Do You Believe In Civil Rights?

[MarcATL]

"Civil Rights" as used, means rights for minorities and claims of "white privilege". It's institutionalized racism through giving special rights to select groups and special hiring or educational slots for select groups. It's added additional penalities for "hate crimes" so that a crime against one American citizen is punished less than an attack against another American citizen.

What we need is true "civil rights", enforcement of the 14th Amendment's Equal Protection clause. There is no way to fix the wrongs of the past, but we can stop doing those wrongs in the present.

Really? WoW!!

How did you calculate all that?

I'm also curious to the difference between civil rights and "Civil Rights" as you put it.

 

[Rambunctious]

Do you believe that civil rights needs more attention, or it already have had enough and it's time to move on?

Why/why not?

America should always lead the world in Civil rights for all. But some people equate civil rights with some really far out stuff so I guess like everything else it has to be a case by case basis.

 

[Divine Wind]

"Civil Rights" as used, means rights for minorities and claims of "white privilege". It's institutionalized racism through giving special rights to select groups and special hiring or educational slots for select groups. It's added additional penalities for "hate crimes" so that a crime against one American citizen is punished less than an attack against another American citizen.

What we need is true "civil rights", enforcement of the 14th Amendment's Equal Protection clause. There is no way to fix the wrongs of the past, but we can stop doing those wrongs in the present.

Really? WoW!!

How did you calculate all that?

I'm also curious to the difference between civil rights and "Civil Rights" as you put it.

Read it again. When discussing "Civil Rights Movement" do you think most Americans think of it as civil rights for all or as civil rights for black people?

 

[Contumacious]

Do you believe that civil rights needs more attention, or it already have had enough and it's time to move on?

Why/why not?

I believe in CONSTITUTIONAL RIGHTS, ie, Life, Liberty, Property and to pursue happiness.

.

AKA civil rights.

No , civil rights to you are welfare state rights

1- right to be fed
2- right to be educated
3- right to be clothed
4- right to Obama hellcare
5- right to have the government quenched your thirst
6- right to enslave the taxpayers


.

 

[LuckyDuck]

I believe that all people should have some basic civil rights. However, I do believe that we need to stop treating religion as some sort of "sacred cow" that cannot be criticized or controlled. If the ancient religions of human sacrifice were resumed in the belief that sacrificing humans pleased the gods so that there would be good weather and crops, we wouldn't stand for it and thus we shouldn't allow religions to exist that preach subjugating, hatred and killing of those not of that particular religion, or who leave the religion. Religion is a powerful influence on people and thus they can and be easily be swayed to commit horrible atrocities in the name of the religion.
So, my belief in civil rights ends with religion.

 

[Contumacious]

I believe there are inequalities which cannot be legislated away. We will always be burdened with bigots, and no law will make them change.

We can enforce behaviors, but that is very dangerous ground, and I do think the federal government has overstepped in that department. I teach my children all about the black civil right struggle. I had given them detailed knowledge of the unholy horrors blacks had to endure to get the same freedoms we enjoy. But at the same time, I rankle at the federal government trying to control my behavior.

There is something more powerful than laws which we have not pursued enough.

Education. Contrary to what some people may believe around here, I have a great deal of faith in the intelligence of the American people. I think education is the solution to almost all of our problems, not just our racial problems.

But even where we have been educating people on matters of race, it has been mostly one way. Teaching us whites about tolerance, while overlooking or outright condoning the bigotry and hate directed at us.

In addition to conscious bigotry, there are also racial and cultural biases which cause people to treat those who are unlike them differently without being aware of it. White cops give black drivers more tickets, for example. I don't believe this is always deliberate, and that is where education comes in.

We all have behaviors of which we are unaware until someone points them to us. That is probably one of the biggest benefits of marriage. To have someone there to point out, "You behaved like an asshole just then."

I also think it is time for the black community to admit it has been fostering some incredibly self-destructive behaviors. Behaviors which are becoming downright cultural. Once behaviors become part of a culture, they are a real bitch to put a stop to.

To be honest with you Marc, I think at this point the black community is doing more damage to the black community than whites are.

And that feeds right into the bigots' propaganda.

Please expound. What kinds of things are the black community doing to themselves that are making it worse on themselves?

Believing that Liberal democrats are your friends

How long does it take the police to answer a 911 call from the 'hood?

Yet "liberal' politicians are AGAINST allowing us to arm ourselves, they don't trust us.

WTF

.

 

[Disir]

Do you believe that civil rights needs more attention, or it already have had enough and it's time to move on?

Why/why not?

We have them. Stop fighting for rights you already have.

