CDZ Does the Texas church shooting change the gun debate? 6 seconds to stop the attacker....

[candycorn]

Cheering that there were “only” two deaths changes the debate? How?

 

[Mac-7]

It is there for the world to see.....a shooter is stopped in 6 seconds by an armed citizen....lives are lost, but many more lives are saved...how many?

In Russia, a shooter with a 5 shot, pump action shotgun killed 20 people and injured 70 with the police station 300 meters away from the location.

In the Texas Church shooting, a shooter with a 5 shot, pump action shotgun killed two, but in the 6 seconds he revealed himself, he was dead, and stopped by an armed citizen.

Can you honestly say that this doesn't create doubt if you are an anti-gun supporter....?

When seconds count the cops are only minutes away

 

[2aguy]

Cheering that there were “only” two deaths changes the debate? How?

Because it is obvious that armed citizens, at the scene of an attack can shut the attack down and save lives....

Again...

Kerch, Russia shooting....same weapon, 5 shot, pump action shotgun....

20 killed 70 injured, the Russian police station 300 meters away.

Texas Church shooting, same weapon.....5 shot, pump action shotgun..

2 killed, stopped in six seconds by armed citizen.

Lives saved because the shooter was immediately engaged by someone with a gun.....without those people on the scene, it would have taken minimum 5 minutes for the police to arrive...with guns.......and likely a lot longer........

And more? The other armed citizens did not just start spraying gun fire around the room......they did not shoot at police when they arrived and did not get shot by police when they arrived...

Nothing the anti-gun extremists say about armed citizens happened.......they acted rationally and with control in the middle of the attack...

That is what is being celebrated....

 

[alang1216]

It is there for the world to see.....a shooter is stopped in 6 seconds by an armed citizen....lives are lost, but many more lives are saved...how many?

In Russia, a shooter with a 5 shot, pump action shotgun killed 20 people and injured 70 with the police station 300 meters away from the location.

In the Texas Church shooting, a shooter with a 5 shot, pump action shotgun killed two, but in the 6 seconds he revealed himself, he was dead, and stopped by an armed citizen.

Can you honestly say that this doesn't create doubt if you are an anti-gun supporter....?

I don't think of myself as anti-gun, more like anti-gun violence. If Texas churches want to allow guns that is their call. I think the debate should be over how this, seemingly deranged, person got possession of a firearm and what can be done to prevent future incidents.

I know what we can do! Make illegal guns illegal! That would have stopped him!

I often wonder why we haven't made murder illegal yet.......I mean...shouldn't we do that to stop people from killing each other?

So your point is that, since some people will break the law, we shouldn't have laws?

Why do you guys always use that fake talking point? What we have in this country is a political party, the democrat party, that does everything it can to let repeat gun offenders out of jail on bond, or no bond, and out of prison on short sentences....sentences they change to make as short as possible......then the repeat gun offender goes out, gets an illegal gun and shoots people......

Here is my solution to both regular gun criminals and mass pubic shooters....and they actually work....

I support a life sentence on any criminal who uses a gun for an actual gun crime..... and 30 years if a criminal is caught in possession of a gun, even if they are not using it at that moment for crime.

This will dry up gun crime over night. Criminals will stop using guns for robberies, rapes and murders.....and those who do will be gone forever......

Criminals will also stop walking around with guns in their pants......which is the leading cause of random gang shootings in our cities. if they are stopped by police, with a gun in their pants, they are gone for 30 years...they will stop carrying those guns, and random gang violence will end.

You implement this with two other things...

1) No More Bargaining Away the Gun Charge.........it must be against the law to bargain away a gun charge as part of a plea deal....this stops.

2) When a criminal is arrested for any crime, and booked in...they will be read the announcement that any use of a crime is a life sentence without parole, owning or carrying a gun as a felon is a 30 year sentence without parole....when they are released from custody...the same will be read to them again....when they meet their parole officer it will be read to them again.....the U.S. government will also buy and send out Public announcements on this policy on t.v. radio. and cable......

That is how you stop gun crime over night.

Mass shooters are different..... but with only 93 people killed in mass public shootings in 2018, they are not the major problem in gun crime.

