When it is really a heartbeat.

[elektra]

Many here do seem to be functioning with only a lizard brain, but it is a functioning lizard brain.

certainly, being brainless, you are bewildered

 

[OhPleaseJustQuit]

Just stop killing unborn humans. It's a simple thing that we all have the power to manifest. Just stop making babies that you don't want. The brainless ones are the ones who fuck like dogs and then go "OOOPS! A little accident".

 

[BULLDOG]

and your medical expertise is a google search?

I claim no medical expertise, but I have had lengthy converations with people who do have extensive expertise, and I generally back up any claims I might make with credible proof.

 

[Couchpotato]

I know plenty of people in their 40's, 50's and 60's who would not qualify under that metric. Many of them post here.

Can I walk into a hospital and stab someone who is brain dead? What if that person who was brain dead would recover in say 9 months can I still stab him while he's brain dead?

 

[elektra]

I claim no medical expertise, but I have had lengthy converations with people who do have extensive expertise, and I generally back up any claims I might make with credible proof.

yes, well many of us who have kids, have seen the early ultrasounds, of a beating heart, so there is that, our fact and eyewitness compared to people you talk to.

 

[Flash]

Please present the science that says you can have a heartbeat, as we know it, without any muscle, or heart structure present.

You dipshit Moon Bats deny basic Biology. Then you wonder why we ridicule you so much.

 

[SassyIrishLass]

yes, well many of us who have kids, have seen the early ultrasounds, of a beating heart, so there is that, our fact and eyewitness compared to people you talk to.

We saw ours. That was our babies

 

[BULLDOG]

yes, well many of us who have kids, have seen the early ultrasounds, of a beating heart, so there is that, our fact and eyewitness compared to people you talk to.

Those early ultrasounds showed a few cells that would eventually become part of the heart. They didn't show a heart, because a heart doesn't exist at that point. There are no structures such as valves or chambers because there is no muscle to form them. All that happens much later in a short 4 day period starting on day 124.

 

[justinacolmena]

no heart structure present to actually behave as a heart behaves. No valves, no chambers, no muscle to pump anything.

There's nothing wrong that infant's heart. The problem is the heartless adult female who desires to experience transitory sensual pleasure with another adult and murder an innocent child as a human sacrifice for her sin.

 

[Papageorgio]

Conception isn't the start of life. The egg and sperm are life before they join, and continue to be life after they join. The question is when does it become a seperate and individual life.

Science says otherwise. The egg and sperm are not life before they join.
When Do Human Beings Begin?

The fusion of the sperm (with 23 chromosomes) and the oocyte (with 23 chromosomes) at fertilization results in a live human being, a single-cell human zygote, with 46 chromosomes�the number of chromosomes characteristic of an individual member of the human species. Quoting Moore:

"Zygote: This cell results from the union of an oocyte and a sperm. A zygote is the beginning of a new human being (i.e., an embryo). The expression fertilized ovum refers to a secondary oocyte that is impregnated by a sperm; when fertilization is complete, the oocyte becomes a zygote."10 (Emphasis added.)

This new single-cell human being immediately produces specifically human proteins and enzymes11 (not carrot or frog enzymes and proteins), and genetically directs his/her own growth and development. (In fact, this genetic growth and development has been proven not to be directed by the mother.)12 Finally, this new human being�the single-cell human zygote�is biologically an individual, a living organism�an individual member of the human species. Quoting Larsen:

"... [W]e begin our description of the developing human with the formation and differentiation of the male and female sex cells or gametes, which will unite at fertilization to initiate the embryonic development of a new individual."13 (Emphasis added.)

In sum, a mature human sperm and a mature human oocyte are products of gametogenesis�each has only 23 chromosomes. They each have only half of the required number of chromosomes for a human being. They cannot singly develop further into human beings. They produce only "gamete" proteins and enzymes. They do not direct their own growth and development. And they are not individuals, i.e., members of the human species. They are only parts�each one a part of a human being. On the other hand, a human being is the immediate product of fertilization. As such he/she is a single-cell embryonic zygote, an organism with 46 chromosomes, the number required of a member of the human species. This human being immediately produces specifically human proteins and enzymes, directs his/her own further growth and development as human, and is a new, genetically unique, newly existing, live human individual.​

 

[Dana7360]

I'm convinced that the actually believe the crap they spew. People they trust told them it was so, so in their minds, it must be so. If I believed the crazy shit they do, I would probably be ranting right along with them. I have no idea what the solution might be. It's a scary/sad situation.

I don't believe all of them actually believe that.

In fact I would not be surprised if at least half the anti choicers don't believed a word of the lies they spew.

Honestly doesn't matter to people like that.

A person has to be extremely stupid to believe that a non existent heart beats non existent blood through non existent veins all regulated by a non existent brain.

I don't believe that people are that stupid.

Whether they are or not, I'm extremely tired of their lies and their refusal to be tolerant of pro choice views while demanding we tolerate theirs.

