why not just sit on your butt and pray?

[PostmodernProph]

no seriously....tell me.....do you think they are still alive?.....

It seems that your being shown to be utterly clueless about the religious dogma you try to defend has gotten you incensed.

Let this be a life lesson for you. You will find that a great many non-believers know your holy texts with far greater insight than you ever will. Your embarrassment at being shown to be a know-nothing is your own responsibility.

you think Adam and Eve didn't die and you think I should be embarrassed?....seriously?.....

 

[Chuckt]

A&E didn't die, as the serpent pointed out, they lived

right....they're living in Boulder, CO under assumed names I expect.....

I was going to ask if you're reallythat clueless to write a post such as the above, but yeah, you're really that clueless.

"ye shall eat of all things but not of the fruit of the Tree of Knowledge -- for on that day, ye shall die".

A&E didn't die, as the serpent pointed out, they lived; God lied, Satan told the truth-- how ironic.

Hollie,

I can understand that you're shocked and surprised to learn what is actually in the bibles. You have only yourself to blame for never having taken the time to read the bibles and thus, stumble over your own ignorance.

Hollie, maybe you should learn what is in the Bible because you are saying something that isn't correct.

The English word "Die" is a verb and Death is a process. My Father in Law had aortic stenosis and probably died on his feet.

Death is a process and little babies have green poop and when you get older, your bowel movement turns darker because you are dieing.

If you also looked at the outline of Biblical usage of the word "day" or "yowm", it can mean:

days (lifetime), days, time period, year, etc.

You wouldn't happen to know Hebrew and know what you are talking about? I provided links so that everyone can look for themselves and they don't have to believe that you know what you are talking about.

Genesis 2 (Blue Letter Bible: KJV - King James Version)

Blue Letter Bible - Lexicon

One enquiry sent to me about Genesis 2:17 said that the verse says “in THAT day” you shall surely die. So, the enquirer said, it sure seems to say that Adam would die physically that day. But the demonstrative pronoun, “that,” is not in the Hebrew text at this point. The Hebrew has beyom (בְּיוֹ&#1501, where the Hebrew preposition b (ב, usually is translated “in&#8221 is connected as a prefix to yom (יוֹם, which is the word for “day&#8221. This Hebrew temporal adverb is often translated with the English prepositional phrase “in the day that.” This would be the essentially “woodenly literal” translation (although “the” and “that” are not in the Hebrew but are added to make the English sound smooth). But only sometimes (not always) does beyom refer to a literal day, in which case the context makes it clear. This same construction (beyom) appears in Genesis 2:4 and does not refer to a specific 24-hour day but to the whole creation week of six literal days.

Genesis 2:17??you shall surely die? - Answers in Genesis

Matthew Pool gives the understanding of death as threefold which means the Bible reveals it is a process.

Matthew Poole's Commentary
With a threefold death.

1. Spiritual, by the guilt and power of sin: at that instant thou shalt be dead in trespasses and sins, Ephesians 2:1.

2. Temporal, or the death of the body, which shall then begin in thee, by decays, infirmities, terrors, dangers, and other harbingers of death.

3. Eternal, which shall immediately succeed the other.

Genesis 2:17 Commentaries: but from the tree of the knowledge of good and evil you shall not eat, for in the day that you eat from it you will surely die."

Physical death is when you die and that is how most people understand it but the second death is described when God in Revelation 21:8 as having part in the lake of fire which is the second death. So the Bible describes death as a process where you first die spiritually.

Revelation 21:8 But the fearful, and unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone: which is the second death.

I'm sorry if this is more than you want to go but we can go on and on from here.

I think I'll name my Bible study the big adult version.

 

[Hollie]

no seriously....tell me.....do you think they are still alive?.....

It seems that your being shown to be utterly clueless about the religious dogma you try to defend has gotten you incensed.

Let this be a life lesson for you. You will find that a great many non-believers know your holy texts with far greater insight than you ever will. Your embarrassment at being shown to be a know-nothing is your own responsibility.

you think Adam and Eve didn't die and you think I should be embarrassed?....seriously?.....

Yeah, seriously. Your so clueless, it's an embarrassment.

 

[Hollie]

Hollie, maybe you should learn what is in the Bible because you are saying something that isn't correct.

I wrote nothing that isn't correct.

