Does America Need Be Saved From Theocracy?

[Mac1958]

I would guess that less than 20% of USMB Trumpsters are sincere, practicing Christians.

Most are just talk radio pseudo-libertarians who bark about Christianity because they figure they have to 'n stuff.

Ask them directly if they're Christians and they start dancing.

Look at their posts. They hold themselves to no standards whatsoever regarding the treatment of their fellow man. They just hate and attack.
.

 

[PoliticalChic]

So, there are no politicians trying to legislate their religious beliefs?

Example. The right wants the ability for businesses to discriminate based on their religious beliefs. They want it to be OK for a Pharmacist to refuse to fill a prescription if that prescription is against his "religion".

/——-/ So? You’re OK with a muslime deli refusing to sell pork and alcohol? And a muslime pharmacist can refuse to fill an abortion pill. Another pharmacist in the store can do it. Where is you’d fake outrage over that?

Good point.

And, for clarity....I'm fine with both of your examples.

And....Asians love their pork!

 

[PoliticalChic]

So, there are no politicians trying to legislate their religious beliefs?

Example. The right wants the ability for businesses to discriminate based on their religious beliefs. They want it to be OK for a Pharmacist to refuse to fill a prescription if that prescription is against his "religion".

/——-/ So? You’re OK with a muslime deli refusing to sell pork and alcohol? And a muslime pharmacist can refuse to fill an abortion pill. Another pharmacist in the store can do it. Where is you’d fake outrage over that?

If a Muslim store does not sell pork, it doesn't sell it to everyone.
Every pharmacist should fill any legal prescription as long as there is no medical issues with other drugs.

/——-/ 13 Gay Bakeries Refuse to Make Traditional Marriage Cake With the Message: 'Gay Marriage Is Wrong'

What a great example!!!



And I'm fine with their view too.


Coulter:


1. If liberals could trust the voters, they wouldn’t need the Court to invent ludicrous ‘constitutional rights’ for them in the first place.

2. The only limit on liberal insanity in this country is how many issues liberals can get before a court…A lot is at stake for liberals with the court. If they lose a liberal vote, they will be forced t fight political battles through a messy little system know as ‘democracy.’

3. When conservative judges strike down laws, it’s because of what’s in the Constitution. When liberal judges strike down laws (or impose new laws, such as tax increases), it’s because of what’s in the New York Times.

 

[PoliticalChic]

I would guess that less than 20% of USMB Trumpsters are sincere, practicing Christians.

Most are just talk radio pseudo-libertarians who bark about Christianity because they figure they have to 'n stuff.

Ask them directly if they're Christians and they start dancing.

Look at their posts. They hold themselves to no standards whatsoever regarding the treatment of their fellow man. They just hate and attack.
.

Why is it your business what someone else's religion is?

 

[LuckyDuck]

1.I have actually had to endure posts from government school grads along this line of what passes for thinking:
“You religious Bible-thumpers want to ram your superstition down our throats…..this is not a theocracy!!!”

Wow.



There are ‘religion’ groups that do demand control of the society…but the Judeo-Christian view on which this nation was founded is not one. But this nation was created with Judeo-Christian principles in mind:

“Our Constitution was made only for a moral and religious people. It is wholly inadequate to the government of any other.” John Adams



2. Now about that ‘ramming down disproving throats’ fable.

“Although Christianity in its many varieties was the religion of the original colonies, Christianity does not preach operational dominance over the body politic in America. Tocqueville compared this aspect to Islam: “Mohammed professed to derive from Heaven, and has inserted in the Koran, not only religious doctrines, but political maxims, civil and criminal laws, and theories of science. The Gospel, on the contrary, speaks only of the general relations of men to God and to each other, beyond which it inculcates and imposes no point of faith. This alone, besides a thousand other reasons, would suffice to prove that the former of these religions will never long predominate in a cultivated and democratic age, while the latter is destined to retain its sway at these as at all other periods.” Tocqueville, “Democracy in America,” vol.2, p. 23.



3. Assume arguendo that there is as much reason to have a religious citizenry as there is to have an non-religious one. The solution is that you don’t have to believe, ....but it is in your interest to have others believe.

The most succinct argument in favor of a religious citizenry comes from a famous atheist, Voltaire: "I don't believe in God, but I hope my valet does so he won't steal my spoons."
How Voltaire's Atheism Overthrew Deism

And, Voltaire also famously said "Si Dieu n'existait pas, il faudrait l'inventer." Mais toute la nature nous crie qu'il existe; qu'il y a une intelligence suprême, un pouvoir immense, un ordre admirable, et tout nous instruit de notre dépendance. "If God did not exist, he would have to be invented."

