Will Americans outlast the insurgency?

[deaddude]

The correct course of action is to finish the job and I will continue to support that

What job is in need of being finished? What do we need to do in order to achieve a mission accomplished?

also PJ empty your Private Message box,

 

[sitarro]

Reviled by people on the other side of the argument, who would have thought? Dont get me wrong, I think it would be foolish to leave, and knowing PJ, he does to. It is just that people are starting to think that it was foolish to go in their in the first place.

Gee, I wonder why, the media shows nothing positive unless they are forced too and then finish the report with a but . . .

The idiots from the Dem side thought this would work to get that French looking metrosexual elected. They let out all of the stops, concerts, MTV's "get out the idiot vote", Hollywood and their big dumbass mouths, Michael Moore's films(and the awards for them), pbs shows, air America and the vile jerks on that station, Sean Penn, mass protests. All of this and more and they still lost. They still tried to change the results after they lost.

It is campaigns like this that make polls meaningless.

If the media would decide that it was in their interest that we were doing well in Iraq the reports would be polar opposite and the polls would skyrocket for the President and the war. I wouldn't think that was something that needed to be explained to you PJ.

 

[Gunny]

What job is in need of being finished? What do we need to do in order to achieve a mission accomplished?

When the gov't of Iraq can stand on it's own, the mission will be accomplished.

also PJ empty your Private Message box,

/

 

[deaddude]

How long are you willing to wait for that to come to fruition?

 

[rtwngAvngr]

How long are you willing to wait for that to come to fruition?

The thing is: We cannot allow these mullahs to get nukes. I know, I know, who are WE decide who gets to have weapons? We're the U.S. that's who.

http://www.newamericancentury.org/

 

[Gunny]

How long are you willing to wait for that to come to fruition?

Dude, I am a US Marine. Hell will freeze over before I'll abandon my post before the mission is complete.

Close enough?

 

[Annie]

Dude, I am a US Marine. Hell will freeze over before I'll abandon my post before the mission is complete.

Close enough?

I am going to go back and look at the polls when I get a chance. The falling numbers in 'favor' of Iraq war falling, have been around for months now, but the follow up question is usually something to the effect of: "Do you support remaining in Iraq until the Iraqis are able to defend themselveds against the insurgency?" This has been repeatedly followed by a high percentage number.

 

[Gunny]

I am going to go back and look at the polls when I get a chance. The falling numbers in 'favor' of Iraq war falling, have been around for months now, but the follow up question is usually something to the effect of: "Do you support remaining in Iraq until the Iraqis are able to defend themselveds against the insurgency?" This has been repeatedly followed by a high percentage number.

I really don't pay much attention to polls because as you mention, they are gamed.

What really gets me is anyone capable of thought KNOWS Americans have a short attention span/demand immediate results. The longer this drags out, the more it plays into the favor of the left.

 

[sitarro]

Dude, I am a US Marine. Hell will freeze over before I'll abandon my post before the mission is complete.

Close enough?

Hey deaddude,
This guy quoted above, that is the spirit and commitment that has made our country great and I would be proud to stand beside him anytime, anywhere

Gunny,
Thank you sir for your unselfish service to this country, you Marines are the BEST! I agree with you completely.

 

[Annie]

I really don't pay much attention to polls because as you mention, they are gamed.

What really gets me is anyone capable of thought KNOWS Americans have a short attention span/demand immediate results. The longer this drags out, the more it plays into the favor of the left.

Actually I think the American public is pretty funny when it comes to polls, they seem to love to contradict themselves. "War is bad", thus "I don't support it, in theory." But, without US troops in Iraq, they do know that 'something bad will happen', they just don't know what, SOOOO, "The troops should stay, until...."

 

[Gunny]

Actually I think the American public is pretty funny when it comes to polls, they seem to love to contradict themselves. "War is bad", thus "I don't support it, in theory." But, without US troops in Iraq, they do know that 'something bad will happen', they just don't know what, SOOOO, "The troops should stay, until...."

I wonder sometimes if they even understand the questions .....

 

[Annie]

I wonder sometimes if they even understand the questions .....

That may well be. I think though, that in their 'gut' Americans do know what must be done. We lost our way once with Vietnam, seems not to be repeated, though do not want to look 'bloodthirsty.' The numbers of those that say 'stay there' has to include many democrats, the numbers are too high.

 

[Gunny]

That may well be. I think though, that in their 'gut' Americans do know what must be done. We lost our way once with Vietnam, seems not to be repeated, though do not want to look 'bloodthirsty.' The numbers of those that say 'stay there' has to include many democrats, the numbers are too high.

They took the poll at the last meeting of the DNC?

 

[Annie]

They took the poll at the last meeting of the DNC?

I'm assuming there are some Dems smarter than their leaders.

 

[LuvRPgrl]

Lets see, PJ made a statement and provided a link to back up his claim, RWA made a statement with no evidence to back it up whatsoever. His best "fact" was to repeat the same statement in his next post. An argument (even if it is a counter argument) does require evidence to back it up.

Or do you exempt RWA from the same rules of debate that you apply to PJ simply because you agree with RWA's position.