It's a shame that you're forced to retreat to Answers in Genesis for your apologetics. AIG is among the more the more notorious of the christian charlatans. But yeah, if you're going to need excuses for glaring, obvious and structural defects in biblical tales and fables, you might as well go to AIG.

"Have you looked at the AiG Statement of Faith"?

Section 1: Priorities

• The scientific aspects of creation are important but are secondary in importance to the proclamation of the gospel of Jesus Christ as Sovereign, Creator, Redeemer, and Judge.
• The doctrines of Creator and Creation cannot ultimately be divorced from the gospel of Jesus Christ.

So yeah, reliability, ethics, truth and honor go flying out the window with these charlatans.

The English word "Die" is a verb and Death is a process.

Well yeah. But how interesting that you and AIG carelessly and incorrectly mix and match terms. On the one hand, you provide an english adaptation of "die" and in you very next sentence, you retreat to a Hebrew translation.

Yours (and AIG's) are all heroic but failed and ultimately dishonest attempts to re-write the bibles in order to force fit your own interpretation - one that doesn't conflict with the obvious errors of what is actually in the bibles

The ONLY time you make such broad, sweeping exceptions from the truth like this when it's in connection religious belief and attempts to sidestep errors and omissions because you would desperately like for it all to be true. Then your normal standards of reason and accountability go flying out the window. It's ridiculously obvious.

If you also looked at the outline of Biblical usage of the word "day" or "yowm", it can mean:

Ah... I see. So in your re-writing of the bibles, (and now the Hebrew text), we have statements that require your specific re-interpretation.

"ye shall eat of all things but not of the fruit of the Tree of Knowledge -- for on that day, ye shall die".

You're now suggesting that the verse be re-interpreted to mean that the men who wrote the bibles meant that "in your lifetime ye shall die".

Are you kidding? Are you thinking that anyone should take that seriously?

I just find it pitiable that charlatans such as AIG prey upon those who "mouth the bait" of their lies and deceit. Now here you are hoping to alter the context of genesis for purely emotional reasons.






[/QUOTE]

 

[Chuckt]

Hollie, maybe you should learn what is in the Bible because you are saying something that isn't correct.

I wrote nothing that isn't correct.

It's a shame that you're forced to retreat to Answers in Genesis for your apologetics. AIG is among the more the more notorious of the christian charlatans. But yeah, if you're going to need excuses for glaring, obvious and structural defects in biblical tales and fables, you might as well go to AIG.

It is a ad-hominen attack. How they exegete the Bible is a separate case from how they do science and may have been done by different experts who know Hebrew.

 

[Chuckt]

You're now suggesting that the verse be re-interpreted to mean that the men who wrote the bibles meant that "in your lifetime ye shall die".

Are you kidding? Are you thinking that anyone should take that seriously?

I just find it pitiable that charlatans such as AIG prey upon those who "mouth the bait" of their lies and deceit. Now here you are hoping to alter the context of genesis for purely emotional reasons.

[/QUOTE]

The language is thousands of years old. Genesis and Job are probably two of the oldest books in the Bible. All language that wasn't in the ark was destroyed except for what was written on stone or cave walls.

Language is based on context and because translators don't want to make a mistake, they translate things very literally and after reading some of the translations for a while, they are so literal that they are wooden translations and all translations are an interpretation.

This is a little about how they do it in Bible school. They made me sit down and find as many observations about two verses as possible and some people can find 400 observations about two verses which takes hours.

They probably died spiritually that day and their light went out and they were separated from God. The fact that they changed and became aware should give you pause that something changed that day.

Here is an example from the Greek that shows you don't know what you are talking about.

Matthew 13:39 The enemy that sowed them is the devil; the harvest is the end of the world; and the reapers are the angels.

The word "world" can mean "age".

Matthew 13 (Blue Letter Bible: KJV - King James Version)
Blue Letter Bible - Lexicon

One of my pastors re-translates the Bible. There are a few words that actually mean something else.

I have seen an old Strong's dictionary. It was multi-volume. It isn't the one volume we have today. It was called Strong's Cyclopedia. When you look at your one volume version and you see an "asterisk" that means the word comes from a word cluster. There are probably 300 common words with multiple meanings and the translators don't know which meaning it is. So you don't know what you are talking about.

 

[Hollie]

You're now suggesting that the verse be re-interpreted to mean that the men who wrote the bibles meant that "in your lifetime ye shall die".

Are you kidding? Are you thinking that anyone should take that seriously?

