What Does One Want Anyhow?

[Detmurds]

This is the big question that drives every debate in our political world! Many are crying for the right to live (free everything), and others just want to keep what they earn when they get "paid" for the work they have done! Really,...are many just asking for the handout?,.....or the opportunity to make a good living?......Welcome to the USA where one has the chance to do both,..."for now!" Free to live a "normal" life? , or Free to get wealth? What do you want?

I know, same story, but from a different angle.

 

[midcan5]

On the egotistic side, I want to live a long time, retire, and drive the country slowly, visiting places we have missed, lots of small towns, and backroads. On the other hand, I want to see my kids and their kids grow up healthy and live long past when I am dust. Money has never been relevant to me although the wife thinks differently.

 

[Detmurds]

On the egotistic side, I want to live a long time, retire, and drive the country slowly, visiting places we have missed, lots of small towns, and backroads. On the other hand, I want to see my kids and their kids grow up healthy and live long past when I am dust. Money has never been relevant to me although the wife thinks differently.

So, what do you want,..government control, or to be in control of yourself?

Can anyone even name a U.S. program, that is/was ran in a Socialist manner that has had great success? Please, don't say Social Security,..because it's doomed to fail here in the near future.

The answer is: the US Military!

 

[mattskramer]

So, what do you want,..government control, or to be in control of yourself?

Can anyone even name a U.S. program, that is/was ran in a Socialist manner that has had great success? Please, don't say Social Security,..because it's doomed to fail here in the near future.

The answer is: the US Military!

http://www.cjnetworks.com/~cubsfan/libgood.html

The following are relatively socialistic programs that I think were met with relative success. I think that America is better off on account of them – all things considered:

Interstate Highway System
era: 1950's-present
Proposed by Roosevelt and erected by Eisenhower (a Republican), the Interstate system was a big government project. As much as anything else in the post WWII era, the Interstate is responsible for tremendous economic growth, prosperity, and has spawned an entire culture.

GI Bill
era: 1950's
This act of Congress enabled millions upon millions of Americans to get college educations, something that most Americans had never had the opportunity to do previously. An entire generation of leaders, scientists, and business people owe their education to the GI Bill.

Labor Laws
era: 1930's-present
An end to child labor, 40 hour work weeks, the right of employees to collectively bargain, overtime pay, workplace safety, all of the things we take for granted today are thanks to liberal laws passed in the first half of this century. It was the conservatives who fought tooth and nail against the end of sweatshops and exploitation.

Marshall Plan
era: late 1940's-1950's
Foreign aid is a popular scapegoat these days. Those who would cut it should look back at the Marshall Plan, which rebuilt Europe, and is the major reason that Communism never made it past East Berlin.

Environmental Laws
era: 1970's-present
The environment has gotten much better in the last 30 years thanks to liberals. Bald Eagles fly once again thanks to endangered species laws, most rivers and lakes are clean again due to anti-pollution laws, and frequent smog days are a thing of the past in most big American cities.

Food safety laws
era: 1910's-present
Ever read Sinclair's "The Jungle?" That's what things were really like before food purity laws were on the books. Today cases of food poisoning are rare, and consumers know that whatever they buy is safe to eat.

Workplace safety laws
era: 1930's-present
Long hours in unsafe conditions are much rarer today than in the past. Tragedies such as the Triangle Shirtwaist fire and child labor have been eliminated by liberal and progressive legislation.

Space Program
era: 1950's-present
It was Kennedy who challenged us to make it to the moon, and it is under his and Johnson's administrations that the space program took off, with numerous benefits to American industry and peoples' standard of living, not to mention national pride. If you are reading this on a computer, thank the space program and the liberals who got it going.

Peace corps
era: 1960's-present
Kennedy inspired thousands of Americans to ask what they could do for their country, and the Peace Corps is his most visible and effective legacy

Civil rights movement
era: 1950's-present
Liberal ideals drove the biggest change in American society since the Civil War, the civil rights movement of the 1950s and 1960s. All Americans who believe in freedom and opportunity cannot help but be inspired by the valiant struggles of MLK and others. Also recall if you will that the major opponents of civil rights were conservatives.

