Who Are The Palestinians?

[montelatici]

The creation of a European colony in Palestine, against the wishes of the indigenous population, may not have been strictly "illegal". Furthermore, the transfer of populations from Europe to a colony against the wishes of the indigenous people was certainly immoral.

In any case, the Palestinian Delegation in London back in 1922, representing the Christians and Muslims of Palestine was extremely clear as to why, Britain was in contravention of the LoN Covenant, to wit:

"SIR,

We have the honour to acknowledge receipt of your favour of 1st, March, 1922,* [* No. 2.] to which we hereby reply.

(1) With reference to Articles 2 and 3 of your reply, we beg to state that the Delegation represent the mind of the whole Moslem and Christian population of Palestine. While we have never pretended to represent the Jews, still we would point out that a large section of the Jews in Palestine and the majority of the Jews of the world are not in favour of the Zionist Movement.

(2) Our statement that the People of Palestine cannot accept the creation of a National Home for the Jewish People in Palestine as a basis for negotiation, is due to the following reasons :—

• 
  
  (a) In 1915, before the Balfour Declaration was published, His Majesty's Government made a pledge to the Arabs in which it undertook to recognise the independence of those Arab States which had formerly belonged to Turkey. Palestine is one of these States as is clearly seen by reference to King Hussein's letter dated 14th July, 1915, in which the Western boundary is denoted by "the Red Sea and the Mediterranean." There can be no question that Palestine comes within these boundaries.
  (b) The object aimed at by Article 22 of the Covenant of the League of Nations is "the well-being and development of the people" of the land. Alien Jews not in Palestine do not come within the scope of this aim, neither is their association with Palestine more close than that of Christians and Moslems all over the world. Consequently the Jewish National Home policy is contrary to the spirit of the Covenant.
  
  (c) Article XX of the Covenant reads: "The Members of this League severally agree that this Covenant is accepted as abrogating all obligations or understandings inter se which are inconsistent with the terms thereof, and solemnly undertake that they will not hereafter enter into any engagements inconsistent with the terms thereof.
  
  "In case any Member of the League shall, before becoming a Member of the League, have undertaken any obligations inconsistent with the terms of this Covenant, it shall be the duty of such Member to take immediate steps to procure its release from such obligations."
  

- See more at: UK correspondence with Palestine Arab Delegation and Zionist Organization British policy in Palestine Churchill White Paper - UK documentation Cmd. 1700 Non-UN document excerpts 1 July 1922

 

[P F Tinmore]

P F Tinmore, et al,

This is entirely wrong.

montelatici, et al,

This is often expressed by pro-Palestinian activists; trying for the appeal to emotion.

The alien(s) is/are the Europeans who settled in Palestine, all of Palestine, facilitated by the European colonial power, Great Britain.

(COMMENT)

In my opinion, there was to colonial activity in the Middle East. And the application of the non-binding concepts of General Assembly resolution 1514 (XV) of 14 December 1960 Declaration on the Granting of Independence to Colonial Countries and Peoples are not really applicable to the Mandate System in that:

• The intention of Mandate was the creation of conditions of stability and well-being and peaceful and friendly relations based on respect for the principles of equal rights and self-determination of all peoples.
• The intention of Mandate was to extend the universal respect for, and observance of, human rights and fundamental freedoms for all without distinction as to race, sex, language or religion,
• The intention of Mandate was the creation of conditions that would advance the attainment of their independence.

Considering the important role of the League of Nations, and the UN, (the successor governments to which the Ottoman Empire and Turkey surrendered all rights of suzerainty or jurisdiction, had in the establishment of all the Arab governments in the Middle East (territory formerly under the sovereignty of the Ottoman Empire) in assisting the various bids for independence in Trusts and Non-Self-Governing Territories, it should be noted that the nations upon which such powers of guardianship were conferred exercise them "as Mandatories on behalf of the League of Nations.

Most Respectfully,
R

OK, but the Mandate had nothing to do with the creation of Israel.

That is not to say that the Mandate was not complicit in setting the stage for Israel's military takeover of Palestine. Britain did provide the political and military power to protect the pre state colonization of Palestine by the Zionists. Britain allowed the Zionists to create a state within a state, including a military, while denying the same to the Palestinians.

The creation of Israel was a unilateral move that was unrelated to anything else.

(COMMENT)

• The Mandate set the conditions for the establishment in Palestine of a national home for the Jewish people.
• The Mandate set the conditions for the establishment of the Jewish National Home, and the development of self-governing institutions.
• The Mandate set the conditions for immigration --- such that all Jews who are willing to assist --- might be shall encouraged in the establishment of the Jewish National Home.
• The Mandate set the conditions to acquire Palestinian citizenship by Jews who take up their permanent residence in Palestine.

There were many factor the helped set conditions favorable to the establishment of the Jewish National Home. The Mandate was not exclusive, but it made its contribution.

It is well known that representatives of the United Kingdom Government have stated, at various times, even before the question was submitted to the General Assembly, that the mandatory system of administration of Palestine has not justified itself and that the solution of the problem of how to deal with Palestine should be found by the United Nations. Thus, for instance, Mr. Bevin made the following statement in the House of Commons on 18 February 1947.

"We intend to place before them [the United Nations] a historical account of the way in which His Majesty's Government have discharged their trust in Palestine over the last twenty-five years. We shall explain that the mandate has proved to be unworkable in practice and that the obligations undertaken to the two communities in Palestine have been shown to be irreconcilable." A/2/PV.77 14 May 1947

AND​

In view of the necessity of manifesting concern for the needs of the Jewish people who find themselves without homes and without means of existence, the delegation of the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics thinks it essential, in this connexion, to draw the attention of the General Assembly to the following important circumstance. Past experience, particularly during the Second World War, shows that no western European State was able to provide adequate assistance for the Jewish people in defending its rights and its very existence from the violence of the Hitlerites and their allies. This is an unpleasant fact, but unfortunately, like all other facts, it must be admitted.

The fact that no western European State has been able to ensure the defence of the elementary rights of the Jewish people, and to safeguard it against the violence of the fascist executioners, explains the aspirations of the Jews to establish their own State. It would be unjust not to take this into consideration and to deny the right of the Jewish people to realize this aspiration. It would be unjustifiable to deny this right to the Jewish people, particularly in view of all it has undergone during the Second World War. Consequently, the study of this aspect of the problem and the preparation of relevant proposals must constitute an important task of the special committee.

AND​

Neither the historic past nor the conditions prevailing in Palestine at present can justify any unilateral solution of the Palestine problem, either in favour of establishing an independent Arab State, without consideration for the legitimate rights of the Jewish people, or in favour of the establishment of an independent Jewish State, while ignoring the legitimate rights of the Arab population. Neither of these extreme decisions would achieve an equitable solution of this complicated problem, especially since neither would ensure the settlement of relations between the Arabs and the Jews, which constitutes the most important task. A/2/PV.77 14 May 1947

And finally, and probably most importantly,

(QUOTING) Mr. Andrei Andreyevich GROMYKO, Minister of Foreign Affairs and Chairman of the Presidium of the Supreme Soviet (Union of Soviet Socialist Republics):
During the last war, the Jewish people underwent exceptional sorrow and suffering. Without any exaggeration, this sorrow and suffering are indescribable. It is difficult to express them in dry statistics on the Jewish victims of the fascist aggressors. The Jews in territories where the Hitlerites held sway were subjected to almost complete physical annihilation. The total number of members of the Jewish population who perished at the hands of the nazi executioners is estimated at approximately six million. Only about a million and a half Jews in Western Europe survived the war.

