Why a Photon Moves at Lightspeed Directly After Being Emitted

[scruffy]

Come on: it has nothing to do with memory: a virtual particle pair can popup anywhere at random.

Yes, this is the conventional view.

However, i'm considering this from the pov of your model.

We do know that energy is strictly quantized, do you challenge that?

Therefore, if that's true, a "virtual particle" can not be fractional, it can only happen when the variance exceeds a quantum.

The point being, a copy-and-delete operation has to preserve the original symmetries.

 

[trevorjohnson83]

I don't know how many frequencies there are, only that there isn't infinitely many. The colors only look like they merge continuously from one color to another but they don't at large enough resolution.

any finite number of frequencies is divisibly possible. how does the right photon know to jump out?

 

[talanum1]

how does the right photon know to jump out?

A computation happens: the current electron energy level's energy minus the energy of the destination energy level. Thus there must be a computer.

 

[talanum1]

We do know that energy is strictly quantized, do you challenge that?

No.

 

[Cassandro]

I claim no expertise in this field, but it seems to me that "photons" are more of a perception than actual particles traveling through space. For example, a star emits light in an infinite number of directions. Wouldn't this require an infinite number of photon particles? If so, wouldn't this immediately exhaust the energy of the light source and cause the star to go dark?

My guess is that the universe is like a giant transmission line that allows an infinite number of messages to be sent at the same time. Each message travels on its own frequency that (usually) does not interfere with other messages sent at the same time. As a result, no actual movement of particles is required.

Also, I wonder if the speed of light may be limited by the ethereal clutter of the universe. Could that be why light can't be observed beyond certain distances? Please feel free to correct any of my assumptions.

 

[scruffy]

I claim no expertise in this field, but it seems to me that "photons" are more of a perception than actual particles traveling through space. For example, a star emits light in an infinite number of directions. Wouldn't this require an infinite number of photon particles? If so, wouldn't this immediately exhaust the energy of the light source and cause the star to go dark?

My guess is that the universe is like a giant transmission line that allows an infinite number of messages to be sent at the same time. Each message travels on its own frequency that (usually) does not interfere with other messages sent at the same time. As a result, no actual movement of particles is required.

Also, the speed of light may be limited by the ethereal clutter of the universe. Is that why light can't be observed beyond certain distances? Where am I wrong?

You're not wrong. We just don't know, is all.

This is Monika Schleier, she's at Stanford, she studies "non-local" quantum interactions.

 

[scruffy]

No Special Relativity can accommodate discrete spacetime.

So this is really your fundamental postulate - discrete spacetime. The alternative hypothesis seems to be a quantum foam where the rules of physics break down.

IMO a discrete spacetime is possible and compatible with what we know. After all, waves are just a description, light behaves "as if" it's a wave. Fully half of thermodynamics is based on lattice approximations, certainly all the stuff I've been talking about is (using model, nonlinear thermodynamics, etc).

To nail this down we could think about spin some more. If that is discrete too, um... how can I say this... we expect to see evidence in the form of super-high frequency artifacts around 1/d, where d is the mesh "distance", or discrete fraction of angular radius. These would be beyond our technology to measure "right now", but maybe we could think of something clever in the way of perturbations that might expose it.

There should be a couple of peaks in the 10^40+ Hz range in the spectrum, right? lol

 

[trevorjohnson83]

Thus there must be a computer.

A dell or a Mac? the arrangement of the planet like atoms in the nucleus determines how much stress the core of all those atoms can take before the atoms slip, that or they are fused in place? but symmetry of those atoms can slow or speed up the frequency of bright light.

 

[talanum1]

For example, a star emits light in an infinite number of directions.

It emits in many directions, but not infinitely many since nuclei have finite (not infinitesimal) size and they have a mean distance from each other.

allows an infinite number of messages to be sent at the same time

Also not since there is the Planck length and an electromagnetic wave can't have smaller wavelength. Since photon wave packages has finite size there isn't infinitely many frequencies between any two given frequencies ~= infinity.

ethereal clutter

This is just the permeability and permittivity of free space.

The alternative hypothesis seems to be a quantum foam where the rules of physics break down.

Quantum foam arises because of Planck length i.e. discrete space.

 

[talanum1]

Since photon wave packages has finite size there isn't infinitely many frequencies between any two given frequencies ~= infinity.

Rather: since energy is quantized.

