Alaska's permafrost is thawing

[CrusaderFrank]

Lol 1.5c, even if true, can disrupt the climate of planet Earth.

Lol

How does CO2 do any of that

Lol

 

[Billy_Bob]

Permafrost

Permafrost

Is Alaska Melting?
Studies of permafrost in Alaska are providing valuable information about the potential effects of global warming. One project at the University of Alaska Fairbanks Geophysical Institute has been monitoring temperatures and depth of permafrost since 1976. Precise temperature measurements have been made in a series of holes bored 200 feet deep along a line running north to south down the middle of the state along the Trans-Alaska Pipeline.

Study results show that much of the undisturbed discontinuous permafrost south of the Yukon River has warmed significantly and some of it is thawing. That raises the possibility that roads, buildings, and other structures on thawed areas will collapse. Another problem could arise as well: As permafrost thaws it can release methane and carbon dioxide, gases that contribute to the green house effect and accelerate global warming.

What Alaskans are saying.

C'mon man.. Use those noodles.

That raises the possibility that roads, buildings, and other structures on thawed areas will collapse.

RAISES THE POSSIBILITY?? Don't you think that's an understatement from a GW fanatic? It GUARANTEES the inevitable thaw of the ground under it..

No cooling path to the sky -- No winter refreezing. House, Road, Pipeline, --- doesn't matter. That doesn't even take into account the self-heating and radiative nature of the structure itself. Good Lord.

Tell me about melting permafrost in UNDEVELOPED areas. Don't whine about some soil engineers and hydrologists that are just blaming their very bad judgement on Global Warming. I'd LOVE to hear that court case when some Multi-$$megabuck strip mall sinks into the muck in a decade or so.. And the jury is told the cause was man-made CO2 emissions.

Fallen trees after the permafrost melted in Fairbanks, Alaska, in 2004.


PHOTOGRAPH BY ASHLEY COOPER, CORBIS

Drunken trees are becoming most prevalent in lowland arboreal forests across Alaska, Canada, and northern Eurasia, says Jorgenson. On steeper slopes, meltwater usually runs downhill quickly, which causes less disturbance on the surface. Birch and black spruce—with their shallow root systems—are the species most likely to lean.


Some climate models have predicted that most permafrost could melt by the end of the century. Jorgenson thinks it will take longer, since soil layers above the frozen ground are good insulators. But the area north of Fairbanks is predicted to warm by four to six degrees Celsius by the end of the century.


"In the last hundred years we've increased about 1.5 degrees Celsius, so that's going to be a huge sledgehammer coming down," says Jorgenson.


In that case, there are likely to be more drunken trees. Right now, around 7 to 8 percent of the land in the middle boreal zone in Alaska is showing some signs of drunken trees or other melting-related impacts, says Jorgenson.

Drunken Trees: Dramatic Signs of Climate Change

But you knew about this already, Flacaltenn. Dishonest of you to make the statement you have knowing this.

Tell me Moron, what is the age of those trees? From the diameter of them most are younger than 10 years and the older ones are about 50-60 years old. Any one with a shred of intelligence can tell you those were the last two warming cycles and the fell trees below them are of the same average size and diam indicating that this is cyclical and NATURAL... your own dam pictures shows you a fraud if you use critical thinking skills.

 

[flacaltenn]

Permafrost

Permafrost

Is Alaska Melting?
Studies of permafrost in Alaska are providing valuable information about the potential effects of global warming. One project at the University of Alaska Fairbanks Geophysical Institute has been monitoring temperatures and depth of permafrost since 1976. Precise temperature measurements have been made in a series of holes bored 200 feet deep along a line running north to south down the middle of the state along the Trans-Alaska Pipeline.

Study results show that much of the undisturbed discontinuous permafrost south of the Yukon River has warmed significantly and some of it is thawing. That raises the possibility that roads, buildings, and other structures on thawed areas will collapse. Another problem could arise as well: As permafrost thaws it can release methane and carbon dioxide, gases that contribute to the green house effect and accelerate global warming.