The value in my plan......it actually targets the individuals actually using guns to commit crimes and murder people....

It does not require new background check laws, it does not require gun licensing, licensing gun owners, gun registration, new taxes, fees or regulations on guns...

By making gun crime a life sentence, criminals will stop using guns for crime and will stop carrying guns around for protection.....

Also....a nurse, with a legal gun, driving from Pennsylvania, to New Jersey, will not be considered a gun criminal.....that will end. Criminals with a record of crime, caught with a gun will get 30 years, no deals.....and criminals who use guns for actual crime...robbing the local store, rape, robbery, murder.....life without parole...

This, of course, eliminates the need for more gun control laws...we can already do this.....
Mass shooters

1) end gun free zones

2) get the media to stop covering mass shootings like it is the Oscars.....

3) We are already seeing this...get people who know these nuts to report these nuts....

4) Make sure the police who know these nuts arrest these nuts when they have the chance so they will pop on background checks....
What does each do to stop mass shooters....

1) keeps shooters from targeting people, since they target gun free zones.

2) The media not covering it like they are the criminal oscars deters copycats...just like they stopped covering teen suicides to stop the copycat effect

3) The only way to stop mass shooters, since they commit no other crime, is for family, coworkers and neighbors to report their violent behavior....the Odessa shooter should have felonies for the crimes he was committing but they didn't report his shooting his weapon from his front porch....

4) The Parkland shooter had 33 contacts with police and numerous contacts with police at his school.....due to Obama's "Promise Program" the police never arrested him for the felonies he committed....so he didn't pop on the background check..

I don't think I have any major issues with your plan. Has it ever been implemented anywhere in the US?

 

[Flash]

One of the Democrat Presidential candidates said that only police should have firearms. Another one of the yokels said that nobody should be allowed to have a carry weapon.

The success of the self protection at the church showed the stupidity of the Democrat's position on the right to keep and bear arms.

Yes it will be a game changer for the better.

 

[2aguy]

I don't think of myself as anti-gun, more like anti-gun violence. If Texas churches want to allow guns that is their call. I think the debate should be over how this, seemingly deranged, person got possession of a firearm and what can be done to prevent future incidents.

I know what we can do! Make illegal guns illegal! That would have stopped him!

I often wonder why we haven't made murder illegal yet.......I mean...shouldn't we do that to stop people from killing each other?

So your point is that, since some people will break the law, we shouldn't have laws?

Why do you guys always use that fake talking point? What we have in this country is a political party, the democrat party, that does everything it can to let repeat gun offenders out of jail on bond, or no bond, and out of prison on short sentences....sentences they change to make as short as possible......then the repeat gun offender goes out, gets an illegal gun and shoots people......

Here is my solution to both regular gun criminals and mass pubic shooters....and they actually work....

I support a life sentence on any criminal who uses a gun for an actual gun crime..... and 30 years if a criminal is caught in possession of a gun, even if they are not using it at that moment for crime.

This will dry up gun crime over night. Criminals will stop using guns for robberies, rapes and murders.....and those who do will be gone forever......

Criminals will also stop walking around with guns in their pants......which is the leading cause of random gang shootings in our cities. if they are stopped by police, with a gun in their pants, they are gone for 30 years...they will stop carrying those guns, and random gang violence will end.

You implement this with two other things...

1) No More Bargaining Away the Gun Charge.........it must be against the law to bargain away a gun charge as part of a plea deal....this stops.

2) When a criminal is arrested for any crime, and booked in...they will be read the announcement that any use of a crime is a life sentence without parole, owning or carrying a gun as a felon is a 30 year sentence without parole....when they are released from custody...the same will be read to them again....when they meet their parole officer it will be read to them again.....the U.S. government will also buy and send out Public announcements on this policy on t.v. radio. and cable......

That is how you stop gun crime over night.

Mass shooters are different..... but with only 93 people killed in mass public shootings in 2018, they are not the major problem in gun crime.

The value in my plan......it actually targets the individuals actually using guns to commit crimes and murder people....

It does not require new background check laws, it does not require gun licensing, licensing gun owners, gun registration, new taxes, fees or regulations on guns...