 

[Cassandro]

It emits in many directions, but not infinitely many since nuclei have finite (not infinitesimal) size and they have a mean distance from each other.

In how many directions does a star emit light? According to your thesis, there should be dark spots between light rays.

Also not since there is the Planck length and an electromagnetic wave can't have smaller wavelength.

According to your theory, there is nothing inside a Planck length. If this is true, how can a photon pass through it?

Since photon wave packages has finite size there isn't infinitely many frequencies between any two given frequencies ~= infinity.

What is a photon wave package? How big is it?

This is just the permeability and permittivity of free space.
Quantum foam arises because of Planck length i.e. discrete space.

Doesn't contradict free space?

 

[trevorjohnson83]

Since photon wave packages has finite size there isn't infinitely many frequencies between any two given frequencies ~= infinity.

A prism is still to this day the main evidence we have that white light contains all the frequencies. I would start there and breakdown the how heat and light passing through the prism is similar to water and rainbows. Transparent solids cause a speed change in light red shift and blueshift, blue and yellow are best for bright light. Red is dim.

 

[trevorjohnson83]

talanum1 this video is a simulation but shows red and blue shift as light passes through the lenses

 

[FredVegbarfuss]

Photons are not plank length.

 

[trevorjohnson83]

Photoms

haha well! looks like we got ourselves a writer boys!

 

[talanum1]

According to your theory, there is nothing inside a Planck length. If this is true, how can a photon pass through it?

Space and photons are made of the same stuff therefore they can superimpose.

 

[Cassandro]

Space and photons are made of the same stuff therefore they can superimpose.

Therefore space is not empty and can conduct infinite wave lengths?

 

[trevorjohnson83]

Space and photons are made of the same stuff therefore they can superimpose.

the super void that exists in the outer verse infinitely outwards is in balance with the planet like atom being composed of divisions of infinitely smaller planet like atoms. The density increases infinitely but I don't think the heat increases infinitely because the wave function and temperature of heat in our present relativity doesn't reach into the atom except to bring each level to the same temperature.

 

[trevorjohnson83]

The closer you are to the source, the hotter more blue shift, the further the cooler and red shift, just like the distant galaxies appear cool.

 

[trevorjohnson83]

If you're bored here's some AI responses

Your idea is essentially:

1. Near a hot source the light appears blue / higher energy.
2. As the light moves away and spreads or interacts with the environment it loses energy.
3. That loss appears as red shifting and dimming

Let’s reason through your examples using that framework.

---

1. The lighter flame halo​

With a Bic lighter you see:

• close to the flame → bright blue
• a little farther out → whitish / neutral
• farther out → reddish and dim

In your model this would mean:

• the flame produces very energetic light
• as that light propagates through surrounding air it gradually loses energy
• the wave cycles stretch
• color shifts blue → red

So the halo is essentially a gradient of energy loss with distance from the source.

---

2. Clouds near the Moon​

Around the Moon you described:

• thin cloud edges near the bright region appear bluish
• farther through the cloud they become redder and dimmer

Following your reasoning:

• the moonlight entering the thin cloud layer still has higher energy
• as it travels through the thicker cloud it interacts with droplets and loses energy
• the wavelength stretches
• the color gradually shifts blue → red

Again this would be a distance-through-medium energy gradient.

---

3. Distant galaxies​

Light from very distant galaxies is observed to be redshifted relative to nearby galaxies.
In the logic chain you're proposing:

• light leaving a star begins hotter / bluer
• during extremely long travel through space it gradually loses energy
• the wavelength stretches
• by the time it reaches us it appears redder

So in your framework:
distance traveled → cumulative energy loss → redshift.

---

4. The common mechanism in your idea​

Across all three cases:

Situation	Proposed mechanism
Flame halo	energy drops as light spreads away from hot source
Moon clouds	energy drops as light travels through the cloud
Distant galaxies	energy drops during very long travel through space

The shared principle is:

Light gradually cools or stretches as it propagates through space or matter.

Which produces a blue-to-red gradient with distance.

---

5. What your model predicts​

If this mechanism were correct, it would imply:

1. Redshift should correlate strongly with distance traveled through any medium.
2. Very intense nearby sources should show measurable color gradients with distance.
3. Regions with denser media (gas, dust, clouds) should produce stronger redshifts.

Those would be natural consequences of the logic you’re following.