What gives the State the right to ban guns in church?

[xsited1]

Colorado shootings by same gunman, police say; security guard credited with saving lives

Colorado shootings by same gunman, police say; security guard credited with saving lives
Steven Saint, Reuters
Published: Tuesday, December 11, 2007
COLORADO SPRINGS, Colorado -- A 24-year-old Denver-area man was responsible for weekend shootings at both a Colorado evangelical Christian church and a missionary training center that killed four people, police said on Monday.

Police said Matthew Murray had ties to the Christian missionary training center in Arvada, where he killed two young missionaries with a handgun shortly after midnight, and apparently bore a grudge there.


Security guard Jean Assam, a volunteer, saved many lives at the church, New Life senior pastor Brady Boyd told a televised news conference on Monday. "She's a real hero," he said. There were about 7,000 people in the building when the shooting erupted.

"I heard shots fired. There was chaos. The shots were so loud, I thought he was inside. I saw him coming through the doors," Assam told reporters.

Assam said she then took cover, identified herself to the gunman and "I took him down." She credited God for her survival because of "the firepower he had compared to what I had."

Assam has a law enforcement background but had never fired on a suspect while working as a police officer.

The guy had over a thousand rounds on him.

enough said.

Good post. I guess that's all that needs to be said.

 

[Zoom-boing]

At my brother's yesterday, my niece said that a woman she works with came into the office last week showing off her new gun. I only caught a bit of the story but they were all upset because she bought it in to show people. They were all OMG, OMG I can't believe she did that, that's terrible! I asked 'was she a loon, going to shoot someone?'. No, she was just showing it. I asked 'did she have a permit, was it a registered gun?'. Yes. I asked 'was it loaded?' No. Apparently she was excited and wanted to share. I don't know why they were all OMGing. No one else seemed to share my viewpoint.

 

[Peejay]

At my brother's yesterday, my niece said that a woman she works with came into the office last week showing off her new gun. I only caught a bit of the story but they were all upset because she bought it in to show people. They were all OMG, OMG I can't believe she did that, that's terrible! I asked 'was she a loon, going to shoot someone?'. No, she was just showing it. I asked 'did she have a permit, was it a registered gun?'. Yes. I asked 'was it loaded?' No. Apparently she was excited and wanted to share. I don't know why they were all OMGing. No one else seemed to share my viewpoint.

And this is what gives gun control folks the ammuniton they need: idiots with guns. A gun is not a toy. It is not something you show off to your friends. It is not an object of admiration. It is not something to brag about or be overjoyed and giddy that you just got a new one and just must show it to the folks at the office. This is the kind of person and kind of non chalant attitude that gets kids killed. When a kid sees a person behaving this way, they will emulate. They too will be excited and giddy about guns. They will want to show it off. They will make a mistake and put an extra hole in someone.

Guns are to be treated with respect. The range is the place to show your gun. A gun shop, the hunt club a show designated for such. Your office? No one in your office should ever know you even have a gun until the day, God forbid, you have to produce it and use it. Same goes for your church, your hardware store, etc.

I'm not for gun control. I'm for idiot control. Find this woman and take that gun away from her before she gets someone killed.

 

[xsited1]

At my brother's yesterday, my niece said that a woman she works with came into the office last week showing off her new gun. I only caught a bit of the story but they were all upset because she bought it in to show people. They were all OMG, OMG I can't believe she did that, that's terrible! I asked 'was she a loon, going to shoot someone?'. No, she was just showing it. I asked 'did she have a permit, was it a registered gun?'. Yes. I asked 'was it loaded?' No. Apparently she was excited and wanted to share. I don't know why they were all OMGing. No one else seemed to share my viewpoint.

That's one advantage of living in a Southern State. If you bring a gun in, everybody wants to check it out. I brought a target in one day and half the people in the office wanted to know what kind of gun I used, how far away from the target I was, which shooting range I went to, and when I was going back.

BTW, we've got some serious Libtards in Arkansas. Here's one:

On Monday, February 16, Arkansas Times blogger Max Brantley, jeopardized the privacy rights of every person with a concealed carry permit in Arkansas by publishing a complete list of permit holders in the Razorback State.