By making gun crime a life sentence, criminals will stop using guns for crime and will stop carrying guns around for protection.....

Also....a nurse, with a legal gun, driving from Pennsylvania, to New Jersey, will not be considered a gun criminal.....that will end. Criminals with a record of crime, caught with a gun will get 30 years, no deals.....and criminals who use guns for actual crime...robbing the local store, rape, robbery, murder.....life without parole...

This, of course, eliminates the need for more gun control laws...we can already do this.....
Mass shooters

1) end gun free zones

2) get the media to stop covering mass shootings like it is the Oscars.....

3) We are already seeing this...get people who know these nuts to report these nuts....

4) Make sure the police who know these nuts arrest these nuts when they have the chance so they will pop on background checks....
What does each do to stop mass shooters....

1) keeps shooters from targeting people, since they target gun free zones.

2) The media not covering it like they are the criminal oscars deters copycats...just like they stopped covering teen suicides to stop the copycat effect

3) The only way to stop mass shooters, since they commit no other crime, is for family, coworkers and neighbors to report their violent behavior....the Odessa shooter should have felonies for the crimes he was committing but they didn't report his shooting his weapon from his front porch....

4) The Parkland shooter had 33 contacts with police and numerous contacts with police at his school.....due to Obama's "Promise Program" the police never arrested him for the felonies he committed....so he didn't pop on the background check..

I don't think I have any major issues with your plan. Has it ever been implemented anywhere in the US?

Nope.

In fact, the democrat party does the exact opposite....which is why Chicago, Balitmore, St. Louis, New Orleans, D.C. and the other cities they completely control have such high gun murder and gun crime rates.........they all have revolving door policies for violent repeat gun offenders.

It has, however, been implemented in Japan...against their Yakuza...it is where I came to understand the solution to gun crime......locking up actual gun criminals. The Yakuza would use guns, grenades to conduct their wars against each other....now, they have long prison sentences for merely having a gun....and in Japan, their conviction rate is over 95%.....so if you are caught you are doing time.......so now, with long prison sentences, their criminals stopped using guns in all but the rarest of situations.....

 

[Flash]

Cheering that there were “only” two deaths changes the debate? How?

By knowing that had men in the congregation not been armed then there could have been dozens of deaths.

Any more questions?

 

[Flash]

[

So your point is that, since some people will break the law, we shouldn't have laws?

The point was that gun control laws don't stop criminals from having and using firearms, only taking away Constitutional Liberty away from American citizens.

 

[alang1216]

I know what we can do! Make illegal guns illegal! That would have stopped him!

I often wonder why we haven't made murder illegal yet.......I mean...shouldn't we do that to stop people from killing each other?

So your point is that, since some people will break the law, we shouldn't have laws?

Why do you guys always use that fake talking point? What we have in this country is a political party, the democrat party, that does everything it can to let repeat gun offenders out of jail on bond, or no bond, and out of prison on short sentences....sentences they change to make as short as possible......then the repeat gun offender goes out, gets an illegal gun and shoots people......

Here is my solution to both regular gun criminals and mass pubic shooters....and they actually work....

I support a life sentence on any criminal who uses a gun for an actual gun crime..... and 30 years if a criminal is caught in possession of a gun, even if they are not using it at that moment for crime.

This will dry up gun crime over night. Criminals will stop using guns for robberies, rapes and murders.....and those who do will be gone forever......

Criminals will also stop walking around with guns in their pants......which is the leading cause of random gang shootings in our cities. if they are stopped by police, with a gun in their pants, they are gone for 30 years...they will stop carrying those guns, and random gang violence will end.

You implement this with two other things...

1) No More Bargaining Away the Gun Charge.........it must be against the law to bargain away a gun charge as part of a plea deal....this stops.

2) When a criminal is arrested for any crime, and booked in...they will be read the announcement that any use of a crime is a life sentence without parole, owning or carrying a gun as a felon is a 30 year sentence without parole....when they are released from custody...the same will be read to them again....when they meet their parole officer it will be read to them again.....the U.S. government will also buy and send out Public announcements on this policy on t.v. radio. and cable......

