Depressed? Ever considered suicide?

[jillian]

Where in the Bible does it say that you are automatically sent to Hell if you commit suicide? Chapter and verse please.

Me? I believe that if you want to take yourself out, you can, just don't take anyone else with you.

Have I considered it? Yes. A couple of times in my teen years and once when I was in my 30's (rough times both of them and I didn't want to be here). However, people saw I was in a bad place and bailed me out.

Would I consider it again? Depends on whether or not my life gets as bad as those last two times. I don't see it happening anytime in the forseeable future though.

I maintain there is no Biblical prohibition against suicide. I have posted the following before and think it is appropriate to publish again:

Some Christians would define suicide as a type of murder, but I disagree. I would define murder as: The unlawful killing of one human by another. This is certainly the way the law defines it. I don't believe that we should have one dictionary for use when we speak to each other, and another dictionary when we attempt to interpret the Bible.

But, hey, I agree that suicide should be a crime punishable by death!!

Even though suicide is clearly not murder (a crime which is prohibited by the Bible); some Christians resort to the writings of Paul to show that the body is the temple of the holy spirit and therefore killing one's own body is a sin. These Christians rely on the following scripture:

“Know ye not that ye are the temple of God, and that the Spirit of God dwelleth in you? If any man defile the temple of God, him shall God destroy; for the temple of God is holy, which temple ye are” (1 Corinthians 3:16-17, KJV).

“Flee fornication. Every sin that a man doeth is without the body; but he that committeth fornication sinneth against his own body. What? know ye not that your body is the temple of the Holy Ghost which is in you, which ye have of God, and ye are not your own? For ye are bought with a price: therefore glorify God in your body, and in your spirit, which are God's” (1 Corinthians 6:18-20, KJV).

These verses do not address suicide directly, so I suppose everyone is is free to interpret them in any way they desire. I do find it interesting that the only sin against the body that Paul mentions is fornication, which would strongly suggest that suicide was not such a sin. Besides, if suicide - which I would define as the act of hastening one's own death - is a sin, then it must also be true that any act which causes one's premature demise is equally sinful. Thus, those who smoke, drink excessively or fail to diet and exercise properly would also be condemned to the eternal fires of Hell.

There is a helluva difference between those who kill others others and those who take their own lives in quiet desperation. I have studied various versions of the Bible for over sixty years, and have found no specific mention of suicide. I would contend that if God is fair and just as Christians believe He will not condemn those who took their own lives; instead, he will heal their pain so that they can live and love and laugh again; or, as the Bible puts it, He will “Restore unto me the joy of thy salvation; and uphold me with thy free spirit” (Psalm 51:12) and “God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes; and there shall be no more death, neither sorrow, nor crying, neither shall there be any more pain: for the former things are passed away” (Revelation 21:4). What kind of God would torment for all eternity those who faced so much torment in their lives that they could no longer bear it? Not my God.



For the record, my son committed suicide in 2008, just a few months before his twenty-fourth birthday.

very sorry to hear that.

 

[presonorek]

No, she's not in hell. She was sick, Drifter. You have to be to do something like that.

If God exists then He can make his own decisions about that. He doesn't need anybody's input into the matter.

 

[Michelle420]

Where in the Bible does it say that you are automatically sent to Hell if you commit suicide? Chapter and verse please.

Me? I believe that if you want to take yourself out, you can, just don't take anyone else with you.

Have I considered it? Yes. A couple of times in my teen years and once when I was in my 30's (rough times both of them and I didn't want to be here). However, people saw I was in a bad place and bailed me out.

Would I consider it again? Depends on whether or not my life gets as bad as those last two times. I don't see it happening anytime in the forseeable future though.

I maintain there is no Biblical prohibition against suicide. I have posted the following before and think it is appropriate to publish again:

Some Christians would define suicide as a type of murder, but I disagree. I would define murder as: The unlawful killing of one human by another. This is certainly the way the law defines it. I don't believe that we should have one dictionary for use when we speak to each other, and another dictionary when we attempt to interpret the Bible.

