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see so doing religious stuff in school definately doesn't leave a lasting impression, let alone indoctrinate someone.
your thread title and the initiative's purpose, according to the OP, do not mesh...
whats wrong with providing an opportunity? seems you are against freedom....
Sounds like there's already an opportunity:
Schools currently are allowed to offer Christmas music as long as it is used for academic purposes rather than devotional purposes and isn't used to promote a particular religious belief, according to an analysis by the California Legislative Analyst's Office.
but the schools don't have to offer it...hence the difference
That translates to consumerism, materialism and presents, of course.
you make no sense....it doesn't matter if students don't have all rights, they do have some rights though....this should be up to the students, you're taking away their opportunity and instead oddly leaving it up to administrators....it doesn't harm anyone if the students have the choice vs. the administrators....
of course they're only talking about christmas carols, this is the christmas season, christmas holiday etc....
They have rights however they do not have a voting bloc. The Administrators have decided, and the decision is final. I was in High School until a year ago, there was a lot of rules I did not like. I thought plenty of them were unfair. But could we do anything about it? No.
And maybe you're still in 1950, but Christmas is no longer the only major holiday in this season.
Sounds like there's already an opportunity:
but the schools don't have to offer it...hence the difference
Why should they "have" to? Why should any one particular religion be favored by a mandate?
In fact that kind of madate - worded the way it is, does smack of unwarrented religious intrusion into Ceasar's realm even with the "opt out" clause. There are enough problems with the school systems with out adding extraneous crap which is the same degree of silliness as those fussing of mention of God on coinage.
but the schools don't have to offer it...hence the difference
Why should they "have" to? Why should any one particular religion be favored by a mandate?
In fact that kind of madate - worded the way it is, does smack of unwarrented religious intrusion into Ceasar's realm even with the "opt out" clause. There are enough problems with the school systems with out adding extraneous crap which is the same degree of silliness as those fussing of mention of God on coinage.
what is the holiday called? what is the multiple week break the students get called? hint: christ is in the word
you make no sense....it doesn't matter if students don't have all rights, they do have some rights though....this should be up to the students, you're taking away their opportunity and instead oddly leaving it up to administrators....it doesn't harm anyone if the students have the choice vs. the administrators....
of course they're only talking about christmas carols, this is the christmas season, christmas holiday etc....
They have rights however they do not have a voting bloc. The Administrators have decided, and the decision is final. I was in High School until a year ago, there was a lot of rules I did not like. I thought plenty of them were unfair. But could we do anything about it? No.
And maybe you're still in 1950, but Christmas is no longer the only major holiday in this season.
uh....other than new years, it is the only official holiday and you want to take away the students opportunity to sing about this official holiday and leave it up to the admins, ostensibly because when you were in school you didn't like all the rules and too bad.....
we will just have to disagree, you want it left solely to the admins, i want the students to have the opportunity to sing or not sing about this national holiday.....you want to prohibit their right, i don't
Merry Hyatt, Tea Party Patriot, Wants Mandatory Christmas Carols In Public Schools
It's called the "Freedom to Present Christmas Music in Public School Classrooms or Assemblies" initiative.
Merry Hyatt, a substitute teacher and member of the Redding Tea Party Patriots, is behind the push. The Record Searchlight reports:
The initiative would require schools to provide children the opportunity to listen to or perform Christmas carols, and would subject the schools to litigation if the rule isn't followed.
Schools currently are allowed to offer Christmas music as long as it is used for academic purposes rather than devotional purposes and isn't used to promote a particular religious belief, according to an analysis by the California Legislative Analyst's Office.
Parents are allowed to have their students opt out of the caroling if they express that desire in advance.
The initiative has the support of the local Tea Party Patriots president.
Isn't the Tea Parties purpose suppose to be limited Government, not having the Government control our lives, etc. Doesn't this go directly against that?
Sounds like to me more people using the whole concept of "tea parties" to further their own agenda. Thoughts?
They have rights however they do not have a voting bloc. The Administrators have decided, and the decision is final. I was in High School until a year ago, there was a lot of rules I did not like. I thought plenty of them were unfair. But could we do anything about it? No.
And maybe you're still in 1950, but Christmas is no longer the only major holiday in this season.
uh....other than new years, it is the only official holiday and you want to take away the students opportunity to sing about this official holiday and leave it up to the admins, ostensibly because when you were in school you didn't like all the rules and too bad.....
we will just have to disagree, you want it left solely to the admins, i want the students to have the opportunity to sing or not sing about this national holiday.....you want to prohibit their right, i don't
That's a strawman argument - no one is taking anything away. Schools are allowed to sing Christmas carols in the existing law.
Why should they "have" to? Why should any one particular religion be favored by a mandate?
