American Terrorism

[Toro]

Unless you count Blackwater, Tripod and the multitude of private security firms. Plus, the military industrial complex includes surveillance, computers, weapons and so on.

No, including those too.

That is a myth. Conservatives yell and scream about the liberal media and yet who dominates the airwaves? Shows like Rush Limbaugh, Hannity & Colms, FoxNews and all the talking heads like Ann Coulter and Bill O'Reilly. Yeah a real big liberal conspiracy going on here. The real conspiracy is that people are willingly lied to. I wonder why that is.

That's your opinion. Conservatives feel that the MSM is biased against them - pretty much everything except Fox News and talk radio, the only references you mentioned. How can this be? Are they all stupid? If big corporate media interests are so pro-conservative, why do so many conservatives loathe the media?

Yes and no. It has harmed the taxpayers and domestic business. Transnationals like Wal-mart and ExxonMobil are doing fine. There are two Americas: Corporate America (which includes the banks, investors & companies) and everyday America (which is where you and live). We are spectators in this economic boon that Bush speaks of. The true American economy is in shambles and has been for a long time. You can thank the concept of speculative markets for that.

Most big "transnationals" do not benefit from this war. Most business interests do not benefit from this war. Yet, business interests run the GOP do they not? How can it be that the business-dominated GOP is beholden to such a small, narrow slice of American commerce when it is so much against their interest? Most banks, investors and companies do not benefit from this war.

 

[eots]

No, including those too.



That's your opinion. Conservatives feel that the MSM is biased against them - pretty much everything except Fox News and talk radio, the only references you mentioned. How can this be? Are they all stupid? If big corporate media interests are so pro-conservative, why do so many conservatives loathe the media?

because anyone who considers fox to be anything but a state run propaganda tool is likely to have a lot of distorted views

Most big "transnationals" do not benefit from this war. Most business interests do not benefit from this war. Yet, business interests run the GOP do they not? How can it be that the business-dominated GOP is beholden to such a small, narrow slice of American commerce when it is so much against their interest? Most banks, investors and companies do not benefit from this war

war is totally desirable to the military industrial complex that has taken control of this nation

 

[LordBrownTrout]

But it is soooooooo true. You do realize that the news is not the news per se right? The news is opinion shaped by the heads of the owning corporations and by the sponsors.

You do realize that the military industrial complex has gained strength and is now infiltrating our state department. First response teams will soon beome privatized and run by firms like Blackwater right?

Rather than being sarcastic and flippant, you should be opening your eyes to what is happening to our country. We should be stopping this at all costs.

You do realize that the problem lies within both parties yet I see Bush hate banter.

You do realize that two Americas is nothing more than class warfare.

Willingly lied to huh? No sir, that requires an implied acceptance to all talking heads. It is our responsibility to reject and do our on homework in regards to what's proffered. Here's a thought, Maybe if everyone quit watching such jewels on the networks such as "Who wants to eat a cockroach" and "Why I want to marry my sister" and tabloid celebrity news and then substituting it with the history and real issues that we're facing we MIGHT just achieve something.

I don't listen to Rush or Hannity but you're wrong again. The reason they"re successful is because capitalism is working ie, people buying ad time during their time slots. People quit listening, money dries up, talking heads go away. It really is quite simple.

The true American economy is in shambles? Hmmm. Well, if you say so but before you carry on about how all bad greedy corporations have gone overseas let's heap a little criticism on our favorite native Arkansas son and his most favored nation -- yes, that would be China, and your favorite, a republican congress.

And yes, bombing abortion factory workers is murder, the same as pulling an infant out of the womb with forceps and crushing its skull and then tossing it into a medical waste box where it is then delivered to be incinerated or chemically treated, then shredded up and given a burial in your local landfill.

 

[LordBrownTrout]

Not hardly. One, that German citizens "knew" is conjecture. Two, even if they might have known some or all, it's REAL easy for you to sit and judge and blow all kinds of smoke about what you'd stand up to because you don't have a Gestapo agent holding a P-38 to your head.

