be life different in Alabama?

[MeadHallPirate]

Almost 60% black, hmmm...I wonder if that's what you would call a Republican county?

ahoy Meathead,

well met, matey. the voters 'o Hale County picked Mr. Obama to thar POTUS.

the thing is, though, only a doctor put someone up fer disability. ye can't just wake up with the idear and do it on yer own.

i figure most 'o the MDs be white in Hale County, aye?

- MeadHallPirate

That may not be the case. Meharry Medical School is in Nashville. That is a large predominately black school. Most of the grads from their medical school are black. There are a fair number of them throughout the south.

ahoy Sunshine me friend,

i did more research (which basically consisted 'o listenin' to the entire "This American Life" segment).

this be what i've found;

almost all the folks who went on disability Greensboro, Alabama (which be in Hale County) were referred by Dr. Perry Timberlake - the only general practitioner in the entire town, and he be white.

he asks his patients, "what grade did you finish?", an odd question, aye?

Dr. Timberlake went on...

"and rarely, rarely...im not sure if ever, did they finish college. alotta them finished the 12th grade, alotta them finished less than that. they've just a high school eduction. there aren't too many sit-down jobs. they just don't get the chance.".

Dr. Timberlake is sayin' 1 in 4 folks in Hale County be disabled because they can't get a job.

he puts'm on disability as an act 'o Christian compassion.

Trends With Benefits | This American Life

'tis interestin', mateys.

the US economy be creatin', roughly, 150,000 jobs per month...this be counterbalanced, to a degree, by the reality that 250,000 americans per month apply fer disability.

*ponders and gazes at the ink black sky...the waxin' moon...a barren harbor*

when i was writin' the OP, i felt sorta angry at all these layabouts in Alabama - a conservative stronghold - a tax welfare state thats nothin' but ballast on our seaworthy vessel...

...but maybe disability be one 'o the many, many devices that hath been set up to protect our most vulnerable. them who lack the education to be productive members 'o our society o'er the length 'o thar lives, because thar be a limit on how much manual labor one can squeeze outta a human being.

so maybe the huge influx 'o folks on disability be a price that we pay fer them who be left behind in a country that be doin' away with blue collar labor (we sent them jobs to places like Bangladesh).

'tis hard to figure what be the right thing to do on this topic.

*frowns*

aye.

- MeadHallPirate

 

[MeadHallPirate]

That's great, but unless they improve on public education, only the wealthier will be able to get the type of education necessary to apply for some of these jobs. Alabama is a red state and Republicans seem to want to get rid of public education, that won't help Alabama raise its standard of living.

ahoy Mertex,

argh.

i hope the folks in Alabama aren't countin' on education as the vessel that'll deliver them from the fiscal morass they're ensconced in, Mertex.

since 2008, the folks in Alabama hath cut thar fundin' fer K-12 education by o'er 21%, 2nd to Arizona as the biggest slashers 'o education monies in our great country.

- MeadHallPirate

 

[depotoo]

ahoy all,

In the past three decades, the number of Americans who get a monthly disability check from the federal government has skyrocketed. It's now up to 14 million people. That's due in part to our aging workforce. But in many pockets of the country, there's much more to the story. Factories and mills have closed and the U.S. economy has left behind millions of workers who now find themselves unfit or unqualified for the jobs that remain.

For many, going on disability is the answer. In some counties, nearly one in four working-age adults are not working because they are disabled, one in four.

In this part of the program, we're going to take you to one of the those places, Hale County, Alabama.

1 in 4 folks live completely on the funds 'o US taxpayers (them evil blue states, yarrrrRR!!!).

in a conversation that took place amongst a group 'o laddys who'd been put outta work by a mill closin' down in Alabama, this was the exchange;

BIRDSALL: It was an older guy there that worked for Work Source. And he just looked at me and he goes, Scott, he goes, I'm going to be honest with you. There's nobody going to hire you.

If there's no place for you around here where you're going to get a job, just draw your unemployment and just suck all the benefits you can out of the system until everything's gone and then you're on your own.

