For those of you who think Obama has not helped create or save jobs...

[Rozman]

1) The Stimulus: created around 2 million jobs. According to Moody Analytics, it "significantly softened the recession."

What is Obama's actual record on creating jobs? | syracuse.com

2) According to this site that cites empirican research, it is likely the Recovery Act's benefits significantly outweighed the costs:

Did the stimulus work? A review of the nine best studies on the subject - The Washington Post

3) The results of Obama extending unemployment benefits under his stimulus plan reduced the fall of GDP by 18.3% and saved 1.6 million jobs

ETA News Release: US Labor Department study underscores positive impact of unemployment insurance [11/16/2010]

4) 114,407 teaching jobs have been created or saved

Education Jobs Fund - Official Website

5) The GM, Crysler bailout added about 45,000 and saved about 1 million:

http://www.whitehouse.gov/sites/default/files/rss_viewer/one_year_later_autos_report.pdf

(^^^The White House is citing the Bureau of Labor Statistics in this article)


I found other independent research showing "possible economic progress" under Obama's stimulus, but I know you cons would be quick to jump all over any information like that. For now, though, this should settle the argument that Obama "has done nothing." If you would all just stop watching Fox News (or MSNBC), you may just have an informed opinion about Obama.

I found other independent research showing "possible economic progress" under Obama's stimulus, but I know you cons would be quick to jump all over any information like that. For now, though, this should settle the argument that Obama "has done nothing." If you would all just stop watching Fox News (or MSNBC), you may just have an informed opinion about Obama.
__________________
Somewhere between Fox News and MSNBC lies the honest truth.

I don't put much stock in a report that says Obama's stimulus saved or created anywhere
from 1 job to 25 million jobs....and by the time the election gets here
the Libs will be saying he saved or created anywhere near 250 million jobs.

You are gonna have to try to narrow that field a bit more for me...

 

[Billy000]

My opinion is and has consistently been that the stimulus did accomplish something but that it could have accomplished significantly more if Obama had actually paid attention to making sure it was working right instead of taking his eye off the ball and inflicting the nation with the ACA year from hell.

If Obama actually cared about infrastructure for example, and put his time and political weight where his mouth was, instead of using old bridges as little more than photo ops, then the stimulus could have had more oomph.

But Obama didn't care about making sure the stimulus was working. In the back of his head in a tactical way I'm sure he hoped it would work. But he didn't put his energy and attention into it. He didn't act like he really meant it when he said he "got it" when he talked about knowing that people wanted him to pay attention to the economy and jobs. He didn't care about anything but putting his name in the history books with some version, no matter how weak, of something resembling universal healthcare. It didn't matter to him how many campaign promises he had to break to do that, how many lies he had to tell the American people to do it, how many shady deals he had to do it, or how badly the American people were recoiling from what he was doing.

All that mattered to Obama was this vanity legislation.



So trot out all the numbers you want about jobs. I'm glad we seem to be in a recovery however anemic. I hope it continues.

But Obama didn't make it happen. He did set some things in motion which could have earned him credit for a robust recovery. But then he stepped all over it and held it back from getting traction.

I don't understand where you are getting this idea that he didn't put enough energy into it. Just because it didn't do all that he said it would, it doesn't mean that he didn't care about improving the nation. To improve the nation also makes political sense. If Obama was planning to do his job for a total of 8 years, then he wouldn't have become lazy over something as important as the economy.

You are also dead wrong about Obama's committment to infrastructure:

http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/promises/obameter/subjects/infrastructure/

 

[Billy000]

1) The Stimulus: created around 2 million jobs. According to Moody Analytics, it "significantly softened the recession."

What is Obama's actual record on creating jobs? | syracuse.com

2) According to this site that cites empirican research, it is likely the Recovery Act's benefits significantly outweighed the costs:

Did the stimulus work? A review of the nine best studies on the subject - The Washington Post

3) The results of Obama extending unemployment benefits under his stimulus plan reduced the fall of GDP by 18.3% and saved 1.6 million jobs

ETA News Release: US Labor Department study underscores positive impact of unemployment insurance [11/16/2010]

4) 114,407 teaching jobs have been created or saved

Education Jobs Fund - Official Website

5) The GM, Crysler bailout added about 45,000 and saved about 1 million:

http://www.whitehouse.gov/sites/default/files/rss_viewer/one_year_later_autos_report.pdf

(^^^The White House is citing the Bureau of Labor Statistics in this article)


I found other independent research showing "possible economic progress" under Obama's stimulus, but I know you cons would be quick to jump all over any information like that. For now, though, this should settle the argument that Obama "has done nothing." If you would all just stop watching Fox News (or MSNBC), you may just have an informed opinion about Obama.