Does this message go to the NRA who is engaged in a non-stop fight for their 2nd Amendment rights?

Yep. You have no idea how freaking over it I am with the screaming.

The NRA isn't using statistics from 1994. The NRA isn't playing tit for tat games.

People either want to do nothing more than stand in the street and scream shit or they want to get things done. Which do you want to do? Fighting for rights you already have is phenomenally stupid and goes nowhere. At some point it will need to kick in............it's a waste of time and energy.......because you already have those rights.

Has there been ANY discussion of returning funding to public defenders? No. How about taking that fight to your state? No. So...........what do you want from the rest of us? Your fifteen minutes of fame? You want to go down in the history books ? because the people that fought for those rights have that slot

 

[g5000]

I believe there are inequalities which cannot be legislated away. We will always be burdened with bigots, and no law will make them change.

We can enforce behaviors, but that is very dangerous ground, and I do think the federal government has overstepped in that department. I teach my children all about the black civil right struggle. I had given them detailed knowledge of the unholy horrors blacks had to endure to get the same freedoms we enjoy. But at the same time, I rankle at the federal government trying to control my behavior.

There is something more powerful than laws which we have not pursued enough.

Education. Contrary to what some people may believe around here, I have a great deal of faith in the intelligence of the American people. I think education is the solution to almost all of our problems, not just our racial problems.

But even where we have been educating people on matters of race, it has been mostly one way. Teaching us whites about tolerance, while overlooking or outright condoning the bigotry and hate directed at us.

In addition to conscious bigotry, there are also racial and cultural biases which cause people to treat those who are unlike them differently without being aware of it. White cops give black drivers more tickets, for example. I don't believe this is always deliberate, and that is where education comes in.

We all have behaviors of which we are unaware until someone points them to us. That is probably one of the biggest benefits of marriage. To have someone there to point out, "You behaved like an asshole just then."

I also think it is time for the black community to admit it has been fostering some incredibly self-destructive behaviors. Behaviors which are becoming downright cultural. Once behaviors become part of a culture, they are a real bitch to put a stop to.

To be honest with you Marc, I think at this point the black community is doing more damage to the black community than whites are.

And that feeds right into the bigots' propaganda.

Please expound. What kinds of things are the black community doing to themselves that are making it worse on themselves?

1) 80 percent illegitimacy rate, for starters. This is simply staggering. From this flows much poverty. And from poverty comes crime, drug abuse, depravity, and hopelessness.

2) Deriding success achieved outside the black community. The proverbial bucket of crabs. When one begins to climb out, the others pull him back into the bucket.

3) Choosing the wrong martyrs. A thug shot by the cops is not a hero. Michael Brown was a thug. He was not Emmitt Till.

4) Choosing the wrong leadership. Defending obvious criminals and bad actors in positions of power just because they are black. I realize this is not strictly a black thing. Far from it. But if you are in a disadvantageous position on an unlevel playing field, you do not have the luxury of choosing scumbags to be your mouthpiece. Whenever you re-elect a piece of shit like Marion Barry, or defend a crook like William J. Jefferson, you are communicating that's the best you can do. That is the wrong message. Not just the wrong message to the world, it is the wrong message to tell yourselves.

Numbers 1 and 4 are the two which break my heart the most.

 

[Contumacious]

I believe there are inequalities which cannot be legislated away. We will always be burdened with bigots, and no law will make them change.

We can enforce behaviors, but that is very dangerous ground, and I do think the federal government has overstepped in that department. I teach my children all about the black civil right struggle. I had given them detailed knowledge of the unholy horrors blacks had to endure to get the same freedoms we enjoy. But at the same time, I rankle at the federal government trying to control my behavior.

There is something more powerful than laws which we have not pursued enough.

Education. Contrary to what some people may believe around here, I have a great deal of faith in the intelligence of the American people. I think education is the solution to almost all of our problems, not just our racial problems.

But even where we have been educating people on matters of race, it has been mostly one way. Teaching us whites about tolerance, while overlooking or outright condoning the bigotry and hate directed at us.

In addition to conscious bigotry, there are also racial and cultural biases which cause people to treat those who are unlike them differently without being aware of it. White cops give black drivers more tickets, for example. I don't believe this is always deliberate, and that is where education comes in.

We all have behaviors of which we are unaware until someone points them to us. That is probably one of the biggest benefits of marriage. To have someone there to point out, "You behaved like an asshole just then."

I also think it is time for the black community to admit it has been fostering some incredibly self-destructive behaviors. Behaviors which are becoming downright cultural. Once behaviors become part of a culture, they are a real bitch to put a stop to.