'tis a short piece to read, but apparently if ye live in Hale County, Alabama, thar be somethin' in the water or the food or what have ye, thats very bad fer backs;

JOFFE-WALT: There is no diagnosis called disability. You don't go to the doctor and the doctor says, well, we've run the tests and it looks like you have disability. It is, by definition, squishy. And in Hale County, one of the most common diagnoses is one of the squishiest - back pain.

In One Alabama County, Nearly 1 In 4 Working-Age Adults Is On Disability : NPR

does this forum have folks from the land 'o Alabama? i was wonderin' why this Southern, conservative, "personal responsibility" state hosts such a large armada 'o injured americans?

- MeadHallPirate

Hale County, AL voting demographics -

2004 Presidential Election results in Hale County Alabama
Kerry/Edwards (Democratic): 58.3%
Bush/Cheney (Republican): 41.3%


2008 Presidential Election results in Hale County Alabama
Obama (Democratic): 60.7%
McCain (Republican): 39.0%



2012 Presidential Election Results in Hale County Alabama
OBama (Democratic) 62.61%
Romney (Republican) 37.14%


Read more: Hale County, Alabama detailed profile - houses, real estate, cost of living, wages, work, agriculture, ancestries, and more

http://results.enr.clarityelections.com/AL/Hale/44327/114675/en/summary.html

 

[MeadHallPirate]

Hale County, AL voting demographics -

2004 Presidential Election results in Hale County Alabama
Kerry/Edwards (Democratic): 58.3%
Bush/Cheney (Republican): 41.3%


2008 Presidential Election results in Hale County Alabama
Obama (Democratic): 60.7%
McCain (Republican): 39.0%

2012 Presidential Election Results in Hale County Alabama
OBama (Democratic) 62.61%
Romney (Republican) 37.14%

Read more: Hale County, Alabama detailed profile - houses, real estate, cost of living, wages, work, agriculture, ancestries, and more

Hale - Election Results

ahoy Depotoo,

someone else posted the election results, matey.

i just don't see the relevance 'o them numbers, though.

the entire state be a black hole whar taxpayer monies from New Jersey, Connecticut, New York, Massachusetts, etc, etc, etc (it only be "etc" if ye name blue states, mostly) vanish, endlessly.

the entire state be a template 'o how to exist by the goodwill 'o the Federal coffers.

heck, Alabama even had to recently rewrite its state constitution so it could raid its Oil and Gas trust fund to plug the holes in its budget (they were hopin' fer another stimulus, fer the skipper's edicts had helped float that state fer the last few years, though they hate'm fer it). 'tis sorta like eatin' yer seed corn so ye don't go hungry, which i suppose be understandable, but it doesn't bode well fer the state's future.

'tis an odd place, Alabama.

shiver me timbers!

- MeadHallPirate

 

[depotoo]

their big problem seems to be the Education there. It is the biggest expense of their budget. Over 50% of their entire budget goes toward education

 

[Sunshine]

When I was in nursing school and took Community Health Nursing, there was a task we were called upon to complete, a community assessment.

In order to learn about a particular community an assessment was done to identify the core problems and values of that community. There are many aspects to a community assessment. The team doing the assessment has to call upon a lot of individuals in the community. You go to the government agencies, the churches, businesses, etc. Here are some of the things you are looking for:

•physical environment
•education
•safety and transportation
•politics and government
•health and social services
•communication
•economics
•recreation

You also look at:

air and water quality of the area, as well as the safety of the city

Community nursing assessment class help

If there is one community that is different in terms of employment, disability, etc. you would really need to do an assessment of that community and compare it to others to find out what 'the problem' is. And one thing we learned doing this assignment is that generally there is not ONE problem, but a set of problems that feeds into the larger issue. To think there can only be ONE problem is reductionist thinking, and will usually not pan out.

One thing we noticed when we did our community assessment was the level of denial present in some places. Example: We asked the schools if there was a problem in that community with teenage pregnancy. The answer was an emphatic 'no.' But when we went to the county health department and asked the same question, the answer was, 'teenage pregnancy is an epidemic in this county.'

So, based on something other than reductionist thinking, and regional bias against the south, the question is, 'what is the difference in this place and any other in the US?'

