Are You More Or Less "Free" In A Society That

[Madeline]

You folks are being a bit dim IMO. here are some ways you might have a crap credit rating and thus, be unemployable, uninsurable, etc.:

* You could have an unpaid utility bill from college, nothing else, and generate a credit rating of 600. All available data suggests you are a bad risk, correct?

* You could have paid cash for everything you have bought in the previous ten years. Since you have not borrowed, you have also not repaid...and thus, you are a "bad risk".

* You could be less than 18 years old and have suffered identity theft, not know it, have parents who did not protect you, and be fucked before you ever leave home. Or over 18, and did not catch on in time.

* You might have declared bankruptcy due to job loss or catastrophic illness or both (about 95% of all personal bankruptcies fall in this class). Your credit rating will hover near 600 for the next 10 years.

* You might have cosigned a loan for someone who defaulted. Even if you knew they had stopped paying, you might not have been able to service the debt. The number one scenario here is a child's student loans.

Tell me, which of the above do you find to be "morally deficient"? Which ones should suffer being locked out of middle class life?

I think MarcATL is 100% correct....except I also think far too many Americans will have shit credit ratings for employers, etc. to be able to maintain their high standards.

 

[shintao]

Is it government that loans money, or is it corporations? Does the government sell you the washer and dryer or is it corporations? Is it government that sells trucks, or is it corporations? Is it government that sells heavy equipment, or is it corporations? Live in the reality, yes, good credit score equates to more freedoms

My point is that corporations control your freedoms like the other enity, the government. The only way to escape both is pay cash & give up credit. But you will never be as free as the illegal alien is in America.

WTF? Corporations can allow you to attain your freedoms. Not many people have, let's say money in the bank for a house or heavy equipment. Corporations can help, if you have the credit. Go ahead and pay cash....for what you can afford.
Have you ever seen a van full of illegals get in a wreck? They scatter like flies, I guess you can call that freedom. I've seen it, but it didn't look anything like freedom to me.

Outside of the cheese for credit because they can't get much cash out of you, what has a corporation done in your favor of freedoms? How did selling your credit history to the sharks help you out? How did sending all your personal information to India help you out? Why do people spend thousands a year making themselves invisible? If the mob wanted you for some reason, do you think they would have trouble finding you? Or an investigator? Or a creditor? I know, I know, "Well, if you haven't got anything to hide." The fact is, you have nothing that is hidden, nothing. Is that freedom? Maybe in your world, but not mine.


Ever seen a load of gang members bailout of a car and run, that don't seem like freedom to me either. Or in Arizona, innocent Mexicans being pulled from their cars.

 

[MarcATL]

Luck has nothing to do with it. In 1986, I was 24 years old, with 12K in the bank and making 40k/year. I made a conscious decision that credit wasn't smart money (unless you could get 0%). It has worked out well for me, though I can't count the days I had to "go without" because I didn't have the cash to go and get whatever I wanted NOW. What if you go out today and finance a home for 300K, based on your income, then get hit by a bus tomorrow?

Your wife will have to pay for the house, or be homeless.

Mine will bury me, then come back home to the house she owned the day she unlocked the door. But mine had to "do without" for a long time to help get us into that position.

Luck has absolutely nothing to do with it. ANYONE can do what I did, but it isn't an easy or convenient choice to make.

I bet if you give me the details of your backgrond and circumstances I can show you exactly how "luck" had everything to do with your current situation.

Of course that doesn't negate the actual hard work you put in, but to dispense with one's personal situation is just...folly. Just as it is to say everything is based on luck. It's a mix of the two. BTW...I use luck to equate to one's personal life circumstance.

 

[Dis]

You folks are being a bit dim IMO. here are some ways you might have a crap credit rating and thus, be unemployable, uninsurable, etc.:

* You could have an unpaid utility bill from college, nothing else, and generate a credit rating of 600. All available data suggests you are a bad risk, correct?

* You could have paid cash for everything you have bought in the previous ten years. Since you have not borrowed, you have also not repaid...and thus, you are a "bad risk".

* You could be less than 18 years old and have suffered identity theft, not know it, have parents who did not protect you, and be fucked before you ever leave home. Or over 18, and did not catch on in time.

* You might have declared bankruptcy due to job loss or catastrophic illness or both (about 95% of all personal bankruptcies fall in this class). Your credit rating will hover near 600 for the next 10 years.

