Why is America on the decline?

[The Beaver]

First and foremost; anti-american liberals who constantly admonish this country because they lack the fortitude to inject any semblance of agrument based on reality. Their arguments are weak, their directives stink, their vision is blurry, and unless they can personally attack their opponent, they have nothing but lies and distortion up their sleeves. They are the main reason this country is disliked by so many. They love to take jabs at this great country when we happen to be at a low point. It's like seeing some kid get beat up at school by a bully and encouraging the bully to keep pounding away. Don't stop the pounding until we see some blood. Well, the leftist in this country as well as Europe hate everything about the United States and what we stand for. They have been fighting for Socialism for so long and won't stop fighting until they get it. Although they are closer then they've ever been, the strong will of the United States is a great enforcer of all things good. My suggestions to the American-left, buy a one way ticket out of this great country and try living, say, France, Moscow, or any other socalized country. You're be loved by the "State". You won't have to worry about any thing. You're be taken care of by the "State" from craddle to grave. But please leave now before you do any further harm to this great and honest and loving country. We don't need you any longer. Pack up all your belongings and get the hell out of a country you hate and despise. Why live some where that you dislike so much? Pack up the VW van and try north up to Canada. You'll probably be very familiar with this part of the world. Remember, if you have any brain cells left, that Canada was your home during the Vietnam war. They'll treat you well in Canada. Take my word.

As always, The Beaver

 

[DKSuddeth]

:rotflmao:

what a maroon. seems to me if you would ever learn your lesson from the mistakes you make in the first place we wouldn't have to keep bashing you.

 

[The Beaver]

Thank you DK Suddeth for making my point. Your first words regarding my recent posting were an attack. You offered nothing in the debate, again! Call this number for me. 1-800-Canada. They'd be happy to arrange to have you picked up at the border, all expenses paid. Please leave any and all good-looking girlfriends or wife behind, Clinton needs them.

See Ya!


The Beaver

 

[wonderwench]

It wouldn't hurt to learn how to indent a few paragraphs. That diatribe is nearly unreadable.

What has caused America's decline is not Leftism, or for that matter, the Vast Right Wing Conspiracy. It is caused by the abandonment of the founding values of Individual Rights and Responsibilities in favor of collectivism and big government. Both the Right and the Left are complicit in this development. Each cater to factions that want to have the government tell us how to live our private lives.

 

[DKSuddeth]

Originally posted by The Beaver
First and foremost; anti-american liberals who constantly admonish this country because they lack the fortitude to inject any semblance of agrument based on reality. Their arguments are weak, their directives stink, their vision is blurry, and unless they can personally attack their opponent, they have nothing but lies and distortion up their sleeves. They are the main reason this country is disliked by so many. They love to take jabs at this great country when we happen to be at a low point. It's like seeing some kid get beat up at school by a bully and encouraging the bully to keep pounding away. Don't stop the pounding until we see some blood. Well, the leftist in this country as well as Europe hate everything about the United States and what we stand for. They have been fighting for Socialism for so long and won't stop fighting until they get it. Although they are closer then they've ever been, the strong will of the United States is a great enforcer of all things good. My suggestions to the American-left, buy a one way ticket out of this great country and try living, say, France, Moscow, or any other socalized country. You're be loved by the "State". You won't have to worry about any thing. You're be taken care of by the "State" from craddle to grave. But please leave now before you do any further harm to this great and honest and loving country. We don't need you any longer. Pack up all your belongings and get the hell out of a country you hate and despise. Why live some where that you dislike so much? Pack up the VW van and try north up to Canada. You'll probably be very familiar with this part of the world. Remember, if you have any brain cells left, that Canada was your home during the Vietnam war. They'll treat you well in Canada. Take my word.

As always, The Beaver

and you didn't see any attack in this crap?

please, learn to think for yourself and accept the fact that there are all types of liberals just as there are all types of conservatives. you are no more right than I am.

 

[DKSuddeth]

being that that was your first post, i hardly had a chance to debate you again.

You offered nothing in the debate, again!

what debate? all you did was state your ridiculously biased position which is probably based on nothing more than limbaugh and coulter speak.

 

[winston churchi]

After living in England I decided I never want socialism in this country. Let me explain why....

A distant relative had a heart problem and needed surgery, she was told she had to wait eight months despite the fact it was considered an emergency. Why? There was a waiting list of others for the surgery room. The woman decided to go into privite healthcare where her surgery was performed straight away.