What Alaskans are saying.

C'mon man.. Use those noodles.

That raises the possibility that roads, buildings, and other structures on thawed areas will collapse.

RAISES THE POSSIBILITY?? Don't you think that's an understatement from a GW fanatic? It GUARANTEES the inevitable thaw of the ground under it..

No cooling path to the sky -- No winter refreezing. House, Road, Pipeline, --- doesn't matter. That doesn't even take into account the self-heating and radiative nature of the structure itself. Good Lord.

Tell me about melting permafrost in UNDEVELOPED areas. Don't whine about some soil engineers and hydrologists that are just blaming their very bad judgement on Global Warming. I'd LOVE to hear that court case when some Multi-$$megabuck strip mall sinks into the muck in a decade or so.. And the jury is told the cause was man-made CO2 emissions.

Fallen trees after the permafrost melted in Fairbanks, Alaska, in 2004.


PHOTOGRAPH BY ASHLEY COOPER, CORBIS

Drunken trees are becoming most prevalent in lowland arboreal forests across Alaska, Canada, and northern Eurasia, says Jorgenson. On steeper slopes, meltwater usually runs downhill quickly, which causes less disturbance on the surface. Birch and black spruce—with their shallow root systems—are the species most likely to lean.


Some climate models have predicted that most permafrost could melt by the end of the century. Jorgenson thinks it will take longer, since soil layers above the frozen ground are good insulators. But the area north of Fairbanks is predicted to warm by four to six degrees Celsius by the end of the century.


"In the last hundred years we've increased about 1.5 degrees Celsius, so that's going to be a huge sledgehammer coming down," says Jorgenson.


In that case, there are likely to be more drunken trees. Right now, around 7 to 8 percent of the land in the middle boreal zone in Alaska is showing some signs of drunken trees or other melting-related impacts, says Jorgenson.

Drunken Trees: Dramatic Signs of Climate Change

But you knew about this already, Flacaltenn. Dishonest of you to make the statement you have knowing this.

Yeah !!! Stuff like drunken trees. THAT might indicate SOMETHING. But don't fall for the hype and propaganda stuff.. You do realize that trees don't drink ice, they drink water and therefore there is always an element of thawing where they grow.. And the ground DOES get pretty soupy during height of summer.

 

[Old Rocks]

Well then, we should have records of that phenomenon for prior times. Present those records in rebuttal to what the scientists are presenting. If you cannot, then we have to accept what they are stating.

 

[flacaltenn]

Well then, we should have records of that phenomenon for prior times. Present those records in rebuttal to what the scientists are presenting. If you cannot, then we have to accept what they are stating.

If the same "scientists" are whining about structures and roads built on permafrost being damaged -- I am justified in being skeptical about any other claims made. Best YOU find better anectodal evidence of damage from permafrost being comprised first.

 

[CrusaderFrank]

ice melts in summer...

Wow

Just fucking wow

 

[westwall]

Gotta love it when liars like Westwall, Billy Bob, and jc come on here are flap their yaps. All one has to do is put permafrost and Alaska on google to see what the people up there are dealing with.

Gotta love it when propagandists like olfraud, crick and mammy bleat about the "end of the world" yet have no clue of what is really happening. Typical ignorant twats. Here's a scholarly treatise on permafrost and some other links to show that climate models and reality are two very different things....