 

[Sunshine]

Hale County, AL voting demographics -

2004 Presidential Election results in Hale County Alabama
Kerry/Edwards (Democratic): 58.3%
Bush/Cheney (Republican): 41.3%


2008 Presidential Election results in Hale County Alabama
Obama (Democratic): 60.7%
McCain (Republican): 39.0%

2012 Presidential Election Results in Hale County Alabama
OBama (Democratic) 62.61%
Romney (Republican) 37.14%

Read more: Hale County, Alabama detailed profile - houses, real estate, cost of living, wages, work, agriculture, ancestries, and more

Hale - Election Results

ahoy Depotoo,

someone else posted the election results, matey.

i just don't see the relevance 'o them numbers, though.

the entire state be a black hole whar taxpayer monies from New Jersey, Connecticut, New York, Massachusetts, etc, etc, etc (it only be "etc" if ye name blue states, mostly) vanish, endlessly.
the entire state be a template 'o how to exist by the goodwill 'o the Federal coffers.

heck, Alabama even had to recently rewrite its state constitution so it could raid its Oil and Gas trust fund to plug the holes in its budget (they were hopin' fer another stimulus, fer the skipper's edicts had helped float that state fer the last few years, though they hate'm fer it). 'tis sorta like eatin' yer seed corn so ye don't go hungry, which i suppose be understandable, but it doesn't bode well fer the state's future.

'tis an odd place, Alabama.

shiver me timbers!

- MeadHallPirate

A similar statement issued by people about the Tennessee Valley Authority, the organization that provided jobs in this area after the Great Depression, built KY Dam and my beautiful KY Lake, and brought tourism to this area, an area where most of my neighbors have moved to because they loved it so much when they were here vacationing, a use of funds which was beneficial and productive. So is the use of funds you name beneficial and productive? If not, there needs to be some consideration of the wisdom of their use.

 

[midcan5]

ahoy Midcan5,

well met.

what do ye think, though, 'o the huge amount 'o folks who seem to languish on disability in Hale County, Alabama, matey?

- MeadHallPirate

The cynic in me could reply, human nature. Or maybe life is cheaper in the south so the government handout is nicer than Walmart wages. Or lifestyles of the poor and uneducated leads to nowhere. Or slavery made em all lazy, white black and in between. Or maybe the lack of unions and a lack of pride in work created a land of the obsolete. Or just maybe the job and/or welfare is too easy a choice?

Many years ago before automation, outsourcing, and more modern technology changed work, I was asked if I wanted a managerial position. I told them no way for when you are a workaholic and a bit of a perfectionist - I would have had to murder half of them. Years later after retirement considerations I changed my mind. So I have no easy answers. I will say that opportunity in the work world has changed and drudgery has now moved to the more educated who young provide the workforce for the elite. Presumably all disability requests are means tested so how one gets on disability may need reexamination. Interesting stuff below.

"As far as the federal government is concerned, you're disabled if you have a medical condition that makes it impossible to work. In practice, it's a judgment call made in doctors' offices and courtrooms around the country. The health problems where there is most latitude for judgment -- back pain, mental illness -- are among the fastest growing causes of disability."

http://apps.npr.org/unfit-for-work/

Trends With Benefits | This American Life


""We talk about the pain and what it’s like," he says. "I always ask them, 'What grade did you finish?'"

What grade did you finish, of course, is not really a medical question. But Dr. Timberlake believes he needs this information in disability cases because people who have only a high school education aren't going to be able to get a sit-down job.

Dr. Timberlake is making a judgment call that if you have a particular back problem and a college degree, you're not disabled. Without the degree, you are."


************** Edit **************

And then there is this side of work today:

'Taken for a Ride: Temp Agencies and ‘Raiteros’ in Immigrant Chicago'

"From this crowded barrio, raiteros ferry as many as 1,000 workers a day to warehouses and factories in Chicago and its suburbs. Many of these workers end up making about $6 an hour, well below Illinois' minimum wage of $8.25 an hour, because of the fees and unpaid waiting time.

"If you complain too much, they won't take you to work anymore," said Maria Castro, a Mexican immigrant who has worked on and off for Ty.

Like other workers, Castro said she has never been to Select Remedy, the temp agency that officially employs her. She knows Ty only as los peluches, Spanish for "the stuffed animals.""

http://www.propublica.org/article/taken-for-a-ride-temp-agencies-and-raiteros-in-immigrant-chicago

_

 

[editec]

Lonestar_logic

You have no response to my post answering your question?