I had a severe tooth infection and it needed to be removed. Something was going into my bloodstream from the tooth...I was told I had to sign up and wait three mos. for next available time slot. Why? There was a list of other citizens with emergencies three mos. ahead of me. I ended up going to a school where a student performed the task - it worked for the while as it was considered a temp. solution.

Another relative was taken to the emergency room, she has suffered heart problems and was having some sort of an attack -
We waited in the emergency room as the nurse came out and called the names into the doctor one by one. It was torture for me - I dont know what it must have been for her. She went into privite heathcare after that.

There were signs posted all over London at the times of misuse of the emergency vehicals. It seemed that since the citizens feel it is their right to call an ambulance for anything , they do. How many times an ambulance was called for a cut finger? How many times the ambulance was called only to find out it was used as taxi service to get the rider from one place to another? Countless. These were factual posters placed throughout the tubes.

 

[wonderwench]

The concept is quite simple: "The Tragedy of the Commons".

 

[William Joyce]

WW, if you have read Hardin, why are you so hostile to racial realism?

Anyway...

"What has caused America's decline is not Leftism, or for that matter, the Vast Right Wing Conspiracy. It is caused by the abandonment of the founding values of Individual Rights and Responsibilities in favor of collectivism and big government. Both the Right and the Left are complicit in this development. Each cater to factions that want to have the government tell us how to live our private lives."

I'll sign on to this analysis.

But y'all know what I'm going ADD to it: the founding values of individual rights and responsibilities are workable only with an ethno-cultural core. America was doin' fine right up until the late 60s, and that is pretty much when our demographics began to spin out of control. The ethno-cultural core we had was white. The real tragedy of the commons today is that there are none. "Commons" require a common people with common values and common goals. History records that that, in turn, occurs overwhelmingly within a racial group.

Perspective on Hardin here:

http://www.lrainc.com/swtaboo/stalkers/hardin.html

Hardin, btw, is recently deceased. He was a quiet and gentle genius, much ignored by flashy media. Investigating the man's life, work and thoughts will leave you a more thoughtful person.

 

[Bern80]

Originally posted by DKSuddeth
and you didn't see any attack in this crap?

please, learn to think for yourself and accept the fact that there are all types of liberals just as there are all types of conservatives. you are no more right than I am.

Unless you define yourself as an "Anti-American liberal" I'm not sure why you're taking offense. If you're not one he's not talking about you, so get over it.

Granted the first part wasn't the best way to start a debate, I do wish some of the people that continually ream against the US would try his suggestion. If you don't like this country your perfectly free to try it somewhere else. Many people have said I'm leaving this country if he gets elected or this policy is passed (See Alec Baldwin), but when it comes time to put up or shut up, they shut up because they know they won't have it as good anywhere else. It's quite paradoxical if you ask me. You want to make this countries policies similar to that of others yet when it comes time to leave you stay because you know deep down you wouldn't want to live in a country w/ policies like the ones you're advocating

 

[DKSuddeth]

If you don't like this country your perfectly free to try it somewhere else.

well guess what bern? My people were here before yours, you didn't take your own advice, why should anyone else? Seriously though, This is my country as well, not just yours, and if I don't like the direction it is taking I'll stand up and say so, fight for it if I have to. Moving to another country would just be quitting and guess what, 6 years as a marine taught me that I don't quit.

You want to make this countries policies similar to that of others yet when it comes time to leave you stay because you know deep down you wouldn't want to live in a country w/ policies like the ones you're advocating

whats sad is that you actually believe that drivel.

 

[Bern80]

Originally posted by DKSuddeth
well guess what bern? My people were here before yours, you didn't take your own advice, why should anyone else?

Who are "your people" and who are "my people"? I don't recall giving any biographical info about myself to you. For me to not take my own advice I would have to think the alternative to living in the US is better, which i do not.

Seriously though, This is my country as well, not just yours, and if I don't like the direction it is taking I'll stand up and say so, fight for it if I have to. Moving to another country would just be quitting and guess what, 6 years as a marine taught me that I don't quit.

Good for you, but I will fight equally hard to protect the life I currently enjoy. I simply disagree w/ the direction the libs want to take this country. They want things like free health care for all, which sounds nice, but move to Canada and see how well it works for them. Freedom for a Mothers right to choose? Move to China and see it taken to the extreme.

whats sad is that you actually believe that drivel.

Allow me to be more to the point then. Would you want to live in another country permanantly? If so, which and why?

 

[DKSuddeth]

Who are "your people" and who are "my people"? I don't recall giving any biographical info about myself to you.