But, hey, I agree that suicide should be a crime punishable by death!!

Even though suicide is clearly not murder (a crime which is prohibited by the Bible); some Christians resort to the writings of Paul to show that the body is the temple of the holy spirit and therefore killing one's own body is a sin. These Christians rely on the following scripture:

“Know ye not that ye are the temple of God, and that the Spirit of God dwelleth in you? If any man defile the temple of God, him shall God destroy; for the temple of God is holy, which temple ye are” (1 Corinthians 3:16-17, KJV).

“Flee fornication. Every sin that a man doeth is without the body; but he that committeth fornication sinneth against his own body. What? know ye not that your body is the temple of the Holy Ghost which is in you, which ye have of God, and ye are not your own? For ye are bought with a price: therefore glorify God in your body, and in your spirit, which are God's” (1 Corinthians 6:18-20, KJV).

These verses do not address suicide directly, so I suppose everyone is is free to interpret them in any way they desire. I do find it interesting that the only sin against the body that Paul mentions is fornication, which would strongly suggest that suicide was not such a sin. Besides, if suicide - which I would define as the act of hastening one's own death - is a sin, then it must also be true that any act which causes one's premature demise is equally sinful. Thus, those who smoke, drink excessively or fail to diet and exercise properly would also be condemned to the eternal fires of Hell.

There is a helluva difference between those who kill others others and those who take their own lives in quiet desperation. I have studied various versions of the Bible for over sixty years, and have found no specific mention of suicide. I would contend that if God is fair and just as Christians believe He will not condemn those who took their own lives; instead, he will heal their pain so that they can live and love and laugh again; or, as the Bible puts it, He will “Restore unto me the joy of thy salvation; and uphold me with thy free spirit” (Psalm 51:12) and “God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes; and there shall be no more death, neither sorrow, nor crying, neither shall there be any more pain: for the former things are passed away” (Revelation 21:4). What kind of God would torment for all eternity those who faced so much torment in their lives that they could no longer bear it? Not my God.



For the record, my son committed suicide in 2008, just a few months before his twenty-fourth birthday.

Sorry about your son Professor, it's the worst feeling ever.

 

[presonorek]

What are we to do when our belief of God is different than the true God?

For example: We can believe our boss is mean and hateful when he is really the most gentle and caring boss in existence.

For example: We can believe our boss is the most gentle and caring boss in existence when he is really the most mean and hateful boss in the entire world.

Our belief of our boss does not alter the character of the boss in any way shape or form.

In the same vein. What we believe about God does not matter at all. What God really is determines the outcome not what our belief in Him is.

We have to be careful about that. God can put anybody in hell that He wants to put in hell. He is not obligated to be loving and caring. He is not obligated to be just. He could all the wicked people in heaven and all the kind people in hell just because He is bored. If He is really a god then He doesn't have to answer to anyone.

The people that believe God is kind and caring are in more danger of disappointment than those who believe He is hateful and vengeful. Does that make any sense?

I'll break it down a little in the next post with a creative analogy.

I watched some of it. I didn't like it. A vengeful God would not care about the mental state of someone doing this. A kind loving God would embrace those who just couldn't handle life any more, like Drifters sister, and embraces them when they arrive. Period. No ands ifs or buts about it.
If you have a vengeful God in your belief system....ok.
But if the God you believe in is like mine...He loves you. And if you decide to go before He calls...he damn sure is not going to make you suffer more.

 

[presonorek]

I watched some of it. I didn't like it. A vengeful God would not care about the mental state of someone doing this. A kind loving God would embrace those who just couldn't handle life any more, like Drifters sister, and embraces them when they arrive. Period. No ands ifs or buts about it.
If you have a vengeful God in your belief system....ok.
But if the God you believe in is like mine...He loves you. And if you decide to go before He calls...he damn sure is not going to make you suffer more.

