When Asked What, Besides Tax Cuts, Would Help The Economy, Pence Says Tax Cuts

[driveby]

Didn't Biden say that the expiration of these Bush tax cuts would only impact 3% of the small businesses in America? So, is the GOP saying that these 3% of the US small businesses are going to save our econmomy?

You and Biden himself are the only people that believe Biden.......

so you have no real refutation?

By pure default, anyone with half a brain refutes anything Biden says.....

 

[Wry Catcher]

Housing values plummeting is a symptom or result ; not the cause; of what has been wrong for years , a monetary policy of inflating the bubbles, allowing them to fall means that they will be affordable for a new generation of first time home buyers, we need to suffer the ill effects brought about by this market manipulation by government, allow values to fall, burn off the malinvestments and have a stronger economic foundation for all of us, my thoughts on it anyway.

You comment on my last paragraph?

Now there is the paradox that government intervention and the greed fostered by this intervention created, what to do, should we bail them out,should we chance on the entire mortgage /banking sector colasping or what, I think we could have a civil and honest discussion there, I tend to think, let the chips fall where they may, other investors will come in and buy at these fire sales and the ones left to survive will hopefully learn from their mistakes but pumping more money into the system,kicking the can farther down the road and allowing people to profit while underwriting their risks just does not seem fair to the taxpayers and consumers to me. There is no easy and painless solution to a problem that has been in the making for decades;imho.

No, there is no painless solution. Who should suffer? The homeowner who loses his/her home, the banks whose greed is, imho, the proximate cause AND the ultimate cause of the housing meltdown, or should the pain be shared?

 

[Avatar4321]

Cut spending. I mean seriously cut it. Consolidate the government. There is no reason we need all these agencies. It's too big and I am sure we are duplicating countless efforts.

This is just ridiculous.

 

[johnrocks]

You comment on my last paragraph?

Now there is the paradox that government intervention and the greed fostered by this intervention created, what to do, should we bail them out,should we chance on the entire mortgage /banking sector colasping or what, I think we could have a civil and honest discussion there, I tend to think, let the chips fall where they may, other investors will come in and buy at these fire sales and the ones left to survive will hopefully learn from their mistakes but pumping more money into the system,kicking the can farther down the road and allowing people to profit while underwriting their risks just does not seem fair to the taxpayers and consumers to me. There is no easy and painless solution to a problem that has been in the making for decades;imho.

No, there is no painless solution. Who should suffer? The homeowner who loses his/her home, the banks whose greed is, imho, the proximate cause AND the ultimate cause of the housing meltdown, or should the pain be shared?

Had the Federal Reserve not had such artificially low interest rates, it is my opinion that the housing bubble would have never happened; a lot of those mortgages would have never taken place had interest rates been say 10% instead of 4%, I see a lot of homeowners who didn't mind seeing their home values doubling,tripling and quadrupling in value in just a few years time yet now that their values are plummeting, they seem to want to blame the mean old banker, I think both are at fault as far as greed goes but it took the Fed. to foster that greed, it's like a kindergarten teacher bringing a bunch of cokes, Sugar Daddies and Baby Ruths to class and then blaming the kids for having a sugar rush, sure, the kids ate it yet who fostered that outcome, the same with the Fed., the same with Wall Street, the same with a lot of problems that we have, it is these unintended consequences brought about BY Government intervention ,then; after the damage is done; there is no easy fix or way out of it.

 

[Wry Catcher]

Cut spending. I mean seriously cut it. Consolidate the government. There is no reason we need all these agencies. It's too big and I am sure we are duplicating countless efforts.

This is just ridiculous.

How will laying off 10,000, a 100,000 or more employees help the situation? More homes forclosed, more children homeless, less goods and services purchased and more small business failing.
Posting cliches and talking points seems to be the norm around here, considering the consequences less so.

 

[johnrocks]

Just a thought. With housing prices depressed and with forclosures increasing the possibility of "The Market" redistributing the wealth becomes all too real. Instead of the American dream once realized, Americans will again be renters as the investment class corners the market on residential housing, earning income on rents and saving money on taxes as they depreciate their assets while they allow it to degrade.
What will the banks do with all the property they now 'own'? Unwilling to loan, or willing to loan only to those who have 25-30% down, we may see the large national banks become the 'slum lords' of the future.