You seem to have left out the part where ANYONE so much as questioning the Reich was considered an "enemy of the state."

That gets in the way of Taomans many conspiracies. Lol.

 

[Toro]

I don't listen to Rush or Hannity but you're wrong again. The reason they"re successful is because capitalism is working ie, people buying ad time during their time slots. People quit listening, money dries up, talking heads go away. It really is quite simple.

Like Air America for instance.

 

[Gunny]

You do realize that the problem lies within both parties yet I see Bush hate banter.

You do realize that two Americas is nothing more than class warfare.

Willingly lied to huh? No sir, that requires an implied acceptance to all talking heads. It is our responsibility to reject and do our on homework in regards to what's proffered. Here's a thought, Maybe if everyone quit watching such jewels on the networks such as "Who wants to eat a cockroach" and "Why I want to marry my sister" and tabloid celebrity news and then substituting it with the history and real issues that we're facing we MIGHT just achieve something.

I don't listen to Rush or Hannity but you're wrong again. The reason they"re successful is because capitalism is working ie, people buying ad time during their time slots. People quit listening, money dries up, talking heads go away. It really is quite simple.

The true American economy is in shambles? Hmmm. Well, if you say so but before you carry on about how all bad greedy corporations have gone overseas let's heap a little criticism on our favorite native Arkansas son and his most favored nation -- yes, that would be China, and your favorite, a republican congress.

And yes, bombing abortion factory workers is murder, the same as pulling an infant out of the womb with forceps and crushing its skull and then tossing it into a medical waste box where it is then delivered to be incinerated or chemically treated, then shredded up and given a burial in your local landfill.

Damn ... somebody got SERVED. It's all over but the

 

[Taomon]

Conservatives feel that the MSM is biased against them - pretty much everything except Fox News and talk radio, the only references you mentioned. How can this be? Are they all stupid? If big corporate media interests are so pro-conservative, why do so many conservatives loathe the media?

So according to your theory, because they complain about a left-wing conspiracy one must exist? And yet my theories do not?

Is it because they are on TV and the radio and I am not? Or is it because you do not agree with what I am saying here? What do you base your beliefs on? I am not saying that anyone should blindly follow me or anyone else.

Open your eyes brother. Seek the truth and you will find it.

And for the record, conservative shows and their talking heads all bemoan the liberal media, not because there is a liberal media that is lying to anyone about anything. It is a disinformation campaign to steer people like you away from the truth.

There is a reason why investigative journalists like Seymour Hirsch and Bill Moyers say what they say and investigate the things that they do...because the media, news and pundits will not even discuss it. To them, these are not issues until we make them issues.

Why? Because it is bad for their business. Their sponsors do not want us talking about the dangers of smoking, drinking, pollution, the war, torture, executive powers run amok, corruption and so on.

 

[trobinett]

Aww, it does my heart good to see two kindred soul's like eots, and Taomon get together.

You guys will have a big time, and can cover each others back, looking out for the helicopters, and black SUV's, yes, your phone lines ARE tapped.

Do you use public transportation?

Yep, its a CONSPIRACY!!!!!

 

[Taomon]

You do realize that the problem lies within both parties yet I see Bush hate banter.

Yes I hate Bush, and yes I hate both parties. They are both corrupt. I have seen some good come from both sides, but those actions are few and far between. In fact, the few who try and do the right thing are always attacked by the press and their colleagues.

You do realize that two Americas is nothing more than class warfare.

Realize it? All too well.

Willingly lied to huh? No sir, that requires an implied acceptance to all talking heads. It is our responsibility to reject and do our on homework in regards to what's proffered. Here's a thought, Maybe if everyone quit watching such jewels on the networks such as "Who wants to eat a cockroach" and "Why I want to marry my sister" and tabloid celebrity news and then substituting it with the history and real issues that we're facing we MIGHT just achieve something.

And there is a small portion of US society that does just that. You, me, and maybe a thousand or so people. But the vast majority are fed this crap and they willingly raise their spoons for more.

That is why sports and American Idol are so popular. Those are easier pills to swallow than the truth or seeking it.