If you apply for a loan and you believe the bank will charge you a high interest rate then you will be adequately prepared to respond when they actually do.

If you apply for a loan and you believe the bank will charge you a high interest rate then you will be adequately prepared to respond when they charge an extremely low rate.

If you apply for a loan and you believe the bank will charge you a low interest rate then you will not be prepared when they offer you a high interest rate.

If you apply for a loan and you believe the bank will charge you a low interest rate then you will be prepared when they offer you an extremely low rate.

One belief system allows the individual to be prepared for all possibilities. One belief system only allows the individual to be prepared for half of the possibilities.

Believing in a God that is perfect makes us ill prepared to engage life. Reading the Bible might be a better place to discover the character of God than listening to a pastor that loses money for his organization when he says uncomfortable things and gains money for his organization when he says comfortable things.

It's fun to believe that you will be rich and successful but 99+% of us never become rich and successful. There is much harm when you set yourself up for massive disappointment by being unrealistic.

Believing God is perfect and loving might even make you more vulnerable to committing suicide. Think about it.

 

[Michelle420]

What are we to do when our belief of God is different than the true God?

For example: We can believe our boss is mean and hateful when he is really the most gentle and caring boss in existence.

For example: We can believe our boss is the most gentle and caring boss in existence when he is really the most mean and hateful boss in the entire world.

Our belief of our boss does not alter the character of the boss in any way shape or form.

In the same vein. What we believe about God does not matter at all. What God really is determines the outcome not what our belief in Him is.

We have to be careful about that. God can put anybody in hell that He wants to put in hell. He is not obligated to be loving and caring. He is not obligated to be just. He could all the wicked people in heaven and all the kind people in hell just because He is bored. If He is really a god then He doesn't have to answer to anyone.

The people that believe God is kind and caring are in more danger of disappointment than those who believe He is hateful and vengeful. Does that make any sense?

I'll break it down a little in the next post with a creative analogy.

I watched some of it. I didn't like it. A vengeful God would not care about the mental state of someone doing this. A kind loving God would embrace those who just couldn't handle life any more, like Drifters sister, and embraces them when they arrive. Period. No ands ifs or buts about it.
If you have a vengeful God in your belief system....ok.
But if the God you believe in is like mine...He loves you. And if you decide to go before He calls...he damn sure is not going to make you suffer more.

I don't want to believe in that because having already lost my sister to suicide and not knowing what happens after we die I prefer to remain hope filled, and while nobody knows if God exists or the universal life force continues in a different plane, I'd rather go the optimistic route.

Anything is possible.

 

[presonorek]

I don't want to believe in that because having already lost my sister to suicide and not knowing what happens after we die I prefer to remain hope filled, and while nobody knows if God exists or the universal life force continues in a different plane, I'd rather go the optimistic route.

Anything is possible.

The whole concept of a god is an all powerful being. I don't see why it matters what we believe or what we want to believe. An all powerful being doesn't need our approval. A god(ess), if truly a god(ess), will do whatever he/she wants to do.

 

[Michelle420]

I don't want to believe in that because having already lost my sister to suicide and not knowing what happens after we die I prefer to remain hope filled, and while nobody knows if God exists or the universal life force continues in a different plane, I'd rather go the optimistic route.

Anything is possible.

The whole concept of a god is an all powerful being. I don't see why it matters what we believe or what we want to believe. An all powerful being doesn't need our approval. A god(ess), if truly a god(ess), will do whatever he/she wants to do.

If God exists sure, and of course it matters what you believe for your own peace of mind right now.

 

[presonorek]

If God exists sure, and of course it matters what you believe for your own peace of mind right now.

Being comfortable and having a peace of mind can be achieved through drugs. If the drugs quit working you can resort to suicide to achieve peace of mind.

Bad philosophy is bad and does affect the way you live your life. Believing in a perfect world is dangerous. It is extremely dangerous. Imposing a foolish philosophy on an entire society that the world is perfect is even more dangerous.