Housing values plummeting is a symptom or result ; not the cause; of what has been wrong for years , a monetary policy of inflating the bubbles, allowing them to fall means that they will be affordable for a new generation of first time home buyers, we need to suffer the ill effects brought about by this market manipulation by government, allow values to fall, burn off the malinvestments and have a stronger economic foundation for all of us, my thoughts on it anyway.

Do you want your children living in a community of empty homes? Homes rented and not owned? Homes not maintained by absentee owners? Is that the future?

It's not what I want but that is sadly what is happening where the hosing bubble took place, we didn't have an explosion of growth here so we're not seeing a depressed market like many areas are.

 

[Oddball]

Cut spending. I mean seriously cut it. Consolidate the government. There is no reason we need all these agencies. It's too big and I am sure we are duplicating countless efforts.

This is just ridiculous.

How will laying off 10,000, a 100,000 or more employees help the situation? More homes forclosed, more children homeless, less goods and services purchased and more small business failing.

The same way that pulling leeches off of you would increase blood flow to the rest of your body...Because it would free up hundreds of billions of dollars, which would otherwise be wasted on do-nothing bureaucrats, to be used by industry in profitable pursuits. Thereby, most probably spurring enough economic development, to the point that those former pencil pilot bureaucrats would then have opportunities to participate in real productive employment.

Posting cliches and talking points seems to be the norm around here, considering the consequences less so.

You are, without question, the least introspective poster on this entire suffering forum.

 

[Wry Catcher]

Cut spending. I mean seriously cut it. Consolidate the government. There is no reason we need all these agencies. It's too big and I am sure we are duplicating countless efforts.

This is just ridiculous.

How will laying off 10,000, a 100,000 or more employees help the situation? More homes forclosed, more children homeless, less goods and services purchased and more small business failing.

The same way that pulling leeches off of you would increase blood flow to the rest of your body...Because it would free up hundreds of billions of dollars, which would otherwise be wasted on do-nothing bureaucrats, to be used by industry in profitable pursuits. Thereby, most probably spurring enough economic development, to the point that those former pencil pilot bureaucrats would then have opportunities to participate in real productive employment.

Posting cliches and talking points seems to be the norm around here, considering the consequences less so.

You are, without question, the least introspective poster on this entire suffering forum.

Maybe I need hynotherapy. Is that covered by medicare?

 

[Oddball]

What you need is to take a good look in the mirror, before blundering into accusing others of the behaviors at which you yourself excel.

But I ain't holding my breath.

 

[Wry Catcher]

What you need is to take a good look in the mirror, before blundering into accusing others of the behaviors at which you yourself excel.

But I ain't holding my breath.

I'm feeling sleepy, very sleepy...

 

[Flopper]

Now there is the paradox that government intervention and the greed fostered by this intervention created, what to do, should we bail them out,should we chance on the entire mortgage /banking sector colasping or what, I think we could have a civil and honest discussion there, I tend to think, let the chips fall where they may, other investors will come in and buy at these fire sales and the ones left to survive will hopefully learn from their mistakes but pumping more money into the system,kicking the can farther down the road and allowing people to profit while underwriting their risks just does not seem fair to the taxpayers and consumers to me. There is no easy and painless solution to a problem that has been in the making for decades;imho.

No, there is no painless solution. Who should suffer? The homeowner who loses his/her home, the banks whose greed is, imho, the proximate cause AND the ultimate cause of the housing meltdown, or should the pain be shared?

Had the Federal Reserve not had such artificially low interest rates, it is my opinion that the housing bubble would have never happened; a lot of those mortgages would have never taken place had interest rates been say 10% instead of 4%, I see a lot of homeowners who didn't mind seeing their home values doubling,tripling and quadrupling in value in just a few years time yet now that their values are plummeting, they seem to want to blame the mean old banker, I think both are at fault as far as greed goes but it took the Fed. to foster that greed, it's like a kindergarten teacher bringing a bunch of cokes, Sugar Daddies and Baby Ruths to class and then blaming the kids for having a sugar rush, sure, the kids ate it yet who fostered that outcome, the same with the Fed., the same with Wall Street, the same with a lot of problems that we have, it is these unintended consequences brought about BY Government intervention ,then; after the damage is done; there is no easy fix or way out of it.