I just find it pitiable that charlatans such as AIG prey upon those who "mouth the bait" of their lies and deceit. Now here you are hoping to alter the context of genesis for purely emotional reasons.

The language is thousands of years old. Genesis and Job are probably two of the oldest books in the Bible. All language that wasn't in the ark was destroyed except for what was written on stone or cave walls.

Language is based on context and because translators don't want to make a mistake, they translate things very literally and after reading some of the translations for a while, they are so literal that they are wooden translations and all translations are an interpretation.

This is a little about how they do it in Bible school. They made me sit down and find as many observations about two verses as possible and some people can find 400 observations about two verses which takes hours.

They probably died spiritually that day and their light went out and they were separated from God. The fact that they changed and became aware should give you pause that something changed that day.

Here is an example from the Greek that shows you don't know what you are talking about.

Matthew 13:39 The enemy that sowed them is the devil; the harvest is the end of the world; and the reapers are the angels.

The word "world" can mean "age".

Matthew 13 (Blue Letter Bible: KJV - King James Version)
Blue Letter Bible - Lexicon

One of my pastors re-translates the Bible. There are a few words that actually mean something else.

I have seen an old Strong's dictionary. It was multi-volume. It isn't the one volume we have today. It was called Strong's Cyclopedia. When you look at your one volume version and you see an "asterisk" that means the word comes from a word cluster. There are probably 300 common words with multiple meanings. So you don't know what you are talking about.[/QUOTE]

I'm afraid the above is a lot of toothless testimony. And in terms of "you don't know what you are talking about", well, yeah, I actually do.

My description of the errors and inconsistencies in the genesis tale caused you to scour one of the most notorious and really, really deceitful and biased collection of charlatans and snake-oil sales people on the planet.

So tell us about talking snakes. I'm curious to see how AIG will lie their way through that bit of fantasy.

 

[Chuckt]

So tell us about talking snakes. I'm curious to see how AIG will lie their way through that bit of fantasy.

No one believed what splitting atoms could do either.

If God created the Heavens and the Earth, everything else is child's play for Him.

 

[Hollie]

So tell us about talking snakes. I'm curious to see how AIG will lie their way through that bit of fantasy.

No one believed what splitting atoms could do either.

If God created the Heavens and the Earth, everything else is child's play for Him.

That's a horrible analogy. The gods went from creating the heavens and earth to goofy parlor tricks of talking snakes and cursing all of humanity for fruit theft?

 

[Chuckt]

So tell us about talking snakes. I'm curious to see how AIG will lie their way through that bit of fantasy.

No one believed what splitting atoms could do either.

If God created the Heavens and the Earth, everything else is child's play for Him.

That's a horrible analogy. The gods went from creating the heavens and earth to goofy parlor tricks of talking snakes and cursing all of humanity for fruit theft?

How many did the U.S. drop on Japan before the Japanese believed us? How many days went by between Nagasaki and Hiroshima?

If the test were made on some neutral territory, it was hard to believe that Japan's determined and fanatical military men would be impressed. If such an open test were made first and failed to bring surrender, the chance would be gone to give the shock of surprise that proved so effective.

The possibility of a demonstration was raised again in the Franck Report issued by physicist James Franck on June 11 and the Scientific Advisory Panel rejected his report on June 16, saying that "we can propose no technical demonstration likely to bring an end to the war; we see no acceptable alternative to direct military use."

Atomic bombings of Hiroshima and Nagasaki - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

They didn't believe back then and stupid is what stupid does. They didn't stop right away and the third one was on its way.

 

[rdean]

that's obviously the answer to anything

why not just sit on your butt and pray?

Because they usually do it from their knees. Just like, well, you know.

 

[Hollie]

Hollie, maybe you should learn what is in the Bible because you are saying something that isn't correct.

I wrote nothing that isn't correct.

It's a shame that you're forced to retreat to Answers in Genesis for your apologetics. AIG is among the more the more notorious of the christian charlatans. But yeah, if you're going to need excuses for glaring, obvious and structural defects in biblical tales and fables, you might as well go to AIG.

It is a ad-hominen attack. How they exegete the Bible is a separate case from how they do science and may have been done by different experts who know Hebrew.

It's dismissing the credibility of charlatans who admit, and preface their argument with an explicit bias. AIG predefines their conclusions with a commitment to dogma. They're not honest and they're not objective. They're "statement of faith" announces that.

