Why socialism is evil

[Mr. Sauerkraut]

you better don´t say to a former GDR man, that Germany is a "Bit of socialistic".
We have a social market economy. We have our problems but it works. I don´t understand your fear of a common health system for everyone.

 

[hipeter924]

you better don´t say to a former GDR man, that Germany is a "Bit of socialistic".
We have a social market economy. We have our problems but it works. I don´t understand your fear of a common health system for everyone.

The US already has a public health care system, but it's messed up with inefficiencies and government incompetence, it's why Obama's health care plan is so unworkable, the system itself is flawed, so you are merely using a broken tool to fix a problem. But in any case a health care system is meant to have private hospitals/clinics to relieve the pressure off the public system and provide specialist care that otherwise would be prohibitively expensive or unworkable in the public system.

 

[Mr. Sauerkraut]

so the idea of a public health care system is good but it´s bad constructed?

 

[Sallow]

Okay..you may have a point..with this evil Socialism..and it may be time to change the Constitution..

Specifically:

Section 8 - Powers of Congress

The Congress shall have Power To lay and collect Taxes, Duties, Imposts and Excises, to pay the Debts and provide for the common Defence and general Welfare of the United States; but all Duties, Imposts and Excises shall be uniform throughout the United States;

To borrow money on the credit of the United States;

To regulate Commerce with foreign Nations, and among the several States, and with the Indian Tribes;

To establish Post Offices and Post Roads;

To promote the Progress of Science and useful Arts, by securing for limited Times to Authors and Inventors the exclusive Right to their respective Writings and Discoveries;

To raise and support Armies, but no Appropriation of Money to that Use shall be for a longer Term than two Years;

To provide and maintain a Navy;

To make Rules for the Government and Regulation of the land and naval Forces;

To provide for calling forth the Militia to execute the Laws of the Union, suppress Insurrections and repel Invasions;

To provide for organizing, arming, and disciplining, the Militia, and for governing such Part of them as may be employed in the Service of the United States, reserving to the States respectively, the Appointment of the Officers, and the Authority of training the Militia according to the discipline prescribed by Congress;

Amendment 6 - Right to Speedy Trial, Confrontation of Witnesses. Ratified 12/15/1791.

In all criminal prosecutions, the accused shall enjoy the right to a speedy and public trial, by an impartial jury of the State and district wherein the crime shall have been committed, which district shall have been previously ascertained by law, and to be informed of the nature and cause of the accusation; to be confronted with the witnesses against him; to have compulsory process for obtaining witnesses in his favor, and to have the Assistance of Counsel for his defence.

Damn that evil socialism.

 

[goldcatt]

It depends how far you go, the way I see socialism is an impingement of individual rights, but regardless of the title it makes a good point, that Americans are using and exploiting each other rather than honestly doing things out of charity and good will, in a way that is evil. But on the point of proving socialism is evil, it didn't get close, it did a good job I thought of proving that forcing someone to help someone else against their will is immoral to an extent.

The problem is it doesn't describe "socialism". Words do have meanings, even if those meanings are inconvenient to the agenda being pushed. The title tells anyone with the capacity for critical thought that it's nothing but emotionally driven ideological propaganda, which is borne out repeatedly in the body of the article.

Sorry, that dog won't hunt. Pile it Higher and Deeper all you want, but the piece is nothing but an elaborate bumper sticker meant to induce an emotional response. It was obviously successful in its purpose, but from a rational point of view it's crap because from Word One it's built on a false premise.

I find plenty of articles like that all the time, it doesn't mean they aren't worth reading, otherwise I wouldn't read articles on the net at all. In fact I lived basically without television for a year, you would be surprised how more informed you become as a result of not watching Fox, CNN, or local media. If I was looking for a totally informed article with a true premise then I wouldn't be searching on the net but in an academic book.

What on earth makes you believe I would be "surprised"? Ah, the assumptions people make about others in the internet.

I understand what you're saying about there being little in the way of informed, true information on the internet as well. But it's out there. The fact that you recognize the article you posted in the OP as untrue and uninformed makes me wonder why you posted it at all, without acknowledging its serious flaws until challenged?

You're far from the only one, sorry to single you out. But you happened to have the most blatant example I opened on a day I felt like laughing at it.