I don't listen to Rush or Hannity but you're wrong again. The reason they"re successful is because capitalism is working ie, people buying ad time during their time slots. People quit listening, money dries up, talking heads go away. It really is quite simple.

No. Because their shows should be labeled as entertainment and they are not, at least not sufficiently enough that their audience does not realize that their opinions are not informed to any level of integrity.

The true American economy is in shambles? Hmmm. Well, if you say so but before you carry on about how all bad greedy corporations have gone overseas let's heap a little criticism on our favorite native Arkansas son and his most favored nation -- yes, that would be China, and your favorite, a republican congress.

Clinton was a bad president, as was Reagan and Bush Sr. But the epitome of them all so far is Bush Jr. No one has singlehandedly caused more harm to American than the Bush/Cheney puppet show.

And yes, bombing abortion factory workers is murder, the same as pulling an infant out of the womb with forceps and crushing its skull and then tossing it into a medical waste box where it is then delivered to be incinerated or chemically treated, then shredded up and given a burial in your local landfill.

Oh, so that is how abortions are done huh? Here I thought that they were only allowed in the first trimester only and that the fetus does not resemble a human being at that point and could not survive outside of the womb - hence negating the need to crush it's skull.

Though abortions would be a rich source of stem cells for research no?

http://www.fwhc.org/abortion/ab-procedures.htm

 

[eots]

Aww, it does my heart good to see two kindred soul's like eots, and Taomon get together.

You guys will have a big time, and can cover each others back, looking out for the helicopters, and black SUV's, yes, your phone lines ARE tapped.

Do you use public transportation?

Yep, its a CONSPIRACY!!!!!

what are you rambling about now ? is this some strange little fantasy of yours ?

 

[Toro]

So according to your theory, because they complain about a left-wing conspiracy one must exist? And yet my theories do not?

No, what I'm saying to you is that you view the world based through a political spectrum that effects how you draw your conclusions. Conservatives view the world through another political spectrum that effects how they draw their conclusions. If conservatives viewed the MSM as being "on their side" as you suggest, then they would not be hostile to it.

The far Left views the media as right-wing based on where they are on the political spectrum. The far right views the media as left-wing based on where they are on the political spectrum.

 

[Taomon]

No, what I'm saying to you is that you view the world based through a political spectrum that effects how you draw your conclusions. Conservatives view the world through another political spectrum that effects how they draw their conclusions. If conservatives viewed the MSM as being "on their side" as you suggest, then they would not be hostile to it.

The far Left views the media as right-wing based on where they are on the political spectrum. The far right views the media as left-wing based on where they are on the political spectrum.

So in YOUR opinion, is there a left-wing media conspiracy or is there a right-wing media conspiracy?

I think that there are biased outlets on both sides and that is what big businesses want for us. They want us arguing about trivial shit so we ignore what is truly going on.

Plus there is a market (on both sides) for political paraphenalia.

 

[Toro]

There is no "conspiracy."

That's my original point.

 

[Taomon]

There is no "conspiracy."

That's my original point.

To that I concur that neither the left nor the right have a conspiracy. I do believe that socialist groups of industries via their lobbys do commit conspiracies against us. And the evidence is in the laws.

 

[CSM]

9/11 was not the first terrorist attack on US soil. In fact, throughout history America and her citizens have committed terrorist acts.

The bombing of the Alfred P Murrah Federal building was pinned on Timothy Mc Veigh. He confessed and mainstream America believe that he and Terry Nichols were the sole conspirators. There is a school of thought that puts forth the thesis that the two perpetrators were covering up a larger conspiracy tied to Middle East terror groups. While this may be true, the basic fact is that the bombing was a terrorist attack executed on American soil against American interests. So 9/11 was not the first strike against America on American soil (sorry Noam). But perhaps I am splitting hairs here.