To be honest with you Marc, I think at this point the black community is doing more damage to the black community than whites are.

And that feeds right into the bigots' propaganda.

Please expound. What kinds of things are the black community doing to themselves that are making it worse on themselves?

1) 80 percent illegitimacy rate, for starters. This is simply staggering. From this flows much poverty. And from poverty comes crime, drug abuse, depravity, and hopelessness.

2) Deriding success achieved outside the black community. The proverbial bucket of crabs. When one begins to climb out, the others pull him back into the bucket.

3) Choosing the wrong martyrs. A thug shot by the cops is not a hero. Michael Brown was a thug.

4) Choosing the wrong leadership. Defending obvious criminals and bad actors in positions of power just because they are black. I realize this is not strictly a black thing. Far from it. But if you are in a disadvantageous position on an unlevel playing field, you do not have the luxury of choosing scumbags to be your mouthpiece. Whenever you re-elect a piece of shit like Marion Barry, you are communicating that's the best you can do. That is the wrong message. Not just the wrong message to the world, it is the wrong message to tell yourselves.

Numbers 1 and 4 are the two which break my heart the most.

And those issues are the taxpayers fault how?

/

 

[petro]

I don't believe in identity politics which the notion of civil rights require. It is a continuation of grievance and a victim mentality and will never allow an honest discussion of race or gender issues without the protected class citizen claiming a bias.

 

[MarcATL]

Read it again. When discussing "Civil Rights Movement" do you think most Americans think of it as civil rights for all or as civil rights for black people?

Read what again?

Anyway, my answer is yes, Most Americans should see civil rights for all, being as it helps all.

Why do you think otherwise?

 

[MarcATL]

1) 80 percent illegitimacy rate, for starters. This is simply staggering. From this flows much poverty. And from poverty comes crime, drug abuse, depravity, and hopelessness.

2) Deriding success achieved outside the black community. The proverbial bucket of crabs. When one begins to climb out, the others pull him back into the bucket.

3) Choosing the wrong martyrs. A thug shot by the cops is not a hero. Michael Brown was a thug. He was not Emmitt Till.

4) Choosing the wrong leadership. Defending obvious criminals and bad actors in positions of power just because they are black. I realize this is not strictly a black thing. Far from it. But if you are in a disadvantageous position on an unlevel playing field, you do not have the luxury of choosing scumbags to be your mouthpiece. Whenever you re-elect a piece of shit like Marion Barry, or defend a crook like William J. Jefferson, you are communicating that's the best you can do. That is the wrong message. Not just the wrong message to the world, it is the wrong message to tell yourselves.

Numbers 1 and 4 are the two which break my heart the most.

Now we're getting somewhere.

1. So how do you think that tragic statistic came to be?

2. That's subjective. Any examples or types of examples you can share?

3. The example you're using was a rather recent one. I don't think our problems stem from stuff like that. Using that same example, the problem comes from the fact that cops are so willing to end black children's lives so easily, whereas a white kid doing the exact same thing would have met a much nicer fate.

4. Interesting. I'm curious to know who you think are wrong and who would you suggest as right.

 

[yiostheoy]

Do you believe that civil rights needs more attention, or it already have had enough and it's time to move on?

Why/why not?

Civil rights is critical to a free and just society.

The latest violations of civil rights have been the several police shootings.

Either these police officers have been trigger happy or else they have been trained wrong.

I do not believe there has been much improvement in civil rights during the BHO administration. However affirmative action has skyrocketed during the past 8 years especially at The White House. This will likely change soon.

I hope Pres Trump puts more energy into civil rights and not as much emphasis on affirmative action. Affirmative action has been overdone.

 

[yiostheoy]

I don't believe in identity politics which the notion of civil rights require. It is a continuation of grievance and a victim mentality and will never allow an honest discussion of race or gender issues without the protected class citizen claiming a bias.

I guess you have not been paying much attention to the police shootings (by police not of police) over the past couple of years.

 

[yiostheoy]

I believe there are inequalities which cannot be legislated away. We will always be burdened with bigots, and no law will make them change.

We can enforce behaviors, but that is very dangerous ground, and I do think the federal government has overstepped in that department. I teach my children all about the black civil right struggle. I had given them detailed knowledge of the unholy horrors blacks had to endure to get the same freedoms we enjoy. But at the same time, I rankle at the federal government trying to control my behavior.

There is something more powerful than laws which we have not pursued enough.

Education. Contrary to what some people may believe around here, I have a great deal of faith in the intelligence of the American people. I think education is the solution to almost all of our problems, not just our racial problems.