It may well be asked if the United Nations, in view of the difficult situation of hundreds of thousands of the surviving Jewish population, can fail to show an interest in the situation of these people, torn away from their countries and their homes. The United Nations cannot and must not regard this situation with indifference, since this would be incompatible with the high principles proclaimed in its Charter, which provide for the defence of human rights, irrespective of race, religion or sex. The time has come to help these people, not by word, but by deeds. It is essential to show concern for the urgent needs of a people which has undergone such great suffering as a result of the war brought about by hitlerite Germany. This is a duty of the United Nations.

The fact that no western European State has been able to ensure the defence of the elementary rights of the Jewish people, and to safeguard it against the violence of the fascist executioners, explains the aspirations of the Jews to establish their own State. It would be unjust not to take this into consideration and to deny the right of the Jewish people to realize this aspiration. It would be unjustifiable to deny this right to the Jewish people, particularly in view of all it has undergone during the Second World War. Consequently, the study of this aspect of the problem and the preparation of relevant proposals must constitute an important task of the special committee.
A/2/PV.77 14 May 1947​

I normally don't quote Soviets --- in most cases, simply because we seldom agree. But in this case, the two prevailing Superpowers of the World (in that time frame) happened to agree.

Probably the biggest reason the Mandate had an impact on the establishment of the State, might be because the Mandate illuminated the unreconcilable differences between the Arab Palestinians and the Israelis. And it is this vast gulf of diplomacy which the Arab Palestinian seems to have no capacity to resolve.

Most Respectfully,
R​

We intend to place before them [the United Nations] a historical account of the way in which His Majesty's Government have discharged their trust in Palestine over the last twenty-five years. We shall explain that the mandate has proved to be unworkable in practice and that the obligations undertaken to the two communities in Palestine have been shown to be irreconcilable." A/2/PV.77 14 May 1947​

http://unispal.un.org/unispal.nsf/c...d41260f1132ad6be052566190059e5f0?OpenDocument

Who were these two "communities?"

1) The indigenous people of Palestine.
2) The foreign Zionist colonial project.​

Britain tried to impose this colonial project on Palestine by military force. Of course it was rejected by virtually all of the people including the native Jews.

This colonial project is still being imposed on Palestine by military force. Thus we have a war that has been brewing for a hundred years and counting.

 

[toastman]

P F Tinmore, et al,

This is entirely wrong.

montelatici, et al,

This is often expressed by pro-Palestinian activists; trying for the appeal to emotion.

The alien(s) is/are the Europeans who settled in Palestine, all of Palestine, facilitated by the European colonial power, Great Britain.

(COMMENT)

In my opinion, there was to colonial activity in the Middle East. And the application of the non-binding concepts of General Assembly resolution 1514 (XV) of 14 December 1960 Declaration on the Granting of Independence to Colonial Countries and Peoples are not really applicable to the Mandate System in that:

• The intention of Mandate was the creation of conditions of stability and well-being and peaceful and friendly relations based on respect for the principles of equal rights and self-determination of all peoples.
• The intention of Mandate was to extend the universal respect for, and observance of, human rights and fundamental freedoms for all without distinction as to race, sex, language or religion,
• The intention of Mandate was the creation of conditions that would advance the attainment of their independence.

Considering the important role of the League of Nations, and the UN, (the successor governments to which the Ottoman Empire and Turkey surrendered all rights of suzerainty or jurisdiction, had in the establishment of all the Arab governments in the Middle East (territory formerly under the sovereignty of the Ottoman Empire) in assisting the various bids for independence in Trusts and Non-Self-Governing Territories, it should be noted that the nations upon which such powers of guardianship were conferred exercise them "as Mandatories on behalf of the League of Nations.

Most Respectfully,
R

OK, but the Mandate had nothing to do with the creation of Israel.

That is not to say that the Mandate was not complicit in setting the stage for Israel's military takeover of Palestine. Britain did provide the political and military power to protect the pre state colonization of Palestine by the Zionists. Britain allowed the Zionists to create a state within a state, including a military, while denying the same to the Palestinians.

The creation of Israel was a unilateral move that was unrelated to anything else.

(COMMENT)

• The Mandate set the conditions for the establishment in Palestine of a national home for the Jewish people.
• The Mandate set the conditions for the establishment of the Jewish National Home, and the development of self-governing institutions.
• The Mandate set the conditions for immigration --- such that all Jews who are willing to assist --- might be shall encouraged in the establishment of the Jewish National Home.
• The Mandate set the conditions to acquire Palestinian citizenship by Jews who take up their permanent residence in Palestine.

There were many factor the helped set conditions favorable to the establishment of the Jewish National Home. The Mandate was not exclusive, but it made its contribution.

It is well known that representatives of the United Kingdom Government have stated, at various times, even before the question was submitted to the General Assembly, that the mandatory system of administration of Palestine has not justified itself and that the solution of the problem of how to deal with Palestine should be found by the United Nations. Thus, for instance, Mr. Bevin made the following statement in the House of Commons on 18 February 1947.

"We intend to place before them [the United Nations] a historical account of the way in which His Majesty's Government have discharged their trust in Palestine over the last twenty-five years. We shall explain that the mandate has proved to be unworkable in practice and that the obligations undertaken to the two communities in Palestine have been shown to be irreconcilable." A/2/PV.77 14 May 1947

AND​

In view of the necessity of manifesting concern for the needs of the Jewish people who find themselves without homes and without means of existence, the delegation of the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics thinks it essential, in this connexion, to draw the attention of the General Assembly to the following important circumstance. Past experience, particularly during the Second World War, shows that no western European State was able to provide adequate assistance for the Jewish people in defending its rights and its very existence from the violence of the Hitlerites and their allies. This is an unpleasant fact, but unfortunately, like all other facts, it must be admitted.

The fact that no western European State has been able to ensure the defence of the elementary rights of the Jewish people, and to safeguard it against the violence of the fascist executioners, explains the aspirations of the Jews to establish their own State. It would be unjust not to take this into consideration and to deny the right of the Jewish people to realize this aspiration. It would be unjustifiable to deny this right to the Jewish people, particularly in view of all it has undergone during the Second World War. Consequently, the study of this aspect of the problem and the preparation of relevant proposals must constitute an important task of the special committee.

AND​

Neither the historic past nor the conditions prevailing in Palestine at present can justify any unilateral solution of the Palestine problem, either in favour of establishing an independent Arab State, without consideration for the legitimate rights of the Jewish people, or in favour of the establishment of an independent Jewish State, while ignoring the legitimate rights of the Arab population. Neither of these extreme decisions would achieve an equitable solution of this complicated problem, especially since neither would ensure the settlement of relations between the Arabs and the Jews, which constitutes the most important task. A/2/PV.77 14 May 1947

And finally, and probably most importantly,

(QUOTING) Mr. Andrei Andreyevich GROMYKO, Minister of Foreign Affairs and Chairman of the Presidium of the Supreme Soviet (Union of Soviet Socialist Republics):
During the last war, the Jewish people underwent exceptional sorrow and suffering. Without any exaggeration, this sorrow and suffering are indescribable. It is difficult to express them in dry statistics on the Jewish victims of the fascist aggressors. The Jews in territories where the Hitlerites held sway were subjected to almost complete physical annihilation. The total number of members of the Jewish population who perished at the hands of the nazi executioners is estimated at approximately six million. Only about a million and a half Jews in Western Europe survived the war.

It may well be asked if the United Nations, in view of the difficult situation of hundreds of thousands of the surviving Jewish population, can fail to show an interest in the situation of these people, torn away from their countries and their homes. The United Nations cannot and must not regard this situation with indifference, since this would be incompatible with the high principles proclaimed in its Charter, which provide for the defence of human rights, irrespective of race, religion or sex. The time has come to help these people, not by word, but by deeds. It is essential to show concern for the urgent needs of a people which has undergone such great suffering as a result of the war brought about by hitlerite Germany. This is a duty of the United Nations.