The link to the list was later removed after some protest but on Tuesday, February 24, an anonymous website was created that allows the visitor to search for any Right-to-Carry permit holder in the state. Both of these sources have been removed at the time of this posting, but this remains a threat for all gun owners in Arkansas.

In response to this abuse, State Representative Randy Stewart (D-23) has introduced House Bill 1623, legislation that would prohibit outlets or individuals from publishing records in the future that open gun owners up to identity theft and persecution for their Second Amendment rights. Currently, HB 1623 is in the House Judiciary Committee where a hearing has yet to be scheduled.

Arkansas Right-to-Carry Confidentiality Bill Needs Your Help! - TheHighRoad.US

Here's the idiot who published the list:



ARRA News Service: "Mad" Max Brantley No Friend of Gun Owners

 

[Againsheila]

Do Christians feel that firearms are appropriate in a House of God where men come to stand side by side and worship together? Should it not be a place that the love of God would give them protection and guns would be unnecessary?

It should, but we live in an age when people enter churches and start shooting, when people on these very boards want to lock people inside their churches and burn them. Why should people in churches be less safe than people in their homes?

 

[Zoom-boing]

At my brother's yesterday, my niece said that a woman she works with came into the office last week showing off her new gun. I only caught a bit of the story but they were all upset because she bought it in to show people. They were all OMG, OMG I can't believe she did that, that's terrible! I asked 'was she a loon, going to shoot someone?'. No, she was just showing it. I asked 'did she have a permit, was it a registered gun?'. Yes. I asked 'was it loaded?' No. Apparently she was excited and wanted to share. I don't know why they were all OMGing. No one else seemed to share my viewpoint.

And this is what gives gun control folks the ammuniton they need: idiots with guns. A gun is not a toy. It is not something you show off to your friends. It is not an object of admiration. It is not something to brag about or be overjoyed and giddy that you just got a new one and just must show it to the folks at the office. This is the kind of person and kind of non chalant attitude that gets kids killed. When a kid sees a person behaving this way, they will emulate. They too will be excited and giddy about guns. They will want to show it off. They will make a mistake and put an extra hole in someone.

Guns are to be treated with respect. The range is the place to show your gun. A gun shop, the hunt club a show designated for such. Your office? No one in your office should ever know you even have a gun until the day, God forbid, you have to produce it and use it. Same goes for your church, your hardware store, etc.

I'm not for gun control. I'm for idiot control. Find this woman and take that gun away from her before she gets someone killed.

How is she an idiot? It wasn't loaded, she wasn't a loon, she wasn't giddy, there were no kids in the office and she was handling the gun with respect. She showed it to people and put it away and everyone was all OMG!! I wonder if they would still feel the same way if a real loon had entered the office with a gun and she was able to defend.

 

[Peejay]

At my brother's yesterday, my niece said that a woman she works with came into the office last week showing off her new gun. I only caught a bit of the story but they were all upset because she bought it in to show people. They were all OMG, OMG I can't believe she did that, that's terrible! I asked 'was she a loon, going to shoot someone?'. No, she was just showing it. I asked 'did she have a permit, was it a registered gun?'. Yes. I asked 'was it loaded?' No. Apparently she was excited and wanted to share. I don't know why they were all OMGing. No one else seemed to share my viewpoint.

That's one advantage of living in a Southern State. If you bring a gun in, everybody wants to check it out. I brought a target in one day and half the people in the office wanted to know what kind of gun I used, how far away from the target I was, which shooting range I went to, and when I was going back.

And that is a problem. I was raised with guns and smart gun folks. Houses full of guns. They were observed as tools of hunting and defense. They didn't come out for show and tell sessions. There was protocol for even bringing a weapon out of it's place, hoe it was handled and complete sense of the lethal nature of the weapon, it's purpose and where and when it was to be used. As kids, we were in houses full of guns but our fathers never sat around showing off guns and we were instructed from a very early age that these guns were not to be toyed with. We hunted with them, we went to the range, we shot skeet. The guns went from the case, to use and back.