That is how you stop gun crime over night.

Mass shooters are different..... but with only 93 people killed in mass public shootings in 2018, they are not the major problem in gun crime.

The value in my plan......it actually targets the individuals actually using guns to commit crimes and murder people....

It does not require new background check laws, it does not require gun licensing, licensing gun owners, gun registration, new taxes, fees or regulations on guns...

By making gun crime a life sentence, criminals will stop using guns for crime and will stop carrying guns around for protection.....

Also....a nurse, with a legal gun, driving from Pennsylvania, to New Jersey, will not be considered a gun criminal.....that will end. Criminals with a record of crime, caught with a gun will get 30 years, no deals.....and criminals who use guns for actual crime...robbing the local store, rape, robbery, murder.....life without parole...

This, of course, eliminates the need for more gun control laws...we can already do this.....
Mass shooters

1) end gun free zones

2) get the media to stop covering mass shootings like it is the Oscars.....

3) We are already seeing this...get people who know these nuts to report these nuts....

4) Make sure the police who know these nuts arrest these nuts when they have the chance so they will pop on background checks....
What does each do to stop mass shooters....

1) keeps shooters from targeting people, since they target gun free zones.

2) The media not covering it like they are the criminal oscars deters copycats...just like they stopped covering teen suicides to stop the copycat effect

3) The only way to stop mass shooters, since they commit no other crime, is for family, coworkers and neighbors to report their violent behavior....the Odessa shooter should have felonies for the crimes he was committing but they didn't report his shooting his weapon from his front porch....

4) The Parkland shooter had 33 contacts with police and numerous contacts with police at his school.....due to Obama's "Promise Program" the police never arrested him for the felonies he committed....so he didn't pop on the background check..

I don't think I have any major issues with your plan. Has it ever been implemented anywhere in the US?

Nope.

In fact, the democrat party does the exact opposite....which is why Chicago, Balitmore, St. Louis, New Orleans, D.C. and the other cities they completely control have such high gun murder and gun crime rates.........they all have revolving door policies for violent repeat gun offenders.

It has, however, been implemented in Japan...against their Yakuza...it is where I came to understand the solution to gun crime......locking up actual gun criminals. The Yakuza would use guns, grenades to conduct their wars against each other....now, they have long prison sentences for merely having a gun....and in Japan, their conviction rate is over 95%.....so if you are caught you are doing time.......so now, with long prison sentences, their criminals stopped using guns in all but the rarest of situations.....

I think you're only giving us a part of the Japanese solution:

If Japanese people want to own a gun, they must attend an all-day class, pass a written test, and achieve at least 95% accuracy during a shooting-range test. Then they have to pass a mental-health evaluation, which takes place at a hospital, and pass a background check, in which the government digs into their criminal record and interviews friends and family. They can only buy shotguns and air rifles — no handguns — and every three years they must retake the class and initial exam.​

 

[alang1216]

[

So your point is that, since some people will break the law, we shouldn't have laws?

The point was that gun control laws don't stop criminals from having and using firearms, only taking away Constitutional Liberty away from American citizens.

Sorry but I don't buy it. Other countries have gun control laws and have fewer gun deaths than the US.

 

[Flash]

[

So your point is that, since some people will break the law, we shouldn't have laws?

The point was that gun control laws don't stop criminals from having and using firearms, only taking away Constitutional Liberty away from American citizens.

Sorry but I don't buy it. Other countries have gun control laws and have fewer gun deaths than the US.

Other countries don't have millions of inner city ghetto assholes that commit most of the gun crimes in the US.

If we shipped our Negroes and Illegals over to any other country their gun crime would sky rocket.

 

[alang1216]

[

So your point is that, since some people will break the law, we shouldn't have laws?

The point was that gun control laws don't stop criminals from having and using firearms, only taking away Constitutional Liberty away from American citizens.

Sorry but I don't buy it. Other countries have gun control laws and have fewer gun deaths than the US.

Other countries don't have millions of inner city ghetto assholes that commit most of the gun crimes in the US.

If we shipped our Negroes and Illegals over to any other country their gun crime would sky rocket.