The Internet
era: 1960's-present
Not a liberal program per se, but rather a government one, which many equate as the same thing. The internet is a good example of what a government program can do when allowed to work.

National Weather Service
era: 1930's-present
This is one of those things you never think about, but you are glad its there. Far from just forecasting the weather, the NWS also provides vital data to pilots and sailors, and the NWS satellites and observation posts provide the raw data that all other weather forecasting services (private ones too!) depend on.

Scientific Research
era: 1940's-present
Much of the great discoveries in science have come about through grants from the government. This is not to say that scientific genius depends on Washington, but the fact remains that pure science is expensive, and private industry will often not fund experiments which don't have a direct commercial potential. From Salk's polio vaccine to todays Human Genome Project and Hubble Space Telescope, the government is an important partner in scientific discovery.

Product Labeling/Truth in Advertising Laws
era: 1910's-present
"We take it for granted that if a claim is made publicly for a product, it's reasonable to assume it's true. Plus, every time we check the ingredients on a can or package of food, we should mentally call down blessings on the liberals who passed the necessary legislation over the anguished howls of the conservatives, who were convinced such info would be prohibitively expensive, and too big a burden on business."

Public Health
era: 1910's-present
Government funded water and sewage systems are an important part of modernity. In addition, organizations such as the National Institute of Health and the Center for Disease Control play an important part in maintaining the national health and preventing epidemics through research, vaccination programs, etc.

Bank Deposit Insurance
era: 1930's-present day
About 1934, as part of extensive New Deal banking legislation, Congress created the Federal Deposit Insurance Corporation (FDIC) to provide federal insurance for bank deposits.Ê This was instrumental in restoring confidence in our nation's banks, and remains so to this day.

Centers for Disease Control and Prevention
era: 1940's-present day
The world's foremost authority and defense against infectious disease and epidemic is a department of the United States government.

Consumer Product Safety Commission
era: 1972-present day
These guys regulate consumer products for safety. Everything from sharp (and edible) baby toys to flammable pjamas have been taken off the market due to the work of this commission.

 

[indago]

"I believe that that policy is best for this country which brings prosperity first to those who toil; give them first the inspiration to work and then protect them in the enjoyment of their rightful share of the proceeds of their toil, and their prosperity will find its way up to the other class of society which rests upon them. I challenge you to find in the pages of recorded history a single instance where prosperity came from the upper crust of society; it always comes from the masses, - - - the foundation of society." — Congressman William Jennings Bryan 1896

 

[midcan5]

So, what do you want,..government control, or to be in control of yourself?

I don't think that question is relevant for most of us in America. We are free and government control is hopefully beneficent. The tougher question is how do we (?) confer that feeling of simple freedom to others in the US and even abroad? Live and let live, do unto others....

 

[Larkinn]

So, what do you want,..government control, or to be in control of yourself?

Neither. I'd like a mix. I don't want the government to decide what I have for breakfast, or what I say, but I don't really want to be responsible for building the GW bridge either.

 

[AllieBaba]

And yet it's the socialist countries that have the biggest problems, and who are generally violators of human rights.

It's great that we had an end to child labor...but unions were nothing more than gangs and thugs.

A heightened awareness of our environment is great...but environmentalists are responsible for arson and untold environmental damage, done in the name of ill-conceived programs which have to be reversed down the road.

And public health is great..but not to the exclusion of private health. Just ask a Canadian who can't get treated in his own country.

 

[Diuretic]

And yet it's the socialist countries that have the biggest problems, and who are generally violators of human rights.

It's great that we had an end to child labor...but unions were nothing more than gangs and thugs.

A heightened awareness of our environment is great...but environmentalists are responsible for arson and untold environmental damage, done in the name of ill-conceived programs which have to be reversed down the road.

And public health is great..but not to the exclusion of private health. Just ask a Canadian who can't get treated in his own country.

Well that was a lot of generalised tosh there Allie. Care to cite some examples??