You make a good point. If interest rates were not low, then we would not have had the giant housing bubble. But also consider that if interest rates were not low, we would not have had the business expansion we had.

What many seem to ignore is that the economy is cyclic. There will be periods of expansion followed by contraction. The longer and steeper the rise, the longer and steeper the fall. The government can only influences the economy. It doesn't control it. Interest rate changes, job programs, government spending, and taxes all influence the economy. However, economists can never agree on just how much influence they have.

 

[Rozman]

Ask a Lib what would help the economy the answer surely would be......
Tax the hell out of the evil rich.
Tax the hell out of the evil oil companies.
Tax the hell out of the evil corporations.
Tax the hell out of the evil rich,oh wait we did that.
Spend the hell out of all that new tax revenue on well......... let's just spend it, it's who we are.

 

[NYcarbineer]

So,

currently 47% of households pay no income tax.

if the Republicans answer is more tax cuts, and they get their way, what's the result?

57% of households pay no income tax? 67%? 77%?

How high does number have to go before the Pences of the world are happy?

 

[Yurt]

so the dem answer is to tax and spend....got it

 

[Flopper]

So,

currently 47% of households pay no income tax.

if the Republicans answer is more tax cuts, and they get their way, what's the result?

57% of households pay no income tax? 67%? 77%?

How high does number have to go before the Pences of the world are happy?

If Republicans get control of the House, they will not propose tax cuts and the Democrats certainly will not. I not sure what the purpose is in discussing this, since it just ain't gonna happen.

 

[johnrocks]

No, there is no painless solution. Who should suffer? The homeowner who loses his/her home, the banks whose greed is, imho, the proximate cause AND the ultimate cause of the housing meltdown, or should the pain be shared?

Had the Federal Reserve not had such artificially low interest rates, it is my opinion that the housing bubble would have never happened; a lot of those mortgages would have never taken place had interest rates been say 10% instead of 4%, I see a lot of homeowners who didn't mind seeing their home values doubling,tripling and quadrupling in value in just a few years time yet now that their values are plummeting, they seem to want to blame the mean old banker, I think both are at fault as far as greed goes but it took the Fed. to foster that greed, it's like a kindergarten teacher bringing a bunch of cokes, Sugar Daddies and Baby Ruths to class and then blaming the kids for having a sugar rush, sure, the kids ate it yet who fostered that outcome, the same with the Fed., the same with Wall Street, the same with a lot of problems that we have, it is these unintended consequences brought about BY Government intervention ,then; after the damage is done; there is no easy fix or way out of it.

You make a good point. If interest rates were not low, then we would not have had the giant housing bubble. But also consider that if interest rates were not low, we would not have had the business expansion we had.

What many seem to ignore is that the economy is cyclic. There will be periods of expansion followed by contraction. The longer and steeper the rise, the longer and steeper the fall. The government can only influences the economy. It doesn't control it. Interest rate changes, job programs, government spending, and taxes all influence the economy. However, economists can never agree on just how much influence they have.

The expansion was too large and could not be sustained though, had government not been so involved, a contraction may very well had taken place years ago before the bubbles got so huge to begin with.
All true and government influence can and does have unintended consequences.

 

[Mr. Shaman]

January 27, 2011​

"Rich Americans are not only shopping again. They're showing off their purchases, despite an economy that still leaves millions of people jobless and underemployed.

"It's not polite to flaunt money when your friends are out of work," says Erika Maschmeyer, an analyst of retail stocks at Robert W. Baird in Chicago. Now, though, "we're far enough away from the disaster of 2008. We're back to normal fashion cycles."

While the U.S. unemployment rate remains high at 9.4 percent, the past two years have benefited Americans who primarily rely on income from investments rather than their jobs. The broad Standard & Poor's 500 stock index is up 61 percent since its March 2009 low and now trades above its level before the collapse of Lehman Brothers."

Here​

​