You can lead a horse to water but you can't make it drink.

Same thing with these anti choice people.

 

[BULLDOG]

Science says otherwise. The egg and sperm are not life before they join.
When Do Human Beings Begin?

The fusion of the sperm (with 23 chromosomes) and the oocyte (with 23 chromosomes) at fertilization results in a live human being, a single-cell human zygote, with 46 chromosomes�the number of chromosomes characteristic of an individual member of the human species. Quoting Moore:

"Zygote: This cell results from the union of an oocyte and a sperm. A zygote is the beginning of a new human being (i.e., an embryo). The expression fertilized ovum refers to a secondary oocyte that is impregnated by a sperm; when fertilization is complete, the oocyte becomes a zygote."10 (Emphasis added.)

This new single-cell human being immediately produces specifically human proteins and enzymes11 (not carrot or frog enzymes and proteins), and genetically directs his/her own growth and development. (In fact, this genetic growth and development has been proven not to be directed by the mother.)12 Finally, this new human being�the single-cell human zygote�is biologically an individual, a living organism�an individual member of the human species. Quoting Larsen:

"... [W]e begin our description of the developing human with the formation and differentiation of the male and female sex cells or gametes, which will unite at fertilization to initiate the embryonic development of a new individual."13 (Emphasis added.)

In sum, a mature human sperm and a mature human oocyte are products of gametogenesis�each has only 23 chromosomes. They each have only half of the required number of chromosomes for a human being. They cannot singly develop further into human beings. They produce only "gamete" proteins and enzymes. They do not direct their own growth and development. And they are not individuals, i.e., members of the human species. They are only parts�each one a part of a human being. On the other hand, a human being is the immediate product of fertilization. As such he/she is a single-cell embryonic zygote, an organism with 46 chromosomes, the number required of a member of the human species. This human being immediately produces specifically human proteins and enzymes, directs his/her own further growth and development as human, and is a new, genetically unique, newly existing, live human individual.​

The egg and sperm are certainly living cells.

 

[elektra]

Those early ultrasounds showed a few cells that would eventually become part of the heart. They didn't show a heart, because a heart doesn't exist at that point. There are no structures such as valves or chambers because there is no muscle to form them. All that happens much later in a short 4 day period starting on day 124.

sorry, but doctors say you are wrong, no matter how much you scream you are not murdering babies, the facts say you dont know a single thing about this topic.

 

[buttercup]

Sorry, but it actually is a heart, and a heartbeat. Read the link below. I mean, as others have said, I get that you guys have to dehumanize the preborn baby, to justify killing, but by saying things like this you just make yourself look ignorant.

19.5 Development of the Heart - Anatomy and Physiology | OpenStax

The human heart is the first functional organ to develop. It begins beating and pumping blood around day 21 or 22, a mere three weeks after fertilizatio...

openstax.org

 

[BULLDOG]

sorry, but doctors say you are wrong, no matter how much you scream you are not murdering babies, the facts say you dont know a single thing about this topic.

So which doctors say muscles, valves, chambers, and all the other parts required for a heart are present at 6 weeks? Link please.

 

[OhPleaseJustQuit]

I'm convinced that the actually believe the crap they spew. People they trust told them it was so, so in their minds, it must be so. If I believed the crazy shit they do, I would probably be ranting right along with them. I have no idea what the solution might be. It's a scary/sad situation.

I'm convinced that the actually believe the crap they spew. The TV told them it was so, so in their minds, it must be so. If I believed the crazy shit they do, I would probably be ranting right along with them. I have no idea what the solution might be. It's a scary/sad situation.

 

[elektra]

So which doctors say muscles, valves, chambers, and all the other parts required for a heart are present at 6 weeks? Link please.

first, link to the doctors that say all these must be fully developed before it is a heart.

Your demand, your OP, you are stating it is not, fine.

Your OP, your demand, link to the doctor that states all the above you mentioned must be fully developed to be classified as a, "heart".

 

[elektra]

I'm convinced that the actually believe the crap they spew. The TV told them it was so, so in their minds, it must be so. If I believed the crazy shit they do, I would probably be ranting right along with them. I have no idea what the solution might be. It's a scary/sad situation.

yet you rant just the same????

 

[mamooth]

Science says otherwise. The egg and sperm are not life before they join.

That was quite a delusional opinion piece. Pro-lifers say the craziest things to justify their giggling homidical massacre of helpless haploid humans. Whatever helps them sleep at night, I suppose.

Someday, I may find a pro-lifers who doesn't fail completeley at basic biology, logic and morality. But it won't be here.

 

[OhPleaseJustQuit]

So which doctors say muscles, valves, chambers, and all the other parts required for a heart are present at 6 weeks? Link please.

If this is truly the most salient point you can come up with in this whole big debate, I feel sorry for you and the narrow little mind beyond which you have not managed to evolve.