Angela Corey should be fired

[bigrebnc1775]

Would you bet your life on it? or do you never leave your house? No one has ever approached you on the street to ask you a question?

I'd bet my life I wouldn't be in a sitauation where a kid might think I'm a mortal threat to him.

Or be a mortal threat...

So yeah, pretty sure.

Dude you don't know that anything is possible. You could have car trouble when you forced to take a detour, because you had to go to the hospital at two in the morning, and while you out of your car two thugs walk up too you and try too rob you at knife point.

 

[JoeB131]

[
I take it then that it is your contention, Joe, that if someone is Black, or happens to belong to any other designated ethnic "victim group", it is perfectly OK for them to decide that they may prey upon any and all White people, .

Nope, didn't say that at all. Go back, read it again, and have someone help you with the big words.

 

[JoeB131]

Would you bet your life on it? or do you never leave your house? No one has ever approached you on the street to ask you a question?

I'd bet my life I wouldn't be in a sitauation where a kid might think I'm a mortal threat to him.

Or be a mortal threat...

So yeah, pretty sure.

Dude you don't know that anything is possible. You could have car trouble when you forced to take a detour, because you had to go to the hospital at two in the morning, and while you out of your car two thugs walk up too you and try too rob you at knife point.

I wouldn't have walked out of the door with a fucking gun... so, no, the chance I shot an innocent kid with a bag of skittles would be pretty unlikely.

But lets say I took them on with a tire-iron and by some kind of lucky break, inflicted fatal injuries on them.

Probably they had criminal records. And, oh, yeah, there would be that knife in their hands that would indicate I really, really did have a reasonable fear of my life.

Skittles aren't dangerous.

 

[bigrebnc1775]

I'd bet my life I wouldn't be in a sitauation where a kid might think I'm a mortal threat to him.

Or be a mortal threat...

So yeah, pretty sure.

Dude you don't know that anything is possible. You could have car trouble when you forced to take a detour, because you had to go to the hospital at two in the morning, and while you out of your car two thugs walk up too you and try too rob you at knife point.

I wouldn't have walked out of the door with a fucking gun... so, no, the chance I shot an innocent kid with a bag of skittles would be pretty unlikely.

But lets say I took them on with a tire-iron and by some kind of lucky break, inflicted fatal injuries on them.

Probably they had criminal records. And, oh, yeah, there would be that knife in their hands that would indicate I really, really did have a reasonable fear of my life.

Skittles aren't dangerous.

I wouldn't have walked out of the door with a fucking gun... so, no, the chance I shot an innocent kid with a bag of skittles would be pretty unlikely.

You are hung up on that bullshit media produced Skittles. Did Trayvon have skittles? Was it in the police report? Or was it what al sharpton told Trayvon parents to say that he had?


I seriously doubt you could defend your life with a tie iron against two experienced thug's with knives. for one thing your tie iron will be in the trunk in a locked compartment, because it's not a flat you're fixing.. But keep thinking that. Now let's up the danger what if they had a gun?

 

[gallantwarrior]

Still racist.

For the record, I think it is ridiculous for anyone to judge anyone. I also think it is ridiculous for anyone to think anyone else should be outraged about anything.

You, being a racist, probably don't get what I mean.

I think the thing is, if you kick a dog every day of its life, some day that dog is going to turn around and maul you.

And people are going to do the same thing, being the animals that we are...

Again, we're white, we've never been pulled over for a DWB (Driving While Black); African American friends of mine say that they usually calculate this into any driving plan they have. Studies show that resumes with names like "Jamal" get rejected at twice the rate as ones with the name "Michael" on them.

And to be fair, most of them grin and bear it, at least until they see an absolute travesty like the cops who beat Rodney King getting a walk from an all white jury.

When i was in the Guard, and they were teaching us Civil Disturbance training, the first thing the officer giving the class said was, 'These people are not the enemy they are your fellow citizens, they are damned mad about something and they probably have the right to be."

So, yes, if we mess it up and don't convict Zimmerman, there will be riots. Hope you can live with that.

Thank you for proving that you, being a racist, just don't get what I am saying.