For the same reason as above....it is society's interest to have more religious folks, than non-religious


BTW…when about to die, Voltaire recanted: “He at once sent for the priest, and wanted to be ‘reconciled with the church.’ The Tragic Death of Voltaire the Atheist | Paw Creek Ministries





Atheism can’t sustain a rights-based, virtue-based system as a God-less ideology. Rousseau, Hegel and Marx took the opposite view, and the result was multiple millions slaughtered.


4. The less educated also claim that the Constitution somehow inveighs against religion and mandates it be separated from government. Another falsity.
The first amendment, formulated by a learned and religious group, simply made certain that no government of America mandated a particular belief. Or, have none at all.




Sooooo......where is the 'threat' of a theocracy?????

Judaism, Christianity and Islam are all lumped into what is referred to as the "Abrahamic Religions." In comparison with competing religions, they at present, the worst of the lot, with Islam ahead of the other two in barbarity. Religion in general, is a powerful influence on peoples behavior and can get people to do unspeakable things to their fellow human-beings, just because they don't believe the same way. Throughout religion's history, it has led humans into many, many wars...in the name of "God" or "Allah."
In Christianity, thousands were tortured, to get them to convert and murdered if they would not. As for our initial colonies, pilgrims fled Europe because of religious persecution, only to persecute their fellow citizens (stockades, et cetera) if they hadn't memorized the 10 Commandments and other parts of the bible. Women were murdered for being so-called "witches," because the bible said such things existed. Only after people had been drowned, crushed or, hung, did some common sense individuals in the government step in and stop the killings. Reason? It was better that we don't execute someone without actual proof, as we might be hanging an innocent person.....not that fanciful things such as true witches (not Wiccans) never existed.
It doesn't take much to drag people back into the mire of primitive, hardcore beliefs that are spelled out in those idiotic so-called "holy books." which, by the way, were written LOOONNNNG before the superstitious dark ages and thus should be taken with a grain of salt. As for whether a God is real or is a creation of man. I feel that such a being was indeed, created by man. Men had domination over women and could write. Because of ego; us being the leading form of life on the planet, that meant that their creation had to look just like us. The creation can see-all, know-all, control-all, creates all life and the universe. It also harbors the same emotions as humans, despite it being the perfect being. Knowing all and what will happen, it couldn't know that in creating humans, they wouldn't listen to it, even at the very beginning....yet it knows all.
If as Abrahamic religions say, there will be an Armageddon, it would have known that all along, thus every human is programmed to behave in a certain way, vote in a certain way and take sides in a conflict as it chooses.
Anyway, just because religion isn't running the government at this time, doesn't mean it isn't trying to influence the government and wanting to run the country. The separation of church and state is a good thing. And, for those who have "strict" religious beliefs, they should think twice about starting or entering into any business that serves the general public, as some who enter their business, may have very different beliefs.

 

[PoliticalChic]

So, there are no politicians trying to legislate their religious beliefs?

Example. The right wants the ability for businesses to discriminate based on their religious beliefs. They want it to be OK for a Pharmacist to refuse to fill a prescription if that prescription is against his "religion".

a. So you object to enforcing the commandment against murder?

b. You view is that forcing conscientious objectors to bake a cake is more important than liberty?

c. One must admit the consistency you folks stick to going back to your revolution in 1905.
I knew you wouldn't understand that, RealDumb....you're a government school grad.

Laws against murder exist outside of your religion/. What part of that don't you get?

Why do you want the freedom to discriminate. Is your bigotry that important to you?

I'm not the one who elected a Russian troll, that be you.

"Why do you want the freedom to discriminate."

Everyone discriminates.

For example, I would never hang with you.


If, some bright distant day, you learn to read, and you find a copy of the Constitution, you will find that it guarantees freedom of assembly.



For laughs and giggles....how about you answer this query:

Specifically.....'racism.' Are you opposed to it????

If so....

Is 'racism a term for actual documented harm to someone, or is it an opinion, a 'thought crime' akin to what you Nazis/Bolsheviks have always sought to punish?

I'm an American, and consider the Constitution the law of the land.

The first amendment covers any and all thought and just about any speech.

So if 'racism' is an opinion you don't agree with.....what do you believe government should do about it?

 

[PoliticalChic]

So, there are no politicians trying to legislate their religious beliefs?

Example. The right wants the ability for businesses to discriminate based on their religious beliefs. They want it to be OK for a Pharmacist to refuse to fill a prescription if that prescription is against his "religion".