MY people are the Cherokee, who are yours?

They want things like free health care for all

Whos THEY? because I'm a lib and I don't want free health care.

Freedom for a Mothers right to choose?

I said freedom for ANYONE to choose. Not just a mothers.

Allow me to be more to the point then. Would you want to live in another country permanantly? If so, which and why?

New Zealand, If I was forced to choose, because the scenery is wonderful and theres not alot of government around.

 

[wonderwench]

Originally posted by William Joyce
WW, if you have read Hardin, why are you so hostile to racial realism?

The concept of the Tragedy of the Commons was identified by Adam Smith.

Your enthocentric view of economics is appallingly shallow.

 

[wonderwench]

Originally posted by DKSuddeth
well guess what bern? My people were here before yours, you didn't take your own advice, why should anyone else? Seriously though, This is my country as well, not just yours, and if I don't like the direction it is taking I'll stand up and say so, fight for it if I have to. Moving to another country would just be quitting and guess what, 6 years as a marine taught me that I don't quit.

 

[Bern80]

Originally posted by DKSuddeth
MY people are the Cherokee, who are yours?

Why did one of 'your people' (you) choose to fight for 'my poeple'?

Technically I am Polish-German and Scandinavian, but an American first. Ancestrally speaking i did take my advice. My ancestors didn't like where they lived so they moved here.

Whos THEY? because I'm a lib and I don't want free health care.

that would put you in the minority. Seems to be pretty big issue for the Dem candidates (no i'm not insiniating that you're for any of them)

I said freedom for ANYONE to choose. Not just a mothers.

Including unborn babies?

New Zealand, If I was forced to choose, because the scenery is wonderful and theres not alot of government around.

Honestly not a bad pick. I'd go for Australia except for the heat. I don't tolerate the sun too well. I hear NZ is a hunters paradise. No seasons. You can hunt anything and as many as you want and you don't even have to buy a license i don't think.

 

[Said1]

Originally posted by Bern80


They want things like free health care for all, which sounds nice, but move to Canada and see how well it works for them. Freedom for a Mothers right to choose?

For those who work, health care is not free in Canada, it's called taxes. It's also not free in all provinces, some have to pay a monthly fee based on income. Yes, it's seen better days, but it's not a third world country. Geez, what's your grip with Canada anyway? Didn't any draft dodgers head to Mexico? And where I come from, it's legal for women to go topless any time anywhere, and there's not a thing anyone can do about it

 

[Bern80]

Perhaps i should have put "free" in quotations. Not only do Canadians pay exorbitant amounts in taxes for their "free" health care, but half the time it's not there when you need it. Hope you don't need a kidney transplant or a major operation anytime soon. Even if you don't you may want to get in line now cause you'll be waiting awhile.

Other than that I have lot's of gripes with Canada. Specifcally there asanine border restrictions. I live about two hours from Canada in MN South of Lake fo the Woods. The one thing that areas has going for it is tourism yet the country is doing its darndest to make people not want to come. Among the many stupid border laws they have are things Americans can't bring across. I enjoy fishing in Canada, but we can't bring our own live bait across the border and as an accomplished fisherman i can tell the bait in Canada sucks. On top of that Canada now wants to pass a law that requires American fisherman to take a boating safety course for a hundred bucks out of pocket. You also can't bring potatoes or dog food across the border. These laws serve no redeeming purpose and are only there to get money out of Americans pockets.

The laws against Americans in that country are simply asanine and it is in danger of losing one of the last viable industries it has left if they keep it up

 

[Said1]

As far as your health care analysis goes, I waited one week for major eye surgery, and have a friend who recently waited 2 weeks to have a brain tumor removed - I could go on, but you get the point. If I needed a kidney, I'd feel safer here, since I'm poor and would be unable to buy one. I can't disagree about taxes, way to much all around. As for your other remarks - I could go on about entry refusals on your end, does anyone really care about that - I know I don't. Do you know how much it costs to regain entry into the US after you are refused? $100 CND, and that doesn't always mean you can get back accross. How's that for draining pockets. We could go back and forth with this all day, but like I said, I don't really care much about that.

BTW: You can't bring a soggy old plumb that's been sitting in old cooler water accross either - how unfair and undignified, but thanks for responding without personal attacks:

 

[Bern80]

obviously I care. We take a fishing trip to Canada every summer. It is the one vaction I look forward to. But if they keep making us jump through more and more hoops just to fish one of these years Americans are gonna say it's just not worth it.