 

[Hollie]

No one believed what splitting atoms could do either.

If God created the Heavens and the Earth, everything else is child's play for Him.

That's a horrible analogy. The gods went from creating the heavens and earth to goofy parlor tricks of talking snakes and cursing all of humanity for fruit theft?

How many did the U.S. drop on Japan before the Japanese believed us? How many days went by between Nagasaki and Hiroshima?

If the test were made on some neutral territory, it was hard to believe that Japan's determined and fanatical military men would be impressed. If such an open test were made first and failed to bring surrender, the chance would be gone to give the shock of surprise that proved so effective.

The possibility of a demonstration was raised again in the Franck Report issued by physicist James Franck on June 11 and the Scientific Advisory Panel rejected his report on June 16, saying that "we can propose no technical demonstration likely to bring an end to the war; we see no acceptable alternative to direct military use."

Atomic bombings of Hiroshima and Nagasaki - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

They didn't believe back then and stupid is what stupid does. They didn't stop right away and the third one was on its way.

What does any of that have to do with the genesis fable?

 

[Newby]

Hollie....are they alive?......if they had never sinned they would not have died......they sinned.....they died.....we weren't created to die.....

Your question proves yet again the damages done by sniffing glue.

And you keep exposing yourself as a total and complete idiot who has zero understanding of the Bible.

Not sure why you keep wasting your time Proph, but you are doing a nice job of exposing her ignorance.

 

[Hollie]

So tell us about talking snakes. I'm curious to see how AIG will lie their way through that bit of fantasy.

No one believed what splitting atoms could do either.

If God created the Heavens and the Earth, everything else is child's play for Him.

Similarly, at one time no one believed the earth was globular or that the cure for disease was with medicine as opposed to prayer or rattling bones. You dwell in this fantasy world of miracles, supernaturalism, designer gods surrounded by fat, naked babies playing harps and winged horses pulling chariots through the clouds. These are the tales and fables you were taught as a child and you believe them still.

 

[HUGGY]

That's a horrible analogy. The gods went from creating the heavens and earth to goofy parlor tricks of talking snakes and cursing all of humanity for fruit theft?

How many did the U.S. drop on Japan before the Japanese believed us? How many days went by between Nagasaki and Hiroshima?

The possibility of a demonstration was raised again in the Franck Report issued by physicist James Franck on June 11 and the Scientific Advisory Panel rejected his report on June 16, saying that "we can propose no technical demonstration likely to bring an end to the war; we see no acceptable alternative to direct military use."

Atomic bombings of Hiroshima and Nagasaki - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

They didn't believe back then and stupid is what stupid does. They didn't stop right away and the third one was on its way.

What does any of that have to do with the genesis fable?

The religists do have seem to excavated an inexhaustable number of rabbit holes to wander aimlessly through.

 

[HUGGY]

I wonder, reading the excuses and awkward apologies from the religists, how many of these foolish individuals still secretly write letters to Santa Claus?

What's the difference in that and praying to god and the bejeebus?

 

[MaxGrit]

You just proved my point, and you can't even understand it.
This is exactly what proves the part that I highlighted in red incorrect.
Can you figure it out?

What - this is what was said ; The half-life of carbon 14 is approximate 5,730 years. That means if you took one pound of 100 percent carbon-14, in 5,730 years, you would only have half a pound left.

Says that same thing; half life of about 5730 years

Half life has absolutely nothing to do with weight.
Zero.
It is a function of radioactivity. Nothing shrinks or gets lighter.

Learn to comprehend what you are reading. The subject didn't change throughout the paragraph. Half a pound remains of what?

a)Beef
b)Chicken
c)Pork
d)Silver
e)Gold
f)Lead
g)Carbon-14

 

[RandomVariable]

What - this is what was said ; The half-life of carbon 14 is approximate 5,730 years. That means if you took one pound of 100 percent carbon-14, in 5,730 years, you would only have half a pound left.

Says that same thing; half life of about 5730 years

Half life has absolutely nothing to do with weight.
Zero.
It is a function of radioactivity. Nothing shrinks or gets lighter.

Learn to comprehend what you are reading. The subject didn't change throughout the paragraph. Half a pound remains of what?

a)Beef
b)Chicken
c)Pork
d)Silver
e)Gold
f)Lead
g)Carbon-14

http://www.usmessageboard.com/relig...sit-on-your-butt-and-pray-11.html#post9081250