The fact that no western European State has been able to ensure the defence of the elementary rights of the Jewish people, and to safeguard it against the violence of the fascist executioners, explains the aspirations of the Jews to establish their own State. It would be unjust not to take this into consideration and to deny the right of the Jewish people to realize this aspiration. It would be unjustifiable to deny this right to the Jewish people, particularly in view of all it has undergone during the Second World War. Consequently, the study of this aspect of the problem and the preparation of relevant proposals must constitute an important task of the special committee.
A/2/PV.77 14 May 1947​

I normally don't quote Soviets --- in most cases, simply because we seldom agree. But in this case, the two prevailing Superpowers of the World (in that time frame) happened to agree.

Probably the biggest reason the Mandate had an impact on the establishment of the State, might be because the Mandate illuminated the unreconcilable differences between the Arab Palestinians and the Israelis. And it is this vast gulf of diplomacy which the Arab Palestinian seems to have no capacity to resolve.

Most Respectfully,
R​

We intend to place before them [the United Nations] a historical account of the way in which His Majesty's Government have discharged their trust in Palestine over the last twenty-five years. We shall explain that the mandate has proved to be unworkable in practice and that the obligations undertaken to the two communities in Palestine have been shown to be irreconcilable." A/2/PV.77 14 May 1947​

Who were these two "communities?"

1) The indigenous people of Palestine.
2) The foreign Zionist colonial project.​

Britain tried to impose this colonial project on Palestine by military force. Of course it was rejected by virtually all of the people including the native Jews.

This colonial project is still being imposed on Palestine by military force. Thus we have a war that has been brewing for a hundred years and counting.

The 'foreign Zionist colonial project' is Palestinian propaganda.

 

[montelatici]

What do you call settling Europeans in Palestine, evicting the natives and creating a state? A picnic?

 

[montelatici]

What do you call settling people from another continent on land that the people living there were opposed to?

 

[Phoenall]

montelatici, et al,

This is often expressed by pro-Palestinian activists; trying for the appeal to emotion.

The alien(s) is/are the Europeans who settled in Palestine, all of Palestine, facilitated by the European colonial power, Great Britain.

(COMMENT)

In my opinion, there was to colonial activity in the Middle East. And the application of the non-binding concepts of General Assembly resolution 1514 (XV) of 14 December 1960 Declaration on the Granting of Independence to Colonial Countries and Peoples are not really applicable to the Mandate System in that:

• The intention of Mandate was the creation of conditions of stability and well-being and peaceful and friendly relations based on respect for the principles of equal rights and self-determination of all peoples.
• The intention of Mandate was to extend the universal respect for, and observance of, human rights and fundamental freedoms for all without distinction as to race, sex, language or religion,
• The intention of Mandate was the creation of conditions that would advance the attainment of their independence.

Considering the important role of the League of Nations, and the UN, (the successor governments to which the Ottoman Empire and Turkey surrendered all rights of suzerainty or jurisdiction, had in the establishment of all the Arab governments in the Middle East (territory formerly under the sovereignty of the Ottoman Empire) in assisting the various bids for independence in Trusts and Non-Self-Governing Territories, it should be noted that the nations upon which such powers of guardianship were conferred exercise them "as Mandatories on behalf of the League of Nations.

Most Respectfully,
R

OK, but the Mandate had nothing to do with the creation of Israel.

That is not to say that the Mandate was not complicit in setting the stage for Israel's military takeover of Palestine. Britain did provide the political and military power to protect the pre state colonization of Palestine by the Zionists. Britain allowed the Zionists to create a state within a state, including a military, while denying the same to the Palestinians.

The creation of Israel was a unilateral move that was unrelated to anything else.

BULLSHIT

The Mandate for Palestine was set up primarily to enable the Jews to set up their National Home. It even says so in the first 10 articles, or don't you read the links you keep demanding

 

[Challenger]

theliq, et al,

I see nothing above that substantiates your outlandish claim that: "Israel is an Illegal State." --- Although I see this quite often from pro-Palestinian Activist.

Israel is an ILLEGAL State,see comment above..........you are perpetuating and supporting this Illegal State........like most of your (Most Respectfully) comments,they mean nought,nothing,zilch......so STOP this erroneous commentary of yours......Resectfully or NOT

(OBSERVATIONS)

PLAN OF PARTITION WITH ECONOMIC UNION --- PART I --- Future constitution and government of Palestine
Section B --- STEPS PREPARATORY TO INDEPENDENCE --- Resolution 181 (II) of the General Assembly, dated 29 November 1947
PART II --- Boundaries --- Section A. - THE ARAB STATE Section B - THE JEWISH STATE

• S/747 16 May 1948 Declaration of Independence
• S/1093 29 November 1948 Application for Admission to the UN
• S/RES/69 S/1277 4 March 1949 Favorable UN Security Council Recommendation
• A/RES/273 (III) 11 May 1949 General Assembly Decides to admit Israel to membership in the United Nations.

(COMMENT)

I fail to see the justification for your comment that "Israel is an ILLEGAL State."

Most Respectfully,
R

It's an illegal state because it was created in direct violation of the will of the majority of the population of Palestine, and it's admission to the UN was based on Israel's adherance to two UN resolutions.

"Recalling its resolutions of 29 November 1947 3/ and 11 December 1948 4/ and taking note of the declarations and explanationsmade by the representative of the Government of Israel 5/ before the ad hoc Political Committee in respect of the implementation of the said resolutions,"

Which it has failed to do.

 

[Challenger]

P F Tinmore, et al,

This is entirely wrong.

montelatici, et al,

This is often expressed by pro-Palestinian activists; trying for the appeal to emotion.

The alien(s) is/are the Europeans who settled in Palestine, all of Palestine, facilitated by the European colonial power, Great Britain.

(COMMENT)

In my opinion, there was to colonial activity in the Middle East. And the application of the non-binding concepts of General Assembly resolution 1514 (XV) of 14 December 1960 Declaration on the Granting of Independence to Colonial Countries and Peoples are not really applicable to the Mandate System in that:

• The intention of Mandate was the creation of conditions of stability and well-being and peaceful and friendly relations based on respect for the principles of equal rights and self-determination of all peoples.
• The intention of Mandate was to extend the universal respect for, and observance of, human rights and fundamental freedoms for all without distinction as to race, sex, language or religion,
• The intention of Mandate was the creation of conditions that would advance the attainment of their independence.

Considering the important role of the League of Nations, and the UN, (the successor governments to which the Ottoman Empire and Turkey surrendered all rights of suzerainty or jurisdiction, had in the establishment of all the Arab governments in the Middle East (territory formerly under the sovereignty of the Ottoman Empire) in assisting the various bids for independence in Trusts and Non-Self-Governing Territories, it should be noted that the nations upon which such powers of guardianship were conferred exercise them "as Mandatories on behalf of the League of Nations.

Most Respectfully,
R

OK, but the Mandate had nothing to do with the creation of Israel.

That is not to say that the Mandate was not complicit in setting the stage for Israel's military takeover of Palestine. Britain did provide the political and military power to protect the pre state colonization of Palestine by the Zionists. Britain allowed the Zionists to create a state within a state, including a military, while denying the same to the Palestinians.

The creation of Israel was a unilateral move that was unrelated to anything else.

(COMMENT)

• The Mandate set the conditions for the establishment in Palestine of a national home for the Jewish people.
• The Mandate set the conditions for the establishment of the Jewish National Home, and the development of self-governing institutions.
• The Mandate set the conditions for immigration --- such that all Jews who are willing to assist --- might be shall encouraged in the establishment of the Jewish National Home.
• The Mandate set the conditions to acquire Palestinian citizenship by Jews who take up their permanent residence in Palestine.

There were many factor the helped set conditions favorable to the establishment of the Jewish National Home. The Mandate was not exclusive, but it made its contribution.

