World Markets Plunge on Fears of US Economy

[Paulie]

http://www.cnn.com/2008/BUSINESS/01/21/markets.plunge/index.html

LONDON, England (CNN) -- Stock markets around the world plummeted Monday, prompted by pessimism about U.S. President George W. Bush's plans to boost the U.S. economy.

...


On Friday U.S. President George W. Bush announced an economic stimulus plan involving a $145 billion tax relief package (Where is it going to COME from?). But investors remain skeptical that the plan will encourage consumer spending, said CNN's Eunice Yoon.

"What people are wondering here is will those tax breaks actually address some of the main issues - not only the weakness in the financial sector or the weakness in the housing market but will they actually get people spending again," she said.

She added: "People out here in Asia rely very heavily on the consumer in the United States and that's one of the reasons why Toyota, which has about 54 percent of its business in the United States, saw its share price tank this morning."

Today's fall will renew speculation that the crisis in the U.S. housing market may trigger a global recession.


"There's a big fear people are so gripped by debt now they won't spend but will pay down their debt, and if that happens that doesn't mean more manufacturing, it doesn't mean more employment, it doesn't help the economy," said CNN's Todd Benjamin.

"People feel at large that what the Bush administration is proposing is too little, too late," he added.

And the one's that DO spend, are probably going to hit Wal-Mart, K-Mart, and the other discount outlets to buy NON-US products ANYWAY.

This is the biggest waste of $145 Billion dollars that we don't even have to BEGIN with.

People, please buy American with this money. You weren't expecting to have it ANYWAY, so at least put it to the best use possible.

That, or buy some gold and silver to hedge it against inflation. The roughest times look to be indeed still ahead of us.

 

[RetiredGySgt]

Did you even read the piece? Global means outside the US. Buy American helps avert a world wide recession how? As for the housing crash that has been coming for YEARS. Speculation with no substance generally leads to an eventual crash. Remember the 1929 stock market collapse? Property is at ignorant prices, homes are as well. All based on made up unsupported inflation of value fueled not just by private speculation but by Local and State Governments inflating values to collect more taxes.

 

[Paulie]

Did you even read the piece? Global means outside the US. Buy American helps avert a world wide recession how? As for the housing crash that has been coming for YEARS. Speculation with no substance generally leads to an eventual crash. Remember the 1929 stock market collapse? Property is at ignorant prices, homes are as well. All based on made up unsupported inflation of value fueled not just by private speculation but by Local and State Governments inflating values to collect more taxes.

Always so quick to attack, without thinking the whole post through that you're responding to.

If you'd have read ANYTHING I've posted the last few days regarding this ridiculous 'stimulus package', you'd know that I don't even support it at all. I only posted THIS, to basically show that even the international community is starting to lose faith in our economy. Expect reserve dumps in the foreseeable future.

We have caused far too many problems with our monetary policies for a little stimulus package to boost the world's economy.

But if we absolutely MUST have another $145 billion dollars printed, or borrowed from another nation, let's at least use it for AMERICAN products.

Get it now RGS? Or is that tunnel you live in infinitely dark and endless?

Hope you got some gold, dude. Hope you stocked up on non-perishable foods and necessities.

 

[RetiredGySgt]

Always so quick to attack, without thinking the whole post through that you're responding to.

If you'd have read ANYTHING I've posted the last few days regarding this ridiculous 'stimulus package', you'd know that I don't even support it at all. I only posted THIS, to basically show that even the international community is starting to lose faith in our economy. Expect reserve dumps in the foreseeable future.

We have caused far too many problems with our monetary policies for a little stimulus package to boost the world's economy.

But if we absolutely MUST have another $145 billion dollars printed, or borrowed from another nation, let's at least use it for AMERICAN products.

Get it now RGS? Or is that tunnel you live in infinitely dark and endless?

Hope you got some gold, dude. Hope you stocked up on non-perishable foods and necessities.

Hope you bought some weapons and ammo. The coming Zombie hordes won't want your canned goods, they prefer brains.

 

[Paulie]

Hope you bought some weapons and ammo. The coming Zombie hordes won't want your canned goods, they prefer brains.

I guess that was supposed to be funny. I'm thinking humor's never been one of your good qualities in life.

It's unintentionally funny though, how a person who thinks the spending we've done is good, would tell ME what I should be stocking up on.