I can easily imagine what it feels like to get profiled, even if it has never happened to me. If people who have had that happen to them want to be outraged about it, I will support them. I, personally, am outraged about it, even though it has never happened to me. That does not mean I think that everyone who is black should be outraged about it. It does not offend me that Herman Cain, who is black, is not deeply and personally offended by the fact that this kind of stuff happened while he was growing up, or that he is not morally outraged by personally being pulled over for being a black man in a white man's car. The reason for that is simple, I am not a racist, and I don't think people should react based on the color of their skin.

I am also pretty sure that comparing blacks to dogs is offensive to blacks.

While it may be normal for some to feel outraged and angry, especially after they are fed the racist drivel that Sharpton, Jackson, et.al. specialize in dishing out, it is NOT acceptable to express that outrage and anger by rioting, raping, pillaging, burning, and attacking innocent people who have nothing more than be born with a different skin color.

 

[gallantwarrior]

Speaking of fail. Geez, just because you have no use for a firearm doesn't mean they are useless. LOL

Um, guy. I've listened to the gun nuts tell me why they need guns, and their two top reasons are kind of retarded.

Reason -1 - "To shoot them minorities...errrr criminals when they comes to my house!"

Ummm, actually, there's a 4300% greater chance that gun will kill a member of your family than a bad guy.

Reason 2- "I need that in case the gummit needs to overthrown".

The GOvernment has bigger guns, along with tanks, fighter, drones, artillery, and if they ever decide to take you out, it's because your neighbors called you in because you were frightening the children.

Although you are only detailing the reasons why you think some people feel they need firearms, and why you feel you do not need any, that doesn't mean other people should be disenfranchised of their right to own a firearm.
This is generally another of those liberal/conservative schisms. Liberals feel that because they do not want to do or own something, that no one else should be permitted to do or own those things either. Firearms ownership falls into that category. People who wish to own firearms do not constantly strive to force everyone else to own them, too. But the same cannot be said of the anti-gun folks. If they don't want to own a gun, fine. But they have no right to force me to give up my firearms.

 

[gallantwarrior]

Still racist.

For the record, I think it is ridiculous for anyone to judge anyone. I also think it is ridiculous for anyone to think anyone else should be outraged about anything.

You, being a racist, probably don't get what I mean.

I think the thing is, if you kick a dog every day of its life, some day that dog is going to turn around and maul you.

And people are going to do the same thing, being the animals that we are...

Again, we're white, we've never been pulled over for a DWB (Driving While Black); African American friends of mine say that they usually calculate this into any driving plan they have. Studies show that resumes with names like "Jamal" get rejected at twice the rate as ones with the name "Michael" on them.

And to be fair, most of them grin and bear it, at least until they see an absolute travesty like the cops who beat Rodney King getting a walk from an all white jury.

When i was in the Guard, and they were teaching us Civil Disturbance training, the first thing the officer giving the class said was, 'These people are not the enemy they are your fellow citizens, they are damned mad about something and they probably have the right to be."

So, yes, if we mess it up and don't convict Zimmerman, there will be riots. Hope you can live with that.

I take it then that it is your contention, Joe, that if someone is Black, or happens to belong to any other designated ethnic "victim group", it is perfectly OK for them to decide that they may prey upon any and all White people, with whatever degree of violence and atrocity they may choose; after all, "we have no right" to demand any standard of civilized behavior from them. I take it also, that it is your contention that justice should be decided by the rule of the mob in the streets (at least if that mob is comprised of members of a "persecuted minority"); after all, what's the sacrifice of one man's life and liberty to appease the mob, especially if they are all "victims"?

Here's my answer. The second part of this, is absolute anathema to everything that makes America the country she is; it flies in the face of the constitution and rule of law, is abhorrent to liberty, and an absolute mockery of justice for the purpose of appeasement and political expediency. Such a sentiment reveals its author as a soul too craven, too unprincipled, and too spineless, to defend either his own rights or anyone else's, lest he have to get some blood on his lily-white, soft, hypocritical hands in the process. I will NOT accord to one with such a nature even my contempt, as any such creature is both beneath it, and unworthy to be called an American, or even a man.