I found other independent research showing "possible economic progress" under Obama's stimulus, but I know you cons would be quick to jump all over any information like that. For now, though, this should settle the argument that Obama "has done nothing." If you would all just stop watching Fox News (or MSNBC), you may just have an informed opinion about Obama.
__________________
Somewhere between Fox News and MSNBC lies the honest truth.

I don't put much stock in a report that says Obama's stimulus saved or created anywhere
from 1 job to 25 million jobs....and by the time the election gets here
the Libs will be saying he saved or created anywhere near 250 million jobs.

You are gonna have to try to narrow that field a bit more for me...

Why would you not believe independent research? Why is it so hard to believe? You also got the numbers wrong. Obama created at least 2 million jobs and saved somewhere between 5 and 25 million.

 

[Oldstyle]

How about we approach it this way...

If back in early 2009 Obama said this in a state of the union address to congress....

" I would like congress to grant me permission to borrow one trillion dollars so I can enact a stimulus/recovery plan. It is our estimate that this stimulus will rewsult in an increase in unemployment to ablout 10% before dropping and stablizing at 9% by the end of three years. Our GDP will show very little growth over the three year period with the stimulus, but an increase is still an increase. Some of those receiving stimulus money will likely go under and I can assure you that at least one company will lose 550 million of the borrowed money with the taxpayer being pushed to the back of the line as it pertains to recouping some of that money. On the other side, however, we will be able to ensure that some states will be able to retain many of their employees...in essence allowing us to save many government jobs"

Do you think a democratic congress would have passed it?

If your answer is no....then the stimulus was a failure.

If your answer is yes, you are full of shit.

Or how about this:

Suppose back in 09 the President had said, "The stock market has fallen by 50%. The banking system is imploding. Banks are refusing to lend to each other, and may have to shut their doors altogether. Foreclosures are skyrocketing. Companies are going bankrupt - GM, Merril Lynch, Lehman Bros., AIG etc. Unemployment is soaring. Economists are saying if nothing is done the financial system may collapse altogether.

We can do nothing and hope for the best.

Or we can intervene, and by the end of 2011 the economy will have added 3 million jobs, stocks will have doubled, and the economy will be expanding."

That's what actually happened.

The idea that the economy and the banking system would have improved on their own, on the other hand, is wishful thinking.

Not to point out the inconvenient here, Sun...but wasn't it TARP that rescued the banks? It wasn't the Obama Stimulus.

 

[Oldstyle]

Yup. Show me where Obama made a promise to anyone that the unemployment rate would stay below 7% or 8% or any other number and I'll "shut the fuck up" and apologize.

Stimulus: White House tells critics not to judge yet - Jul. 6, 2009

Ok, I'm ready.

Obama warned upon taking office that if "dramatic action" were not taken, "the unemployment rate could reach double digits," with the recession lasting for years.

But PolitiFact could find no evidence of anyone in the administration making a public pledge that the stimulus would keep the unemployment rate below 8 percent.

PolitiFact Ohio | John Boehner says Obama promised the stimulus would keep unemployment below 8 percent

It's a popular talking point among Republicans, but no one in the Obama administration ever promised the unemployment rate would never go above 8% - or any other number.

That's an incorrect statement actually. Both Christina Romer and Jared Bernstein made the statement that if the Obama Administration was given the stimulus it was looking for that unemployment would not go above 8%. It was their contention that if we DIDN'T do the stimulus they were asking for that unemployment might very well go over 9%.

 

[Oldstyle]

1) The Stimulus: created around 2 million jobs. According to Moody Analytics, it "significantly softened the recession."

What is Obama's actual record on creating jobs? | syracuse.com

2) According to this site that cites empirican research, it is likely the Recovery Act's benefits significantly outweighed the costs:

Did the stimulus work? A review of the nine best studies on the subject - The Washington Post

3) The results of Obama extending unemployment benefits under his stimulus plan reduced the fall of GDP by 18.3% and saved 1.6 million jobs

ETA News Release: US Labor Department study underscores positive impact of unemployment insurance [11/16/2010]

4) 114,407 teaching jobs have been created or saved

Education Jobs Fund - Official Website

5) The GM, Crysler bailout added about 45,000 and saved about 1 million:

http://www.whitehouse.gov/sites/default/files/rss_viewer/one_year_later_autos_report.pdf

(^^^The White House is citing the Bureau of Labor Statistics in this article)


I found other independent research showing "possible economic progress" under Obama's stimulus, but I know you cons would be quick to jump all over any information like that. For now, though, this should settle the argument that Obama "has done nothing." If you would all just stop watching Fox News (or MSNBC), you may just have an informed opinion about Obama.