 

[hipeter924]

The problem is it doesn't describe "socialism". Words do have meanings, even if those meanings are inconvenient to the agenda being pushed. The title tells anyone with the capacity for critical thought that it's nothing but emotionally driven ideological propaganda, which is borne out repeatedly in the body of the article.

Sorry, that dog won't hunt. Pile it Higher and Deeper all you want, but the piece is nothing but an elaborate bumper sticker meant to induce an emotional response. It was obviously successful in its purpose, but from a rational point of view it's crap because from Word One it's built on a false premise.

I find plenty of articles like that all the time, it doesn't mean they aren't worth reading, otherwise I wouldn't read articles on the net at all. In fact I lived basically without television for a year, you would be surprised how more informed you become as a result of not watching Fox, CNN, or local media. If I was looking for a totally informed article with a true premise then I wouldn't be searching on the net but in an academic book.

What on earth makes you believe I would be "surprised"? Ah, the assumptions people make about others in the internet.

I understand what you're saying about there being little in the way of informed, true information on the internet as well. But it's out there. The fact that you recognize the article you posted in the OP as untrue and uninformed makes me wonder why you posted it at all, without acknowledging its serious flaws until challenged?

You're far from the only one, sorry to single you out. But you happened to have the most blatant example I opened on a day I felt like laughing at it.

At the end of the day I don't believe what he is saying, because he is not right wing or freedom seeking enough for me, he still believes in keeping intact the corporate framework while removing the regulatory structure (like taking a shell off an egg), while removing a welfare system, and at the same time making little difference to tax rates (if you believe tax is stealing then it stands to reason on that argument all tax should be voluntary). But worse he is providing no alternative system to put people into work (and no charitable alternative to care for those who can't) which would eliminate the need for a welfare system.

But besides that...I enjoyed the article.

PS: You would probably not understand, the same interest makes me read Robert Fisk and Ann Coulter.

 

[Mr. Sauerkraut]

If Socialism is evil

is capitalism holy and sacred then?

 

[Intense]

Imagine there's an elderly widow down the street from you. She has neither the strength to mow her lawn nor enough money to hire someone to do it. Here's my question to you, and I'm almost afraid for the answer: Would you support a government mandate that forces one of your neighbors to mow the lady's lawn each week? If he failed to follow the government orders, would you approve of some kind of punishment ranging from house arrest and fines to imprisonment? I'm hoping that the average American would condemn such a government mandate because it would be a form of slavery, the forcible use of one person to serve the purposes of another.

Would there be the same condemnation if instead of the government forcing your neighbor to physically mow the widow's lawn, the government forced him to give the lady $40 of his weekly earnings? That way the widow could hire someone to mow her lawn. I'd say that there is little difference between the mandates. While the mandate's mechanism differs, it is nonetheless the forcible use of one person to serve the purposes of another.

Probably most Americans would have a clearer conscience if all the neighbors were forced to put money in a government pot and a government agency would send the widow a weekly sum of $40 to hire someone to mow her lawn. This mechanism makes the particular victim invisible, but it still boils down to one person being forcibly used to serve the purposes of another. Putting the money into a government pot makes palatable acts that would otherwise be deemed morally offensive.

Full Article here: Why socialism is evil

Walter E. Williams, Ph.D., is the John M. Olin Distinguished Professor of Economics at George Mason University in Fairfax, Va.

Utter hogwash, not worthy of consideration.

Socialism is surely imperfect. But what existing alternative is half as good? None.

If you want to invent something better, GREAT!

If you just wanna kill socialism to make way for more rapacious cannibal capitalism, go to hell, Satan.

It is amazing that you defend Socialism not being perfect, yet condemn Liberty, and Free Market Capitalism as evil, with no hesitation what so ever. The very system that has advanced Mankind more than every other put together. Merry Christmas!

 

[Intense]

Did the retard OP just compare food and shelter to landscaping?

So....... You want to discuss the merits of a Safety Net, for the Needy, with qualifications, and a Step Program to lead People out of it, when able, I'm all for it. Government by the Consent of the Governed should never be abandoned for any Cause, JB. There is a big disconnect there. Merry Christmas.