As to the first part, it is, if anything, as contemptible and as un-American as the second. He who would advocate such a course, abrogates the principles of liberty and real equality, tramples the constitution, and is a creature so filled with self-loathing as to be beneath pity. You hate your own to the extent that I am led to suppose that you would suggest that a man offer up his wife to be raped and tortured by a any fiend or group of fiends who happened to belong to some "oppressed minority", and then get on his knees and beg for his own life like a mangy whipped hound licking its master's boots. I suspect, more likely, you would simply suggest that course of action to others, who you deem unworthy of the right of defending themselves and their families against criminal predation; as for yourself, you'd hope to offer them someone else's wife and daughters, in the hope that that might be sufficient sacrifice to the predators to encourage them, in their infinite mercy, to leave you and yours alone. THAT, even the mere suggestion of it, is an act, and a thought, so selfish, and so odious, and of such self-serving moral and physical cowardice, that I would never have believed that even YOU would be capable of uttering it! That is a thought and act unworthy of the lowliest, ill-bred, simpering cur dog; I daresay even a cornered mouse would show a higher level of "valor".

That is all. I no longer care to tolerate the stench of your verbal defecations here.

What you wrote indicates that you are angry and outraged.

 

[gallantwarrior]

I'd bet my life I wouldn't be in a sitauation where a kid might think I'm a mortal threat to him.

Or be a mortal threat...

So yeah, pretty sure.

Dude you don't know that anything is possible. You could have car trouble when you forced to take a detour, because you had to go to the hospital at two in the morning, and while you out of your car two thugs walk up too you and try too rob you at knife point.

I wouldn't have walked out of the door with a fucking gun... so, no, the chance I shot an innocent kid with a bag of skittles would be pretty unlikely.

But lets say I took them on with a tire-iron and by some kind of lucky break, inflicted fatal injuries on them.

Probably they had criminal records. And, oh, yeah, there would be that knife in their hands that would indicate I really, really did have a reasonable fear of my life.

Skittles aren't dangerous.

Wouldn't it be racist, though, if all they wanted was a light? And you beat them with a tire iron.

 

[JoeB131]

[

You are hung up on that bullshit media produced Skittles. Did Trayvon have skittles? Was it in the police report? Or was it what al sharpton told Trayvon parents to say that he had?


I seriously doubt you could defend your life with a tie iron against two experienced thug's with knives. for one thing your tie iron will be in the trunk in a locked compartment, because it's not a flat you're fixing.. But keep thinking that. Now let's up the danger what if they had a gun?

Then I'd hand over my wallet and that would be that, which is by the way what the police say you SHOULD do if threatened by someone with a knife or gun.

Of course, if I went for a gun, his would already be out, and that wouldn't be such a good thing.

You know, I'm always amazed by you gun fetishists and your obsession with crime. You need guns because there are so many bad guys out there. We lock up more people than any country in the world, and you are still quaking in your boots in fear. You'd think that we were living in some kind of Mad Max scenario the way you all are carrying on.

 

[JoeB131]

Dude you don't know that anything is possible. You could have car trouble when you forced to take a detour, because you had to go to the hospital at two in the morning, and while you out of your car two thugs walk up too you and try too rob you at knife point.

I wouldn't have walked out of the door with a fucking gun... so, no, the chance I shot an innocent kid with a bag of skittles would be pretty unlikely.

But lets say I took them on with a tire-iron and by some kind of lucky break, inflicted fatal injuries on them.

Probably they had criminal records. And, oh, yeah, there would be that knife in their hands that would indicate I really, really did have a reasonable fear of my life.

Skittles aren't dangerous.

Wouldn't it be racist, though, if all they wanted was a light? And you beat them with a tire iron.

Actually, if all they wanted was a light and I started brandishing a tire iron, they'd probably scream something like "Shit, that white boy crazy!" and run.

 

[bigrebnc1775]

[

You are hung up on that bullshit media produced Skittles. Did Trayvon have skittles? Was it in the police report? Or was it what al sharpton told Trayvon parents to say that he had?


I seriously doubt you could defend your life with a tie iron against two experienced thug's with knives. for one thing your tie iron will be in the trunk in a locked compartment, because it's not a flat you're fixing.. But keep thinking that. Now let's up the danger what if they had a gun?

Then I'd hand over my wallet and that would be that, which is by the way what the police say you SHOULD do if threatened by someone with a knife or gun.

Of course, if I went for a gun, his would already be out, and that wouldn't be such a good thing.

You know, I'm always amazed by you gun fetishists and your obsession with crime. You need guns because there are so many bad guys out there. We lock up more people than any country in the world, and you are still quaking in your boots in fear. You'd think that we were living in some kind of Mad Max scenario the way you all are carrying on.