This flippant attitude about guns is a problem. If you expect to keep them and not face regulation, I suggest we concentrate on treating them for what they are. Not a fad, a trend, a status symbol. Again, if responsible people want to keep their guns, THEY are the ones that had better get a handle on these fools and start promoting the respect and responsibilty that comes with a weapon. If they don't the other people who fear guns will have their say about it.

[

 

[Zoom-boing]

At my brother's yesterday, my niece said that a woman she works with came into the office last week showing off her new gun. I only caught a bit of the story but they were all upset because she bought it in to show people. They were all OMG, OMG I can't believe she did that, that's terrible! I asked 'was she a loon, going to shoot someone?'. No, she was just showing it. I asked 'did she have a permit, was it a registered gun?'. Yes. I asked 'was it loaded?' No. Apparently she was excited and wanted to share. I don't know why they were all OMGing. No one else seemed to share my viewpoint.

That's one advantage of living in a Southern State. If you bring a gun in, everybody wants to check it out. I brought a target in one day and half the people in the office wanted to know what kind of gun I used, how far away from the target I was, which shooting range I went to, and when I was going back.

I live in the NE but I'd be one of the ones wanting to check it out.

Where is the rationalization that the bad guys have guns but the good guys shouldn't?

 

[Againsheila]

Whoever feels the need to bring a gun into a church, especially during services, has some serious paranoid issues. It just goes to show you how backwards thinking those that live by "god and guns" are, (and they usually live in the South, hmmmm where marrying your second cousin is legal).

Did you read the post where Huffy says he wants to lock Christians in their churches and burn them? You know, just cause you're paranoid doesn't mean nobody is after you.

 

[Peejay]

At my brother's yesterday, my niece said that a woman she works with came into the office last week showing off her new gun. I only caught a bit of the story but they were all upset because she bought it in to show people. They were all OMG, OMG I can't believe she did that, that's terrible! I asked 'was she a loon, going to shoot someone?'. No, she was just showing it. I asked 'did she have a permit, was it a registered gun?'. Yes. I asked 'was it loaded?' No. Apparently she was excited and wanted to share. I don't know why they were all OMGing. No one else seemed to share my viewpoint.

And this is what gives gun control folks the ammuniton they need: idiots with guns. A gun is not a toy. It is not something you show off to your friends. It is not an object of admiration. It is not something to brag about or be overjoyed and giddy that you just got a new one and just must show it to the folks at the office. This is the kind of person and kind of non chalant attitude that gets kids killed. When a kid sees a person behaving this way, they will emulate. They too will be excited and giddy about guns. They will want to show it off. They will make a mistake and put an extra hole in someone.

Guns are to be treated with respect. The range is the place to show your gun. A gun shop, the hunt club a show designated for such. Your office? No one in your office should ever know you even have a gun until the day, God forbid, you have to produce it and use it. Same goes for your church, your hardware store, etc.

I'm not for gun control. I'm for idiot control. Find this woman and take that gun away from her before she gets someone killed.

How is she an idiot? It wasn't loaded, she wasn't a loon, she wasn't giddy, there were no kids in the office and she was handling the gun with respect. She showed it to people and put it away and everyone was all OMG!! I wonder if they would still feel the same way if a real loon had entered the office with a gun and she was able to defend.

Let me explain a little concept to you: THERE IS NO SUCH THING AS AN UNLOAED GUN.

If you don't know that, you are as big a part of the problem as this lady and shouldn't own either.

There are some very basic rules about guns that are not difficult to grasp. Somehow, somewhere, they have been lost on many people. It's not guns. It's people who do not have any business with them.

 

[necritan]

At my brother's yesterday, my niece said that a woman she works with came into the office last week showing off her new gun. I only caught a bit of the story but they were all upset because she bought it in to show people. They were all OMG, OMG I can't believe she did that, that's terrible! I asked 'was she a loon, going to shoot someone?'. No, she was just showing it. I asked 'did she have a permit, was it a registered gun?'. Yes. I asked 'was it loaded?' No. Apparently she was excited and wanted to share. I don't know why they were all OMGing. No one else seemed to share my viewpoint.