/——-/ So? You’re OK with a muslime deli refusing to sell pork and alcohol? And a muslime pharmacist can refuse to fill an abortion pill. Another pharmacist in the store can do it. Where is you’d fake outrage over that?

If a Muslim store does not sell pork, it doesn't sell it to everyone.
Every pharmacist should fill any legal prescription as long as there is no medical issues with other drugs.

Muslim cab drivers refuse to take folks with bottles of alcohol....or with pet dogs.




Booze, dogs too much for some Muslim cabbies
Drivers refuse service to passengers, Minn. airport officials put up a fight
Booze, dogs too much for some Muslim cabbies


Wanna shoot 'em??

1. 
   

 

[PoliticalChic]

1.I have actually had to endure posts from government school grads along this line of what passes for thinking:
“You religious Bible-thumpers want to ram your superstition down our throats…..this is not a theocracy!!!”

Wow.



There are ‘religion’ groups that do demand control of the society…but the Judeo-Christian view on which this nation was founded is not one. But this nation was created with Judeo-Christian principles in mind:

“Our Constitution was made only for a moral and religious people. It is wholly inadequate to the government of any other.” John Adams



2. Now about that ‘ramming down disproving throats’ fable.

“Although Christianity in its many varieties was the religion of the original colonies, Christianity does not preach operational dominance over the body politic in America. Tocqueville compared this aspect to Islam: “Mohammed professed to derive from Heaven, and has inserted in the Koran, not only religious doctrines, but political maxims, civil and criminal laws, and theories of science. The Gospel, on the contrary, speaks only of the general relations of men to God and to each other, beyond which it inculcates and imposes no point of faith. This alone, besides a thousand other reasons, would suffice to prove that the former of these religions will never long predominate in a cultivated and democratic age, while the latter is destined to retain its sway at these as at all other periods.” Tocqueville, “Democracy in America,” vol.2, p. 23.



3. Assume arguendo that there is as much reason to have a religious citizenry as there is to have an non-religious one. The solution is that you don’t have to believe, ....but it is in your interest to have others believe.

The most succinct argument in favor of a religious citizenry comes from a famous atheist, Voltaire: "I don't believe in God, but I hope my valet does so he won't steal my spoons."
How Voltaire's Atheism Overthrew Deism

And, Voltaire also famously said "Si Dieu n'existait pas, il faudrait l'inventer." Mais toute la nature nous crie qu'il existe; qu'il y a une intelligence suprême, un pouvoir immense, un ordre admirable, et tout nous instruit de notre dépendance. "If God did not exist, he would have to be invented."

For the same reason as above....it is society's interest to have more religious folks, than non-religious


BTW…when about to die, Voltaire recanted: “He at once sent for the priest, and wanted to be ‘reconciled with the church.’ The Tragic Death of Voltaire the Atheist | Paw Creek Ministries





Atheism can’t sustain a rights-based, virtue-based system as a God-less ideology. Rousseau, Hegel and Marx took the opposite view, and the result was multiple millions slaughtered.


4. The less educated also claim that the Constitution somehow inveighs against religion and mandates it be separated from government. Another falsity.
The first amendment, formulated by a learned and religious group, simply made certain that no government of America mandated a particular belief. Or, have none at all.




Sooooo......where is the 'threat' of a theocracy?????

Judaism, Christianity and Islam are all lumped into what is referred to as the "Abrahamic Religions." In comparison with competing religions, they at present, the worst of the lot, with Islam ahead of the other two in barbarity. Religion in general, is a powerful influence on peoples behavior and can get people to do unspeakable things to their fellow human-beings, just because they don't believe the same way. Throughout religion's history, it has led humans into many, many wars...in the name of "God" or "Allah."
In Christianity, thousands were tortured, to get them to convert and murdered if they would not. As for our initial colonies, pilgrims fled Europe because of religious persecution, only to persecute their fellow citizens (stockades, et cetera) if they hadn't memorized the 10 Commandments and other parts of the bible. Women were murdered for being so-called "witches," because the bible said such things existed. Only after people had been drowned, crushed or, hung, did some common sense individuals in the government step in and stop the killings. Reason? It was better that we don't execute someone without actual proof, as we might be hanging an innocent person.....not that fanciful things such as true witches (not Wiccans) never existed.
It doesn't take much to drag people back into the mire of primitive, hardcore beliefs that are spelled out in those idiotic so-called "holy books." which, by the way, were written LOOONNNNG before the superstitious dark ages and thus should be taken with a grain of salt. As for whether a God is real or is a creation of man. I feel that such a being was indeed, created by man. Men had domination over women and could write. Because of ego; us being the leading form of life on the planet, that meant that their creation had to look just like us. The creation can see-all, know-all, control-all, creates all life and the universe. It also harbors the same emotions as humans, despite it being the perfect being. Knowing all and what will happen, it couldn't know that in creating humans, they wouldn't listen to it, even at the very beginning....yet it knows all.
If as Abrahamic religions say, there will be an Armageddon, it would have known that all along, thus every human is programmed to behave in a certain way, vote in a certain way and take sides in a conflict as it chooses.
Anyway, just because religion isn't running the government at this time, doesn't mean it isn't trying to influence the government and wanting to run the country. The separation of church and state is a good thing. And, for those who have "strict" religious beliefs, they should think twice about starting or entering into any business that serves the general public, as some who enter their business, may have very different beliefs.