* You might have cosigned a loan for someone who defaulted. Even if you knew they had stopped paying, you might not have been able to service the debt. The number one scenario here is a child's student loans.

Tell me, which of the above do you find to be "morally deficient"? Which ones should suffer being locked out of middle class life?

I think MarcATL is 100% correct....except I also think far too many Americans will have shit credit ratings for employers, etc. to be able to maintain their high standards.

Why on earth hasn't that utility bill been paid by now?

You guys can all hire each other, or anyone you want, and I can do the same - I fail to see the problem for anyone...

 

[Dis]

Luck has nothing to do with it. In 1986, I was 24 years old, with 12K in the bank and making 40k/year. I made a conscious decision that credit wasn't smart money (unless you could get 0%). It has worked out well for me, though I can't count the days I had to "go without" because I didn't have the cash to go and get whatever I wanted NOW. What if you go out today and finance a home for 300K, based on your income, then get hit by a bus tomorrow?

Your wife will have to pay for the house, or be homeless.

Mine will bury me, then come back home to the house she owned the day she unlocked the door. But mine had to "do without" for a long time to help get us into that position.

Luck has absolutely nothing to do with it. ANYONE can do what I did, but it isn't an easy or convenient choice to make.

I bet if you give me the details of your backgrond and circumstances I can show you exactly how "luck" had everything to do with your current situation.

Of course that doesn't negate the actual hard work you put in, but to dispense with one's personal situation is just...folly. Just as it is to say everything is based on luck. It's a mix of the two. BTW...I use luck to equate to one's personal life circumstance.

I hardly see how going without dinners out, movies, flashy clothes/jewelry, boats, motorcycles, vacations, etc. in the beginning of your life in an attempt to secure some sort of future for yourself falls under the category of "luck"..

Sounds an awful lot like self-sacrifice to me...

 

[MarcATL]

You folks are being a bit dim IMO. here are some ways you might have a crap credit rating and thus, be unemployable, uninsurable, etc.:

* You could have an unpaid utility bill from college, nothing else, and generate a credit rating of 600. All available data suggests you are a bad risk, correct?

* You could have paid cash for everything you have bought in the previous ten years. Since you have not borrowed, you have also not repaid...and thus, you are a "bad risk".

* You could be less than 18 years old and have suffered identity theft, not know it, have parents who did not protect you, and be fucked before you ever leave home. Or over 18, and did not catch on in time.

* You might have declared bankruptcy due to job loss or catastrophic illness or both (about 95% of all personal bankruptcies fall in this class). Your credit rating will hover near 600 for the next 10 years.

* You might have cosigned a loan for someone who defaulted. Even if you knew they had stopped paying, you might not have been able to service the debt. The number one scenario here is a child's student loans.

Tell me, which of the above do you find to be "morally deficient"? Which ones should suffer being locked out of middle class life?

I think MarcATL is 100% correct....except I also think far too many Americans will have shit credit ratings for employers, etc. to be able to maintain their high standards.

Of course they are!

All these RW heathens can see is someone or some group that is "taking something AWAY" from them. That fuels their political beliefs...not so much what they have or have earned or got, but what they can KEEP FROM others.

It's dripping and oozing from their every post on USMB.

Despicable!!

 

[Dis]

You folks are being a bit dim IMO. here are some ways you might have a crap credit rating and thus, be unemployable, uninsurable, etc.:

* You could have an unpaid utility bill from college, nothing else, and generate a credit rating of 600. All available data suggests you are a bad risk, correct?

* You could have paid cash for everything you have bought in the previous ten years. Since you have not borrowed, you have also not repaid...and thus, you are a "bad risk".

* You could be less than 18 years old and have suffered identity theft, not know it, have parents who did not protect you, and be fucked before you ever leave home. Or over 18, and did not catch on in time.

* You might have declared bankruptcy due to job loss or catastrophic illness or both (about 95% of all personal bankruptcies fall in this class). Your credit rating will hover near 600 for the next 10 years.

* You might have cosigned a loan for someone who defaulted. Even if you knew they had stopped paying, you might not have been able to service the debt. The number one scenario here is a child's student loans.

Tell me, which of the above do you find to be "morally deficient"? Which ones should suffer being locked out of middle class life?