"Average temperature during the year is the most important factor for permafrost existence. Permafrost temperatures at 1 m below ground in central Alaska have been warming since the 1960s and were reaching near to the melting point in the mid-1990s. There has been a retreat to colder temperatures (less than -1°C) in the last few years."

permafrost

Arctic Change - Land: Permafrost

 

[Old Rocks]

The effect of permafrost thaw on old carbon release and net carbon exchange from tundra : Abstract : Nature

Permafrost soils in boreal and Arctic ecosystems store almost twice as much carbon1, 2 as is currently present in the atmosphere3. Permafrost thaw and the microbial decomposition of previously frozen organic carbon is considered one of the most likely positive climate feedbacks from terrestrial ecosystems to the atmosphere in a warmer world1, 2, 4, 5, 6, 7. The rate of carbon release from permafrost soils is highly uncertain, but it is crucial for predicting the strength and timing of this carbon-cycle feedback effect, and thus how important permafrost thaw will be for climate change this century and beyond1, 2, 4, 5, 6, 7. Sustained transfers of carbon to the atmosphere that could cause a significant positive feedback to climate change must come from old carbon, which forms the bulk of the permafrost carbon pool that accumulated over thousands of years8, 9,10, 11. Here we measure net ecosystem carbon exchange and the radiocarbon age of ecosystem respiration in a tundra landscape undergoing permafrost thaw12 to determine the influence of old carbon loss on ecosystem carbon balance. We find that areas that thawed over the past 15 years had 40 per cent more annual losses of old carbon than minimally thawed areas, but had overall net ecosystem carbon uptake as increased plant growth offset these losses. In contrast, areas that thawed decades earlier lost even more old carbon, a 78 per cent increase over minimally thawed areas; this old carbon loss contributed to overall net ecosystem carbon release despite increased plant growth. Our data document significant losses of soil carbon with permafrost thaw that, over decadal timescales, overwhelms increased plant carbon uptake13, 14, 15 at rates that could make permafrost a large biospheric carbon source in a warmer world

What researchers are stating.

 

[Old Rocks]

An Error Occurred Setting Your User Cookie

ABSTRACT
The resilience and vulnerability of permafrost to climate change depends on complex interactions among topography, water, soil, vegetation, and snow, which allow permafrost to persist at mean annual air temperatures (MAATs) as high as +2 °C and degrade at MAATs as low as –20 °C. To assess these interactions, we compiled existing data and tested effects of varying conditions on mean annual surface temperatures (MASTs) and 2 m deep temperatures (MADTs) through modeling. Surface water had the largest effect, with water sediment temperatures being ~10 °C above MAAT. A 50% reduction in snow depth reduces MADT by 2 °C. Elevation changes between 200 and 800 m increases MAAT by up to 2.3 °C and snow depths by ~40%. Aspect caused only a ~1 °C difference in MAST. Covarying vegetation structure, organic matter thickness, soil moisture, and snow depth of terrestrial ecosystems, ranging from barren silt to white spruce (Picea glauca (Moench) Voss) forest to tussock shrub, affect MASTs by ~6 °C and MADTs by ~7 °C. Groundwater at 2–7 °C greatly affects lateral and internal permafrost thawing. Analyses show that vegetation succession provides strong negative feedbacks that make permafrost resilient to even large increases in air temperatures. Surface water, which is affected by topography and ground ice, provides even stronger negative feedbacks that make permafrost vulnerable to thawing even under cold temperatures.

More.

 

[flacaltenn]

Don't think you even read these abstracts Rocks. There's no prophesies of doom in either one. Says what you should ALREADY know. That permafrost is perhaps MORE influenced by the timing and depth of snow and ice cover and the amount and type of vegetation than a degree or 2 in surface temp.

Maybe if you actually read and understood them -- you could get your head out of the permafrost.

 

[IsaacNewton]

People on a message board entrenched in fantasy are not worth the effort.

Scientists settled the science 15 years ago. Global Warming is real and accelerating.

There is no debate.

 

[Billy_Bob]

People on a message board entrenched in fantasy are not worth the effort.

Scientists settled the science 15 years ago. Global Warming is real and accelerating.

There is no debate.

Proof positive that you are someone who believes what your masters feed you without question.. You will make a good slave and a useful idiot in the taking of every right Americans hold dear.

Your hope to silence the debate that shows your religion a farce and a lie is going down in flames just as the 20 who tried it earlier on the IGES web site and their letter to Obama.

