Why do so few think of consequences?

[ConHog]

Tasteful or not (which it isn't), one side has the law on their side and the other doesn't. I'm not willing to trash the constitution because someone's insensitivity pisses me off.

Asking someone to not do something that you acknowledge they have the right to do is not trashing the COTUS, talk about a stupid argument.

You are aware that many, many knee jerkers are discussing ways of stopping them aren't you? Of course you are, you spend your entire day here. Stopping them from building as opposed to asking them not to is indeed trashing the constitution.

I thought you were a conservative?

Yes, I am a aware that a few are. I am also aware that a few want their fellow Americans to die, I am also aware that a few want to see LEO get shot in the head, i am also aware that some would like to see Christianity ran out of the US. Those few are in fact few, and don't represent anything but a minority. At least 3 "conservatives" hold my view for every one that wants the Mosque outlawed.

 

[Charles_Main]

Tasteful or not (which it isn't), one side has the law on their side and the other doesn't. I'm not willing to trash the constitution because someone's insensitivity pisses me off.

Asking someone to not do something that you acknowledge they have the right to do is not trashing the COTUS, talk about a stupid argument.

You are aware that many, many knee jerkers are discussing ways of stopping them aren't you? Of course you are, you spend your entire day here. Stopping them from building as opposed to asking them not to is indeed trashing the constitution.

I thought you were a conservative?

Are you liberals for real. If this was a fucking walmart you people would have no trouble with the City or State using Zoning laws or any kind of trick they could to stop it from being built. All of the sudden you are standing up for property rights. To funny.

Liberals have no problem with opposing the construction of anything they do not like. They will use the courts, obscure Zoning laws, or the EPA to stop it. If no legal route works they will simply picket the site until you bow to the pressure and move your build. You people are the Biggest god damn Hippocrates ever.

 

[Avatar4321]

Good question. Why don't you?

 

[theDoctorisIn]

Legally they can build that Mosque, or whatever it is, on their own land.

If they do build it then I feel its a terribly insensitive thing to do. I don't care if they think their motives are good.

I'm sure the survivors of the victims of 9-11 will be the first to go visit the new mosque. Yeah Right. Jeeze.

Well, I'm a survivor of Sept. 11th. And I plan on going by there as soon as it opens. I hear there's gonna be a pool!

 

[Harry Dresden]

Well, I'm a survivor of Sept. 11th. And I plan on going by there as soon as it opens. I hear there's gonna be a pool!

so what....there aint going to be no woman in the pool......at least not when the men are there.......

 

[Quantum Windbag]

This mosque is not about religious freedom but more of a political statement by the muslims. If they seek the tolerance that say we don't have, maybe they themselves should be more tolerant to what the majority of Americans think about the building of a mosque in this location. Building the mosque in this location may be legal but it is very very poor taste and not a wise thing to do.

In your opinion. The mosque/cultural cente, is all about religious freedom, if one supports the Constitution of the United States. It is not wise, in my opinon, to characterize all muslims as terrorists, or fellow travelers of terrorism.
BTW, if the hysteria of the herd is any indication, most Americans don't think. Most Americans react emotionally, out of fear and hate cultivated by those with an agenda.

Why do people who know nothing about the issues involved here pontificate like they do?

This is not a First Amendment issue in any way, shape, or form. This is a property issue, which makes it a Fourth Amendment issue. Yet liberals, who mostly oppose the First Amendment anyway, want to prove their religious tolerance by supporting this as a religious freedom issue.

If you do not support the right of someone to stand on a street corner and yell at the top of his lings that all Muslims are going to go to hell if they do not accept Jesus you do not support the First Amendment. If you do not support the right of Jehovah's Witnesses to go door to door offering their version of salvation you do not support religious freedom. If you do not support the right of Santeria to sacrifice chickens in their living rooms you do not support religious freedom. If you do not support the right of everyone to be totally obnoxious and offensive to you personally as they desire, as long as they do it in the name of their religion, you do not support freedom of religion.

So please stop trying to be holier than thou and claim you suddenly support religious freedom because you support the Park51 group's desire to build a YMCA type community center a few blocks from ground zero. If just makes you look as idiotic as those who claim that this is a monument to the victory of Islam over the US by building a mosque at ground zero. You do not really support religious freedom, if you did you would know that is not what this is about.

 

[Quantum Windbag]

Some idiots want a war for religious purposes on one fifth of the population of this planet.

How fucking stupid that is.

And you just want to prove how stupid and ignorant you are.

 

[Quantum Windbag]

Its not complicated.

We are about freedom of religion or we are not.

Take your pick

This is not about religious freedom, as everyone who actually supports freedom of religion understands.

 

[Quantum Windbag]

On the one hand I can understand that people feel offended by the Muslims' request to build a mosque in this location but on the other hand it is not directly at ground zero (as I understood it) and denying them their right to religious freedom, which may have even been their reason for their immigration to America, cannot be the right decision. It's a very complicated situation indeed...

Then the other side comes in and makes the type of false claim that you just did. No sense in letting truth get in the way of you accusing the other side of being deceptive though.

 

[Quantum Windbag]

You are aware I assume that this mosque is not a stand alone building with a dome on top across the street from ground zero arent you? It will be a suite on a floor of a multi-story building three blocks away. That gets conventiently overlooked by all the talking heads stirring the pot.

what.....a suite in a building?.....3 blocks away?.....EVERYTHING i have read,i dont listen to the heads,but everything i have read says this is going to be a MOSQUE.....even the Muslims i see in interviews say MOSQUE not a Suite in a building 3 blocks away....

Yesssss.....convenient, no? The talking heads like to throw out chunks of red meat for ratings purposes and it becomes the truth nationwide....truth as they see it. Funny how the real facts get overlooked isn't it?

The truth about the 'mosque': The leader of proposed Muslim center near Ground Zero defends his plan

After our proposal to build a community and cultural center two blocks from the World Trade Center site, I was pleased and gratified by the outpouring of support from city officials and a wide range of people who understand our mission.....


......The project has been mischaracterized, so I want to explain clearly what it would be. Our planned 13-story community center is intended for Park Place between Church St. and West Broadway. It is not a mosque, although it will include a space for Muslim prayer services. It will have a swimming pool, basketball court, meeting rooms, a 500-seat auditorium, banquet facilities and many other things a community needs to be healthy. The center will offer theatrical programming, art exhibitions and cooking classes. These are amenities missing now from this part of the city.......

View attachment 11224

If they wanted to do what they claim they are trying to do they would acknowledge the bitterness they are causing and accept the offer to move the center.

 

[Quantum Windbag]

It's simple.

Republicans have nothing to run on, ever. No one likes their underlying aims: tax cuts for the rich, no regulation on business, ending medicare and social security. So they have to run on fear. They find an issue and blow it all out of proportion to distract from the facts: their platform is unsustainable.

Then we have the Democrats. The problem with them is that blame Bush is the only thing they ever manage to articulate.

 

[Ravi]

It's simple.

Republicans have nothing to run on, ever. No one likes their underlying aims: tax cuts for the rich, no regulation on business, ending medicare and social security. So they have to run on fear. They find an issue and blow it all out of proportion to distract from the facts: their platform is unsustainable.

Then we have the Democrats. The problem with them is that blame Bush is the only thing they ever manage to articulate.

No, there's plenty of blame to go around starting from Ronnie forward. At least the Dems have a goal...no matter how poorly articulated it is...the Reps have nothing but dross.

 

[Quantum Windbag]

so those that voice their opposition to this use in this location also have every right to voice their opposition and try to stop it from being built.....

If you posit that our Constitution prohibits restraints on the free exercise of religion which, last time I looked, it does, then I would question this statement.

I suppose you could argue, philosophically, that anyone has the right to voice opposition to anything - but when that opposition runs square in the face of a Constitutional guarantee/prohibition, I don't think it's going to get very far. Kind of like saying, those that are in favor of slavery have every right to voice their opposition to the present state of affairs and to argue that slavery should be made the law of the land. Sure, they have every right to argue that way . . .

You are getting caught up in the lie that this is about religion. this is a simple property rights issue. Most people who oppose the development acknowledge they have every legal right to build whatever they want on their property, they just question the wisdom of these people building this here.

 

[Quantum Windbag]

You are aware that many, many knee jerkers are discussing ways of stopping them aren't you? Of course you are, you spend your entire day here. Stopping them from building as opposed to asking them not to is indeed trashing the constitution.

I thought you were a conservative?

Funny thing about all of this, one of the biggest voices in support of this misdirected argument about freedom of religion is adamantly opposed to allowing WalMart to build a store on land they own just because he has the power to stop them, and he doesn't like their position about unions. Do you have a problem with the liberal knee jerkers preventing WalMart form developing their property, or is only people who disagree with you that you have a problem with?

 

[Quantum Windbag]

It's simple.

Republicans have nothing to run on, ever. No one likes their underlying aims: tax cuts for the rich, no regulation on business, ending medicare and social security. So they have to run on fear. They find an issue and blow it all out of proportion to distract from the facts: their platform is unsustainable.

Then we have the Democrats. The problem with them is that blame Bush is the only thing they ever manage to articulate.

No, there's plenty of blame to go around starting from Ronnie forward. At least the Dems have a goal...no matter how poorly articulated it is...the Reps have nothing but dross.

Blame Bush is a goal?

Thanks for telling me, I thought it was an excuse.

 

[Wry Catcher]

This mosque is not about religious freedom but more of a political statement by the muslims. If they seek the tolerance that say we don't have, maybe they themselves should be more tolerant to what the majority of Americans think about the building of a mosque in this location. Building the mosque in this location may be legal but it is very very poor taste and not a wise thing to do.