And this is what gives gun control folks the ammuniton they need: idiots with guns. A gun is not a toy. It is not something you show off to your friends. It is not an object of admiration. It is not something to brag about or be overjoyed and giddy that you just got a new one and just must show it to the folks at the office. This is the kind of person and kind of non chalant attitude that gets kids killed. When a kid sees a person behaving this way, they will emulate. They too will be excited and giddy about guns. They will want to show it off. They will make a mistake and put an extra hole in someone.

Guns are to be treated with respect. The range is the place to show your gun. A gun shop, the hunt club a show designated for such. Your office? No one in your office should ever know you even have a gun until the day, God forbid, you have to produce it and use it. Same goes for your church, your hardware store, etc.

I'm not for gun control. I'm for idiot control. Find this woman and take that gun away from her before she gets someone killed.

How does admiring a gun make kids die???

 

[Peejay]

At my brother's yesterday, my niece said that a woman she works with came into the office last week showing off her new gun. I only caught a bit of the story but they were all upset because she bought it in to show people. They were all OMG, OMG I can't believe she did that, that's terrible! I asked 'was she a loon, going to shoot someone?'. No, she was just showing it. I asked 'did she have a permit, was it a registered gun?'. Yes. I asked 'was it loaded?' No. Apparently she was excited and wanted to share. I don't know why they were all OMGing. No one else seemed to share my viewpoint.

And this is what gives gun control folks the ammuniton they need: idiots with guns. A gun is not a toy. It is not something you show off to your friends. It is not an object of admiration. It is not something to brag about or be overjoyed and giddy that you just got a new one and just must show it to the folks at the office. This is the kind of person and kind of non chalant attitude that gets kids killed. When a kid sees a person behaving this way, they will emulate. They too will be excited and giddy about guns. They will want to show it off. They will make a mistake and put an extra hole in someone.

Guns are to be treated with respect. The range is the place to show your gun. A gun shop, the hunt club a show designated for such. Your office? No one in your office should ever know you even have a gun until the day, God forbid, you have to produce it and use it. Same goes for your church, your hardware store, etc.

I'm not for gun control. I'm for idiot control. Find this woman and take that gun away from her before she gets someone killed.

How does admiring a gun make kids die???

It's all about attitude. I know a couple of kids that learned to admire guns. They pulled one out of their grandfathers night stand and one accidentally blew a hole in the others head. You don't admire. You respect. It is a weapon. It is not a piece of art.

 

[AnnECUCherry]

Arkansas is a fine state. Little Rock is one of my favorite towns. Reminds me a lot of Raleigh, NC. Even in town, the people have a rural vibe. NC is moderate like Arkansas too. Comparing NC / SC is like apples and oranges. SC is very red and very conservative. Not anywhere near the industry, research and progressiveness of NC. Jim Hunt really made a huge difference for NC, over four terms as Governor. Improved education by leaps and bounds, provided incentives for new industry, research and pharmacueticals, instead of sitting around and waiting for textiles and furniture to die. That's pretty much what SC has done and is still doing. Crying about the loss of textiles but doing little in the way of progressing to new industry. I think they are just getting the idea that the textiles ARE NOT COMING BACK.

But guns? Shit, we got guns. NC is open carry, despite the fact it is a progressive state. Jessecrats are a pretty cool breed. SC is not open carry. You are forced to conceal your weapon when you travel. When you hit the state line, you have to pull over and unlock the trunk or glove box and put the gun out on the seat before you continue into NC. I don't know if you can carry gun into church or not. I don't know how much of an issue it is. We do have plenty of gun accidents though.

But when I weigh the issues, it comes down to the fact that at some point, nuts with guns may be all that stands between me and my government. I don't like jack ass cops or nuts with guns but they both serve a valuable purpose. Same reason I don't kill snakes.

For about three years now, NC has allowed concealed carry with permit and non-residents can carry concealed if they have a valid concealed carry permit issued by their home state. Obtaining the permit requires completion of specific concealed carry training.

The Biblical Recorder weighed in on this issue:

"...According to a spokesman for the Department of Law Enforcement in the North Carolina Department of Justice, North Carolina’s concealed weapons policy allows permit holders to carry a concealed weapon into places of worship if the pastor does not object; if there is no sign posted that prohibits such weapons and if there is no school on the premises.

...Our gun culture is costly in terms of both lives and treasure. Firearm-related deaths and injuries with their related legal and societal costs, drain an estimated $100 billion each year, the legal center estimates.