None at all?!

Not even a simply thank you for taking my question seriously enough to bother to respond?

That's rather disappointing.

 

[Mertex]

That's great, but unless they improve on public education, only the wealthier will be able to get the type of education necessary to apply for some of these jobs. Alabama is a red state and Republicans seem to want to get rid of public education, that won't help Alabama raise its standard of living.

ahoy Mertex,

argh.

i hope the folks in Alabama aren't countin' on education as the vessel that'll deliver them from the fiscal morass they're ensconced in, Mertex.

It's major. Education is a major key to success!

since 2008, the folks in Alabama hath cut thar fundin' fer K-12 education by o'er 21%, 2nd to Arizona as the biggest slashers 'o education monies in our great country.

- MeadHallPirate

Seems like they don't want to improve their situation.

 

[MeadHallPirate]

A similar statement issued by people about the Tennessee Valley Authority, the organization that provided jobs in this area after the Great Depression, built KY Dam and my beautiful KY Lake, and brought tourism to this area, an area where most of my neighbors have moved to because they loved it so much when they were here vacationing, a use of funds which was beneficial and productive. So is the use of funds you name beneficial and productive? If not, there needs to be some consideration of the wisdom of their use.

ahoy Sunshine,

the bolded, to me, be the key metric to keep an eye on when the Federal Government doles out its monies...and long hath ye spoken 'o the vicissitudes 'o yer lakeside quarters, lass - it does sound wonderful.

it doesn't really bother me if the Federal Government sends monies to this state or that, but i do feel impatient (at times) when states that continually be tax welfare states seem scream the loudest when it comes to the evils 'o big government spendin'.

*bows*

- MeadHallPirate

 

[Sunshine]

A similar statement issued by people about the Tennessee Valley Authority, the organization that provided jobs in this area after the Great Depression, built KY Dam and my beautiful KY Lake, and brought tourism to this area, an area where most of my neighbors have moved to because they loved it so much when they were here vacationing, a use of funds which was beneficial and productive. So is the use of funds you name beneficial and productive? If not, there needs to be some consideration of the wisdom of their use.

ahoy Sunshine,

the bolded, to me, be the key metric to keep an eye on when the Federal Government doles out its monies...and long hath ye spoken 'o the vicissitudes 'o yer lakeside quarters, lass - it does sound wonderful.

it doesn't really bother me if the Federal Government sends monies to this state or that, but i do feel impatient (at times) when states that continually be tax welfare states seem scream the loudest when it comes to the evils 'o big government spendin'.

*bows*

- MeadHallPirate

Perhaps certain states are the loudest because it is not the actualy recipients screaming, but rather those individuals who have to watch the wastefulness up close and personal.

 

[Sunshine]

Explain why the unemployment rate in Alabama is 7.2% while the national average is 7.6% and California is 9.4%.

Could the type of work and amount of pay have anything to do with it? There may be plenty of jobs, but low-paying jobs that only benefit non-professionals.

Alabama's economy creating wrong kind of jobs, labor experts say | al.com

Airbus is spending billions to locate it's US manufacturing facility in Mobile, Hyundai has a $1.7 billion plant in Montgomery. Our dry-dock and ship building facilities are buzzing, but you'd rather push stereotypes.

That's great, but unless they improve on public education, only the wealthier will be able to get the type of education necessary to apply for some of these jobs. Alabama is a red state and Republicans seem to want to get rid of public education, that won't help Alabama raise its standard of living.

That just isn't true. A child who wants an education can find it in any of our public schools in this country. In fact, anyone who has a 5th grade education in this country can read and write well enough to go to college, and I know people who actually have sent their children to college at a young age, and those children have graduated college by the time they were teens. You can't force learning on someone who doesn't want it. And many don't want it because it isn't cool to be an egghead.

Now if you want to argue this point, then show me that Alabama's teachers aren't college graduates, and that they don't have books or buildings in which to learn.

Before we moved to TN, my children went to school in one of the worst school districts in the entire country. My children were motivated and enjoyed school, and when we moved to Nashville, they weren't behind at all. In fact my son qualified for and graducated from one of their academic magnet schools.