Short of shipping our 'Negroes and Illegals' over to another country, what's your solution? Give those 'Negroes and Illegals' more guns?

 

[Flash]

[

So your point is that, since some people will break the law, we shouldn't have laws?

The point was that gun control laws don't stop criminals from having and using firearms, only taking away Constitutional Liberty away from American citizens.

Sorry but I don't buy it. Other countries have gun control laws and have fewer gun deaths than the US.

Other countries don't have millions of inner city ghetto assholes that commit most of the gun crimes in the US.

If we shipped our Negroes and Illegals over to any other country their gun crime would sky rocket.

Short of shipping our 'Negroes and Illegals' over to another country, what's your solution? Give those 'Negroes and Illegals' more guns?

These Negroes that commit most of the gun crime in the US mostly live in Democrat controlled big city shitholes that already have strict gun control laws.

Gun control laws do nothing to curtail gun violence among the mostly Negro gang bangers, druggies, and thugs that commit the great majority of gun crimes in the US.

If we ship these thugs over to the UK or Australia or any place else in the world with strick gun control laws then their gun crime would sky rocket.

 

[alang1216]

Short of shipping our 'Negroes and Illegals' over to another country, what's your solution? Give those 'Negroes and Illegals' more guns?

These Negroes that commit most of the gun crime in the US mostly live in Democrat controlled big city shitholes that already have strict gun control laws.

Gun control laws do nothing to curtail gun violence among the mostly Negro gang bangers, druggies, and thugs that commit the great majority of gun crimes in the US.

If we ship these thugs over to the UK or Australia or any place else in the world with strick gun control laws then their gun crime would sky rocket.

I'll ask again, what's your solution?

 

[TNHarley]

[

So your point is that, since some people will break the law, we shouldn't have laws?

The point was that gun control laws don't stop criminals from having and using firearms, only taking away Constitutional Liberty away from American citizens.

Sorry but I don't buy it. Other countries have gun control laws and have fewer gun deaths than the US.

How many of our gun deaths are not suicides or done with illegal guns?
Not many.

 

[alang1216]

[

So your point is that, since some people will break the law, we shouldn't have laws?

The point was that gun control laws don't stop criminals from having and using firearms, only taking away Constitutional Liberty away from American citizens.

Sorry but I don't buy it. Other countries have gun control laws and have fewer gun deaths than the US.

How many of our gun deaths are not suicides or done with illegal guns?
Not many.

In 2017, six-in-ten gun-related deaths in the U.S. were suicides (23,854), while 37% were murders (14,542), according to the CDC. The remainder were unintentional (486), involved law enforcement (553) or had undetermined circumstances (338).

How many used 'illegal' guns? Don't know and don't care. Every victim is equally dead.

 

[Flash]

Short of shipping our 'Negroes and Illegals' over to another country, what's your solution? Give those 'Negroes and Illegals' more guns?

These Negroes that commit most of the gun crime in the US mostly live in Democrat controlled big city shitholes that already have strict gun control laws.

Gun control laws do nothing to curtail gun violence among the mostly Negro gang bangers, druggies, and thugs that commit the great majority of gun crimes in the US.

If we ship these thugs over to the UK or Australia or any place else in the world with strick gun control laws then their gun crime would sky rocket.

I'll ask again, what's your solution?

The Democrats need to get control of their Negro voting block. That is where 90% of the gun violence in the US takes place.

There should never be a crime to keep and bear arms. The crime should be doing something illegal with the arm.

 

[alang1216]

The Democrats need to get control of their Negro voting block.

Excellent idea. How do you suggest they do that?

 

[Flash]

The Democrats need to get control of their Negro voting block.

Excellent idea. How do you suggest they do that?

If the Democrats can get the Negroes to the voting booth to keep them in power then they should be able to figure out a way to keep the Negroes from shooting themselves.

 

[alang1216]

The Democrats need to get control of their Negro voting block.

Excellent idea. How do you suggest they do that?

If the Democrats can get the Negroes to the voting booth to keep them in power then they should be able to figure out a way to keep the Negroes from shooting themselves.

And I was so sure you were going to say whips and chains. At least that would have been something.