But even where we have been educating people on matters of race, it has been mostly one way. Teaching us whites about tolerance, while overlooking or outright condoning the bigotry and hate directed at us.

In addition to conscious bigotry, there are also racial and cultural biases which cause people to treat those who are unlike them differently without being aware of it. White cops give black drivers more tickets, for example. I don't believe this is always deliberate, and that is where education comes in.

We all have behaviors of which we are unaware until someone points them to us. That is probably one of the biggest benefits of marriage. To have someone there to point out, "You behaved like an asshole just then."

I also think it is time for the black community to admit it has been fostering some incredibly self-destructive behaviors. Behaviors which are becoming downright cultural. Once behaviors become part of a culture, they are a real bitch to put a stop to.

To be honest with you Marc, I think at this point the black community is doing more damage to the black community than whites are.

And that feeds right into the bigots' propaganda.

Please expound. What kinds of things are the black community doing to themselves that are making it worse on themselves?

1) 80 percent illegitimacy rate, for starters. This is simply staggering. From this flows much poverty. And from poverty comes crime, drug abuse, depravity, and hopelessness.

2) Deriding success achieved outside the black community. The proverbial bucket of crabs. When one begins to climb out, the others pull him back into the bucket.

3) Choosing the wrong martyrs. A thug shot by the cops is not a hero. Michael Brown was a thug. He was not Emmitt Till.

4) Choosing the wrong leadership. Defending obvious criminals and bad actors in positions of power just because they are black. I realize this is not strictly a black thing. Far from it. But if you are in a disadvantageous position on an unlevel playing field, you do not have the luxury of choosing scumbags to be your mouthpiece. Whenever you re-elect a piece of shit like Marion Barry, or defend a crook like William J. Jefferson, you are communicating that's the best you can do. That is the wrong message. Not just the wrong message to the world, it is the wrong message to tell yourselves.

Numbers 1 and 4 are the two which break my heart the most.

M.Brown was indeed a thug.

But it did not reasonably require 11 shots to bring him down.

This was an execution not a justified shooting.

 

[yiostheoy]

Do you believe that civil rights needs more attention, or it already have had enough and it's time to move on?

Why/why not?

I think all the recent evidence is that there IS oppression. Not so much race based as class based. If you read the Federal report on Ferguson for instance you'll find the MAIN source of oppression is a local govt that had an average of 3 outstanding warrants and 1.5 arrests per household. A system where MOST of those warrants were garbage or clerical errors. A system where someone TRYING to pay off a fine in installments had their money returned and their asses thrown in jail. .

There is a CLEAR pattern of oppression from muni govts that try to run by the SAME rules as wealthier towns or suburbs. And the irony of all that is of course -- that these victims just love them some MORE big muscular govt with piss poor "customer service" and lack of innovation.. And they VOTE that way -- all the fucking time.

That "innovation" has to come from recognizing that problems that LOOK like "racial oppression" are often clearly --- something else entirely.. And it has to come from folks that THINK emancipated and better represented.

Then it IS race based, but this race in this location (as in most) happens to be locked in an endless chain of poverty and crime.

Wilson was lunatic when he emptied his pistol into Brown however.

I can't believe he thought he would get away with this. It has cost him his police career. He is lucky it did not cost him more.

 

[dblack]

I simply believe that everyone should be treated equally

The question is: By whom?

I believe government should treat everyone equally. But how we treat each other is up to us.

 

[AnCap'n_Murica]

Not at all.

The very notion of "civil rights" turns the model for the republic on its head.

You have unalienable natural rights, as a matter of course of you being a free human, regardless of ethnicity, color, or creed. Your rights depend upon no legislator or bureaucrat.

"Civil rights" can be read as "special rights". They are extended to politically favored identity groups, as though the government owns all the rights, then dispenses them via statute or court ruling like Santa Claus at Christmas.

 

[Contumacious]

Not at all.

The very notion of "civil rights" turns the model for the republic on its head.

You have unalienable natural rights, as a matter of course of you being a free human, regardless of ethnicity, color, or creed. Your rights depend upon no legislator or bureaucrat.

"Civil rights" can be read as "special rights". They are extended to politically favored identity groups, as though the government owns all the rights, then dispenses them via statute or court ruling like Santa Claus at Christmas.

I do believe that the BLM issue falls under the RIGHT TO LIFE - which applies to ALL Americans.

.

 

[petro]

Then where is BLM regarding black on black murders. The silence in the inner cities on that issue is deafening. The group doesn't want any honest discussion as that might take self reflection instead of deflection. Do all lives matter to BLM. So far their actions and rhetoric would prove otherwise.