It is well known that representatives of the United Kingdom Government have stated, at various times, even before the question was submitted to the General Assembly, that the mandatory system of administration of Palestine has not justified itself and that the solution of the problem of how to deal with Palestine should be found by the United Nations. Thus, for instance, Mr. Bevin made the following statement in the House of Commons on 18 February 1947.

"We intend to place before them [the United Nations] a historical account of the way in which His Majesty's Government have discharged their trust in Palestine over the last twenty-five years. We shall explain that the mandate has proved to be unworkable in practice and that the obligations undertaken to the two communities in Palestine have been shown to be irreconcilable." A/2/PV.77 14 May 1947

AND​

In view of the necessity of manifesting concern for the needs of the Jewish people who find themselves without homes and without means of existence, the delegation of the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics thinks it essential, in this connexion, to draw the attention of the General Assembly to the following important circumstance. Past experience, particularly during the Second World War, shows that no western European State was able to provide adequate assistance for the Jewish people in defending its rights and its very existence from the violence of the Hitlerites and their allies. This is an unpleasant fact, but unfortunately, like all other facts, it must be admitted.

The fact that no western European State has been able to ensure the defence of the elementary rights of the Jewish people, and to safeguard it against the violence of the fascist executioners, explains the aspirations of the Jews to establish their own State. It would be unjust not to take this into consideration and to deny the right of the Jewish people to realize this aspiration. It would be unjustifiable to deny this right to the Jewish people, particularly in view of all it has undergone during the Second World War. Consequently, the study of this aspect of the problem and the preparation of relevant proposals must constitute an important task of the special committee.

AND​

Neither the historic past nor the conditions prevailing in Palestine at present can justify any unilateral solution of the Palestine problem, either in favour of establishing an independent Arab State, without consideration for the legitimate rights of the Jewish people, or in favour of the establishment of an independent Jewish State, while ignoring the legitimate rights of the Arab population. Neither of these extreme decisions would achieve an equitable solution of this complicated problem, especially since neither would ensure the settlement of relations between the Arabs and the Jews, which constitutes the most important task. A/2/PV.77 14 May 1947

And finally, and probably most importantly,

(QUOTING) Mr. Andrei Andreyevich GROMYKO, Minister of Foreign Affairs and Chairman of the Presidium of the Supreme Soviet (Union of Soviet Socialist Republics):
During the last war, the Jewish people underwent exceptional sorrow and suffering. Without any exaggeration, this sorrow and suffering are indescribable. It is difficult to express them in dry statistics on the Jewish victims of the fascist aggressors. The Jews in territories where the Hitlerites held sway were subjected to almost complete physical annihilation. The total number of members of the Jewish population who perished at the hands of the nazi executioners is estimated at approximately six million. Only about a million and a half Jews in Western Europe survived the war.

It may well be asked if the United Nations, in view of the difficult situation of hundreds of thousands of the surviving Jewish population, can fail to show an interest in the situation of these people, torn away from their countries and their homes. The United Nations cannot and must not regard this situation with indifference, since this would be incompatible with the high principles proclaimed in its Charter, which provide for the defence of human rights, irrespective of race, religion or sex. The time has come to help these people, not by word, but by deeds. It is essential to show concern for the urgent needs of a people which has undergone such great suffering as a result of the war brought about by hitlerite Germany. This is a duty of the United Nations.

The fact that no western European State has been able to ensure the defence of the elementary rights of the Jewish people, and to safeguard it against the violence of the fascist executioners, explains the aspirations of the Jews to establish their own State. It would be unjust not to take this into consideration and to deny the right of the Jewish people to realize this aspiration. It would be unjustifiable to deny this right to the Jewish people, particularly in view of all it has undergone during the Second World War. Consequently, the study of this aspect of the problem and the preparation of relevant proposals must constitute an important task of the special committee.
A/2/PV.77 14 May 1947​

I normally don't quote Soviets --- in most cases, simply because we seldom agree. But in this case, the two prevailing Superpowers of the World (in that time frame) happened to agree.

Probably the biggest reason the Mandate had an impact on the establishment of the State, might be because the Mandate illuminated the unreconcilable differences between the Arab Palestinians and the Israelis. And it is this vast gulf of diplomacy which the Arab Palestinian seems to have no capacity to resolve.

Most Respectfully,
R
​

The soviets were working to their own agenda at the time, they wanted Britain out and hoped that a "Socialist" Israel would become a Soviet ally or "satellite" state in the region. Remember the Soviets were Israel's main arms supplier at the time via Czechoslovakia and other Eastern bloc states. Significantly the speech ignores the huge Jewish populationof the United States, which still has 40% of all the World's Jewish population.

 

[Phoenall]

P F Tinmore, et al,

This is entirely wrong.

montelatici, et al,

This is often expressed by pro-Palestinian activists; trying for the appeal to emotion.

The alien(s) is/are the Europeans who settled in Palestine, all of Palestine, facilitated by the European colonial power, Great Britain.

(COMMENT)

In my opinion, there was to colonial activity in the Middle East. And the application of the non-binding concepts of General Assembly resolution 1514 (XV) of 14 December 1960 Declaration on the Granting of Independence to Colonial Countries and Peoples are not really applicable to the Mandate System in that:

• The intention of Mandate was the creation of conditions of stability and well-being and peaceful and friendly relations based on respect for the principles of equal rights and self-determination of all peoples.
• The intention of Mandate was to extend the universal respect for, and observance of, human rights and fundamental freedoms for all without distinction as to race, sex, language or religion,
• The intention of Mandate was the creation of conditions that would advance the attainment of their independence.

Considering the important role of the League of Nations, and the UN, (the successor governments to which the Ottoman Empire and Turkey surrendered all rights of suzerainty or jurisdiction, had in the establishment of all the Arab governments in the Middle East (territory formerly under the sovereignty of the Ottoman Empire) in assisting the various bids for independence in Trusts and Non-Self-Governing Territories, it should be noted that the nations upon which such powers of guardianship were conferred exercise them "as Mandatories on behalf of the League of Nations.

Most Respectfully,
R

OK, but the Mandate had nothing to do with the creation of Israel.

That is not to say that the Mandate was not complicit in setting the stage for Israel's military takeover of Palestine. Britain did provide the political and military power to protect the pre state colonization of Palestine by the Zionists. Britain allowed the Zionists to create a state within a state, including a military, while denying the same to the Palestinians.

The creation of Israel was a unilateral move that was unrelated to anything else.

(COMMENT)

• The Mandate set the conditions for the establishment in Palestine of a national home for the Jewish people.
• The Mandate set the conditions for the establishment of the Jewish National Home, and the development of self-governing institutions.
• The Mandate set the conditions for immigration --- such that all Jews who are willing to assist --- might be shall encouraged in the establishment of the Jewish National Home.
• The Mandate set the conditions to acquire Palestinian citizenship by Jews who take up their permanent residence in Palestine.

There were many factor the helped set conditions favorable to the establishment of the Jewish National Home. The Mandate was not exclusive, but it made its contribution.

It is well known that representatives of the United Kingdom Government have stated, at various times, even before the question was submitted to the General Assembly, that the mandatory system of administration of Palestine has not justified itself and that the solution of the problem of how to deal with Palestine should be found by the United Nations. Thus, for instance, Mr. Bevin made the following statement in the House of Commons on 18 February 1947.

"We intend to place before them [the United Nations] a historical account of the way in which His Majesty's Government have discharged their trust in Palestine over the last twenty-five years. We shall explain that the mandate has proved to be unworkable in practice and that the obligations undertaken to the two communities in Palestine have been shown to be irreconcilable." A/2/PV.77 14 May 1947

AND​

In view of the necessity of manifesting concern for the needs of the Jewish people who find themselves without homes and without means of existence, the delegation of the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics thinks it essential, in this connexion, to draw the attention of the General Assembly to the following important circumstance. Past experience, particularly during the Second World War, shows that no western European State was able to provide adequate assistance for the Jewish people in defending its rights and its very existence from the violence of the Hitlerites and their allies. This is an unpleasant fact, but unfortunately, like all other facts, it must be admitted.