People are killed even though they hand over their wallet.

You know, I'm always amazed by you gun fetishists and your obsession with crime. You need guns because there are so many bad guys out there. We lock up more people than any country in the world, and you are still quaking in your boots in fear. You'd think that we were living in some kind of Mad Max scenario the way you all are carrying on

I live in the real world you live in some alternate kumbaya holding each others hand by campfire world. There are people out there that will kill you on a dare or just too join a gang.

 

[JoeB131]

You know, I'm always amazed by you gun fetishists and your obsession with crime. You need guns because there are so many bad guys out there. We lock up more people than any country in the world, and you are still quaking in your boots in fear. You'd think that we were living in some kind of Mad Max scenario the way you all are carrying on.

People are killed even though they hand over their wallet.

People are killed because they got into a fight with their gun-fetishist brother in law over who got the last strip of bacon! In fact, most murder victims know their killer.

I live in the real world you live in some alternate kumbaya holding each others hand by campfire world. There are people out there that will kill you on a dare or just too join a gang.

Yes, there are.. there are also gun fetishists who spend their whole lives being afraid of them, but a member of their family is 43 times more likely to be on the business end of one of their guns.

But I go back to my point. Why are these people out there?

You compare the US to a country like Germany, where they don't have a lot of privately owned guns, and only look up 78,000 criminals compared to the 2 million people we lock up, and they don't have nearly the murder rate we have.

Germany has a murder rate of .84 per 100,000 compared to the US with a murder rate of 4.8 per 100,000.

Hmmmmm.... what are the Germans doing that we arent doing? Hmmmmmmmm.

(I let you stew on that one for a few minutes.)

 

[bigrebnc1775]

You know, I'm always amazed by you gun fetishists and your obsession with crime. You need guns because there are so many bad guys out there. We lock up more people than any country in the world, and you are still quaking in your boots in fear. You'd think that we were living in some kind of Mad Max scenario the way you all are carrying on.

People are killed even though they hand over their wallet.

People are killed because they got into a fight with their gun-fetishist brother in law over who got the last strip of bacon! In fact, most murder victims know their killer.

I live in the real world you live in some alternate kumbaya holding each others hand by campfire world. There are people out there that will kill you on a dare or just too join a gang.

Yes, there are.. there are also gun fetishists who spend their whole lives being afraid of them, but a member of their family is 43 times more likely to be on the business end of one of their guns.

But I go back to my point. Why are these people out there?

You compare the US to a country like Germany, where they don't have a lot of privately owned guns, and only look up 78,000 criminals compared to the 2 million people we lock up, and they don't have nearly the murder rate we have.

Germany has a murder rate of .84 per 100,000 compared to the US with a murder rate of 4.8 per 100,000.

Hmmmmm.... what are the Germans doing that we arent doing? Hmmmmmmmm.

(I let you stew on that one for a few minutes.)

German gun controls to be tightened - CNN

 

[KissMy]

You know, I'm always amazed by you gun fetishists and your obsession with crime. You need guns because there are so many bad guys out there. We lock up more people than any country in the world, and you are still quaking in your boots in fear. You'd think that we were living in some kind of Mad Max scenario the way you all are carrying on.

People are killed even though they hand over their wallet.

People are killed because they got into a fight with their gun-fetishist brother in law over who got the last strip of bacon! In fact, most murder victims know their killer.

I live in the real world you live in some alternate kumbaya holding each others hand by campfire world. There are people out there that will kill you on a dare or just too join a gang.

Yes, there are.. there are also gun fetishists who spend their whole lives being afraid of them, but a member of their family is 43 times more likely to be on the business end of one of their guns.

But I go back to my point. Why are these people out there?

You compare the US to a country like Germany, where they don't have a lot of privately owned guns, and only look up 78,000 criminals compared to the 2 million people we lock up, and they don't have nearly the murder rate we have.

Germany has a murder rate of .84 per 100,000 compared to the US with a murder rate of 4.8 per 100,000.

Hmmmmm.... what are the Germans doing that we arent doing? Hmmmmmmmm.

(I let you stew on that one for a few minutes.)

I don't give a shit what JoeGives131blowjobs says. You are absolutely not safer without citizens Conceal Carrying Guns.