I found other independent research showing "possible economic progress" under Obama's stimulus, but I know you cons would be quick to jump all over any information like that. For now, though, this should settle the argument that Obama "has done nothing." If you would all just stop watching Fox News (or MSNBC), you may just have an informed opinion about Obama.
__________________
Somewhere between Fox News and MSNBC lies the honest truth.

I don't put much stock in a report that says Obama's stimulus saved or created anywhere
from 1 job to 25 million jobs....and by the time the election gets here
the Libs will be saying he saved or created anywhere near 250 million jobs.

You are gonna have to try to narrow that field a bit more for me...

Why would you not believe independent research? Why is it so hard to believe? You also got the numbers wrong. Obama created at least 2 million jobs and saved somewhere between 5 and 25 million.

You wonder why people laugh at the numbers you're throwing around Billy and then you make the statement that the number is "somewhere between 5 and 25 million"? It's patently obvious that anyone who's using estimates that are THAT inexact are just pulling things out of their ass. Nobody's buying the whole "saved" thing anymore. It was a joke when they first trotted it out and nothings changed since.

What the stimulus did was allow States to keep public sector workers from being laid off despite the fact that State revenues were way down. If you'll recall, Obama sold his stimulus by promising that 90% of the jobs created would be in the private sector which as we all know now was complete rubbish. Now the original stimulus money is gone and Obama is back asking for more because NOW the public sector is being forced to lay off workers like the private sector did two years ago. So, yes...Obama "saved" public sector jobs for a short period of time but because his stimulus didn't do Jack for the private sector we now don't have the revenue coming in from the private sector to PAY for the public sector jobs...hence the need for stimulus II.

 

[cheetah440]

Stimulus: White House tells critics not to judge yet - Jul. 6, 2009

Ok, I'm ready.

Obama warned upon taking office that if "dramatic action" were not taken, "the unemployment rate could reach double digits," with the recession lasting for years.

But PolitiFact could find no evidence of anyone in the administration making a public pledge that the stimulus would keep the unemployment rate below 8 percent.

PolitiFact Ohio | John Boehner says Obama promised the stimulus would keep unemployment below 8 percent

It's a popular talking point among Republicans, but no one in the Obama administration ever promised the unemployment rate would never go above 8% - or any other number.

That's an incorrect statement actually. Both Christina Romer and Jared Bernstein made the statement that if the Obama Administration was given the stimulus it was looking for that unemployment would not go above 8%. It was their contention that if we DIDN'T do the stimulus they were asking for that unemployment might very well go over 9%.

Even Barney Frank acknowledges the point. I mean, some of these Libs are simply incredulous with their revisionist history. Why do historical facts not matter to some people? I guess they just believe everyone is stupid, you repeat the lie enough and they will just go along with it.

""President Obama, whom I greatly admire ... when the economic recovery bill — we're supposed to call it the 'recovery bill,' not the 'stimulus' bill; that's what the focus groups tell us — he predicted or his aides predicted at the time that if it passed, unemployment would get under 8 percent," Frank said Tuesday evening during an appearance on the Fox Business Network. "That was a dumb thing to do."

Frank: Obama admin 'dumb' to predict no higher than 8% unemployment - The Hill's Blog Briefing Room

 

[Billy000]

I don't put much stock in a report that says Obama's stimulus saved or created anywhere
from 1 job to 25 million jobs....and by the time the election gets here
the Libs will be saying he saved or created anywhere near 250 million jobs.

You are gonna have to try to narrow that field a bit more for me...

Why would you not believe independent research? Why is it so hard to believe? You also got the numbers wrong. Obama created at least 2 million jobs and saved somewhere between 5 and 25 million.

You wonder why people laugh at the numbers you're throwing around Billy and then you make the statement that the number is "somewhere between 5 and 25 million"? It's patently obvious that anyone who's using estimates that are THAT inexact are just pulling things out of their ass. Nobody's buying the whole "saved" thing anymore. It was a joke when they first trotted it out and nothings changed since.