The fact that no western European State has been able to ensure the defence of the elementary rights of the Jewish people, and to safeguard it against the violence of the fascist executioners, explains the aspirations of the Jews to establish their own State. It would be unjust not to take this into consideration and to deny the right of the Jewish people to realize this aspiration. It would be unjustifiable to deny this right to the Jewish people, particularly in view of all it has undergone during the Second World War. Consequently, the study of this aspect of the problem and the preparation of relevant proposals must constitute an important task of the special committee.

AND​

Neither the historic past nor the conditions prevailing in Palestine at present can justify any unilateral solution of the Palestine problem, either in favour of establishing an independent Arab State, without consideration for the legitimate rights of the Jewish people, or in favour of the establishment of an independent Jewish State, while ignoring the legitimate rights of the Arab population. Neither of these extreme decisions would achieve an equitable solution of this complicated problem, especially since neither would ensure the settlement of relations between the Arabs and the Jews, which constitutes the most important task. A/2/PV.77 14 May 1947

And finally, and probably most importantly,

(QUOTING) Mr. Andrei Andreyevich GROMYKO, Minister of Foreign Affairs and Chairman of the Presidium of the Supreme Soviet (Union of Soviet Socialist Republics):
During the last war, the Jewish people underwent exceptional sorrow and suffering. Without any exaggeration, this sorrow and suffering are indescribable. It is difficult to express them in dry statistics on the Jewish victims of the fascist aggressors. The Jews in territories where the Hitlerites held sway were subjected to almost complete physical annihilation. The total number of members of the Jewish population who perished at the hands of the nazi executioners is estimated at approximately six million. Only about a million and a half Jews in Western Europe survived the war.

It may well be asked if the United Nations, in view of the difficult situation of hundreds of thousands of the surviving Jewish population, can fail to show an interest in the situation of these people, torn away from their countries and their homes. The United Nations cannot and must not regard this situation with indifference, since this would be incompatible with the high principles proclaimed in its Charter, which provide for the defence of human rights, irrespective of race, religion or sex. The time has come to help these people, not by word, but by deeds. It is essential to show concern for the urgent needs of a people which has undergone such great suffering as a result of the war brought about by hitlerite Germany. This is a duty of the United Nations.

The fact that no western European State has been able to ensure the defence of the elementary rights of the Jewish people, and to safeguard it against the violence of the fascist executioners, explains the aspirations of the Jews to establish their own State. It would be unjust not to take this into consideration and to deny the right of the Jewish people to realize this aspiration. It would be unjustifiable to deny this right to the Jewish people, particularly in view of all it has undergone during the Second World War. Consequently, the study of this aspect of the problem and the preparation of relevant proposals must constitute an important task of the special committee.
A/2/PV.77 14 May 1947​

I normally don't quote Soviets --- in most cases, simply because we seldom agree. But in this case, the two prevailing Superpowers of the World (in that time frame) happened to agree.

Probably the biggest reason the Mandate had an impact on the establishment of the State, might be because the Mandate illuminated the unreconcilable differences between the Arab Palestinians and the Israelis. And it is this vast gulf of diplomacy which the Arab Palestinian seems to have no capacity to resolve.

Most Respectfully,
R​

We intend to place before them [the United Nations] a historical account of the way in which His Majesty's Government have discharged their trust in Palestine over the last twenty-five years. We shall explain that the mandate has proved to be unworkable in practice and that the obligations undertaken to the two communities in Palestine have been shown to be irreconcilable." A/2/PV.77 14 May 1947​

Who were these two "communities?"

1) The indigenous people of Palestine.
2) The foreign Zionist colonial project.​

Britain tried to impose this colonial project on Palestine by military force. Of course it was rejected by virtually all of the people including the native Jews.

This colonial project is still being imposed on Palestine by military force. Thus we have a war that has been brewing for a hundred years and counting.

No the arab muslims from the whole of the M.E and the Jews from the whole of the M.E. and Europe. Don't forget the muslims have a history of land grabs, illegal immigration and violence that is still evident today.

 

[Phoenall]

P F Tinmore, et al,

This is entirely wrong.

montelatici, et al,

This is often expressed by pro-Palestinian activists; trying for the appeal to emotion.

The alien(s) is/are the Europeans who settled in Palestine, all of Palestine, facilitated by the European colonial power, Great Britain.

(COMMENT)

In my opinion, there was to colonial activity in the Middle East. And the application of the non-binding concepts of General Assembly resolution 1514 (XV) of 14 December 1960 Declaration on the Granting of Independence to Colonial Countries and Peoples are not really applicable to the Mandate System in that:

• The intention of Mandate was the creation of conditions of stability and well-being and peaceful and friendly relations based on respect for the principles of equal rights and self-determination of all peoples.
• The intention of Mandate was to extend the universal respect for, and observance of, human rights and fundamental freedoms for all without distinction as to race, sex, language or religion,
• The intention of Mandate was the creation of conditions that would advance the attainment of their independence.

Considering the important role of the League of Nations, and the UN, (the successor governments to which the Ottoman Empire and Turkey surrendered all rights of suzerainty or jurisdiction, had in the establishment of all the Arab governments in the Middle East (territory formerly under the sovereignty of the Ottoman Empire) in assisting the various bids for independence in Trusts and Non-Self-Governing Territories, it should be noted that the nations upon which such powers of guardianship were conferred exercise them "as Mandatories on behalf of the League of Nations.

Most Respectfully,
R

OK, but the Mandate had nothing to do with the creation of Israel.

That is not to say that the Mandate was not complicit in setting the stage for Israel's military takeover of Palestine. Britain did provide the political and military power to protect the pre state colonization of Palestine by the Zionists. Britain allowed the Zionists to create a state within a state, including a military, while denying the same to the Palestinians.

The creation of Israel was a unilateral move that was unrelated to anything else.

(COMMENT)

• The Mandate set the conditions for the establishment in Palestine of a national home for the Jewish people.
• The Mandate set the conditions for the establishment of the Jewish National Home, and the development of self-governing institutions.
• The Mandate set the conditions for immigration --- such that all Jews who are willing to assist --- might be shall encouraged in the establishment of the Jewish National Home.
• The Mandate set the conditions to acquire Palestinian citizenship by Jews who take up their permanent residence in Palestine.

There were many factor the helped set conditions favorable to the establishment of the Jewish National Home. The Mandate was not exclusive, but it made its contribution.

It is well known that representatives of the United Kingdom Government have stated, at various times, even before the question was submitted to the General Assembly, that the mandatory system of administration of Palestine has not justified itself and that the solution of the problem of how to deal with Palestine should be found by the United Nations. Thus, for instance, Mr. Bevin made the following statement in the House of Commons on 18 February 1947.

"We intend to place before them [the United Nations] a historical account of the way in which His Majesty's Government have discharged their trust in Palestine over the last twenty-five years. We shall explain that the mandate has proved to be unworkable in practice and that the obligations undertaken to the two communities in Palestine have been shown to be irreconcilable." A/2/PV.77 14 May 1947

AND​

In view of the necessity of manifesting concern for the needs of the Jewish people who find themselves without homes and without means of existence, the delegation of the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics thinks it essential, in this connexion, to draw the attention of the General Assembly to the following important circumstance. Past experience, particularly during the Second World War, shows that no western European State was able to provide adequate assistance for the Jewish people in defending its rights and its very existence from the violence of the Hitlerites and their allies. This is an unpleasant fact, but unfortunately, like all other facts, it must be admitted.