When it was illegal to carry guns I did not have a gun, but I had 7 guns pulled on me. One was a family member. I have other family members who have shot another family member when CCW was illegal. Not having a gun does not mean a family member will not shoot you over the last strip of bacon!

Now that it is legal to carry & I have guns and I have not had a gun pulled on me since.

Polite society means safe society.

 

[JoeB131]

I don't give a shit what JoeGives131blowjobs says. You are absolutely not safer without citizens Conceal Carrying Guns.

When it was illegal to carry guns I did not have a gun, but I had 7 guns pulled on me. One was a family member. Not having a gun does not mean a family member will not shoot you.

Now that it is legal to carry & I have guns and I have not had a gun pulled on me since.

Polite society means safe society.

Guy, I really have to wonder what kind of life you live when you've had people pull guns on you 7 times in your life.

I've lived most of my life in Chicago, never had a gun pulled on me, once. Ever. The only time I've been a victim of a crime was when I was on National Guard manuevers for two weeks and someone robbed my house when I wasn't home. And I lived in a pretty shitty neighborhood at the time.

Point is, a gun is 43 times more likely to kill a family member than a criminal, and most murder victims know their murderers. Guns do not make us safer.

All that said- one more time- I don't want to ban guns, or really even change the gun laws that much.

Saying you are wearing a silly hat doesn't mean I want to take your hat away. It just means you look silly in it.

 

[KissMy]

I don't give a shit what JoeGives131blowjobs says. You are absolutely not safer without citizens Conceal Carrying Guns.

When it was illegal to carry guns I did not have a gun, but I had 7 guns pulled on me. One was a family member. I have other family members who have shot another family member when CCW was illegal. Not having a gun does not mean a family member will not shoot you over the last strip of bacon!

Now that it is legal to carry & I have guns and I have not had a gun pulled on me since.

Polite society means safe society.

Guy, I really have to wonder what kind of life you live when you've had people pull guns on you 7 times in your life.

I've lived most of my life in Chicago, never had a gun pulled on me, once. Ever. The only time I've been a victim of a crime was when I was on National Guard manuevers for two weeks and someone robbed my house when I wasn't home. And I lived in a pretty shitty neighborhood at the time.

Point is, a gun is 43 times more likely to kill a family member than a criminal, and most murder victims know their murderers. Guns do not make us safer.

All that said- one more time- I don't want to ban guns, or really even change the gun laws that much.

Saying you are wearing a silly hat doesn't mean I want to take your hat away. It just means you look silly in it.

You likely live in fear of others, avoid areas, walk away from bullies & aggressive assholes. I don't! When a bullie or agressive asshole tells me to shut-up or leave a place I have every right to be, the next words out of my mouth are why don't you make me. I stand my ground.

Most of my friends & family did not believe I had guns pulled on me either until they were with me a couple of times when it happened. They froze in fear while I handled the situation. In school bullies just wanted to attack me, I don't know why. It is probably because I don't cower & take any shit from anyone. I stand my ground & give right back to them. I never started a fight, swing at or hit anyone first, but I have been in at least a hundred fights & only lost 1 because I was sitting on a barstool drunk when 2 assholes hit me from behind.

I don't feel you should have to live life in fear of others, let them push you around or have to avoid places you have a right to be. My school principal was on my ass for being in so many fights believing that I had to be starting them. I made him a deal that every-time someone told me they were going to beat my ass or they were going to jump me, if I had the chance I would tell him first so he could deal with them before I had to. Three days later I went to the office & told him when & where the next time I was going to defend myself was going to be after the school thugs said they were going to jump my ass on the way to lunch. He was watching out the window when they did. To bad he did not make it out in time before I injured 2 thugs & the teacher. He never called me into the office again.

 

[bodecea]

Angela Corey should go to jail for a long time for what she did...Pissing on our justice system is a very serious offense.

 

[JoeB131]

You likely live in fear of others, avoid areas, walk away from bullies & aggressive assholes. I don't! When a bullie or agressive asshole tells me to shut-up or leave a place I have every right to be, the next words out of my mouth are why don't you make me. I stand my ground.

Most of my friends & family did not believe I had guns pulled on me either until they were with me a couple of times when it happened. They froze in fear while I handled the situation. In school bullies just wanted to attack me, I don't know why. It is probably because I don't cower & take any shit from anyone. I stand my ground & give right back to them. I never started a fight, swing at or hit anyone first, but I have been in at least a hundred fights & only lost 1 because I was sitting on a barstool drunk when 2 assholes hit me from behind.