What the stimulus did was allow States to keep public sector workers from being laid off despite the fact that State revenues were way down. If you'll recall, Obama sold his stimulus by promising that 90% of the jobs created would be in the private sector which as we all know now was complete rubbish. Now the original stimulus money is gone and Obama is back asking for more because NOW the public sector is being forced to lay off workers like the private sector did two years ago. So, yes...Obama "saved" public sector jobs for a short period of time but because his stimulus didn't do Jack for the private sector we now don't have the revenue coming in from the private sector to PAY for the public sector jobs...hence the need for stimulus II.

They're pulling it out of their ass? Tell me, how would you have done the economic analysis differently? How would you have come to a more clear estimate? Are you suggesting these numbers are false estimates? Really? The CBO shouldn't be taken seriously, huh?

Your last paragraph obviously indicates you ignoring the data in my OP. Where are your sources that dispute my information?

 

[Oldstyle]

It's quite obvious that you don't come up with a new classification..."jobs saved or created"...unless the old one wasn't working for you. If your stimulus WORKED you'd be talking about the jobs that you "created"...it's only if it didn't work that you'd try to come up with a statistic that confused the issue so much that nobody would know for sure WHAT you'd done. Hence, "jobs saved or created". It's a classic case of "baffle them with bullshit"!

 

[Full-Auto]

1) The Stimulus: created around 2 million jobs. According to Moody Analytics, it "significantly softened the recession."

What is Obama's actual record on creating jobs? | syracuse.com

2) According to this site that cites empirican research, it is likely the Recovery Act's benefits significantly outweighed the costs:

Did the stimulus work? A review of the nine best studies on the subject - The Washington Post

3) The results of Obama extending unemployment benefits under his stimulus plan reduced the fall of GDP by 18.3% and saved 1.6 million jobs

ETA News Release: US Labor Department study underscores positive impact of unemployment insurance [11/16/2010]

4) 114,407 teaching jobs have been created or saved

Education Jobs Fund - Official Website

5) The GM, Crysler bailout added about 45,000 and saved about 1 million:

http://www.whitehouse.gov/sites/default/files/rss_viewer/one_year_later_autos_report.pdf

(^^^The White House is citing the Bureau of Labor Statistics in this article)


I found other independent research showing "possible economic progress" under Obama's stimulus, but I know you cons would be quick to jump all over any information like that. For now, though, this should settle the argument that Obama "has done nothing." If you would all just stop watching Fox News (or MSNBC), you may just have an informed opinion about Obama.

I found other independent research showing "possible economic progress" under Obama's stimulus, but I know you cons would be quick to jump all over any information like that. For now, though, this should settle the argument that Obama "has done nothing." If you would all just stop watching Fox News (or MSNBC), you may just have an informed opinion about Obama.
__________________
Somewhere between Fox News and MSNBC lies the honest truth.

I don't put much stock in a report that says Obama's stimulus saved or created anywhere
from 1 job to 25 million jobs....and by the time the election gets here
the Libs will be saying he saved or created anywhere near 250 million jobs.

You are gonna have to try to narrow that field a bit more for me...

Why would you not believe independent research? Why is it so hard to believe? You also got the numbers wrong. Obama created at least 2 million jobs and saved somewhere between 5 and 25 million.

It just doesnt show in the net numbers and we cant prove it.

Very impressive.

 

[Oldstyle]

What would I have done if the stimulus I said would keep unemployment below 8% didn't keep it below 9.5%? Why I guess I'd come up with "jobs saved" and hope nobody laughed at me.

 

[Billy000]

I don't put much stock in a report that says Obama's stimulus saved or created anywhere
from 1 job to 25 million jobs....and by the time the election gets here
the Libs will be saying he saved or created anywhere near 250 million jobs.

You are gonna have to try to narrow that field a bit more for me...

Why would you not believe independent research? Why is it so hard to believe? You also got the numbers wrong. Obama created at least 2 million jobs and saved somewhere between 5 and 25 million.

It just doesnt show in the net numbers and we cant prove it.

Very impressive.

Again, none of you have sources to counter my OP.

 

[Oddball]

1) The Stimulus: created around 2 million jobs. According to Moody Analytics, it "significantly softened the recession."