Do you feel safer with a handgun in the house? If you have a gun, how do you keep children, grandchildren, or neighbor kids from finding it and having a tragic accident?


Do you feel safer or less safe knowing that in North Carolina it is legal to carry a concealed weapon into your church service? If you feel less safe do whatever you must to get your pastor to express his disapproval, and to post signs at your entries prohibiting weapons in your sanctuary.
Biblical Recorder - Arkansas beats NC in gun savvy

The Biblical Recorder is the news publication of the NC State Baptist Convention.

 

[AnnECUCherry]

At my brother's yesterday, my niece said that a woman she works with came into the office last week showing off her new gun. I only caught a bit of the story but they were all upset because she bought it in to show people. They were all OMG, OMG I can't believe she did that, that's terrible! I asked 'was she a loon, going to shoot someone?'. No, she was just showing it. I asked 'did she have a permit, was it a registered gun?'. Yes. I asked 'was it loaded?' No. Apparently she was excited and wanted to share. I don't know why they were all OMGing. No one else seemed to share my viewpoint.

That's one advantage of living in a Southern State. If you bring a gun in, everybody wants to check it out. I brought a target in one day and half the people in the office wanted to know what kind of gun I used, how far away from the target I was, which shooting range I went to, and when I was going back.

BTW, we've got some serious Libtards in Arkansas. Here's one:

On Monday, February 16, Arkansas Times blogger Max Brantley, jeopardized the privacy rights of every person with a concealed carry permit in Arkansas by publishing a complete list of permit holders in the Razorback State.

The link to the list was later removed after some protest but on Tuesday, February 24, an anonymous website was created that allows the visitor to search for any Right-to-Carry permit holder in the state. Both of these sources have been removed at the time of this posting, but this remains a threat for all gun owners in Arkansas.

In response to this abuse, State Representative Randy Stewart (D-23) has introduced House Bill 1623, legislation that would prohibit outlets or individuals from publishing records in the future that open gun owners up to identity theft and persecution for their Second Amendment rights. Currently, HB 1623 is in the House Judiciary Committee where a hearing has yet to be scheduled.

Arkansas Right-to-Carry Confidentiality Bill Needs Your Help! - TheHighRoad.US

Here's the idiot who published the list:

View attachment 7253

ARRA News Service: "Mad" Max Brantley No Friend of Gun Owners

I don't know about other states, but in NC gun permits are public records. Obtaining a permit conveys no expectation of privacy.

However, several years ago when state press associations tested the public information law, reporters discovered that not all agencies, notably law enforcement, were willing to comply.

RALEIGH, N.C. — Expect rejection one-third of the time when you request a North Carolina city or county public record and a higher refusal rate by police agencies, which often violate citizens' rights by asking who wants the record and why.

In an unprecedented test of North Carolina's public records-access law, the North Carolina Press Association and the North Carolina Associated Press News Council sent reporters to agencies in 89 counties to request public information from May 3-7. Newspapers in the state's other 11 counties chose not to participate in the survey.

Reporters from 49 newspapers presented themselves as average citizens, as the law says they may do, at police and sheriff's departments, county health offices, city and town finance offices and school district headquarters.

Seven types of documents were sought: crime logs and crime incident reports, concealed-pistol permit applications, coaches' salaries, restaurant sanitation ratings, and expense reports for mayors and town managers. All are public records under state law, meaning the public is supposed to be able to view and copy them upon request.

Compliance ranged from 52% to 67% for six records. Attempts to obtain the seventh —the pistol permit applications — failed in all but two instances, often because the applications also contained private information and sheriffs wrongly thought that placed them off-limits.

Denials and hostility spiked at police agencies when reporters invoked their legal right to anonymity when seeking public information. Police often pressured them to reveal their names, whom they worked for and why they wanted to see the public record....

freedomforum.org: Survey finds haphazard compliance with N.C. public-records law

 

[Peejay]

Cherry, I think you may be confusing "concealed carry" with "open carry".