I think MarcATL is 100% correct....except I also think far too many Americans will have shit credit ratings for employers, etc. to be able to maintain their high standards.

Of course they are!

All these RW heathens can see is someone or some group that is "taking something AWAY" from them. That fuels their political beliefs...not so much what they have or have earned or got, but what they can KEEP FROM others.

It's dripping and oozing from their every post on USMB.

Despicable!!

I'm not keeping anything from you that was actually YOURS to begin with. I'm simply keeping what is and was MINE from the second I earned it.

 

[MarcATL]

Luck has nothing to do with it. In 1986, I was 24 years old, with 12K in the bank and making 40k/year. I made a conscious decision that credit wasn't smart money (unless you could get 0%). It has worked out well for me, though I can't count the days I had to "go without" because I didn't have the cash to go and get whatever I wanted NOW. What if you go out today and finance a home for 300K, based on your income, then get hit by a bus tomorrow?

Your wife will have to pay for the house, or be homeless.

Mine will bury me, then come back home to the house she owned the day she unlocked the door. But mine had to "do without" for a long time to help get us into that position.

Luck has absolutely nothing to do with it. ANYONE can do what I did, but it isn't an easy or convenient choice to make.

I bet if you give me the details of your backgrond and circumstances I can show you exactly how "luck" had everything to do with your current situation.

Of course that doesn't negate the actual hard work you put in, but to dispense with one's personal situation is just...folly. Just as it is to say everything is based on luck. It's a mix of the two. BTW...I use luck to equate to one's personal life circumstance.

I hardly see how going without dinners out, movies, flashy clothes/jewelry, boats, motorcycles, vacations, etc. in the beginning of your life in an attempt to secure some sort of future for yourself falls under the category of "luck"..

Sounds an awful lot like self-sacrifice to me...

You did well, you did your part, nothing bad or unfortunate happened, you got lucky...many others start off on the same path and something awful interjects into their life and its all gone.

I'm happy everything worked out swimmingly for you.

Good job.

 

[MarcATL]

I'm not keeping anything from you that was actually YOURS to begin with. I'm simply keeping what is and was MINE from the second I earned it.

See? Prime example of being OBSESSED with the "what is mine" mentally of the right.

Nothing in the OP suggests taking away other's stuff. Only the lack of freedom that comes from being FORCED to have or prove good credit by Corporations.

I mean, damn...we live in a society where an individual has to PAY for their OWN credit report. In the instance where an individual can figure out where and/or how to do it for free, there's a LIMIT on how many times per year one can do this. BTW...none of the above is made or is actually "easy" for the average Joe/Jane to figure out, or do.

You don't find that SICK?!?? I bet you don't. Business as usual in your twisted RW world huh?

Disgusting!

 

[Mini 14]

Luck has nothing to do with it. In 1986, I was 24 years old, with 12K in the bank and making 40k/year. I made a conscious decision that credit wasn't smart money (unless you could get 0%). It has worked out well for me, though I can't count the days I had to "go without" because I didn't have the cash to go and get whatever I wanted NOW. What if you go out today and finance a home for 300K, based on your income, then get hit by a bus tomorrow?

Your wife will have to pay for the house, or be homeless.

Mine will bury me, then come back home to the house she owned the day she unlocked the door. But mine had to "do without" for a long time to help get us into that position.

Luck has absolutely nothing to do with it. ANYONE can do what I did, but it isn't an easy or convenient choice to make.

I bet if you give me the details of your backgrond and circumstances I can show you exactly how "luck" had everything to do with your current situation.

Of course that doesn't negate the actual hard work you put in, but to dispense with one's personal situation is just...folly. Just as it is to say everything is based on luck. It's a mix of the two. BTW...I use luck to equate to one's personal life circumstance.

And I bet if you give me the details of your background and circumstances I can show you exactly how your personal choices have put you in the position you are in today.

You're not looking for real solutions. You're looking for a quick, easy fix to your current personal dilemma.

Can't help you there, especially when you've already decided on the answer you want to hear.

 

[Dis]

I bet if you give me the details of your backgrond and circumstances I can show you exactly how "luck" had everything to do with your current situation.

Of course that doesn't negate the actual hard work you put in, but to dispense with one's personal situation is just...folly. Just as it is to say everything is based on luck. It's a mix of the two. BTW...I use luck to equate to one's personal life circumstance.