What is Obama's actual record on creating jobs? | syracuse.com

2) According to this site that cites empirican research, it is likely the Recovery Act's benefits significantly outweighed the costs:

Did the stimulus work? A review of the nine best studies on the subject - The Washington Post

3) The results of Obama extending unemployment benefits under his stimulus plan reduced the fall of GDP by 18.3% and saved 1.6 million jobs

ETA News Release: US Labor Department study underscores positive impact of unemployment insurance [11/16/2010]

4) 114,407 teaching jobs have been created or saved

Education Jobs Fund - Official Website

5) The GM, Crysler bailout added about 45,000 and saved about 1 million:

http://www.whitehouse.gov/sites/default/files/rss_viewer/one_year_later_autos_report.pdf

(^^^The White House is citing the Bureau of Labor Statistics in this article)


I found other independent research showing "possible economic progress" under Obama's stimulus, but I know you cons would be quick to jump all over any information like that. For now, though, this should settle the argument that Obama "has done nothing." If you would all just stop watching Fox News (or MSNBC), you may just have an informed opinion about Obama.

I found other independent research showing "possible economic progress" under Obama's stimulus, but I know you cons would be quick to jump all over any information like that. For now, though, this should settle the argument that Obama "has done nothing." If you would all just stop watching Fox News (or MSNBC), you may just have an informed opinion about Obama.
__________________
Somewhere between Fox News and MSNBC lies the honest truth.

I don't put much stock in a report that says Obama's stimulus saved or created anywhere
from 1 job to 25 million jobs....and by the time the election gets here
the Libs will be saying he saved or created anywhere near 250 million jobs.

You are gonna have to try to narrow that field a bit more for me...

Why would you not believe independent research? Why is it so hard to believe? You also got the numbers wrong. Obama created at least 2 million jobs and saved somewhere between 5 and 25 million.

It's known as "quantification", ya putz.....If you cannot put a more specific number on your claims better than "between 5-25 million", then you have a popcorn fart.

The bullshit "saved jobs" straw dog is also completely unfalsifiable.

Go sell your unicorns, fairies and elves to the Boiking butt sniffers over at DU.

 

[Oddball]

Why would you not believe independent research? Why is it so hard to believe? You also got the numbers wrong. Obama created at least 2 million jobs and saved somewhere between 5 and 25 million.

It just doesnt show in the net numbers and we cant prove it.

Very impressive.

Again, none of you have sources to counter my OP.

Basic logic refutes your OP.

 

[Full-Auto]

Why would you not believe independent research? Why is it so hard to believe? You also got the numbers wrong. Obama created at least 2 million jobs and saved somewhere between 5 and 25 million.

It just doesnt show in the net numbers and we cant prove it.

Very impressive.

Again, none of you have sources to counter my OP.

You are entitled to an opinion. Just not your own made up facts.

The point is you can not prove them. MAKING YOU A STALINGRAD.

 

[Oldstyle]

Why would you not believe independent research? Why is it so hard to believe? You also got the numbers wrong. Obama created at least 2 million jobs and saved somewhere between 5 and 25 million.

It just doesnt show in the net numbers and we cant prove it.

Very impressive.

Again, none of you have sources to counter my OP.

Give it up, Billy...nobody is buying the bullshit anymore. Unemployment is around 9%. The stimulus was a trillion dollar Keynesian "science project" by Larry Summers and Christina Romer that failed miserably out in the real world. Why do you think they both abandoned ship and went back to academia? Because the Obama Stimulus worked? Come on...show some common sense...

 

[Billy000]

It just doesnt show in the net numbers and we cant prove it.

Very impressive.

Again, none of you have sources to counter my OP.

You are entitled to an opinion. Just not your own made up facts.

The point is you can not prove them. MAKING YOU A STALINGRAD.

Well, they aren't my facts, are they?

 

[cheetah440]

Again, none of you have sources to counter my OP.

You are entitled to an opinion. Just not your own made up facts.

The point is you can not prove them. MAKING YOU A STALINGRAD.

Well, they aren't my facts, are they?

Why the hell would Barney Frank make that statement?

 

[Rozman]

I am going to use Lib logic the next time someone asks me for directions.
I will just say it's between 1 mile east of here or 100 miles....
I am going to answer my boss the next time he wants to know how long a job will take me.
I will answer between 1 hr and 100 hrs....

What an interesting way to do things..
That way no one can be pissed that it took too long.
Hey I said between 1 and 100...

 

[Listening]

The idea that the economy and the banking system would have improved on their own, on the other hand, is wishful thinking.

How would you know ?

They were not allowed to do it on their own.

And there is plenty of reason to believe we'd be better off if they had left it alone.