 

[Intense]

That the person who would write such nonsense is a PhD proves once more that real education requires thought, living, experience, not just the passing of artificial requirements that proclaim - or is that pretend - knowledge. Even a simple dictionary definition contains more information than our presumed educated fool. Socialism | Define Socialism at Dictionary.com

Socialism like capitalism, like Christianity, like communism, are simply abstractions. They are words today that only gain meaning in context and use, outside of those areas they are meaningless. They possess meaning for the charlatans, as they are easy negatives, applied to whomever is the out-group at the moment. Rather than think, name call is the fool's tool.

Another aspect to the constant need to criticize an idea is WHY? Why do some always need to pick on abstractions as if the sky were falling? What personal need drives this constant war against something that is no threat. 'Socialism' has replaced the devil, sin, and witches in the 21th century and is as real as they were.

"Moreover, if we give the matter a moment's thought, we can see that the 20th century morality tale of 'socialism vs. freedom' or 'communism vs. capitalism' is misleading. Capitalism is not a political system; it is a form of economic life, compatible in practice with right wing dictatorships (Chile under Pinochet), left-wing dictatorships (contemporary China), social-democratic monarchies (Sweden), and plutocratic republics (the United States), whether capitalist economies thrive best under conditions of freedom is perhaps more of an open question than we like to think." Tony Judt 'Ill fares the Land'

Amazon.com: Socialism: A Very Short Introduction (Very Short Introductions) (9780192804310): Michael Newman: Books

When we stir up the pond we loose site because of the mud. There will alway's be those that take advantage of a temporary condition, to profit, to enslave, to institute draconian legislation to advance Totalitarian Government. State Capitalism, Oligarchy Capitalism, is not comparable to Free Market Capitalism. Word games don't mask Injustice and Tyranny from Everyone. Merry Christmas Midcan.

 

[Intense]

WELFARE is NOT socialism, folks.

Words have meanings.

Learn them or continue to prove your ignorance.

Socialism doesn't work well because central planning of a nation's industries does not have the advantage of being flexible to changing conditions, PLUS when central plans go wrong they go VERY WRONG.

THAT is what's wrong with a socialist economic system.

Fantastic argument for the soft touch of Light Handed Federalism, the Vision Madison shared. Too bad we turned our backs on it. Merry Christmas!

 

[Intense]

I love the way propagandists throw absolute emotionally charged terms like "evil" around. Gets that warm, fuzzy, knee jerk, no thought involved response they're looking for every time. Just like Pavlov's dogs.

It depends how far you go, the way I see socialism is an impingement of individual rights, but regardless of the title it makes a good point, that Americans are using and exploiting each other rather than honestly doing things out of charity and good will, in a way that is evil. But on the point of proving socialism is evil, it didn't get close, it did a good job I thought of proving that forcing someone to help someone else against their will is immoral to an extent.

Your Definitions are confused. Socialism has nothing to do with Unalienable Rights. We, knowing Liberty, and the Author of it, came up with that realization. If anything, Socialism, it's control, it's devalue of the Individual, threatens that. We Each matter.

 

[Intense]

hi
we have here in germany mercedes benz and a health care system for everyone. What do you think we are: Socialists ore Capitalists?

Confused, in debt, and spending beyond your means. The same as here. Merry Christmas!

 

[Intense]

Okay..you may have a point..with this evil Socialism..and it may be time to change the Constitution..

Specifically:

Section 8 - Powers of Congress

The Congress shall have Power To lay and collect Taxes, Duties, Imposts and Excises, to pay the Debts and provide for the common Defence and general Welfare of the United States; but all Duties, Imposts and Excises shall be uniform throughout the United States;

To borrow money on the credit of the United States;

To regulate Commerce with foreign Nations, and among the several States, and with the Indian Tribes;

To establish Post Offices and Post Roads;

To promote the Progress of Science and useful Arts, by securing for limited Times to Authors and Inventors the exclusive Right to their respective Writings and Discoveries;

To raise and support Armies, but no Appropriation of Money to that Use shall be for a longer Term than two Years;

To provide and maintain a Navy;

To make Rules for the Government and Regulation of the land and naval Forces;

To provide for calling forth the Militia to execute the Laws of the Union, suppress Insurrections and repel Invasions;

To provide for organizing, arming, and disciplining, the Militia, and for governing such Part of them as may be employed in the Service of the United States, reserving to the States respectively, the Appointment of the Officers, and the Authority of training the Militia according to the discipline prescribed by Congress;

Amendment 6 - Right to Speedy Trial, Confrontation of Witnesses. Ratified 12/15/1791.