SC and NC have concealed carry laws that allowed permitted owners to carry a "concealed" weapon. However, SC is not an "open carry" state while NC is an "open carry" state. This means that anyone may carry a weapon that is not concealed. A pistol, strapped to your hip, in plain view, is leagal to carry, for anyone, in NC. Not SC. You do not need any permit or registration to "open carry" in NC, as there is no madatory gun registration in NC.

 

[AnnECUCherry]

Cherry, I think you may be confusing "concealed carry" with "open carry".

SC and NC have concealed carry laws that allowed permitted owners to carry a "concealed" weapon. However, SC is not an "open carry" state while NC is an "open carry" state. This means that anyone may carry a weapon that is not concealed. A pistol, strapped to your hip, in plain view, is leagal to carry, for anyone, in NC. Not SC. You do not need any permit or registration to "open carry" in NC, as there is no madatory gun registration in NC.

You're right. I'm confusing permits to purchase with registration.

We do have a law prohibiting "going armed to the terror of the public"! But no registration. Household goods aren't required to be listed when filing property taxes, either.

 

[Nelsonexe]

Typical Liberal attitude. They think that if guns are not allowed there nobody will bring one in. Tell that to Knoxville TN,Salt Lake City UT, and the latest on in Illinois. Lot of good gun restrictions did there.

 

[AnnECUCherry]

Typical Liberal attitude. They think that if guns are not allowed there nobody will bring one in. Tell that to Knoxville TN,Salt Lake City UT, and the latest on in Illinois. Lot of good gun restrictions did there.

I don't think that "liberals," or anybody else, think that "if guns are not allowed ... nobody will bring one in."

Most laws that restrict something are intended as deterrents, not fail safe mechanisms.

 

[Zoom-boing]

Typical Liberal attitude. They think that if guns are not allowed there nobody will bring one in. Tell that to Knoxville TN,Salt Lake City UT, and the latest on in Illinois. Lot of good gun restrictions did there.

I don't think that "liberals," or anybody else, think that "if guns are not allowed ... nobody will bring one in."

Most laws that restrict something are intended as deterrents, not fail safe mechanisms.

Again, where's the rationalization that the bad guys have guns - cause they do - but the good guys should be 'restricted', making it harder to defend themselves?

 

[xsited1]

At my brother's yesterday, my niece said that a woman she works with came into the office last week showing off her new gun. I only caught a bit of the story but they were all upset because she bought it in to show people. They were all OMG, OMG I can't believe she did that, that's terrible! I asked 'was she a loon, going to shoot someone?'. No, she was just showing it. I asked 'did she have a permit, was it a registered gun?'. Yes. I asked 'was it loaded?' No. Apparently she was excited and wanted to share. I don't know why they were all OMGing. No one else seemed to share my viewpoint.

That's one advantage of living in a Southern State. If you bring a gun in, everybody wants to check it out. I brought a target in one day and half the people in the office wanted to know what kind of gun I used, how far away from the target I was, which shooting range I went to, and when I was going back.

And that is a problem. I was raised with guns and smart gun folks. Houses full of guns. They were observed as tools of hunting and defense. They didn't come out for show and tell sessions. There was protocol for even bringing a weapon out of it's place, hoe it was handled and complete sense of the lethal nature of the weapon, it's purpose and where and when it was to be used. As kids, we were in houses full of guns but our fathers never sat around showing off guns and we were instructed from a very early age that these guns were not to be toyed with. We hunted with them, we went to the range, we shot skeet. The guns went from the case, to use and back.

This flippant attitude about guns is a problem. If you expect to keep them and not face regulation, I suggest we concentrate on treating them for what they are. Not a fad, a trend, a status symbol. Again, if responsible people want to keep their guns, THEY are the ones that had better get a handle on these fools and start promoting the respect and responsibilty that comes with a weapon. If they don't the other people who fear guns will have their say about it.

[

Problem? Flippant attitude? You make a lot of assumptions and they are all wrong. Everyone I know has used a gun since they were very young and are well versed in handling and safety. It goes without saying that it is not a toy. Everyone who wants to look at the gun first makes sure that it is unloaded. It's important to get the right weapon for your needs and that is the main reason we share stories. I guess in your world there are a lot of people who see guns as a toy and have that 'flippant attitude' you speak of. Not in my world.