I don't feel you should have to live life in fear of others, let them push you around or have to avoid places you have a right to be. My school principal was on my ass for being in so many fights believing that I had to be starting them. I made him a deal that every-time someone told me they were going to beat my ass or they were going to jump me, if I had the chance I would tell him first so he could deal with them before I had to. Three days later I went to the office & told him when & where the next time I was going to defend myself was going to be after the school thugs said they were going to jump my ass on the way to lunch. He was watching out the window when they did. To bad he did not make it out in time before I injured 2 thugs & the teacher. He never called me into the office again.

Dude, it sounds to me like you have serious anger management problems. Seriously, you are probably going to be a Zimmerman at some point... and that's bad for you.

 

[logical4u]

I don't give a shit what JoeGives131blowjobs says. You are absolutely not safer without citizens Conceal Carrying Guns.

When it was illegal to carry guns I did not have a gun, but I had 7 guns pulled on me. One was a family member. Not having a gun does not mean a family member will not shoot you.

Now that it is legal to carry & I have guns and I have not had a gun pulled on me since.

Polite society means safe society.

Guy, I really have to wonder what kind of life you live when you've had people pull guns on you 7 times in your life.

I've lived most of my life in Chicago, never had a gun pulled on me, once. Ever. The only time I've been a victim of a crime was when I was on National Guard manuevers for two weeks and someone robbed my house when I wasn't home. And I lived in a pretty shitty neighborhood at the time.

Point is, a gun is 43 times more likely to kill a family member than a criminal, and most murder victims know their murderers. Guns do not make us safer.

All that said- one more time- I don't want to ban guns, or really even change the gun laws that much.

Saying you are wearing a silly hat doesn't mean I want to take your hat away. It just means you look silly in it.

According to the National Self Defense Survey conducted by Florida State University criminologists in 1994, the rate of Defensive Gun Uses can be projected nationwide to approximately 2.5 million per year -- one Defensive Gun Use every 13 seconds.
Among 15.7% of gun defenders interviewed nationwide during The National Self Defense Survey, the defender believed that someone "almost certainly" would have died had the gun not been used for protection -- a life saved by a privately held gun about once every 1.3 minutes. (In another 14.2% cases, the defender believed someone "probably" would have died if the gun hadn't been used in defense.)

In 83.5% of these successful gun defenses, the attacker either threatened or used force first -- disproving the myth that having a gun available for defense wouldn't make any difference.

In 91.7% of these incidents the defensive use of a gun did not wound or kill the criminal attacker (and the gun defense wouldn't be called "newsworthy" by newspaper or TV news editors). In 64.2% of these gun-defense cases, the police learned of the defense, which means that the media could also find out and report on them if they chose to.

In 73.4% of these gun-defense incidents, the attacker was a stranger to the intended victim. (Defenses against a family member or intimate were rare -- well under 10%.) This disproves the myth that a gun kept for defense will most likely be used against a family member or someone you love.

In over half of these gun defense incidents, the defender was facing two or more attackers -- and three or more attackers in over a quarter of these cases. (No means of defense other than a firearm -- martial arts, pepper spray, or stun guns -- gives a potential victim a decent chance of getting away uninjured when facing multiple attackers.)

In 79.7% of these gun defenses, the defender used a concealable handgun. A quarter of the gun defenses occured in places away from the defender's home.


Source: "Armed Resistance to Crime: The Prevalence and Nature of Self-Defense with a Gun," by Gary Kleck and Marc Gertz, in The Journal of Criminal Law & Criminology, Northwestern University School of Law, Volume 86, Number 1, Fall, 1995


from the website: The Defensive Gun Use Statistics

 

[JoeB131]

Oooookay, I kno wyou really need to believe that shit put together by the NRA.

They Kellerman Study is pretty solid. For every death of a bad guy, there were 43 deaths of family members.

there were 1.3 times as many accidental firearm-related deaths in the home where the gun was kept as self-protection shootings
there were 4.6 times as many criminal firearm-related homicides in the home where the gun was kept as self-protection shootings
there were 37 times as many suicides in the home where the gun was kept as self-protection shootings.

Arthur Kellermann - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia