Why Do Schools Not Give Pragmatic Classes?

[Samson]

Academia is not supposed to be "real life."

Real Life is Real Life.

At 14 years of age, all kids should have a job AS PART OF THEIR EDUCATION. In urban areas they could work painting over graffitti, picking up trash, recycling, eventually working in cafeterias and bus maintenance, etc. Lose your job? Opps, no degree for you, partner.

 

[Samson]

GOP Opposes Critical Thinking: Party platform paints original ideas as a liberal conspiracy - News - The Austin Chronicle

Party platform paints original ideas as a liberal conspiracy

"Knowledge-Based Education – We oppose the teaching of Higher Order Thinking Skills (HOTS) (values clarification), critical thinking skills and similar programs that are simply a relabeling of Outcome-Based Education (OBE) (mastery learning) which focus on behavior modification and have the purpose of challenging the student’s fixed beliefs and undermining parental authority."

What was the TX Dem Party platform position?

Reading the ENTIRE position, essentially the TX GOP opposed (2012) teaching that focuses on changing behaviour of students and thereby "Undermining parental authority."

To what could this possibly refer? Whatever PARENTS define as undermining their authority. IOW, Republicans support parental judgement in defining what should be taught. Frankly, having dealt with a wide range of parents, almost none are qualified to accomplish this.

 

[Sunshine]

Academia is not supposed to be "real life."

Real Life is Real Life.

At 14 years of age, all kids should have a job AS PART OF THEIR EDUCATION. In urban areas they could work painting over graffitti, picking up trash, recycling, eventually working in cafeterias and bus maintenance, etc. Lose your job? Opps, no degree for you, partner.

Poor kids at my school worked in the cafeteria cleaning up and washing dishes to pay for their lunches. When I was a senior, I was invited to work in the principal's office, but it wasn't a paid position. They just looked to see who had most of their credits worked off and would have the extra time. It paid prestige.

 

[House]

Academia is not supposed to be "real life."

Real Life is Real Life.

At 14 years of age, all kids should have a job AS PART OF THEIR EDUCATION. In urban areas they could work painting over graffitti, picking up trash, recycling, eventually working in cafeterias and bus maintenance, etc. Lose your job? Opps, no degree for you, partner.

Academia, you say?

Let's take a look at the word, shall we?

Academia: the environment or community concerned with the pursuit of research, education, and scholarship. (Thanks to Google for the quick definition)



Now, one of the glaring problems with schools before the college level is that there is no research or scholarship (and by scholarship, I am referring to " academic study or achievement; learning of a high level." - thanks again to Google).





A lot of this thread is about injecting research and scholarship INTO the lives of our children, which some people seem to be oddly against.





Academia has nothing to do with any schooling at the pre-college level.

 

[Samson]

Academia is not supposed to be "real life."

Real Life is Real Life.

At 14 years of age, all kids should have a job AS PART OF THEIR EDUCATION. In urban areas they could work painting over graffitti, picking up trash, recycling, eventually working in cafeterias and bus maintenance, etc. Lose your job? Opps, no degree for you, partner.

Academia, you say?

Let's take a look at the word, shall we?

Academia: the environment or community concerned with the pursuit of research, education, and scholarship. (Thanks to Google for the quick definition)



Now, one of the glaring problems with schools before the college level is that there is no research or scholarship (and by scholarship, I am referring to " academic study or achievement; learning of a high level." - thanks again to Google).





A lot of this thread is about injecting research and scholarship INTO the lives of our children, which some people seem to be oddly against.





Academia has nothing to do with any schooling at the pre-college level.

I assume you point is that A. one can do research using google, and B. dancing around semantics is easier than dealing with the issue.


Bravo.

A. I was not aware Google Search had been omitted from being "injected INTO pre-college lives of children"


B. Your thesis is at odds with Core Curriculum Standards and Goals, for example (p.4)

It is also beyond the scope of the Standards to define the full range of supports appropriate for English language learners and for students with special needs. At the same time, all students must have the opportunity to learn and meet the same high standards if they are to access the knowledge and skills necessary in their post-school lives. The Standards should be read as allowing for the widest possible range of students to participate fully from the outset, along with appropriate accommodations to ensure maximum participation of students with special education needs.

How did you propose to "inject research and scholarship INTO the lives of [ALL] our children?"

Even those that are English language learners? (not a small population)

Even those with "special needs?"

Our system is all inclusive and Manditory. Waving a magic Google wand won't work.

 

[House]

I assume you point is that A. one can do research using google, and B. dancing around semantics is easier than dealing with the issue.


Bravo.

It's called sourcing. I'll take your snide remark as acceptance of the definitions since you had nothing objectionable to post about them.

B. Your thesis is at odds with Core Curriculum Standards and Goals, for example (p.4)

It is also beyond the scope of the Standards to define the full range of supports appropriate for English language learners and for students with special needs. At the same time, all students must have the opportunity to learn and meet the same high standards if they are to access the knowledge and skills necessary in their post-school lives. The Standards should be read as allowing for the widest possible range of students to participate fully from the outset, along with appropriate accommodations to ensure maximum participaton of students with special education needs.

How did you propose to "inject research and scholarship INTO the lives of [ALL] our children?"

Even those that are English language learners? (not a small population)

Even those with "special needs?"

Our system is all inclusive and Manditory. Waving a magic Google wand won't work.

False dilemma is false. Special needs learners and ESL already have separated classes from the mainstream students.

 

[Samson]

Academia is not supposed to be "real life."

Real Life is Real Life.

At 14 years of age, all kids should have a job AS PART OF THEIR EDUCATION. In urban areas they could work painting over graffitti, picking up trash, recycling, eventually working in cafeterias and bus maintenance, etc. Lose your job? Opps, no degree for you, partner.

Poor kids at my school worked in the cafeteria cleaning up and washing dishes to pay for their lunches. When I was a senior, I was invited to work in the principal's office, but it wasn't a paid position. They just looked to see who had most of their credits worked off and would have the extra time. It paid prestige.

Yes I realize there are "teacher's aid classes." This is not a job. This is a ELECTIVE.

I'm talking about actually putting students on a payroll and removing some (not all) janitors, cafeteria workers, maintenance and even teachers from their jobs. I'm saying students would have NO CHOICE but to take a job either within the school district or outside the district (Vocational Career Education would be manditory for graduation).

 

[Samson]

I assume you point is that A. one can do research using google, and B. dancing around semantics is easier than dealing with the issue.


Bravo.

It's called sourcing. I'll take your snide remark as acceptance of the definitions since you had nothing objectionable to post about them.

B. Your thesis is at odds with Core Curriculum Standards and Goals, for example (p.4)

It is also beyond the scope of the Standards to define the full range of supports appropriate for English language learners and for students with special needs. At the same time, all students must have the opportunity to learn and meet the same high standards if they are to access the knowledge and skills necessary in their post-school lives. The Standards should be read as allowing for the widest possible range of students to participate fully from the outset, along with appropriate accommodations to ensure maximum participaton of students with special education needs.

How did you propose to "inject research and scholarship INTO the lives of [ALL] our children?"

Even those that are English language learners? (not a small population)

Even those with "special needs?"

Our system is all inclusive and Manditory. Waving a magic Google wand won't work.

False dilemma is false. Special needs learners and ESL already have separated classes from the mainstream students.

HA!

Well, I see you actually have no experience inside an actual school.

I'm not teaching Ed 101 here. Better fact check your shit before posting it.

I'll give you a clue to begin your journey of discovery: Start with Individuals with Disabilities Education Act (IDEA).

But let's not leave your imaginary world of "separated classes from the mainstreamed students" quite yet.....Pray tell, How did you propose to "inject research and scholarship INTO the lives of [Just MAINSTREAMED] children?"