I hardly see how going without dinners out, movies, flashy clothes/jewelry, boats, motorcycles, vacations, etc. in the beginning of your life in an attempt to secure some sort of future for yourself falls under the category of "luck"..

Sounds an awful lot like self-sacrifice to me...

You did well, you did your part, nothing bad or unfortunate happened, you got lucky...many others start off on the same path and something awful interjects into their life and its all gone.

I'm happy everything worked out swimmingly for you.

Good job.

You don't know what happened in my life to make that determination.. You don't know what happened in anyones life, as a matter of fact.. Some people are just more driven than others, and refuse to give up.

 

[MarcATL]

And I bet if you give me the details of your background and circumstances I can show you exactly how your personal choices have put you in the position you are in today.

You're not looking for real solutions. You're looking for a quick, easy fix to your current personal dilemma.

Can't help you there, especially when you've already decided on the answer you want to hear.

I'm quite happy with my station in life. I'm doing well and only doing better and better. Thank you very much.

 

[blu]

Essentially REQUIRES an individual to have good credit to do/have practically anything.

Aka, an abode, whether rent or own, a car, access to loans (well, this one more understandable), and many other things that decades ago was not necessary.

Well I kinda agree with you to a point. For instance I find it offensive that employers are now starting to consider credit score as a criteria to get a job. That seems fucked up to me. As far as being hamstrung by a bad credit score. A lot of that comes from our society being dependent on Debt spending. Your credit score does not matter when you buy with in your means with Cash

buying with cash only is retarded. I do 0 interactions with cash and enjoy a great credit score and lots of free stuff on amazon through the credit card rewards program and pay 0$ in interest by paying the card off each month.

within the next 20 years we will be a completely "cash free" society and everything will finally go through credit/debit cards (no checks) as it should be now. once "digital cash" becomes properly designed it will quickly move all real cash out of the way

 

[Dis]

I'm not keeping anything from you that was actually YOURS to begin with. I'm simply keeping what is and was MINE from the second I earned it.

See? Prime example of being OBSESSED with the "what is mine" mentally of the right.

Nothing in the OP suggests taking away other's stuff. Only the lack of freedom that comes from being FORCED to have or prove good credit by Corporations.

I mean, damn...we live in a society where an individual has to PAY for their OWN credit report. In the instance where an individual can figure out where and/or how to do it for free, there's a LIMIT on how many times per year one can do this. BTW...none of the above is made or is actually "easy" for the average Joe/Jane to figure out, or do.

You don't find that SICK?!?? I bet you don't. Business as usual in your twisted RW world huh?

Disgusting!

I didn't reply to the OP again - I replied to your most recent statement.

And sure, it may not be easy to find your credit score for free, but with a bit of WORK and DETERMINATION, you can do it. You simply have to want to, and then get off your tail and actually DO something about it.

If everything were easy, nothing would be worth anything.

 

[Madeline]

You folks are being a bit dim IMO. here are some ways you might have a crap credit rating and thus, be unemployable, uninsurable, etc.:

* You could have an unpaid utility bill from college, nothing else, and generate a credit rating of 600. All available data suggests you are a bad risk, correct?

* You could have paid cash for everything you have bought in the previous ten years. Since you have not borrowed, you have also not repaid...and thus, you are a "bad risk".

* You could be less than 18 years old and have suffered identity theft, not know it, have parents who did not protect you, and be fucked before you ever leave home. Or over 18, and did not catch on in time.

* You might have declared bankruptcy due to job loss or catastrophic illness or both (about 95% of all personal bankruptcies fall in this class). Your credit rating will hover near 600 for the next 10 years.

* You might have cosigned a loan for someone who defaulted. Even if you knew they had stopped paying, you might not have been able to service the debt. The number one scenario here is a child's student loans.

Tell me, which of the above do you find to be "morally deficient"? Which ones should suffer being locked out of middle class life?

I think MarcATL is 100% correct....except I also think far too many Americans will have shit credit ratings for employers, etc. to be able to maintain their high standards.

Why on earth hasn't that utility bill been paid by now?

You guys can all hire each other, or anyone you want, and I can do the same - I fail to see the problem for anyone...

The average college kid in America is a financial idiot. Should someone lose all opportunity because he did not pay a $60 light bill? Dun that seem slightly out-of-proportion?