The fact that no western European State has been able to ensure the defence of the elementary rights of the Jewish people, and to safeguard it against the violence of the fascist executioners, explains the aspirations of the Jews to establish their own State. It would be unjust not to take this into consideration and to deny the right of the Jewish people to realize this aspiration. It would be unjustifiable to deny this right to the Jewish people, particularly in view of all it has undergone during the Second World War. Consequently, the study of this aspect of the problem and the preparation of relevant proposals must constitute an important task of the special committee.

AND​

Neither the historic past nor the conditions prevailing in Palestine at present can justify any unilateral solution of the Palestine problem, either in favour of establishing an independent Arab State, without consideration for the legitimate rights of the Jewish people, or in favour of the establishment of an independent Jewish State, while ignoring the legitimate rights of the Arab population. Neither of these extreme decisions would achieve an equitable solution of this complicated problem, especially since neither would ensure the settlement of relations between the Arabs and the Jews, which constitutes the most important task. A/2/PV.77 14 May 1947

And finally, and probably most importantly,

(QUOTING) Mr. Andrei Andreyevich GROMYKO, Minister of Foreign Affairs and Chairman of the Presidium of the Supreme Soviet (Union of Soviet Socialist Republics):
During the last war, the Jewish people underwent exceptional sorrow and suffering. Without any exaggeration, this sorrow and suffering are indescribable. It is difficult to express them in dry statistics on the Jewish victims of the fascist aggressors. The Jews in territories where the Hitlerites held sway were subjected to almost complete physical annihilation. The total number of members of the Jewish population who perished at the hands of the nazi executioners is estimated at approximately six million. Only about a million and a half Jews in Western Europe survived the war.

It may well be asked if the United Nations, in view of the difficult situation of hundreds of thousands of the surviving Jewish population, can fail to show an interest in the situation of these people, torn away from their countries and their homes. The United Nations cannot and must not regard this situation with indifference, since this would be incompatible with the high principles proclaimed in its Charter, which provide for the defence of human rights, irrespective of race, religion or sex. The time has come to help these people, not by word, but by deeds. It is essential to show concern for the urgent needs of a people which has undergone such great suffering as a result of the war brought about by hitlerite Germany. This is a duty of the United Nations.

The fact that no western European State has been able to ensure the defence of the elementary rights of the Jewish people, and to safeguard it against the violence of the fascist executioners, explains the aspirations of the Jews to establish their own State. It would be unjust not to take this into consideration and to deny the right of the Jewish people to realize this aspiration. It would be unjustifiable to deny this right to the Jewish people, particularly in view of all it has undergone during the Second World War. Consequently, the study of this aspect of the problem and the preparation of relevant proposals must constitute an important task of the special committee.
A/2/PV.77 14 May 1947​

I normally don't quote Soviets --- in most cases, simply because we seldom agree. But in this case, the two prevailing Superpowers of the World (in that time frame) happened to agree.

Probably the biggest reason the Mandate had an impact on the establishment of the State, might be because the Mandate illuminated the unreconcilable differences between the Arab Palestinians and the Israelis. And it is this vast gulf of diplomacy which the Arab Palestinian seems to have no capacity to resolve.

Most Respectfully,
R​

We intend to place before them [the United Nations] a historical account of the way in which His Majesty's Government have discharged their trust in Palestine over the last twenty-five years. We shall explain that the mandate has proved to be unworkable in practice and that the obligations undertaken to the two communities in Palestine have been shown to be irreconcilable." A/2/PV.77 14 May 1947​

Who were these two "communities?"

1) The indigenous people of Palestine.
2) The foreign Zionist colonial project.​

Britain tried to impose this colonial project on Palestine by military force. Of course it was rejected by virtually all of the people including the native Jews.

This colonial project is still being imposed on Palestine by military force. Thus we have a war that has been brewing for a hundred years and counting.

The 'foreign Zionist colonial project' is Palestinian propaganda.

It is worse than that it is islamonazi Jew hatred and racist lies.

 

[Phoenall]

What do you call settling Europeans in Palestine, evicting the natives and creating a state? A picnic?

No an islamonazi racist LIE as The Europeans were invited to settle in Palestine after the arab muslims had been given the lions share.

 

[Phoenall]

What do you call settling people from another continent on land that the people living there were opposed to?

Islamonazi illegal immigration which is happening in Europe, Africa, America and Australia. Care to explain why you are blind to these illegal colonial settling by your fellow muslims ?

 

[Phoenall]

theliq, et al,

I see nothing above that substantiates your outlandish claim that: "Israel is an Illegal State." --- Although I see this quite often from pro-Palestinian Activist.

Israel is an ILLEGAL State,see comment above..........you are perpetuating and supporting this Illegal State........like most of your (Most Respectfully) comments,they mean nought,nothing,zilch......so STOP this erroneous commentary of yours......Resectfully or NOT

(OBSERVATIONS)

PLAN OF PARTITION WITH ECONOMIC UNION --- PART I --- Future constitution and government of Palestine
Section B --- STEPS PREPARATORY TO INDEPENDENCE --- Resolution 181 (II) of the General Assembly, dated 29 November 1947
PART II --- Boundaries --- Section A. - THE ARAB STATE Section B - THE JEWISH STATE

• S/747 16 May 1948 Declaration of Independence
• S/1093 29 November 1948 Application for Admission to the UN
• S/RES/69 S/1277 4 March 1949 Favorable UN Security Council Recommendation
• A/RES/273 (III) 11 May 1949 General Assembly Decides to admit Israel to membership in the United Nations.

(COMMENT)

I fail to see the justification for your comment that "Israel is an ILLEGAL State."

Most Respectfully,
R

It's an illegal state because it was created in direct violation of the will of the majority of the population of Palestine, and it's admission to the UN was based on Israel's adherance to two UN resolutions.

"Recalling its resolutions of 29 November 1947 3/ and 11 December 1948 4/ and taking note of the declarations and explanationsmade by the representative of the Government of Israel 5/ before the ad hoc Political Committee in respect of the implementation of the said resolutions,"

Which it has failed to do.

Not at the time the National Home for the Jews was first put into International law, as then the population of Palestine was majority Jewish. It was only after the arab muslims illegally migrated and stole the land that the problems started.
But if you want to play them games then Pakistan and Bangladesh are illegal states as the majority of population of India. Just as the many Islamic nations in Africa are also illegal as they were created against the wishes of the population.


Now when did UN resolutions become legal and binding, and which two were not adhered to by the Israeli's. And then explain why the arab muslims ignored International law in regards to Jerusalem and the eviction of 1 million Jews by force of arms.

 

[Phoenall]

P F Tinmore, et al,

This is entirely wrong.

montelatici, et al,

This is often expressed by pro-Palestinian activists; trying for the appeal to emotion.

The alien(s) is/are the Europeans who settled in Palestine, all of Palestine, facilitated by the European colonial power, Great Britain.

(COMMENT)

In my opinion, there was to colonial activity in the Middle East. And the application of the non-binding concepts of General Assembly resolution 1514 (XV) of 14 December 1960 Declaration on the Granting of Independence to Colonial Countries and Peoples are not really applicable to the Mandate System in that:

• The intention of Mandate was the creation of conditions of stability and well-being and peaceful and friendly relations based on respect for the principles of equal rights and self-determination of all peoples.
• The intention of Mandate was to extend the universal respect for, and observance of, human rights and fundamental freedoms for all without distinction as to race, sex, language or religion,
• The intention of Mandate was the creation of conditions that would advance the attainment of their independence.

Considering the important role of the League of Nations, and the UN, (the successor governments to which the Ottoman Empire and Turkey surrendered all rights of suzerainty or jurisdiction, had in the establishment of all the Arab governments in the Middle East (territory formerly under the sovereignty of the Ottoman Empire) in assisting the various bids for independence in Trusts and Non-Self-Governing Territories, it should be noted that the nations upon which such powers of guardianship were conferred exercise them "as Mandatories on behalf of the League of Nations.