Does this fictional world involve hyperdemics or do they put books under their pillows before going to bed?

 

[House]

I assume you point is that A. one can do research using google, and B. dancing around semantics is easier than dealing with the issue.


Bravo.

It's called sourcing. I'll take your snide remark as acceptance of the definitions since you had nothing objectionable to post about them.

B. Your thesis is at odds with Core Curriculum Standards and Goals, for example (p.4)
How did you propose to "inject research and scholarship INTO the lives of [ALL] our children?"

Even those that are English language learners? (not a small population)

Even those with "special needs?"

Our system is all inclusive and Manditory. Waving a magic Google wand won't work.

False dilemma is false. Special needs learners and ESL already have separated classes from the mainstream students.

HA!

Well, I see you actually have no experience inside an actual school.

I'm not teaching Ed 101 here. Better fact check your shit before posting it.

I'll give you a clue to begin your journey of discovery: Start with Individuals with Disabilities Education Act (IDEA).

But let's not leave your imaginary world of "separated classes from the mainstreamed students" quite yet.....Pray tell, How did you propose to "inject research and scholarship INTO the lives of [Just MAINSTREAMED] children?"

Does this fictional world involve hyperdemics or do they put books under their pillows before going to bed?

Your limitations aren't my problem. I can't help you expand your paradigm, that's something only you can do.

 

[Samson]

It's called sourcing. I'll take your snide remark as acceptance of the definitions since you had nothing objectionable to post about them.




False dilemma is false. Special needs learners and ESL already have separated classes from the mainstream students.

HA!

Well, I see you actually have no experience inside an actual school.

I'm not teaching Ed 101 here. Better fact check your shit before posting it.

I'll give you a clue to begin your journey of discovery: Start with Individuals with Disabilities Education Act (IDEA).

But let's not leave your imaginary world of "separated classes from the mainstreamed students" quite yet.....Pray tell, How did you propose to "inject research and scholarship INTO the lives of [Just MAINSTREAMED] children?"

Does this fictional world involve hyperdemics or do they put books under their pillows before going to bed?

Your limitations aren't my problem. I can't help you expand your paradigm, that's something only you can do.

Thanks for playing.

Clearly the reason Pragmatic classes are missing is because students don't have your access to Google.

 

[House]

Thanks for playing.

Clearly the reason Pragmatic classes are missing is because students don't have your access to Google.

Thanks for the prefacing your post with an appropriate warning smiley.

 

[Samson]

Thanks for playing.

Clearly the reason Pragmatic classes are missing is because students don't have your access to Google.

Thanks for the prefacing your post with an appropriate warning smiley.

Homage to the thread.

 

[psikeyhackr]

For example, teaching children to think critically. Instead of teaching children how to think, teachers are just interested in having the children memorize dry facts that mean absolutely nothing and will be forgotten about before the next report card.

Most teachers are not as smart as you are portraying them to be. Many, if not most are just memorizers themselves. If a smart kid trying to UNDERSTAND something forces them into a corner with too many questions. beyond what they have memorized the teacher usually gets angry.

That is why a good reading list could be so useful. There are books written by authors smarter than most teachers. Like Isaac Asimov.

psik

 

[regent]

Random thoughts on learning:

Some memorizing is essential and a forerunner to learning. Did we not memorize our numbers, the alphabet and a raft of other things as a precursor to learning? Most of us probably memorize something new every day. Critical thinking, logic, the scientific method and other types of thinking methods may simply be methods to find truths, and to this end the scientific method may be our most valuable truth finder, but all of those methods still require memorization and some hours of practice. Another problem, what percentage of our population is able to somewhat master critical thinking or even want to make the attempt to master?
I would suspect that most learning is based on a need to learn for some reason, and in our schools the need is generally a letter grade or a pat on the head of some type.
In today's teen life, perhaps a greater need is the ability to socialize via some electronic device; which is the greater need using twitter or critical thinking?