It is just tiresome when people do not hold those who fail accountable for their own failures. Your excuses for the personal failures of the world are disgusting.

 

[Sunshine]

Explain why the unemployment rate in Alabama is 7.2% while the national average is 7.6% and California is 9.4%.
Airbus is spending billions to locate it's US manufacturing facility in Mobile, Hyundai has a $1.7 billion plant in Montgomery. Our dry-dock and ship building facilities are buzzing, but you'd rather push stereotypes.

And then there is Gulf Shores, which I am in love with and where I plan to spend 2 months in 2014.

When you make it to Gulf Shores, you best post up. I'm 15 minutes away!

see red dot upper right.

You bet! I was there for a week last October.

 

[Sunshine]

ahoy Midcan5,

well met.

what do ye think, though, 'o the huge amount 'o folks who seem to languish on disability in Hale County, Alabama, matey?

- MeadHallPirate

The cynic in me could reply, human nature. Or maybe life is cheaper in the south so the government handout is nicer than Walmart wages. Or lifestyles of the poor and uneducated leads to nowhere. Or slavery made em all lazy, white black and in between. Or maybe the lack of unions and a lack of pride in work created a land of the obsolete. Or just maybe the job and/or welfare is too easy a choice?

Many years ago before automation, outsourcing, and more modern technology changed work, I was asked if I wanted a managerial position. I told them no way for when you are a workaholic and a bit of a perfectionist - I would have had to murder half of them. Years later after retirement considerations I changed my mind. So I have no easy answers. I will say that opportunity in the work world has changed and drudgery has now moved to the more educated who young provide the workforce for the elite. Presumably all disability requests are means tested so how one gets on disability may need reexamination. Interesting stuff below.

"As far as the federal government is concerned, you're disabled if you have a medical condition that makes it impossible to work. In practice, it's a judgment call made in doctors' offices and courtrooms around the country. The health problems where there is most latitude for judgment -- back pain, mental illness -- are among the fastest growing causes of disability."

http://apps.npr.org/unfit-for-work/

Trends With Benefits | This American Life


""We talk about the pain and what it’s like," he says. "I always ask them, 'What grade did you finish?'"

What grade did you finish, of course, is not really a medical question. But Dr. Timberlake believes he needs this information in disability cases because people who have only a high school education aren't going to be able to get a sit-down job.Dr. Timberlake is making a judgment call that if you have a particular back problem and a college degree, you're not disabled. Without the degree, you are."


************** Edit **************

And then there is this side of work today:

'Taken for a Ride: Temp Agencies and ‘Raiteros’ in Immigrant Chicago'

"From this crowded barrio, raiteros ferry as many as 1,000 workers a day to warehouses and factories in Chicago and its suburbs. Many of these workers end up making about $6 an hour, well below Illinois' minimum wage of $8.25 an hour, because of the fees and unpaid waiting time.

"If you complain too much, they won't take you to work anymore," said Maria Castro, a Mexican immigrant who has worked on and off for Ty.

Like other workers, Castro said she has never been to Select Remedy, the temp agency that officially employs her. She knows Ty only as los peluches, Spanish for "the stuffed animals.""

Taken for a Ride: Temp Agencies and ?Raiteros? in Immigrant Chicago - ProPublica

_

Regarding the bolded part of your post. There is something to that. My PH doctor told me to quit work and apply for disability in 2011. When you hear the word 'nurse' that generally means long hours lifting and pulling and on your feet all day. But I an an NP, and a psych NP at that. I sit most of the day. The extent of my physical activity is walking to the front to bring patients back to my office. And I have an easy case load, too. I haven't had to wrestle a single on of them at this clinic. The job is cushy. And I really like the pay. So I defied him and kept working. But I couldn't have worked the units, and nurses who work the units all have college degrees, just not the same ones I have. The term of art for HS grads and GED people working in hospitals is 'scut workers.' They wipe the butts, clean up the messes, and do the heaviest of the heavy lifting.

 

[Mertex]

Explain why the unemployment rate in Alabama is 7.2% while the national average is 7.6% and California is 9.4%.

Could the type of work and amount of pay have anything to do with it? There may be plenty of jobs, but low-paying jobs that only benefit non-professionals.