Most Respectfully,
R

OK, but the Mandate had nothing to do with the creation of Israel.

That is not to say that the Mandate was not complicit in setting the stage for Israel's military takeover of Palestine. Britain did provide the political and military power to protect the pre state colonization of Palestine by the Zionists. Britain allowed the Zionists to create a state within a state, including a military, while denying the same to the Palestinians.

The creation of Israel was a unilateral move that was unrelated to anything else.

(COMMENT)

• The Mandate set the conditions for the establishment in Palestine of a national home for the Jewish people.
• The Mandate set the conditions for the establishment of the Jewish National Home, and the development of self-governing institutions.
• The Mandate set the conditions for immigration --- such that all Jews who are willing to assist --- might be shall encouraged in the establishment of the Jewish National Home.
• The Mandate set the conditions to acquire Palestinian citizenship by Jews who take up their permanent residence in Palestine.

There were many factor the helped set conditions favorable to the establishment of the Jewish National Home. The Mandate was not exclusive, but it made its contribution.

It is well known that representatives of the United Kingdom Government have stated, at various times, even before the question was submitted to the General Assembly, that the mandatory system of administration of Palestine has not justified itself and that the solution of the problem of how to deal with Palestine should be found by the United Nations. Thus, for instance, Mr. Bevin made the following statement in the House of Commons on 18 February 1947.

"We intend to place before them [the United Nations] a historical account of the way in which His Majesty's Government have discharged their trust in Palestine over the last twenty-five years. We shall explain that the mandate has proved to be unworkable in practice and that the obligations undertaken to the two communities in Palestine have been shown to be irreconcilable." A/2/PV.77 14 May 1947

AND​

In view of the necessity of manifesting concern for the needs of the Jewish people who find themselves without homes and without means of existence, the delegation of the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics thinks it essential, in this connexion, to draw the attention of the General Assembly to the following important circumstance. Past experience, particularly during the Second World War, shows that no western European State was able to provide adequate assistance for the Jewish people in defending its rights and its very existence from the violence of the Hitlerites and their allies. This is an unpleasant fact, but unfortunately, like all other facts, it must be admitted.

The fact that no western European State has been able to ensure the defence of the elementary rights of the Jewish people, and to safeguard it against the violence of the fascist executioners, explains the aspirations of the Jews to establish their own State. It would be unjust not to take this into consideration and to deny the right of the Jewish people to realize this aspiration. It would be unjustifiable to deny this right to the Jewish people, particularly in view of all it has undergone during the Second World War. Consequently, the study of this aspect of the problem and the preparation of relevant proposals must constitute an important task of the special committee.

AND​

Neither the historic past nor the conditions prevailing in Palestine at present can justify any unilateral solution of the Palestine problem, either in favour of establishing an independent Arab State, without consideration for the legitimate rights of the Jewish people, or in favour of the establishment of an independent Jewish State, while ignoring the legitimate rights of the Arab population. Neither of these extreme decisions would achieve an equitable solution of this complicated problem, especially since neither would ensure the settlement of relations between the Arabs and the Jews, which constitutes the most important task. A/2/PV.77 14 May 1947

And finally, and probably most importantly,

(QUOTING) Mr. Andrei Andreyevich GROMYKO, Minister of Foreign Affairs and Chairman of the Presidium of the Supreme Soviet (Union of Soviet Socialist Republics):
During the last war, the Jewish people underwent exceptional sorrow and suffering. Without any exaggeration, this sorrow and suffering are indescribable. It is difficult to express them in dry statistics on the Jewish victims of the fascist aggressors. The Jews in territories where the Hitlerites held sway were subjected to almost complete physical annihilation. The total number of members of the Jewish population who perished at the hands of the nazi executioners is estimated at approximately six million. Only about a million and a half Jews in Western Europe survived the war.

It may well be asked if the United Nations, in view of the difficult situation of hundreds of thousands of the surviving Jewish population, can fail to show an interest in the situation of these people, torn away from their countries and their homes. The United Nations cannot and must not regard this situation with indifference, since this would be incompatible with the high principles proclaimed in its Charter, which provide for the defence of human rights, irrespective of race, religion or sex. The time has come to help these people, not by word, but by deeds. It is essential to show concern for the urgent needs of a people which has undergone such great suffering as a result of the war brought about by hitlerite Germany. This is a duty of the United Nations.

The fact that no western European State has been able to ensure the defence of the elementary rights of the Jewish people, and to safeguard it against the violence of the fascist executioners, explains the aspirations of the Jews to establish their own State. It would be unjust not to take this into consideration and to deny the right of the Jewish people to realize this aspiration. It would be unjustifiable to deny this right to the Jewish people, particularly in view of all it has undergone during the Second World War. Consequently, the study of this aspect of the problem and the preparation of relevant proposals must constitute an important task of the special committee.
A/2/PV.77 14 May 1947​

I normally don't quote Soviets --- in most cases, simply because we seldom agree. But in this case, the two prevailing Superpowers of the World (in that time frame) happened to agree.

Probably the biggest reason the Mandate had an impact on the establishment of the State, might be because the Mandate illuminated the unreconcilable differences between the Arab Palestinians and the Israelis. And it is this vast gulf of diplomacy which the Arab Palestinian seems to have no capacity to resolve.

Most Respectfully,
R​

The soviets were working to their own agenda at the time, they wanted Britain out and hoped that a "Socialist" Israel would become a Soviet ally or "satellite" state in the region. Remember the Soviets were Israel's main arms supplier at the time via Czechoslovakia and other Eastern bloc states. Significantly the speech ignores the huge Jewish populationof the United States, which still has 40% of all the World's Jewish population.

Because the soviets were losing so many intelligent people to Israel had nothing to do with it did it. Just as the soviets and US kidnapping thousands of Germany's scientists at the end of WW2 did not take place. You really need to stop reading what your handler tells you is the truth and look at the reality.

 

[P F Tinmore]

montelatici, et al,

This is often expressed by pro-Palestinian activists; trying for the appeal to emotion.

The alien(s) is/are the Europeans who settled in Palestine, all of Palestine, facilitated by the European colonial power, Great Britain.

(COMMENT)

In my opinion, there was to colonial activity in the Middle East. And the application of the non-binding concepts of General Assembly resolution 1514 (XV) of 14 December 1960 Declaration on the Granting of Independence to Colonial Countries and Peoples are not really applicable to the Mandate System in that:

• The intention of Mandate was the creation of conditions of stability and well-being and peaceful and friendly relations based on respect for the principles of equal rights and self-determination of all peoples.
• The intention of Mandate was to extend the universal respect for, and observance of, human rights and fundamental freedoms for all without distinction as to race, sex, language or religion,
• The intention of Mandate was the creation of conditions that would advance the attainment of their independence.

Considering the important role of the League of Nations, and the UN, (the successor governments to which the Ottoman Empire and Turkey surrendered all rights of suzerainty or jurisdiction, had in the establishment of all the Arab governments in the Middle East (territory formerly under the sovereignty of the Ottoman Empire) in assisting the various bids for independence in Trusts and Non-Self-Governing Territories, it should be noted that the nations upon which such powers of guardianship were conferred exercise them "as Mandatories on behalf of the League of Nations.

Most Respectfully,
R

OK, but the Mandate had nothing to do with the creation of Israel.

That is not to say that the Mandate was not complicit in setting the stage for Israel's military takeover of Palestine. Britain did provide the political and military power to protect the pre state colonization of Palestine by the Zionists. Britain allowed the Zionists to create a state within a state, including a military, while denying the same to the Palestinians.

The creation of Israel was a unilateral move that was unrelated to anything else.

BULLSHIT

The Mandate for Palestine was set up primarily to enable the Jews to set up their National Home. It even says so in the first 10 articles, or don't you read the links you keep demanding

I have.

