good". Government has absolutely nothing to offer competitively. But this Order is not about competition, it IS about nationalizing private industry and assets.

Yes, because the private sector built the hoover dam, the interstate system, won WW2 and landed a man on the moon.

Oh...wait.


Explain to me why people with no faith in government, would want to RUN it well?
Answer: They don't.


You get the government you deserve. If you let George Bush appoint a frickin HORSE SHOW JUDGE as head of FEMA, then that's what you deserve, isn't it?
On the other hand, if you put someone into office who BELIEVES that government has a role to play in making Americans' lives better, then you'll probably come a lot closer to achieving that goal than someone who doesn't huh?

All you're doing when you run down our government is show that you are fundamentally unfit to govern. Why should anyone listen to anything you have to say?

Cheer that big government grab cheer it on.

 

[gallantwarrior]

Seizing control of production in a specific industry has been attempted before, and the courts dropped the hammer on it. Youngstown Sheet & Tube Co. v. Sawyer (1952), which requires a seizure either

1. come from an direct authority in Article II
2. directly authorized by an act of Congress

Exactly. Which is why this whole conspiracy surrounding said Executive Order thing is just horsehockey.

This order doesn't provide the President or his staff with any more constitutional authority than he already had, and as far as I can see, it doesn't really attempt to.

Since when has this president or any of his staff paid any attention to whether their acts are constitutional?

 

[Polk]

The value of the dollar wasn't higher in 2008. It was higher against one currency at some point in 2008. The dollar has gained a lot of ground against other currencies (British pound, Mexican peso, Indian rupee, Russian ruble) since 2008.

You said the Euro now you're moving the goal post. The dollar value was higher in 2008 than it is now.

No, it's not. The value of the dollar, relative to the Euro, is the same today as it was in late 2008. The dollar's value as risen relative to the Euro over the past year. The dollar has risen a significant amount against the Pound as well (a pound will by 25% fewer dollars than it would buy in 2008).

My original post mentions both the Euro and the pound.

 

[bigrebnc1775]

As usual, true intent is (very thinly) disguised as something "for the common good". Government has absolutely nothing to offer competitively. But this Order is not about competition, it IS about nationalizing private industry and assets.

OK.

So if you could kindly point out the passage that says that, it'd be much appreciated. Because what was quoted certainly does not.

I read the order, and I'm not seeing it, so feel free to point it out, so I won't miss it again.

From obamas executive order. When you see the words policy recommendations what exactly do you think that means? When someone is making policy are they not in control?

develop policy recommendations to improve the international competitiveness of specific domestic industries and their abilities to meet national defense program needs.

 

[Polk]

The key word is "recommendations". They don't have the power to enact the recommendations, unless already granted the authority by a statute or under the Constitution.

 

[bigrebnc1775]

The value of the dollar wasn't higher in 2008. It was higher against one currency at some point in 2008. The dollar has gained a lot of ground against other currencies (British pound, Mexican peso, Indian rupee, Russian ruble) since 2008.

You said the Euro now you're moving the goal post. The dollar value was higher in 2008 than it is now.

No, it's not. The value of the dollar, relative to the Euro, is the same today as it was in late 2008. The dollar's value as risen relative to the Euro over the past year. The dollar has risen a significant amount against the Pound as well (a pound will by 25% fewer dollars than it would buy in 2008).

My original post mentions both the Euro and the pound.

THE DOLLAR VS. THE POUND 2008
March
2.00147 USD

THE DOLLAR VS. THE POUND 2012
March
1.57836 USD
Monthly Exchange Rate Average (American Dollar, British Pound) 2012 - x-rates

 

[Polk]

So, the pound has fallen about 25% against the dollar. Didn't someone say that earlier in the thread...

 

[bigrebnc1775]

The key word is "recommendations". They don't have the power to enact the recommendations, unless already granted the authority by a statute or under the Constitution.

The recommendations are to be made to the president or did you miss that part? When someone is making policy aren't they in control?

 

[Polk]

The key word is "recommendations". They don't have the power to enact the recommendations, unless already granted the authority by a statute or under the Constitution.

The recommendations are to be made to the president or did you miss that part? When someone is making policy aren't they in control?

Read most closely. They aren't making policy. They are making policy recommendations. Just like if I recommend you order the fried oysters, it doesn't mean you ordered the fried oysters.

 

[bigrebnc1775]

So, the pound has fallen about 25% against the dollar. Didn't someone say that earlier in the thread...

Did the dollar also drop in it's value vs each currency?

 

[Polk]

So, the pound has fallen about 25% against the dollar. Didn't someone say that earlier in the thread...

Did the dollar also drop in it's value vs each currency?

Not every currency. It dropped in value against the yen and Canadian dollar. It increased in value against the ruble, rupee, and peso.

 

[bigrebnc1775]

The key word is "recommendations". They don't have the power to enact the recommendations, unless already granted the authority by a statute or under the Constitution.

The recommendations are to be made to the president or did you miss that part? When someone is making policy aren't they in control?

Read most closely. They aren't making policy. They are making policy recommendations. Just like if I recommend you order the fried oysters, it doesn't mean you ordered the fried oysters.

Read this very slowly and let it sink in.
They are making recommendations to the president. The president makes the policy.

 

[bigrebnc1775]

So, the pound has fallen about 25% against the dollar. Didn't someone say that earlier in the thread...

Did the dollar also drop in it's value vs each currency?

Not every currency. It dropped in value against the yen and Canadian dollar. It increased in value against the ruble, rupee, and peso.

Stop moving the goal post.