In all criminal prosecutions, the accused shall enjoy the right to a speedy and public trial, by an impartial jury of the State and district wherein the crime shall have been committed, which district shall have been previously ascertained by law, and to be informed of the nature and cause of the accusation; to be confronted with the witnesses against him; to have compulsory process for obtaining witnesses in his favor, and to have the Assistance of Counsel for his defence.

Damn that evil socialism.

We don't blame you, just the system that indoctrinated you. I know this is a shock for you... so sit down.... "Government is not God" .... "Government is not Santa"......Merry Christmas Sallow!

 

[Big Fitz]

Because it is a potential threat to the people who consider themselves to be winners at capitalism.

But Adam Smith talked about enlightened self interest.

So why aren't all of the Capitalists and Libertarians advocating mandatory accounting in the schools?

Fifth graders can learn accounting as well as collegians

Double-entry accounting is 700 YEARS OLD. How hard can it be with today's computers?

psik

I'm all for that! Not only that but mandatory micro and macro economics for junior high and high school students, along with classics of western culture.

To fit it in the budget, we can drop some less than useful self esteem programs.

 

[editec]

In order to know why socialism is anything, it might help if you know what socialism is.

Clearly the chorus here telling us why it's evil doesn't have a clue what it is.

FYI, kids Germany is not a socialist state.

 

[Big Fitz]

PS doesn't realize that some people will actually voluntarily help their neighbors.

My brother and nephew did the yard work for the elderly woman who lived across the street from them for a few years. Nobody forced them. It was actually my nephew's idea - my brother taught him decent values.

Big Government bleeds such decency out of a people.

The conservative and libertarian look at the old woman' lawn and choose to help her out, out of their own charity.

The liberal looks at that lawn and feels the charitable pull on their heart and says someone ELSE should help that woman out because they're have a ready excuse why not. And if nobody else will do it willingly, they should be forced to by government because it's just not right.

Of course, they don't realize that their own heart has convicted them to do the task, but they are too selfish to follow through with their own sense of charity.

 

[Mr. Sauerkraut]

WELFARE is NOT socialism, folks.

Words have meanings.

Learn them or continue to prove your ignorance.

Socialism doesn't work well because central planning of a nation's industries does not have the advantage of being flexible to changing conditions, PLUS when central plans go wrong they go VERY WRONG.

THAT is what's wrong with a socialist economic system.

Fantastic argument for the soft touch of Light Handed Federalism, the Vision Madison shared. Too bad we turned our backs on it. Merry Christmas!

I think, that the real problem with socialsim is that the people who decide, what´s to be produced and the distributors of the goods will become the new powerful class. If you want to prevent this, you must introduce a job rotating system where sooner or later everybody does every job. That means, that you won´t get any specialists and the trash collector from yesterday will do your blind gut operation today and calculates your pension tomorrow.

 

[editec]

Fritz. the provlem with sociaism is that it puts all authority for use and dispersal of resources into the hands of government planners.

So the potential for governbment corruption is obvious.

And central planning, while sometimes ncessary in some cases like a city planning a sewage system, clearly does not work for an entire economy.

Bascially socialism puts all society's eggs (resources) into one basket.

Capitalism (when it's not corrupt) is a more ORGANIC.

Since money is distributed in a capitalist economyt, POWER TO DECIDE is likewise distributed.

So while some people's best laid plans go astray, other people's plans work out.

The reason we have SO much problem discussing this political science question, is because most people here think socialism means welfare.

Basically some people here CHOOSE not to understand what poli-sci words mean so they can continue their basically silly argument.

And when you correct them, they instantly image that makes YOU a socialist defending socialism.

Their ascii superpower is their total ignorance about the subjects they presume to lecture us on.... that and the hallaluhah chorus of their fellow ignoramouses who support their ignorance by swearing they're right. of course.

What I can agree with them on is that yes, indeed, socialism is a flawed system.

What we cannot agree on (because they choose to ignore reality) is what socialism actually is.

 

[CrusaderFrank]

Socialism: how mass murderers and sociopaths fool enough people in order to get control of the legitimacy and firepower of the State. (Mao, Hitler, Stalin, Fidel, FDR, Obama)