No thank you. I'll choose a more beneficial way to view the world and hope that you will do the same. Through the ages volumes and volumes of documents have been dedicated to this subject. There is no reason to reject wisdom in exchange for comfort. Wisdom is widely available to us today. You are correct though. Wisdom is not fun nor comforting. It only makes you more productive and useful to others. It does nothing for your temporary comfort or your temporary happiness.

 

[RodISHI]

No, she's not in hell. She was sick, Drifter. You have to be to do something like that.

If God exists then He can make his own decisions about that. He doesn't need anybody's input into the matter.

God exist even you you are unsure. I do agree with you He does make the ultimate decision.

 

[presonorek]

I don't want to believe in that because having already lost my sister to suicide and not knowing what happens after we die I prefer to remain hope filled, and while nobody knows if God exists or the universal life force continues in a different plane, I'd rather go the optimistic route.

Anything is possible.

The whole concept of a god is an all powerful being. I don't see why it matters what we believe or what we want to believe. An all powerful being doesn't need our approval. A god(ess), if truly a god(ess), will do whatever he/she wants to do.

If God exists sure, and of course it matters what you believe for your own peace of mind right now.

The goal of this thread is not to provide comfort. The goal of this thread is to prevent suicide.

Those two goals are not necessarily complimentary of one another. One goal achieves nothing. One goal reduces suicides.

Which one is more worthwhile? We all have to decide that for ourselves.

 

[Michelle420]

If God exists sure, and of course it matters what you believe for your own peace of mind right now.

Being comfortable and having a peace of mind can be achieved through drugs. If the drugs quit working you can resort to suicide to achieve peace of mind.

Bad philosophy is bad and does affect the way you live your life. Believing in a perfect world is dangerous. It is extremely dangerous. Imposing a foolish philosophy on an entire society that the world is perfect is even more dangerous.

No thank you. I'll choose a more beneficial way to view the world and hope that you will do the same.

Drugs don't achieve a peace of mind.

Philosophy is just that, Philosophy people pick what they like including you, mine is different and I'm fine with mine. I've had to deal with 3 suicides and a murder in my lifetime, I don't live a perfect life but I resolve to move forward and I prefer optimism in spite of it all.

You can do what works for you, your chosen philosophy is probably more beneficial for you, that doesn't mean your thought process is beneficial for everyone. It means that is what you choose and it works for you. You're not striking me as an absolutist

 

[Michelle420]

I don't want to believe in that because having already lost my sister to suicide and not knowing what happens after we die I prefer to remain hope filled, and while nobody knows if God exists or the universal life force continues in a different plane, I'd rather go the optimistic route.

Anything is possible.

The whole concept of a god is an all powerful being. I don't see why it matters what we believe or what we want to believe. An all powerful being doesn't need our approval. A god(ess), if truly a god(ess), will do whatever he/she wants to do.

If God exists sure, and of course it matters what you believe for your own peace of mind right now.

The goal of this thread is not to provide comfort. The goal of this thread is to prevent suicide.

Those two goals are not necessarily complimentary of one another.

The goal of her thread was to promote hope that the video gave to the woman who had a nde.

 

[RodISHI]

What are we to do when our belief of God is different than the true God?

For example: We can believe our boss is mean and hateful when he is really the most gentle and caring boss in existence.

For example: We can believe our boss is the most gentle and caring boss in existence when he is really the most mean and hateful boss in the entire world.

Our belief of our boss does not alter the character of the boss in any way shape or form.

In the same vein. What we believe about God does not matter at all. What God really is determines the outcome not what our belief in Him is.

We have to be careful about that. God can put anybody in hell that He wants to put in hell. He is not obligated to be loving and caring. He is not obligated to be just. He could all the wicked people in heaven and all the kind people in hell just because He is bored. If He is really a god then He doesn't have to answer to anyone.

The people that believe God is kind and caring are in more danger of disappointment than those who believe He is hateful and vengeful. Does that make any sense?

