Does the Koran preach intolerance & hate?

Discussion in 'Religion and Ethics' started by Bigmo, Aug 28, 2010.

  1. Bigmo
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    Bigmo Member

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    What? Are you crazy?

    Koran gives complete and absolute freedom unparalleled in human literature!


    16:82 But if they turn away from you, your only duty is a clear delivery of the Message .

    6:107 Yet if God had so willed, they would not have ascribed Divinity to aught besides Him; hence, We have not made you their keeper, nor are you a guardian over them.

    4:79-80 Say:'Whatever good betides you is from God and whatever evil betides you is from your own self and that We have sent you to mankind only as a messenger and all sufficing is God as witness. Whoso obeys the Messenger, he indeed obeys God. And for those who turn away, We have not sent you as a keeper."

    11:28 He (Noah) said "O my people! think over it! If I act upon a clear direction from my Lord who has bestowed on me from Himself the Merciful talent of seeing the right way, a way which you cannot see for yourself, does it follow that we can force you to take the right path when you definitely decline to take it?�

    17:53-54 And tell my servants that they should speak in a most kindly manner. Verily, Satan is always ready to stir up discord between men; for verily; Satan is mans foe .... Hence, We have not sent you with power to determine their Faith.

    21:107-109 (O Prophet?) 'We have not sent you except to be a mercy to all mankind:" Declare, "Verily, what is revealed to me is this, your God is the only One God, so is it not up to you to bow down to Him?' But if they turn away then say, "I have delivered the Truth in a manner clear to one and all, and I know not whether the promised hour is near or far."

    22:67 To every people have We appointed ceremonial rites which they observe; therefore, let them not wrangle over this matter with you, but bid them to turn to your Lord. You indeed are rightly guided. But if they still dispute you in this matter, `God best knows what you do."

    24.54. Say: "Obey God, and obey the Messenger. but if ye turn away, he is only responsible for the duty placed on him and ye for that placed on you. If ye obey him, ye shall be on right guidance. The Messenger's duty is only to preach the clear (Message).

    88:21 22; And so, exhort them your task is only to exhort; you cannot compel them to believe.

    48:28 He it is Who has sent forth His Messenger with the Guidance and the Religion of Truth, to the end that tie make it prevail over every religion, and none can bear witness to the Truth as God does.

    36:16 17 (Three Messengers to their people) Said, "Our Sustainer knows that we have indeed been sent unto you, but we are not bound to more than clearly deliver the Message entrusted to us.'

    39:41 Assuredly, We have sent down the Book to you in right form for the good of man. Whoso guided himself by it does so to his own advantage, and whoso turns away from it does so at his own loss. You certainly are not their keeper.

    42:6 48 And whoso takes for patrons others besides God, over them does God keep a watch. Mark, you are not a keeper over them. But if they turn aside from you (do not get disheartened), for We have not sent you to be a keeper over them; your task is but to preach ....

    64:12 Obey God then and obey the Messenger, but if you turn away (no blame shall attach to our Messenger), for the duty of Our Messenger is just to deliver the message.

    67:25 26 And they ask, "When shall the promise be fulfilled if you speak the Truth?" Say, "The knowledge of it is verily with God alone, and verily I am but a plain warner."

    10.99-100. If it had been thy Lord's will, they would all have believed,- all who are on earth! wilt thou then compel mankind, against their will, to believe! No soul can believe, except by the will of God, and He will place doubt (or obscurity) on those who will not understand

    28.55-56 And when they hear vain talk, they turn away therefrom and say: "To us our deeds, and to you yours; peace be to you: we seek not the ignorant," It is true thou wilt not be able to guide whom thou lovest; but God guides those whom He will and He knows best those who receive guidance.

    109.1-6 Say : O ye that reject Faith,! I worship not that which ye worship, Nor will ye worship that which I worship, And I will not worship that which ye have been wont to worship, Nor will ye worship that which I worship, To you be your Way, and to me mine.

    2:256 There is no compulsion in religion, for the right way is clearly from the wrong way. Whoever therefore rejects the forces of evil and believes in God, he has taken hold of a support most unfailing, which shall never give way, for God is All Hearing and Knowing

    Complete and absolute freedom unparalleled in human literature

    Real Islam is only Koran. Koran is peace! :eusa_pray:
     
  2. Bigmo
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    Bigmo Member

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    With the collapse of Ja'far Al Sadiq's empire in Iran and Ibn Hanbal's slow demise in Saudi Arabia, the tide is turning and the fictitous sects that emerged during the Abbasid Empire knows as the Sunni and Shia sects and others who follow man made revelations known as hadiths are slowly collapsing. Malik's Empire in Sudan is collapsing and Abu Hanifa's Empire in Pakistan is turning upside down. The so called Islamic states have proven to be ideologically obsolete and in the wrong side of history. The sects are on life support and the Koranist will take over. So who are the Koranist?

    The Koranist believe only the Koran should speak for Islam.

    WHAT IS DIFFERENCE BETWEEN ISLAM AND TODAY'S PRACTICES?


    In comparing the teachings of Islam as derived from the Book of God to the practices taught and enforced by the popular Sunni and Shia faiths (1.2 Bn followers), we find that the list is quite extensive, with some of the highlights as follows:

    In Islam, the requirement to be a Muslim is to simply accept and live according to the �Straight Path� (6:151-153), Vs. the Sunni or Shia 5-pillars which come from unauthorized books�

    In Islam, abolishing Slavery is taught to be an act of righteousness (90:12-13), Vs. Sunni and Shia teachings which encourages slavery under war�

    In Islam, women are never forbidden from praying or fasting during Menstruation (2:222), nor is there a specific dress code (i.e. the Headscarf) imposed on them beyond modesty, Vs. the Sunni and Shia which teach the undermining of women and forcing them to cover their hair and avoid praying or fasting at certain times...

    In Islam, a man or women may leave a Will, after settlement of debt (4:12), Vs. Sunnis who refuse to accept wills if there are any direct descendants...

    In Islam, Monogamy is the basis for normal relationships, while polygamy is only allowed in cases involving marrying the mothers of orphans under the man�s guardianship (4:3), Vs. Sunnis where a man may be a polygamist simply if he can afford to, and Shia which allow sex for pleasure (Mut�a)...

    In Islam, Divorce is enforceable only after a two-phase period, and it may be made nullified if the couple reconcile before the end of this period (65:1, 65:4), Vs. Sunni teachings that destroy families by allowing a divorce to occur on the spot with no waiting period and no nullification...

    In Islam, Thieves do not have their hands cut-off, but are made to work until they return that which is stolen (12:76), Vs. Sunni and Shia teachings which brutally amputate the hands causing disability...

    In Islam, no one is allowed to be killed or Stoned for adultery (24:2), Vs. Sunni and Shia laws of stoning married adulterers to death...

    In Islam, absolute Freedom of Faith is allowed (2:256, 10:99; 18:29; 88:21-22), Vs. Sunni and Shia requiring apostates to be killed and rejecting the practice of other faiths...

    In Islam, people are acknowledged as being diverse and each is to be respected for his/her level of spiritual growth. A Submitter �Muslim� must work to attain the status of Faithful �Mumin� (49:14), Vs. Sunni and Shia teachings that all followers of their religion must think, act, and even look the same (cult syndrome)...

    In Islam, War can only be declared in cases of self-defence - no offensives (2:190), Vs. Sunni and Shia teachings allowing raids and attacks on any people who are considered non-Muslim by their standards...

    In Islam, Pilgrimage is a centre for gathering of nations and for all to witness the benefits of being together (22:27-28), Vs. Sunni and Shia bringing in polytheistic rituals and superstition (touching of black stone, circling 7 times, etc..)...

    In Islam, a Year is a luni-solar count made of 365-days (17:12, 9:36), with all the seasons fitting-in-place Vs. Sunnis teaching it to be a lunar one based on 354 days which creates confusion of seasons and time�

    In Islam, males and females are not required to be Circumcised (32:7), Vs. Sunni and Shia teachings requiring all males to be circumcised and females in some cases...

    In Islam, music, statues, gold and silk are all Lawful(7:32-33, 16:116), Vs. Sunni beliefs forbidding silk & gold for men, and forbidding music & statues for all...

    In Islam, rule of Government is under the constitution of the Qur'an through consultation and free-speech (5:48, 42:38). Vs. Sunni teachings which allow the rise of dictators or monarchs, and Shia teachings which uphold self-appointed religious leaders based on genealogy.



    This is the Koranic Islam versus Sunni/Shia Sectarianism. These sects emerged during the Abbasid Empire about two centuries after Muhammad. They follow the Oral traditions known as hadiths. These traditions have the same place in these sects teachings as the Talmud has on Judaism. The Koran confirmed the Torah and attacked the Talmud, and Jesus in the Gospel confirmed the Torah and attacked the Talmud.

    Real Islam is only Koran. Koran is peace!
     
  3. Quantum Windbag
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    Quantum Windbag Gold Member

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    The problem with the Quran is that it is so disjointed and contradictory that anyone can pull any message they want out of it. In comparison, the Bible reads like a technical manual.
     
  4. Bigmo
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    Bigmo Member

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    The Koran confirms the Gospel but attacks the Trinity. The Trinity was introduced three centuries after Jesus. It has no basis in the Gospel and contradicts it.

    You will not find anything in the Koran to contradict what I stated. The Sects believe these verses about freedom were ABROGATED by verse 9-29. But to show that they had to rely on sources OUTSIDE the Koran. Sources that secular historians deemed unreliable and too sectarian to trust. After all Sunnis have conflicting oral traditions than Shias do with each accusing the other of lies and fabrication. Yet they have the same Koran.

    But in recent years, probably after 9-11, these oral sources found new audience in the West. Probably because its easier to attack Islam from them than the Koran.
     
  5. eots
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    eots no fly list

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    Righhht...a technical manual of hate and preversion

    [ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=REJ0Qc10iV0&feature=related]YouTube - An Atheist Reads the Bible - 3 - Jephthah[/ame]



    [ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=00B3IqCvZdE[/ame]


    [ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pENyKqrswYM&feature=related]YouTube - An Atheist Reads the Bible - 11 - Marriage[/ame]
     
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  6. Kalam
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    Kalam Senior Member

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    You've read it, then?
     
  7. Quantum Windbag
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    Quantum Windbag Gold Member

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    Wanna bet I cannot contradict it?

    Slay them wherever ye find them and drive them out of the places whence they drove you out, for persecution is worse than slaughter. - 2:191

    Fight against them until idolatry is no more and Allah's religion reigns supreme. (different translation: ) Fight them until there is no persecution and the religion is God's entirely. - Sura 2:193 and 8:39

    Fighting is obligatory for you, much as you dislike it. - 2:216

    Another person that thinks they know what I think, I love it. Where did I say anything about the Trinity? What I said was that, compared to the Quran, the Bible is well plotted and contains only minor errors. Anyone that has ever had to deal with a tech manual knows that they are almost always full of errors, and make statements that contradict reality, not to mention itself.

    Regardless, the Quran is worse.
     
  8. Quantum Windbag
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    Quantum Windbag Gold Member

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    Amazing how many people think they can read minds. I wonder why no one gets it right.
     
  9. Quantum Windbag
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    Quantum Windbag Gold Member

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    Yes, in more than one translation. I prefer Pickthal's because of the way it handles the alliteration.
     
  10. Kalam
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    Kalam Senior Member

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    Pickthall's is good. Maulana Muhammad Ali's is the best because of its index and helpful footnotes. Arberry's is also quite good. The Saudi one and a few others are complete rubbish. I assume that you failed to see the consistency of its message because you aren't familiar with how it was revealed and applied. The Qur'an can be understood by itself well enough if you have some knowledge of Arabic, but it is most easily understood in the context provided by ahadith and certain other historical accounts. You're welcome to choose not to follow it if you don't want to, but to dismiss it as objectively "disjointed and contradictory" based on your limited familiarity with it is irrational. I've read the Bible in multiple translations and found it to be convoluted and lacking of any consistent message or theme. It's a matter of personal opinion, not fact.
     

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