Alabama's economy creating wrong kind of jobs, labor experts say | al.com

Airbus is spending billions to locate it's US manufacturing facility in Mobile, Hyundai has a $1.7 billion plant in Montgomery. Our dry-dock and ship building facilities are buzzing, but you'd rather push stereotypes.

That's great, but unless they improve on public education, only the wealthier will be able to get the type of education necessary to apply for some of these jobs. Alabama is a red state and Republicans seem to want to get rid of public education, that won't help Alabama raise its standard of living.

That just isn't true. A child who wants an education can find it in any of our public schools in this country. In fact, anyone who has a 5th grade education in this country can read and write well enough to go to college, and I know people who actually have sent their children to college at a young age, and those children have graduated college by the time they were teens. You can't force learning on someone who doesn't want it. And many don't want it because it isn't cool to be an egghead.

Alabama just happens to be close to the bottom when it comes to ranking among the 50 states. It doesn't matter how much a child wants an education, if he only has access to substandard schools, he will not fare as well, as say, students in Mass, Vermont or other states. Alabama ranks #46 in student performance.


Alabama’s Rank in the National Report Card on School Funding
By Trisha Powell Crain . In School Finance . On June 20, 2012 No comments
“Is School Funding Fair? A National Report Card” was released yesterday. It is the second edition of the report, the first one was issued in 2010. Not surprisingly, Alabama didn’t rank highly. The Education Law Center published the report.
Alabama?s Rank in the National Report Card on School Funding

Now if you want to argue this point, then show me that Alabama's teachers aren't college graduates, and that they don't have books or buildings in which to learn.

They do have college degrees, but having a college degree does not mean that you will be a good teacher. Good teachers will seek work in a higher paying environment, wouldn't you? In teacher's pay, Alabama ranks #33.

Before we moved to TN, my children went to school in one of the worst school districts in the entire country. My children were motivated and enjoyed school, and when we moved to Nashville, they weren't behind at all. In fact my son qualified for and graducated from one of their academic magnet schools.

Tenn ranks #39. Many children do well in spite of the low ranking schools they attend, but imagine how much more they would have learned if they had gone to a school that ranks higher.

It is just tiresome when people do not hold those who fail accountable for their own failures. Your excuses for the personal failures of the world are disgusting.

If it was up to each individual, what they learn and how well they learn it, we wouldn't need schools. Making excuses for your state's lack of interest in education is more disgusting, and if you want to settle for lackluster education for your children, that is your choice. But, unless Alabama improves on their education system, the majority of its students will have to settle for low paying jobs after graduating or dropping out, or if they go to college, they will have to work harder. There is always exceptions, and some will do great in spite of it, but they are few. And our children are America's future, we should want them to have the best education possible.

Alabama's graduation rate is 69.9%, compared to Mass, 83.3%, NH 84.3%, and NJ 85.3%.

 

[Ernie S.]

Yes, Alabama ranks close to the bottom in education and near the top in % of population on welfare and in prison. Why do you suppose that is?

 

[MeadHallPirate]

Yes, Alabama ranks close to the bottom in education and near the top in % of population on welfare and in prison. Why do you suppose that is?

ahoy Ernie S.,

thar be a very low population 'o Asian Americans in Alabama?

*cheers*

- MeadHallPirate

 

[Ernie S.]

Yes, Alabama ranks close to the bottom in education and near the top in % of population on welfare and in prison. Why do you suppose that is?

ahoy Ernie S.,

thar be a very low population 'o Asian Americans in Alabama?

*cheers*

- MeadHallPirate

Way to low. It's nearly impossible to get decent egg fu yung. The Chinese restaurants don't serve green tea, only sweet tea and the Chinese buffet has fried chicken, hush puppies and boiled crawdads on the steam table.
The Chinese place closest to my place has been there for 20 years. The owner is more Rebel than I am. I stopped by to get a bite one Sunday afternoon and as I walked in, the owner told me in an accent that was a cross between Chinese and Old Dixie, "We fixin' ta close in a minute, darlin'."

 

[Mertex]

Yes, Alabama ranks close to the bottom in education and near the top in % of population on welfare and in prison. Why do you suppose that is?

I don't know. It's a red state, run by mostly Republicans, that could have something to do with it.