Then again, when one looks at the 1993 World Trade Center Bombing one cannot ignore the blatant fact that we have been attacked already. What differs between the 1993 attack and the 2001 attack? For one, the 1993 attack was declared as and treated as a criminal act, which it was. The perpetrators were apprehended and justice was served. In 2001, Bush declared war. And the evidence was destroyed, a lot of inconsistencies were covered up and no true investigation was done. Unless you think the modern day Warren Commission AKA the 9/11 Commission did their job and no more should be said on the subject. For me, 9/11 was a crime and the cover up of that crime was an offense far worse than the actual terrorist attack. And one last point, for all those people who claim that George W Bush has kept us safe since 9/11; it was 8 years between the first WTC bombing and the next attack.

September 11, 2001 brought America to a screeching halt. This was an effective and brutal attack on our soil. Instantly we knew it was Islamic extremists who sought to radically change our culture to one of a strict theocracy. Americans were shocked and appalled, and rightfully so. But violence caused by religious extremists is not new to America. The Puritans exacted very harsh treatments to those colonists who did not abide by their God-fearing rules. The witch trials of Salem and other places displayed a pathetic, yet dangerous, hysteria surrounding the fear of subversive behavior. But the worst may be the bombings of abortion clinics and the killing of their doctors. Religious zealots dehumanize their victims when they believe that the doctor or the female getting an abortion is sinning and must be punished. Zealots believe that they will be rewarded for doing God’s work. Sound familiar? The 9/11 terrorists had the same belief.

I can go on and on about terrorist activities committed by America and her citizens. There are many more examples. However, the basic fact is that now the guns are pointed at us. But it is the guns of Corporate America. It is the guns of the Military Industrial Complex. It is the guns of the Pentagon and the White House. America is changing into a softer version of a fascist state (think of George Orwell’s 1984). A state controlled by banks and investors. A state where individual liberty pales in comparison to the liberty of capital.

We are cannon fodder for oil executives, mercenaries and war profiteers. We are cattle for business to exploit. The sad part is that we embrace it with open arms because that is what we have been conditioned to do.

So, in essence, what you are saying is that the United States and its citizens deserve to be attacked.

 

[eots]

“Men never do evil so completely and cheerfully as when they do it from religious conviction.”
- Blaise Pascal

George Bush: 'God told me to end the tyranny in Iraq'


President told Palestinians God also talked to him about Middle East peace

Ewen MacAskill
Friday October 7, 2005
The Guardian


George Bush believes he is on a mission from God, according to the politician Nabil Shaath. Photograph: Charles Dharapak/AP



George Bush has claimed he was on a mission from God when he launched the invasions of Afghanistan and Iraq, according to a senior Palestinian politician in an interview to be broadcast by the BBC later this month


http://www.guardian.co.uk/usa/story/0,12271,1586978,00.html

 

[Taomon]

So, in essence, what you are saying is that the United States and its citizens deserve to be attacked.

Deserved? No, but we were asking for it. The citizens were complicit and the government acted with evil hubris. Now many of you are no longer complicit, you are cheering the war machine on. You are cheering the terrorism of our state on.

 

[midcan5]

To that I concur that neither the left nor the right have a conspiracy. I do believe that socialist groups of industries via their lobbys do commit conspiracies against us. And the evidence is in the laws.

Huh? proof? Actually isn't that the so called free market? or as the piece below demonstrates business as usual for many Americans.

"And to Its Fabled Economy...."

By Paul Craig Roberts

http://www.counterpunch.org/roberts06252007.html
[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TCbFEgFajGU[/ame]

"For a number of years Charles McMillion of MBG Information Services and I have documented from BLS nonfarm payroll jobs data that the US economy in the 21st century no longer creates net new jobs in tradable goods and services. In the 21st century, job growth in "the world's only superpower" has a definite third world flavor. US job growth has been limited to domestic services that cannot be moved offshore, such as waitresses and bartenders and health and social services."

 

[Gunny]

Deserved? No, but we were asking for it. The citizens were complicit and the government acted with evil hubris. Now many of you are no longer complicit, you are cheering the war machine on. You are cheering the terrorism of our state on.

Now we're terrorists ....

 

[eots]

Now we're terrorists ....

wow you finally figured it out !