1." Judaism, Christianity and Islam are all lumped into what is referred to as the "Abrahamic Religions."

I certainly didn't.


2. As far as slaughter of innocents, secularists have slaughtered many millions more than those of a religious bent.

3. The holy book called the Bible is copiously quoted by America's founders, and much of our founding documents is based on the Bible.

4. The moral influence is far different from 'running' the government....as this thread shows.

5. No, separation of the moral influence of the Judeo-Christian faith from the running of our government is not a good thing. Nor is there any reason for it.

 

[Billy000]

1.I have actually had to endure posts from government school grads along this line of what passes for thinking:
“You religious Bible-thumpers want to ram your superstition down our throats…..this is not a theocracy!!!”

Wow.



There are ‘religion’ groups that do demand control of the society…but the Judeo-Christian view on which this nation was founded is not one. But this nation was created with Judeo-Christian principles in mind:

“Our Constitution was made only for a moral and religious people. It is wholly inadequate to the government of any other.” John Adams



2. Now about that ‘ramming down disproving throats’ fable.

“Although Christianity in its many varieties was the religion of the original colonies, Christianity does not preach operational dominance over the body politic in America. Tocqueville compared this aspect to Islam: “Mohammed professed to derive from Heaven, and has inserted in the Koran, not only religious doctrines, but political maxims, civil and criminal laws, and theories of science. The Gospel, on the contrary, speaks only of the general relations of men to God and to each other, beyond which it inculcates and imposes no point of faith. This alone, besides a thousand other reasons, would suffice to prove that the former of these religions will never long predominate in a cultivated and democratic age, while the latter is destined to retain its sway at these as at all other periods.” Tocqueville, “Democracy in America,” vol.2, p. 23.



3. Assume arguendo that there is as much reason to have a religious citizenry as there is to have an non-religious one. The solution is that you don’t have to believe, ....but it is in your interest to have others believe.

The most succinct argument in favor of a religious citizenry comes from a famous atheist, Voltaire: "I don't believe in God, but I hope my valet does so he won't steal my spoons."
How Voltaire's Atheism Overthrew Deism

And, Voltaire also famously said "Si Dieu n'existait pas, il faudrait l'inventer." Mais toute la nature nous crie qu'il existe; qu'il y a une intelligence suprême, un pouvoir immense, un ordre admirable, et tout nous instruit de notre dépendance. "If God did not exist, he would have to be invented."

For the same reason as above....it is society's interest to have more religious folks, than non-religious


BTW…when about to die, Voltaire recanted: “He at once sent for the priest, and wanted to be ‘reconciled with the church.’ The Tragic Death of Voltaire the Atheist | Paw Creek Ministries





Atheism can’t sustain a rights-based, virtue-based system as a God-less ideology. Rousseau, Hegel and Marx took the opposite view, and the result was multiple millions slaughtered.


4. The less educated also claim that the Constitution somehow inveighs against religion and mandates it be separated from government. Another falsity.
The first amendment, formulated by a learned and religious group, simply made certain that no government of America mandated a particular belief. Or, have none at all.




Sooooo......where is the 'threat' of a theocracy?????

Um the threat from theocracy isn’t from the actual teachings in the Bible. It comes from faux Christian righty-tighties who cherry pick what Biblical values to live by and which to ignore

 

[PoliticalChic]

1.I have actually had to endure posts from government school grads along this line of what passes for thinking:
“You religious Bible-thumpers want to ram your superstition down our throats…..this is not a theocracy!!!”

Wow.



There are ‘religion’ groups that do demand control of the society…but the Judeo-Christian view on which this nation was founded is not one. But this nation was created with Judeo-Christian principles in mind:

“Our Constitution was made only for a moral and religious people. It is wholly inadequate to the government of any other.” John Adams



2. Now about that ‘ramming down disproving throats’ fable.

“Although Christianity in its many varieties was the religion of the original colonies, Christianity does not preach operational dominance over the body politic in America. Tocqueville compared this aspect to Islam: “Mohammed professed to derive from Heaven, and has inserted in the Koran, not only religious doctrines, but political maxims, civil and criminal laws, and theories of science. The Gospel, on the contrary, speaks only of the general relations of men to God and to each other, beyond which it inculcates and imposes no point of faith. This alone, besides a thousand other reasons, would suffice to prove that the former of these religions will never long predominate in a cultivated and democratic age, while the latter is destined to retain its sway at these as at all other periods.” Tocqueville, “Democracy in America,” vol.2, p. 23.



3. Assume arguendo that there is as much reason to have a religious citizenry as there is to have an non-religious one. The solution is that you don’t have to believe, ....but it is in your interest to have others believe.

The most succinct argument in favor of a religious citizenry comes from a famous atheist, Voltaire: "I don't believe in God, but I hope my valet does so he won't steal my spoons."
How Voltaire's Atheism Overthrew Deism

And, Voltaire also famously said "Si Dieu n'existait pas, il faudrait l'inventer." Mais toute la nature nous crie qu'il existe; qu'il y a une intelligence suprême, un pouvoir immense, un ordre admirable, et tout nous instruit de notre dépendance. "If God did not exist, he would have to be invented."

For the same reason as above....it is society's interest to have more religious folks, than non-religious


BTW…when about to die, Voltaire recanted: “He at once sent for the priest, and wanted to be ‘reconciled with the church.’ The Tragic Death of Voltaire the Atheist | Paw Creek Ministries





Atheism can’t sustain a rights-based, virtue-based system as a God-less ideology. Rousseau, Hegel and Marx took the opposite view, and the result was multiple millions slaughtered.


4. The less educated also claim that the Constitution somehow inveighs against religion and mandates it be separated from government. Another falsity.
The first amendment, formulated by a learned and religious group, simply made certain that no government of America mandated a particular belief. Or, have none at all.




Sooooo......where is the 'threat' of a theocracy?????

Um the threat from theocracy isn’t from the actual teachings in the Bible. It comes from faux Christian righty-tighties who cherry pick what Biblical values to live by and which to ignore

And that affects you.....how?

 

[PoliticalChic]

The discussion has nothing to do with interracial couples....it was a gay couple..

You simply lied.



You asked I I would repeal any statute that restricts individual freedom.

Yup....I sure would.

And Trump is installing conservative judges who, I believe, would do the same.


Sweatin,' huh?

So if someone believes an inter-racial couple is against God's will, do they have the "right" to refuse them service?

View attachment 285387

If you say, "No", then how can you say they should be able to deny gay couples service.

View attachment 285388

No one says "an inter-racial couple is against God's will" except you.

Moses' wife was black.

You do realize that the racists have just as many bible verses to back them up as you homophobes do, right? Why do homophobic bigots get more rights than racist ones do?

Where is your support of states rights when it comes to Public Accommodation laws?

Y'know, I'm glad you brought that up.....'cause I have a suspicion that you don't know what you're talking about.

Specifically.....'racism.'


Is 'racism a term for actual documented harm to someone, or is it an opinion, a 'thought crime' akin to what you Nazis/Bolsheviks have always sought to punish?

I'm an American, and consider the Constitution the law of the land.

The first amendment covers any and all thought and just about any speech.

So if 'racism' is an opinion you don't agree with.....what do you believe government should do about it?




So, you consider disciplining the thoughts of others your province, or that of government's?

You sure do like dodging the question a whole lot and come up with long cut and paste non answers. Simple yes or no question...do you support the repeal of Title II of the Civil Rights Act so that racists no longer have to serve black people or bakers won't have to bake cakes for interracial couples? No cut and paste needed, just yes or no.

Let the record show that you were unable to discuss what 'rights' are, nor could you explain the term 'racist'....that you brought up.

Have you considered that this might explain your failures in school?

 

[Billy000]

1.I have actually had to endure posts from government school grads along this line of what passes for thinking:
“You religious Bible-thumpers want to ram your superstition down our throats…..this is not a theocracy!!!”

Wow.



There are ‘religion’ groups that do demand control of the society…but the Judeo-Christian view on which this nation was founded is not one. But this nation was created with Judeo-Christian principles in mind:

“Our Constitution was made only for a moral and religious people. It is wholly inadequate to the government of any other.” John Adams



2. Now about that ‘ramming down disproving throats’ fable.

“Although Christianity in its many varieties was the religion of the original colonies, Christianity does not preach operational dominance over the body politic in America. Tocqueville compared this aspect to Islam: “Mohammed professed to derive from Heaven, and has inserted in the Koran, not only religious doctrines, but political maxims, civil and criminal laws, and theories of science. The Gospel, on the contrary, speaks only of the general relations of men to God and to each other, beyond which it inculcates and imposes no point of faith. This alone, besides a thousand other reasons, would suffice to prove that the former of these religions will never long predominate in a cultivated and democratic age, while the latter is destined to retain its sway at these as at all other periods.” Tocqueville, “Democracy in America,” vol.2, p. 23.



3. Assume arguendo that there is as much reason to have a religious citizenry as there is to have an non-religious one. The solution is that you don’t have to believe, ....but it is in your interest to have others believe.

The most succinct argument in favor of a religious citizenry comes from a famous atheist, Voltaire: "I don't believe in God, but I hope my valet does so he won't steal my spoons."
How Voltaire's Atheism Overthrew Deism

And, Voltaire also famously said "Si Dieu n'existait pas, il faudrait l'inventer." Mais toute la nature nous crie qu'il existe; qu'il y a une intelligence suprême, un pouvoir immense, un ordre admirable, et tout nous instruit de notre dépendance. "If God did not exist, he would have to be invented."

For the same reason as above....it is society's interest to have more religious folks, than non-religious


BTW…when about to die, Voltaire recanted: “He at once sent for the priest, and wanted to be ‘reconciled with the church.’ The Tragic Death of Voltaire the Atheist | Paw Creek Ministries





Atheism can’t sustain a rights-based, virtue-based system as a God-less ideology. Rousseau, Hegel and Marx took the opposite view, and the result was multiple millions slaughtered.


4. The less educated also claim that the Constitution somehow inveighs against religion and mandates it be separated from government. Another falsity.
The first amendment, formulated by a learned and religious group, simply made certain that no government of America mandated a particular belief. Or, have none at all.




Sooooo......where is the 'threat' of a theocracy?????

Um the threat from theocracy isn’t from the actual teachings in the Bible. It comes from faux Christian righty-tighties who cherry pick what Biblical values to live by and which to ignore

And that affects you.....how?

Up it affects because these same faux Christians have no concept of separation of church and state.

 

[JoeB131]

Wow, you are making things up now.

If you don't like that I won't give you drugs to kill someone, go somewhere else. It is MY business, and I have a right to a conscious and a right to exercise it.

This is NOT forcing anything on you as you are free to go elsewhere.

Fetuses aren't people.
It's a legal drug and if I have a prescription for it, you are required to fill it.

That's what the state licensed you to do. You want to be a clergyman, go to a seminary.

 

[JoeB131]

Seems like I taught you a lesson again, huh?


In the future,try to stick to words whose meaning you actually understand.....even if that leaves you mute.

I sometimes wonder if you even follow your own threads, your response had nothing to do with the argument she was making.

 

[PoliticalChic]

1.I have actually had to endure posts from government school grads along this line of what passes for thinking:
“You religious Bible-thumpers want to ram your superstition down our throats…..this is not a theocracy!!!”

Wow.



There are ‘religion’ groups that do demand control of the society…but the Judeo-Christian view on which this nation was founded is not one. But this nation was created with Judeo-Christian principles in mind:

“Our Constitution was made only for a moral and religious people. It is wholly inadequate to the government of any other.” John Adams



2. Now about that ‘ramming down disproving throats’ fable.

“Although Christianity in its many varieties was the religion of the original colonies, Christianity does not preach operational dominance over the body politic in America. Tocqueville compared this aspect to Islam: “Mohammed professed to derive from Heaven, and has inserted in the Koran, not only religious doctrines, but political maxims, civil and criminal laws, and theories of science. The Gospel, on the contrary, speaks only of the general relations of men to God and to each other, beyond which it inculcates and imposes no point of faith. This alone, besides a thousand other reasons, would suffice to prove that the former of these religions will never long predominate in a cultivated and democratic age, while the latter is destined to retain its sway at these as at all other periods.” Tocqueville, “Democracy in America,” vol.2, p. 23.



3. Assume arguendo that there is as much reason to have a religious citizenry as there is to have an non-religious one. The solution is that you don’t have to believe, ....but it is in your interest to have others believe.

The most succinct argument in favor of a religious citizenry comes from a famous atheist, Voltaire: "I don't believe in God, but I hope my valet does so he won't steal my spoons."
How Voltaire's Atheism Overthrew Deism

And, Voltaire also famously said "Si Dieu n'existait pas, il faudrait l'inventer." Mais toute la nature nous crie qu'il existe; qu'il y a une intelligence suprême, un pouvoir immense, un ordre admirable, et tout nous instruit de notre dépendance. "If God did not exist, he would have to be invented."

For the same reason as above....it is society's interest to have more religious folks, than non-religious


BTW…when about to die, Voltaire recanted: “He at once sent for the priest, and wanted to be ‘reconciled with the church.’ The Tragic Death of Voltaire the Atheist | Paw Creek Ministries





Atheism can’t sustain a rights-based, virtue-based system as a God-less ideology. Rousseau, Hegel and Marx took the opposite view, and the result was multiple millions slaughtered.


4. The less educated also claim that the Constitution somehow inveighs against religion and mandates it be separated from government. Another falsity.
The first amendment, formulated by a learned and religious group, simply made certain that no government of America mandated a particular belief. Or, have none at all.




Sooooo......where is the 'threat' of a theocracy?????

Um the threat from theocracy isn’t from the actual teachings in the Bible. It comes from faux Christian righty-tighties who cherry pick what Biblical values to live by and which to ignore

And that affects you.....how?

Up it affects because these same faux Christians have no concept of separation of church and state.

So other individuals have the power to re-write the Constitution?

I see you prefer not to think before posting....so as to be just as surprised as everyone else by what comes out.


Seems you didn't know that there is no such separation in the Constitution.

 

[Billy000]

1.I have actually had to endure posts from government school grads along this line of what passes for thinking:
“You religious Bible-thumpers want to ram your superstition down our throats…..this is not a theocracy!!!”

Wow.



There are ‘religion’ groups that do demand control of the society…but the Judeo-Christian view on which this nation was founded is not one. But this nation was created with Judeo-Christian principles in mind:

“Our Constitution was made only for a moral and religious people. It is wholly inadequate to the government of any other.” John Adams



2. Now about that ‘ramming down disproving throats’ fable.

“Although Christianity in its many varieties was the religion of the original colonies, Christianity does not preach operational dominance over the body politic in America. Tocqueville compared this aspect to Islam: “Mohammed professed to derive from Heaven, and has inserted in the Koran, not only religious doctrines, but political maxims, civil and criminal laws, and theories of science. The Gospel, on the contrary, speaks only of the general relations of men to God and to each other, beyond which it inculcates and imposes no point of faith. This alone, besides a thousand other reasons, would suffice to prove that the former of these religions will never long predominate in a cultivated and democratic age, while the latter is destined to retain its sway at these as at all other periods.” Tocqueville, “Democracy in America,” vol.2, p. 23.



3. Assume arguendo that there is as much reason to have a religious citizenry as there is to have an non-religious one. The solution is that you don’t have to believe, ....but it is in your interest to have others believe.

The most succinct argument in favor of a religious citizenry comes from a famous atheist, Voltaire: "I don't believe in God, but I hope my valet does so he won't steal my spoons."
How Voltaire's Atheism Overthrew Deism

And, Voltaire also famously said "Si Dieu n'existait pas, il faudrait l'inventer." Mais toute la nature nous crie qu'il existe; qu'il y a une intelligence suprême, un pouvoir immense, un ordre admirable, et tout nous instruit de notre dépendance. "If God did not exist, he would have to be invented."

For the same reason as above....it is society's interest to have more religious folks, than non-religious


BTW…when about to die, Voltaire recanted: “He at once sent for the priest, and wanted to be ‘reconciled with the church.’ The Tragic Death of Voltaire the Atheist | Paw Creek Ministries





Atheism can’t sustain a rights-based, virtue-based system as a God-less ideology. Rousseau, Hegel and Marx took the opposite view, and the result was multiple millions slaughtered.


4. The less educated also claim that the Constitution somehow inveighs against religion and mandates it be separated from government. Another falsity.
The first amendment, formulated by a learned and religious group, simply made certain that no government of America mandated a particular belief. Or, have none at all.




Sooooo......where is the 'threat' of a theocracy?????

Um the threat from theocracy isn’t from the actual teachings in the Bible. It comes from faux Christian righty-tighties who cherry pick what Biblical values to live by and which to ignore

And that affects you.....how?

Up it affects because these same faux Christians have no concept of separation of church and state.

So other individuals have the power to re-write the Constitution?

I see you prefer not to think before posting....so as to be just as surprised as everyone else by what comes out.


Seems you didn't know that there is no such separation in the Constitution.

Uh of course that exists in the constitution. Republicans just pretend that it doesn’t.

 

[Billy000]

 

[PoliticalChic]

Seems like I taught you a lesson again, huh?


In the future,try to stick to words whose meaning you actually understand.....even if that leaves you mute.

I sometimes wonder if you even follow your own threads, your response had nothing to do with the argument she was making.

Of course it does.

And, it isn't what she said....it's what she couldn't say.


I sometimes wonder if you even have the ability to wonder.

 

[JoeB131]

I did not say an employee should not have the right to "violate his conscience". Here is the deal when you are the 'employee' verses the 'owner'; as an owner you sign the paychecks, assume the liabilities and invested your own money first to have ownership of that business so you get to make those calls. When employees own the businesses they work at they also have those same right as co-owners. My money, my time and efforts built my own business not some employee.

You know what, I'm going to cut you off right here because you are boring.

Either you believe that freedom of religion gives you a TOTAL right to refuse to do your job with no consequences, or you don't.

Okay for me but not for thee doesn't cut it. Either both employer and employee have right of conscience or they don't.

 

[PoliticalChic]

1.I have actually had to endure posts from government school grads along this line of what passes for thinking:
“You religious Bible-thumpers want to ram your superstition down our throats…..this is not a theocracy!!!”

Wow.



There are ‘religion’ groups that do demand control of the society…but the Judeo-Christian view on which this nation was founded is not one. But this nation was created with Judeo-Christian principles in mind:

“Our Constitution was made only for a moral and religious people. It is wholly inadequate to the government of any other.” John Adams



2. Now about that ‘ramming down disproving throats’ fable.

“Although Christianity in its many varieties was the religion of the original colonies, Christianity does not preach operational dominance over the body politic in America. Tocqueville compared this aspect to Islam: “Mohammed professed to derive from Heaven, and has inserted in the Koran, not only religious doctrines, but political maxims, civil and criminal laws, and theories of science. The Gospel, on the contrary, speaks only of the general relations of men to God and to each other, beyond which it inculcates and imposes no point of faith. This alone, besides a thousand other reasons, would suffice to prove that the former of these religions will never long predominate in a cultivated and democratic age, while the latter is destined to retain its sway at these as at all other periods.” Tocqueville, “Democracy in America,” vol.2, p. 23.



3. Assume arguendo that there is as much reason to have a religious citizenry as there is to have an non-religious one. The solution is that you don’t have to believe, ....but it is in your interest to have others believe.

The most succinct argument in favor of a religious citizenry comes from a famous atheist, Voltaire: "I don't believe in God, but I hope my valet does so he won't steal my spoons."
How Voltaire's Atheism Overthrew Deism

And, Voltaire also famously said "Si Dieu n'existait pas, il faudrait l'inventer." Mais toute la nature nous crie qu'il existe; qu'il y a une intelligence suprême, un pouvoir immense, un ordre admirable, et tout nous instruit de notre dépendance. "If God did not exist, he would have to be invented."

For the same reason as above....it is society's interest to have more religious folks, than non-religious


BTW…when about to die, Voltaire recanted: “He at once sent for the priest, and wanted to be ‘reconciled with the church.’ The Tragic Death of Voltaire the Atheist | Paw Creek Ministries





Atheism can’t sustain a rights-based, virtue-based system as a God-less ideology. Rousseau, Hegel and Marx took the opposite view, and the result was multiple millions slaughtered.


4. The less educated also claim that the Constitution somehow inveighs against religion and mandates it be separated from government. Another falsity.
The first amendment, formulated by a learned and religious group, simply made certain that no government of America mandated a particular belief. Or, have none at all.




Sooooo......where is the 'threat' of a theocracy?????

Um the threat from theocracy isn’t from the actual teachings in the Bible. It comes from faux Christian righty-tighties who cherry pick what Biblical values to live by and which to ignore

And that affects you.....how?

Up it affects because these same faux Christians have no concept of separation of church and state.

So other individuals have the power to re-write the Constitution?

I see you prefer not to think before posting....so as to be just as surprised as everyone else by what comes out.


Seems you didn't know that there is no such separation in the Constitution.

Uh of course that exists in the constitution. Republicans just pretend that it doesn’t.

Perhaps you could quote where it says that.



And when you can't....if you ask nicely....I'll explain why you are confused in the matter.