In fact that kind of madate - worded the way it is, does smack of unwarrented religious intrusion into Ceasar's realm even with the "opt out" clause. There are enough problems with the school systems with out adding extraneous crap which is the same degree of silliness as those fussing of mention of God on coinage.
what is the holiday called? what is the multiple week break the students get called? hint: christ is in the word
If you want to be exact about it - they officially call it "Winter Holiday" in most jurisdictions. Either way, it's a red herring - it doesn't require a mandate must be made for Christmas carols. As Dogbert pointed out - if the school district community wants it, they will push for it. You don't need some frivolous law requiring recognition of a particular religious ceremony.
Sounds like there's already an opportunity:
but the schools don't have to offer it...hence the difference
Why should they "have" to? Why should any one particular religion be favored by a mandate?
In fact that kind of madate - worded the way it is, does smack of unwarrented religious intrusion into Ceasar's realm even with the "opt out" clause. There are enough problems with the school systems with out adding extraneous crap which is the same degree of silliness as those fussing of mention of God on coinage.
uh....other than new years, it is the only official holiday and you want to take away the students opportunity to sing about this official holiday and leave it up to the admins, ostensibly because when you were in school you didn't like all the rules and too bad.....
we will just have to disagree, you want it left solely to the admins, i want the students to have the opportunity to sing or not sing about this national holiday.....you want to prohibit their right, i don't
That's a strawman argument - no one is taking anything away. Schools are allowed to sing Christmas carols in the existing law.
fine....change taking away with denying....
happy now....
but the schools don't have to offer it...hence the difference
Why should they "have" to? Why should any one particular religion be favored by a mandate?
In fact that kind of madate - worded the way it is, does smack of unwarrented religious intrusion into Ceasar's realm even with the "opt out" clause. There are enough problems with the school systems with out adding extraneous crap which is the same degree of silliness as those fussing of mention of God on coinage.
you're obviously missing the 800 lb gorilla in the room.....we are talking about christmas, a national holiday...what is wrong with singing about a national holiday?
Why should they "have" to? Why should any one particular religion be favored by a mandate?
In fact that kind of madate - worded the way it is, does smack of unwarrented religious intrusion into Ceasar's realm even with the "opt out" clause. There are enough problems with the school systems with out adding extraneous crap which is the same degree of silliness as those fussing of mention of God on coinage.
you're obviously missing the 800 lb gorilla in the room.....we are talking about christmas, a national holiday...what is wrong with singing about a national holiday?
Can you show me the law prohibiting the singing of Christmas carols? Perhaps I missed it?
you're obviously missing the 800 lb gorilla in the room.....we are talking about christmas, a national holiday...what is wrong with singing about a national holiday?
Can you show me the law prohibiting the singing of Christmas carols? Perhaps I missed it?
can you show me the law that allows the students or the community, rather than the admin, the opportunity sing christmas carols at school?
i noticed you ignored the question about your issue with singing about a national holiday
Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.
There is no law against singing carols in school , this law does make it illegal for the school to organize for a specific religion.
If you want a day with EVERY religion to show their religion to other students then there is no problem there. I think they should teach world religion to all ages.
Chistians would blow a gasket.
still running away from the questions i see....
do the other religions have national holidays? do you support abolishing christmas as a national holiday....can schools force childrent to attend school on christmas?
somehow i won't be surprised if you continue to run away
Why would they do that?
answer the question....can they require school attendance on christmas day? yes or no....
They already require people to attend school on talk like a pirate day and could if the christian religion is no longer held by as many people.
They can in that respect.
Otherwise it would be contrary to their own purposes of teaching kids. Too many would just not be there on that day out of choice.
Can you show me the law prohibiting the singing of Christmas carols? Perhaps I missed it?
can you show me the law that allows the students or the community, rather than the admin, the opportunity sing christmas carols at school?
I asked a simple question - is it that hard to find a law prohibiting the singing of carols? That would be the first step.
i noticed you ignored the question about your issue with singing about a national holiday
I have an issue with it? That's news to me....
In fact that kind of madate - worded the way it is, does smack of unwarrented religious intrusion into Ceasar's realm even with the "opt out" clause. There are enough problems with the school systems with out adding extraneous crap which is the same degree of silliness as those fussing of mention of God on coinage.
Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.
There is no law against singing carols in school , this law does make it illegal for the school to organize for a specific religion.
If you want a day with EVERY religion to show their religion to other students then there is no problem there. I think they should teach world religion to all ages.
Chistians would blow a gasket.
still running away from the questions i see....
do the other religions have national holidays? do you support abolishing christmas as a national holiday....can schools force childrent to attend school on christmas?
somehow i won't be surprised if you continue to run away
I janswered you yes long ago Yurt.
Why did you ignore my answer?
see so doing religious stuff in school definately doesn't leave a lasting impression, let alone indoctrinate someone
I'm not saying it does. But there is no reason to make it mandatory. If anyone who is small Government should agree. Leave it up to the individual schools. If enough parents complain, I'm sure it will be changed.
However, making a law is ridiculous.
at the end was to denote me being a wise ass 