In your opinion. The mosque/cultural cente, is all about religious freedom, if one supports the Constitution of the United States. It is not wise, in my opinon, to characterize all muslims as terrorists, or fellow travelers of terrorism.
BTW, if the hysteria of the herd is any indication, most Americans don't think. Most Americans react emotionally, out of fear and hate cultivated by those with an agenda.

Being against this Mosque is not characterizing all Muslims as Terrorist. It is acknowledging that no matter who is behind building it, or how good their intentions are. Jihadists will see it as a sign of Victory, and be drawn to it. Period.

LMAO, and you know what "Jihadists" think? All "Jihadists" think the same? Hell no, only the RW fringe all 'think' the same, exactly what they are told to 'think'.

 

[Chris]

This mosque is not about religious freedom but more of a political statement by the muslims. If they seek the tolerance that say we don't have, maybe they themselves should be more tolerant to what the majority of Americans think about the building of a mosque in this location. Building the mosque in this location may be legal but it is very very poor taste and not a wise thing to do.

No, it's a political statement about the American ideal of freedom of religion.

And America is nothing without her ideals.

 

[saveliberty]

I find it hard to support freedom of religion without feeling I'm supporting terrorists at the same time on this one. I need Muslim leaders to be sensitive to this and find another way to support the community and be good guys. Thanks in advance.

 

[woodjack]

The hysterica which has taken over this MB and the talking heads for the past few days would be funny if displayed in a movie. Herd mentality is not rational, and it is not funny when it shapes the politics of the day.
What damage is done if a temple or church or mosque is built? And yet a local board approved a building and the herd went hysterical.
Stop for a minute and consider how an average muslim might feel by the 'outrage' of Gingrich, Palin or Peter King (R, NY) who characterize a billion people who worship in the Islamic Faith unworthy, simply because of their culture and the religion they practice.
The actors who carried out the mass murder on Sept. 11, 2001 were extremists, those who condemn a billion people for the acts of a few prove they too subscribe to an ends and means philosophy.
Those who don't question the motives of politicians and propagandists who create the climate of hysteria are no less extreme, for the words of hate spewed by Gingrich, Palin, King, Limbaugh, et al lead to the death of innocents, as surely as the actions of the 19 criminals did on Nine-Eleven.

Ahh those consequences, hmm thats fine from an isolationist point of view from someone who has never been over in those countries, but what about other consequences? Perhaps you forget about the men and women overseas in service to this country, perhaps you forget about the extremist muslims whom will use this as a victory call and recruit more lost souls to their cause, perhaps you forget about that this will now cause more bloodshed. Now if we were isolationist and we were not over in those countries, by all means build it. but your going to cause an upsurge in extremists if this is built, are you prepared to deal with those consequences? You are not dealing with rational people, you totaly do not get it and perhaps never will. these people are not like americans, and use anything to get an advantage to kill and cause death, and while you sit there saying this is right you are not looking at the big picture at all, it is in very poor taste.

I hope you never lose a loved one over there, or even have a loved one wounded over there. Hell they kill each other just to make a point , we as americans can never understand those people or hope to subvert them to a peaceful way of existance, even if they get what they all want, they will still kill each other and anyone else. Politicians will never understand that either, they will sit there and talk to diplomats and get lied to all day long, and believe all the crap that they are told. Build it and see what happens you have been warned, but then you may think its something else causing the violence and will probably never get it.

I have seen these moderate muslims in Saudi kill a child/ stone people to death/ crush people/ yes these peaceful people you talk about, but hell it is their country so no big deal! it can't happen here right? there will never be any honor killings in America, right? the thousands of people I saw partake in the killings over there some of them friggin passports and visa to the US. No big deal right they are peaceful. heck some of them were there doing their pilgrimage from america but thats fine.

Heck even the the old testament states they will be in all nations and raise their hands against all nations, even if your not religious, they are and it is very real to them, which definately makes it very real for everybody. Build it somewhere else, no need to build it there!

 

[kwc57]

Asking someone to not do something that you acknowledge they have the right to do is not trashing the COTUS, talk about a stupid argument.

You are aware that many, many knee jerkers are discussing ways of stopping them aren't you? Of course you are, you spend your entire day here. Stopping them from building as opposed to asking them not to is indeed trashing the constitution.

I thought you were a conservative?

Are you liberals for real. If this was a fucking walmart you people would have no trouble with the City or State using Zoning laws or any kind of trick they could to stop it from being built. All of the sudden you are standing up for property rights. To funny.

Liberals have no problem with opposing the construction of anything they do not like. They will use the courts, obscure Zoning laws, or the EPA to stop it. If no legal route works they will simply picket the site until you bow to the pressure and move your build. You people are the Biggest god damn Hippocrates ever.

Hey dumbshit, I'm a conservative libertarian.....which oddly, you claim to be too. We either follow the constitution or we don't. If we don't we are not what we once were or claim to be. Should they build there? No. Do they have a constitutional right to build there? Hell yeah! Do we defend that right? You damn betcha. Grow a pair if you are going to claim to be a conservative libertarian and quit paying lip service to the constitution.