And no, paying the bill 3 years later dun clear up the credit report.

 

[blu]

Essentially REQUIRES an individual to have good credit to do/have practically anything.

Aka, an abode, whether rent or own, a car, access to loans (well, this one more understandable), and many other things that decades ago was not necessary.

you only need good credit if you want to do something on credit. you can buy a car with cash if you want (or have high enoughd own payment so that you get credit), and why would anyone give you a loan if you have shown in the past that you can't pay it back? I don't see this as a "freedom" issue at all

 

[MarcATL]

I hardly see how going without dinners out, movies, flashy clothes/jewelry, boats, motorcycles, vacations, etc. in the beginning of your life in an attempt to secure some sort of future for yourself falls under the category of "luck"..

Sounds an awful lot like self-sacrifice to me...

You did well, you did your part, nothing bad or unfortunate happened, you got lucky...many others start off on the same path and something awful interjects into their life and its all gone.

I'm happy everything worked out swimmingly for you.

Good job.

You don't know what happened in my life to make that determination.. You don't know what happened in anyones life, as a matter of fact.. Some people are just more driven than others, and refuse to give up.

I believe I commented directly based on th e info you gave.

So you're suggesting now that you did NOT do well? You did NOT make good choices? You did NOT work hard? That something MAJORLY bad happened during the course of your life to severely throw you off your life plan/goal, e.g. cancer, serious illness in the family, fire burn down your house and/or business, some other major catastophe?

Is this what you're NOW suggesting?

Correct me if I'm wrong.

 

[Dis]

You folks are being a bit dim IMO. here are some ways you might have a crap credit rating and thus, be unemployable, uninsurable, etc.:

* You could have an unpaid utility bill from college, nothing else, and generate a credit rating of 600. All available data suggests you are a bad risk, correct?

* You could have paid cash for everything you have bought in the previous ten years. Since you have not borrowed, you have also not repaid...and thus, you are a "bad risk".

* You could be less than 18 years old and have suffered identity theft, not know it, have parents who did not protect you, and be fucked before you ever leave home. Or over 18, and did not catch on in time.

* You might have declared bankruptcy due to job loss or catastrophic illness or both (about 95% of all personal bankruptcies fall in this class). Your credit rating will hover near 600 for the next 10 years.

* You might have cosigned a loan for someone who defaulted. Even if you knew they had stopped paying, you might not have been able to service the debt. The number one scenario here is a child's student loans.

Tell me, which of the above do you find to be "morally deficient"? Which ones should suffer being locked out of middle class life?

I think MarcATL is 100% correct....except I also think far too many Americans will have shit credit ratings for employers, etc. to be able to maintain their high standards.

Why on earth hasn't that utility bill been paid by now?

You guys can all hire each other, or anyone you want, and I can do the same - I fail to see the problem for anyone...

The average college kid in America is a financial idiot. Should someone lose all opportunity because he did not pay a $60 light bill? Dun that seem slightly out-of-proportion?

And no, paying the bill 3 years later dun clear up the credit report.

No, it doesn't show it as cleared - but it DOES show it as PAID, and no longer in default. A tiny bit of legwork, and a couple phone calls is what gets it REMOVED from said credit report..

Again, that's work. You actually have to DO something about it.

 

[Cedarswamp]

Do you consider nuzzling the government teat freedom? If you can't provide for yourself you're already someones slave.

 

[Dis]

You did well, you did your part, nothing bad or unfortunate happened, you got lucky...many others start off on the same path and something awful interjects into their life and its all gone.

I'm happy everything worked out swimmingly for you.

Good job.

You don't know what happened in my life to make that determination.. You don't know what happened in anyones life, as a matter of fact.. Some people are just more driven than others, and refuse to give up.

I believe I commented directly based on th e info you gave.

So you're suggesting now that you did NOT do well? You did NOT make good choices? You did NOT work hard? That something MAJORLY bad happened during the course of your life to severely throw you off your life plan/goal, e.g. cancer, serious illness in the family, fire burn down your house and/or business, some other major catastophe?

Is this what you're NOW suggesting?

Correct me if I'm wrong.

I'm telling you I fought my way through every obstacle in life and didn't waste precious time by screaming that things were unfair. I simply did what I had to do to get to where I want to be.

You're welcome to assume anything you like in regards to me. I'm fine with it.