 

[RetiredGySgt]

I guess that was supposed to be funny. I'm thinking humor's never been one of your good qualities in life.

It's unintentionally funny though, how a person who thinks the spending we've done is good, would tell ME what I should be stocking up on.

There ya go again making assumptions with out a shred of evidence to support them. Now tell us all how I love Bush and worship at his feet.

 

[Paulie]

There ya go again making assumptions with out a shred of evidence to support them. Now tell us all how I love Bush and worship at his feet.

RGS, I'm quite sure you don't agree with our runaway spending, considering you're conservative rhetoric on here. I'm not exactly sure where you think the best area to cut is, though. I'd say a lot from EVERYWHERE, right now.

The EASIEST place to cut, which would be IMMEDIATE, and not require any authorization and hullabaloo from congress, would be defense.

It's got nothing to do with Bush either, by the way. That man is so irrelevent at this point in my life, that I really don't care who supports him or who doesn't. Luckily, he only has less than a year now to be the poster child for idiocy.

You cheerlead our military escapades, and that's why I know you think the spending we've done is good. I spend at least 3 days a week out in my community, and others, trying to get people to wake up to the idea that the runaway spending is bankrupting this nation. I'm getting some positive results. I only spend time on HERE, because I'm laid off from work, and I have 2 kids to watch after, and save the enormous child care costs, while my girlfriend holds her steady job and keeps us afloat financially until my work resumes.

If you aren't out in your community, active in the process of trying to affect change, than I don't want to hear your bullshit bellyaching. You bitching about it isn't changing anything. There's a REASON why this country is of the people, for the people, and by the people.

Apparently anymore, people think the government will solve our lives for us.

You deserve what you get if you remain apathetic about it to the point of non-action.

Just serving in the military doesn't mean you affected any change. All you really did was serve the interests of whatever the status-quo agenda was. You didn't change a single fucking policy through your military service. And now more people will follow in your footsteps, because not enough of us are doing anything about it as average citizens.

Go watch American Idol.

 

[RetiredGySgt]

Cut the ONE thing the Goverment is REQUIRED to do? Sure thing.

Defense should be at least 15 to 20 percent of the Budget in my opinion.

Get rid of Social Security, HUD, Education, Medicare Most of the staff of the Congress, half the employees of the Government.

We should spend more on Border security, Coast Guard, Military, Interstate highways, infrastructure. We should force States to allow Nuclear power to be used as a National issue. All and every non retirement social program should be CUT from the Federal Budget. Those programs are illegal. We should ensure Government employees do not have life time jobs just because they got hired, require they be competent in the jobs they hold.

READ the Constitution, the Federal Government has specific powers granted it, we should eliminate every program and agency that does not fall in those powers, and I mean those powers before creative bullshit stretching begins.

Return to the States the powers that are theirs, return to the people the powers that are theirs. Cut taxes and stop forcing States to fund programs illegally ordered by the Federal Government. Make the States do their jobs, THAT is the Governments that should take care of people.

 

[Toro]

Defense should be at least 15 to 20 percent of the Budget in my opinion.

Its 20% now.

 

[Annie]

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB120096124830205037.html?mod=opinion_main_commentaries

REVIEW & OUTLOOK

A Global Selloff
January 22, 2008; Page A18

What was that about "decoupling"? There has been lots of hopeful talk in recent months that European and Asian economies are starting to free themselves from dependence on growth in the U.S. Well, not so fast. Yesterday's rout in global stocks showed once again that as America goes, so goes the rest of the global economy.

While U.S. markets were off for Martin Luther King Day, the world numbers were dismal after last week's U.S. turmoil. Hong Kong's bourse fell 5.5%, its worst day since September 12, 2001. India fell 7.4%, Tokyo 3.9%, Seoul 2.9%, Singapore 6%. Even Shanghai's A-shares market, which often bucks foreign trends thanks to capital controls, slid 5.1%. Europe followed Asia's lead. The DAX, the German blue chip index, plunged 7.2%. London's FTSE closed down 5.5% and the French CAC-40 fell 6.8%. Fears of a U.S. recession appeared to be the common theme....

 

[jillian]

Did you even read the piece? Global means outside the US. Buy American helps avert a world wide recession how? As for the housing crash that has been coming for YEARS. Speculation with no substance generally leads to an eventual crash. Remember the 1929 stock market collapse? Property is at ignorant prices, homes are as well. All based on made up unsupported inflation of value fueled not just by private speculation but by Local and State Governments inflating values to collect more taxes.