The debate is far from settled anything, as the real science has never been done.

 

[Crick]

Proof positive that you're entrenched in your fantasy and not worth the slightest effort.

 

[Uncensored2008]

People on a message board entrenched in fantasy are not worth the effort.

Scientists settled the science 15 years ago. Global Warming is real and accelerating.

There is no debate.

Yes, just as they did with the deniers of the settled science that the universe revolved around the Earth. Those deniers and their heliocentric thing failed to acknowledge that there was consensus that the sun revolved around the Earth.

You cultists have zero grasp of science.

 

[flacaltenn]

People on a message board entrenched in fantasy are not worth the effort.

Scientists settled the science 15 years ago. Global Warming is real and accelerating.

There is no debate.

Science is definitely not settled. ALL of the initial projections and prophecies of doom are failing -- and the ACTUAL numbers for future temperature and disaster are currently being revised WAY down from what they were 15 years ago.

The skeptics have already won without a debate. Debate was never formally allowed. That should tell you something right there. GW is killing itself quite nicely -- thank-you...

 

[Delta4Embassy]

People on a message board entrenched in fantasy are not worth the effort.

Scientists settled the science 15 years ago. Global Warming is real and accelerating.

There is no debate.

Science is definitely not settled. ALL of the initial projections and prophecies of doom are failing -- and the ACTUAL numbers for future temperature and disaster are currently being revised WAY down from what they were 15 years ago.

The skeptics have already won without a debate. Debate was never formally allowed. That should tell you something right there. GW is killing itself quite nicely -- thank-you...

Course, could be too the dooms that didn't come true didn't because of measures taken to prevent them as with granting the premise and reducing emissions and the like.

 

[Gracie]

The one to ask is gallantwarrior since he lives there.

 

[flacaltenn]

People on a message board entrenched in fantasy are not worth the effort.

Scientists settled the science 15 years ago. Global Warming is real and accelerating.

There is no debate.

Science is definitely not settled. ALL of the initial projections and prophecies of doom are failing -- and the ACTUAL numbers for future temperature and disaster are currently being revised WAY down from what they were 15 years ago.

The skeptics have already won without a debate. Debate was never formally allowed. That should tell you something right there. GW is killing itself quite nicely -- thank-you...

Course, could be too the dooms that didn't come true didn't because of measures taken to prevent them as with granting the premise and reducing emissions and the like.

That's a weird statement. "Granting the premise -- and the like" is enough to deter Global Warming?

CO2 is STILL rising.. The temps? Not so much.. Check the man-made emissions for yourself. China is building out about 3 coal plants per month.

 

[flacaltenn]

People on a message board entrenched in fantasy are not worth the effort.

Scientists settled the science 15 years ago. Global Warming is real and accelerating.

There is no debate.

Wanna have a go at it?? Debate -- I mean. Or are you just a parrot with no concept of Global Warming theory or it's fantastic pronouncements?

 

[Delta4Embassy]

People on a message board entrenched in fantasy are not worth the effort.

Scientists settled the science 15 years ago. Global Warming is real and accelerating.

There is no debate.

Science is definitely not settled. ALL of the initial projections and prophecies of doom are failing -- and the ACTUAL numbers for future temperature and disaster are currently being revised WAY down from what they were 15 years ago.

The skeptics have already won without a debate. Debate was never formally allowed. That should tell you something right there. GW is killing itself quite nicely -- thank-you...

Course, could be too the dooms that didn't come true didn't because of measures taken to prevent them as with granting the premise and reducing emissions and the like.

That's a weird statement. "Granting the premise -- and the like" is enough to deter Global Warming?

CO2 is STILL rising.. The temps? Not so much.. Check the man-made emissions for yourself. China is building out about 3 coal plants per month.

Ya, those rising temps in Alaska thawing their permafrost really cast doubt on whether it's getting warmer.