Where does it conflict with my post?

 

[Phoenall]

montelatici, et al,

This is often expressed by pro-Palestinian activists; trying for the appeal to emotion.

The alien(s) is/are the Europeans who settled in Palestine, all of Palestine, facilitated by the European colonial power, Great Britain.

(COMMENT)

In my opinion, there was to colonial activity in the Middle East. And the application of the non-binding concepts of General Assembly resolution 1514 (XV) of 14 December 1960 Declaration on the Granting of Independence to Colonial Countries and Peoples are not really applicable to the Mandate System in that:

• The intention of Mandate was the creation of conditions of stability and well-being and peaceful and friendly relations based on respect for the principles of equal rights and self-determination of all peoples.
• The intention of Mandate was to extend the universal respect for, and observance of, human rights and fundamental freedoms for all without distinction as to race, sex, language or religion,
• The intention of Mandate was the creation of conditions that would advance the attainment of their independence.

Considering the important role of the League of Nations, and the UN, (the successor governments to which the Ottoman Empire and Turkey surrendered all rights of suzerainty or jurisdiction, had in the establishment of all the Arab governments in the Middle East (territory formerly under the sovereignty of the Ottoman Empire) in assisting the various bids for independence in Trusts and Non-Self-Governing Territories, it should be noted that the nations upon which such powers of guardianship were conferred exercise them "as Mandatories on behalf of the League of Nations.

Most Respectfully,
R

OK, but the Mandate had nothing to do with the creation of Israel.

That is not to say that the Mandate was not complicit in setting the stage for Israel's military takeover of Palestine. Britain did provide the political and military power to protect the pre state colonization of Palestine by the Zionists. Britain allowed the Zionists to create a state within a state, including a military, while denying the same to the Palestinians.

The creation of Israel was a unilateral move that was unrelated to anything else.

BULLSHIT

The Mandate for Palestine was set up primarily to enable the Jews to set up their National Home. It even says so in the first 10 articles, or don't you read the links you keep demanding

I have.

Where does it conflict with my post?

Then maybe it needs to be translated for you as you seem to have a problem with understanding English. The Mandate for Palestine states that Palestine is for the Jews national home. You claim that the mandate had nothing to do with setting up Israel.setting

 

[P F Tinmore]

montelatici, et al,

This is often expressed by pro-Palestinian activists; trying for the appeal to emotion.

The alien(s) is/are the Europeans who settled in Palestine, all of Palestine, facilitated by the European colonial power, Great Britain.

(COMMENT)

In my opinion, there was to colonial activity in the Middle East. And the application of the non-binding concepts of General Assembly resolution 1514 (XV) of 14 December 1960 Declaration on the Granting of Independence to Colonial Countries and Peoples are not really applicable to the Mandate System in that:

• The intention of Mandate was the creation of conditions of stability and well-being and peaceful and friendly relations based on respect for the principles of equal rights and self-determination of all peoples.
• The intention of Mandate was to extend the universal respect for, and observance of, human rights and fundamental freedoms for all without distinction as to race, sex, language or religion,
• The intention of Mandate was the creation of conditions that would advance the attainment of their independence.

Considering the important role of the League of Nations, and the UN, (the successor governments to which the Ottoman Empire and Turkey surrendered all rights of suzerainty or jurisdiction, had in the establishment of all the Arab governments in the Middle East (territory formerly under the sovereignty of the Ottoman Empire) in assisting the various bids for independence in Trusts and Non-Self-Governing Territories, it should be noted that the nations upon which such powers of guardianship were conferred exercise them "as Mandatories on behalf of the League of Nations.

Most Respectfully,
R

OK, but the Mandate had nothing to do with the creation of Israel.

That is not to say that the Mandate was not complicit in setting the stage for Israel's military takeover of Palestine. Britain did provide the political and military power to protect the pre state colonization of Palestine by the Zionists. Britain allowed the Zionists to create a state within a state, including a military, while denying the same to the Palestinians.

The creation of Israel was a unilateral move that was unrelated to anything else.

BULLSHIT

The Mandate for Palestine was set up primarily to enable the Jews to set up their National Home. It even says so in the first 10 articles, or don't you read the links you keep demanding

I have.

Where does it conflict with my post?

Then maybe it needs to be translated for you as you seem to have a problem with understanding English. The Mandate for Palestine states that Palestine is for the Jews national home. You claim that the mandate had nothing to do with setting up Israel.setting

Where was the Mandate when Israel claimed its independence and what role did it play in the declaration?

 

[fanger]

[QUOTE="Phoenall, post: 11111339, member: 35705"



Then maybe it needs to be translated for you as you seem to have a problem with understanding English. The Mandate for Palestine states that Palestine is for the Jews national home. You claim that the mandate had nothing to do with setting up Israel.setting[/QUOTE]

you always leave this part out... it being clearly understood that nothing should be done which might prejudice the civil and religious rights of existing non-Jewish communities in Palestine,

 

[MJB12741]

[QUOTE="Phoenall, post: 11111339, member: 35705"



Then maybe it needs to be translated for you as you seem to have a problem with understanding English. The Mandate for Palestine states that Palestine is for the Jews national home. You claim that the mandate had nothing to do with setting up Israel.setting

you always leave this part out... it being clearly understood that nothing should be done which might prejudice the civil and religious rights of existing non-Jewish communities in Palestine,[/QUOTE]


Kill Israeli's & Israel will retaliate against the "civil & religious rights of existing non Jewish communities in Palestine". It's that simple.

 

[Phoenall]

montelatici, et al,

This is often expressed by pro-Palestinian activists; trying for the appeal to emotion.

(COMMENT)

In my opinion, there was to colonial activity in the Middle East. And the application of the non-binding concepts of General Assembly resolution 1514 (XV) of 14 December 1960 Declaration on the Granting of Independence to Colonial Countries and Peoples are not really applicable to the Mandate System in that:

• The intention of Mandate was the creation of conditions of stability and well-being and peaceful and friendly relations based on respect for the principles of equal rights and self-determination of all peoples.
• The intention of Mandate was to extend the universal respect for, and observance of, human rights and fundamental freedoms for all without distinction as to race, sex, language or religion,
• The intention of Mandate was the creation of conditions that would advance the attainment of their independence.

Considering the important role of the League of Nations, and the UN, (the successor governments to which the Ottoman Empire and Turkey surrendered all rights of suzerainty or jurisdiction, had in the establishment of all the Arab governments in the Middle East (territory formerly under the sovereignty of the Ottoman Empire) in assisting the various bids for independence in Trusts and Non-Self-Governing Territories, it should be noted that the nations upon which such powers of guardianship were conferred exercise them "as Mandatories on behalf of the League of Nations.

Most Respectfully,
R

OK, but the Mandate had nothing to do with the creation of Israel.

That is not to say that the Mandate was not complicit in setting the stage for Israel's military takeover of Palestine. Britain did provide the political and military power to protect the pre state colonization of Palestine by the Zionists. Britain allowed the Zionists to create a state within a state, including a military, while denying the same to the Palestinians.

The creation of Israel was a unilateral move that was unrelated to anything else.

BULLSHIT

The Mandate for Palestine was set up primarily to enable the Jews to set up their National Home. It even says so in the first 10 articles, or don't you read the links you keep demanding

I have.

Where does it conflict with my post?

Then maybe it needs to be translated for you as you seem to have a problem with understanding English. The Mandate for Palestine states that Palestine is for the Jews national home. You claim that the mandate had nothing to do with setting up Israel.setting

Where was the Mandate when Israel claimed its independence and what role did it play in the declaration?

It is still in existence as part of the land is still unclaimed, it had everything to do with the declaration as it set the steps to be followed, Why do you think Jordan, Syria and Iran was not set free until Israel declared independence ?