Do you not understand the way our enconomy affects the economies of other countries? Not understand the interaction of the world markets?

 

[RetiredGySgt]

Do you not understand the way our enconomy affects the economies of other countries? Not understand the interaction of the world markets?

Did you read what I wrote? If we only buy american made products.... it does not help the GLOBAL economy? Perhaps a little reading comprehension would help?

 

[Paulie]

Did you read what I wrote? If we only buy american made products.... it does not help the GLOBAL economy? Perhaps a little reading comprehension would help?

I wasn't referring to helping the global economy when I said buy American. I was merely pointing out that our economic pitfalls are effecting the global economy. Buying American with that fake $150 Billion they're going to give us would probably BEST help the economy, in the SHORT term. Our economy getting better would in turn boost the confidence internationally, which would probably boost their markets. I'm no expert, but there IS a certain bit of common sense that goes into this thinking.

If people don't spend that new money on American products, which they probably as a whole WON'T, then it does no good. It's just another $150 biilion dollars of DEBT, or INFLATION.

Spending is what got us INTO this mess, and now they're telling us to SPEND MORE.

Seems fishy to me.

 

[RetiredGySgt]

I wasn't referring to helping the global economy when I said buy American. I was merely pointing out that our economic pitfalls are effecting the global economy. Buying American with that fake $150 Billion they're going to give us would probably BEST help the economy, in the SHORT term. Our economy getting better would in turn boost the confidence internationally, which would probably boost their markets. I'm no expert, but there IS a certain bit of common sense that goes into this thinking.

If people don't spend that new money on American products, which they probably as a whole WON'T, then it does no good. It's just another $150 biilion dollars of DEBT, or INFLATION.

Spending is what got us INTO this mess, and now they're telling us to SPEND MORE.

Seems fishy to me.

My response was to Jillian.

 

[Paulie]

My response was to Jillian.

I know, but you still didn't seem clear on what the OP entailed.

As goes our economy, so goes the global economy. So let's work on boosting OURS.

Buy American. Do you agree? Because taking our cute little $800-$1600 that the government is so kind to be giving to us, and going to walmart with it, or paying down debt, is not going to be putting that money to any sort of good use.

 

[RetiredGySgt]

I know, but you still didn't seem clear on what the OP entailed.

As goes our economy, so goes the global economy. So let's work on boosting OURS.

Buy American. Do you agree? Because taking our cute little $800-$1600 that the government is so kind to be giving to us, and going to walmart with it, or paying down debt, is not going to be putting that money to any sort of good use.

Assuming we actually get said money, it is up to each individual what they do with it. Buying American though, in context to the thread and the article would NOT be helping the global economy.

 

[Paulie]

Assuming we actually get said money, it is up to each individual what they do with it. Buying American though, in context to the thread and the article would NOT be helping the global economy.

I wanted to make 2 different points in one post. ONE: The global economy is falling because OURS is falling.

TWO: When we get this money, buy American, so our OWN production can go up. I don't really care about China's economy, in that I'd rather go to Wal-Mart and buy cheaper items. This is going to be money we weren't even expecting to have, so we might as well just be as responsible with it as we can.

And even though I wasn't trying to make the point that buying American would boost the global economy (for the third god damn time now), explain how it wouldn't, eventually?

I'm only worried about US right now. But confidence in our economy is what drives that rest of the world's economy.

What are you planning on doing with your new fake money?

 

[AllieBaba]

Well, except for the untold numbers of Americans who depend on Walmart for their livelihoods.

 

[Paulie]

Well, except for the untold numbers of Americans who depend on Walmart for their livelihoods.

That's because there are untold numbers of Americans who can't AFFORD to shop anywhere else. So with a "free" $800 to spend now, it would be nice if they had some discipline and shopped American. But they won't. And the government knows that. That's why this is such a bad idea.

Do you have anything INTERESTING to talk about in economics?

 

[AllieBaba]

No, you idiot. I'm talking about the people who work there, not the people who shop there.

And only somebody who has never had to struggle to feed and clothe themselves and their family would sneer at people who "don't have the discipline" to recognize a good deal when they see one.

Elitists make me sick. Hyopcritical pieces of shit.