I'll break it down a little in the next post with a creative analogy.

I watched some of it. I didn't like it. A vengeful God would not care about the mental state of someone doing this. A kind loving God would embrace those who just couldn't handle life any more, like Drifters sister, and embraces them when they arrive. Period. No ands ifs or buts about it.
If you have a vengeful God in your belief system....ok.
But if the God you believe in is like mine...He loves you. And if you decide to go before He calls...he damn sure is not going to make you suffer more.

God does not put people in hell. People make choices to subject themselves while living in earth.

 

[Gracie]

It's a depressing topic after awhile. Kinda like Mr Gracie would never go to AA meetings cuz he said all their stories just made him so depressed he wanted to go buy a couple of bottles...which is essence caused the opposite affect with him in being and staying sober.

If life sucks, or you have nobody that depends on you and you don't want to be dependent on strangers if you are ill or whatever...then do what you feel you want to do and don't worry about whether God will turn His back on you too. He won't.

 

[September]

It would seem most Christians believe that when someone commits suicide it is because they are weak and pathetic or incredibly selfish and could not handle the human experience and decided to destroy the most precious thing that God had given them -Life- and that they will BURN in Hell forever and ever, where they will never stop screaming and their pain and torture will never ever end no matter how much they suffer and lose their mind. Eternity in hellfire, endlessly scorched by fire, endless and unfathomable pain and suffering, and tormented by demons in the worst possible way. That is what those who commit suicide have to look forward to... at least, according to most Christians.

Personally... I believe that humans experience many, many cycles of reincarnation until eventually achieving apotheosis... but I also believe in Heavens and Hells where souls might end up for a time in between lives...

​

 

[presonorek]

God does not put people in hell. People make choices to subject themselves while living in earth.

If humans are the ones who call the shots then by definition that is a non-god or humans are the gods of the god.

Your theology is nonsensical yet very common. Don't beat yourself up over it. Lots of people believe the same thing that you do.

The God of the Bible is Yahweh. His name means, "I am". I don't think that means He is manipulated by humans. It means He is whatever He is and nothing can be done to stop Him. After all, Isn't that what a god is?

 

[RodISHI]

God does not put people in hell. People make choices to subject themselves while living in earth.

If humans are the ones who call the shots then by definition that is a non-god or humans are the gods of the god.

Your theology is nonsensical yet very common. Don't beat yourself up over it. Lots of people believe the same thing that you do.

The God of the Bible is Yahweh. His name means, "I am". I don't think that means He is manipulated by humans. It means He is whatever He is and nothing can be done to stop Him. After all, Isn't that what a god is?

Yes it means "I am" a part of you. That is the spirit is with humankind, hidden deep within. That does not mean humans won't make choices. God stays in control but does give the human over to their own desires and there is consequences to those desires and choices the human makes.
I don't beat myself up and have no reason to. The Lord gave me a message to give to the community of His people a long time ago, "Tell them not to go into their camp. For if they go there they are subject to whatever goes on there"; It was in reference to going into the camp of the hell's angels.

 

[Delta4Embassy]

She was shown what would happen if she gave up and much more....

To Hell and Back (Died by Suicide) NDE & Hell Testimony

Everyone's thought about suicide. Unavoidable once you're asked "Have you ever thought about suicide?"

Went through a depressive bout many years ago and have a condition 1 .45 in my mouth finger on the trigger. ...Fortunately I'm a really bad shot so here I am.

 

[RodISHI]

She was shown what would happen if she gave up and much more....

To Hell and Back (Died by Suicide) NDE & Hell Testimony

Everyone's thought about suicide. Unavoidable once you're asked "Have you ever thought about suicide?"

Went through a depressive bout many years ago and have a condition 1 .45 in my mouth finger on the trigger. ...Fortunately I'm a really bad shot so here I am.

You still have a purpose to fulfill. I posted the video to share because I thought her message was a very inspiring one.