I used his same link to show his reading of it was inaccurate, better no evidence than false evidence.

PJ stated unequivocably, as is the topic of the thread, that public support is diminishing, yet HIS OWN link shows that the percentage he cites, is the same it was two years ago. How is that DIMINISHING support????

 

[LuvRPgrl]

Starting to think? It was a commonly held idea in the military back in 91 that taking out Saddam would result in the Shia, Sunni's, Kurds and Ba'ath's waging civil war for control and that leaving him in place was the wiser course of action. We also thought that taking Saddam out would create the power vaccum it has, drawing every fruitloop in the region like flies.

That is not saying there was not sufficient justification to take Saddam out. IMO, there was way more than enough. But the only real way to control the radical Islamic groups that currently run rampant is by doing it the same way Saddam did -- isolate and contain.

From a military standpoint, the occupation of Iraq has been amateurish at best because of politics. Too many in power here are more worried about what those on the political fronts both here and abroad than they are doing what's right.

They need to turn the military loose on search and destroy and let them drive these dogs to ground when and where found.

Be all that as it may, second-guessing with hindsight is about as useful as tits on a boar. We ARE there. The correct course of action is to finish the job and I will continue to support that and nothign short of that even if I don't agree with the tactics being used.

100% accurate !!!!!!!

 

[LuvRPgrl]

The thing is: We cannot allow these mullahs to get nukes. I know, I know, who are WE decide who gets to have weapons? We're the U.S. that's who.

http://www.newamericancentury.org/

DAMN STRAIGHT !!!!!!!!!

 

[LuvRPgrl]

I feel confident in the polls I provided. Its not just one poll, but mulitple polls done over a long period of time.

So far, no one has been able to point out flaws in my argument that an erosion of support, coupled with the fact that insurgencies take an average of 10 years to defeat, will result in the premature withdrawl of troops.

Yes, improvements are being made, but whether or not a 9 story rental real estate is built matters little if it is destroyed by the insurgency. If American troops are taken out of the equation, and Iraqi troops still aren't up to speed, the terrorists within their country will have a free-for-all.

Thats not even taking into account the ethnic divisions that exist.

Your polls prove NOTHING. First, they are only polls. People respond differently to "hypotheticals" than real life. Second, many times polls are wayyyyyyyyyyy off, they had Arnold losing...

And YOU need to examine your "trustworthy" polls a little closer.

All the polls have an error margin of 3-4 % PLUS OR MINUS, which means it can flucuate in error by up to 8 SWING points. In other words, if bringing the troops home NOW is 45 points in June, and 52 points now, that is a statistical tie, since the 45 points in June could be up to 48-49 points, and the 52 points now could be as low as 48-49 points, a TIE. So the polls done prove a diminishing support level of the public.

And your comment about the insurgency (dont you mean terrorists??-I mean, if they are destroying non military buildings, as you claim they might, that makes them terrorists, right?) destroying the 9 story building is irrelevant to the fact that people are investing in them, which PROVES the people KNOW the situation is getting better and more stable.

 

[Palestinian Jew]

Your polls prove NOTHING. First, they are only polls. People respond differently to "hypotheticals" than real life. Second, many times polls are wayyyyyyyyyyy off, they had Arnold losing...

And YOU need to examine your "trustworthy" polls a little closer.

All the polls have an error margin of 3-4 % PLUS OR MINUS, which means it can flucuate in error by up to 8 SWING points. In other words, if bringing the troops home NOW is 45 points in June, and 52 points now, that is a statistical tie, since the 45 points in June could be up to 48-49 points, and the 52 points now could be as low as 48-49 points, a TIE. So the polls done prove a diminishing support level of the public.

And your comment about the insurgency (dont you mean terrorists??-I mean, if they are destroying non military buildings, as you claim they might, that makes them terrorists, right?) destroying the 9 story building is irrelevant to the fact that people are investing in them, which PROVES the people KNOW the situation is getting better and more stable.

In late 2003, a majority of Americans(roughly 56%) supported the war. Now the majority are against. Yes, the numbers are going down slowly. I realize this. But if winning the war is going to take 7 or 8 more years, how much lower can the number go before the majority DEMANDS withdrawl from it leaders.

As for the polls, there are quite a few of them done by mulitple groups over a long period of time that all point to the same conclusion. They are trustworthy.

Yes, the situation is getting better in the short-term, but we haven't even gotten to what happens when Iraq's ethnicities clash. That is where the real trouble will occur.

 

[LuvRPgrl]

In late 2003, a majority of Americans(roughly 56%) supported the war. Now the majority are against. Yes, the numbers are going down slowly. I realize this. But if winning the war is going to take 7 or 8 more years, how much lower can the number go before the majority DEMANDS withdrawl from it leaders..

It wont take that long.

As for the polls, there are quite a few of them done by mulitple groups over a long period of time that all point to the same conclusion. They are trustworthy..

Doesnt prove they are accurate on this issue.

Yes, the situation is getting better in the short-term, but we haven't even gotten to what happens when Iraq's ethnicities clash. That is where the real trouble will occur.

You dont think they are already clashing????