 

[eots]

I don't think that question is relevant for most of us in America. We are free and government control is hopefully beneficent. The tougher question is how do we (?) confer that feeling of simple freedom to others in the US and even abroad? Live and let live, do unto others....

well lets see ...we can use a terrorist incident to put new limits on our personal freedom, we can have a decider instead of a president we can use the controlled media to release false news story's and press conferences ,we can demonize free speech "lets us never tolerate outrages conspiracy theory on the events of 911 " and brand family's first responders looking for real answers , label men like Ron Paul as being in bed with islamOfacsist..then we can export these freedoms by invading other country's all based on lies and kill there children

"I'm concerned with what's happening in this world. I'm concerned with the structure. I'm concerned with the systems of control. Those that control my life, and those that seek to control it EVEN MORE! I want FREEDOM! That's what I want, and that's what YOU should want !! "

 

[Detmurds]

Folks, I am talking about programs that effect many, or all Americans, and paid for by all in taxes...not the space program, or laws.

(Yes, I know we pay for the space program, but does it really effect a good number of the U.S. population?)

Social Security, Hillary's proposed National Health Care Program is the kind of stuff I am speaking of.

I want less federal government, and more power to each state in the country.

When a government taxes at high rates, they have your money, and when they have your money, they are in control of you.

 

[Gunny]

Folks, I am talking about programs that effect many, or all Americans, and paid for by all in taxes...not the space program, or laws.

(Yes, I know we pay for the space program, but does it really effect a good number of the U.S. population?)

Social Security, Hillary's proposed National Health Care Program is the kind of stuff I am speaking of.

I want less federal government, and more power to each state in the country.

When a government taxes at high rates, they have your money, and when they have your money, they are in control of you.[/QUOTE]

Amen to that. I'll take as little control as possible, please.

I'd also like to comment on a statement you made previously ...

IMO, the military is not a socialist program. It is totalitarian with class privileges.

 

[Shogun]

I WANNA ROOCK!

I WANT. TO. ROCK!

sorry. I had to.

 

[Detmurds]

Folks, I am talking about programs that effect many, or all Americans, and paid for by all in taxes...not the space program, or laws.

(Yes, I know we pay for the space program, but does it really effect a good number of the U.S. population?)

Social Security, Hillary's proposed National Health Care Program is the kind of stuff I am speaking of.

I want less federal government, and more power to each state in the country.

When a government taxes at high rates, they have your money, and when they have your money, they are in control of you.[/QUOTE]

Amen to that. I'll take as little control as possible, please.

I'd also like to comment on a statement you made previously ...

IMO, the military is not a socialist program. It is totalitarian with class privileges.

I know, but I meant in how the military supplies everything for the active duty (medical, food, shelter, different rules than the rest of society, and even entertainment).

 

[mattskramer]

I know, but I meant in how the military supplies everything for the active duty (medical, food, shelter, different rules than the rest of society, and even entertainment).

Your signature line says that you worked for the military. I don’t know what your duties entailed but I don’t think that enough is done for the common soldier. I once heard that some soldiers are paid so little that their families qualify for food stamps. I have a lot of respect for those people, who sign their names on the line, not knowing where they will be sent and what life-threatening dangers they will face.

I think that practically everything should be considered in moderation. Some programs “for the common good” would be better managed by the public sector than by the private sector. Some needs may be better handled by the private sector. As it is with personal liberties, the question is not whether or not to draw the line, but where to draw the line.

Again, as far as my tax money going to pay for a soldier’s health insurance and health care, food, and even some entertainment, I have no objections what so ever.

 

[eots]

I WANNA ROOCK!

I WANT. TO. ROCK!

sorry. I had to.

he has the same doo as your shougun !

 

[Shogun]

Sho'Nuff!

 

[eots]

I have to thank you ..you make me laugh and break into a deesnideresq
shit eating grin

 

[Shogun]

Ill be here all week!

Be sure to tip your waitstaff!

 

[Detmurds]

Your signature line says that you worked for the military. I don’t know what your duties entailed but I don’t think that enough is done for the common soldier. I once heard that some soldiers are paid so little that their families qualify for food stamps. I have a lot of respect for those people, who sign their names on the line, not knowing where they will be sent and what life-threatening dangers they will face.

I think that practically everything should be considered in moderation. Some programs “for the common good” would be better managed by the public sector than by the private sector. Some needs may be better handled by the private sector. As it is with personal liberties, the question is not whether or not to draw the line, but where to draw the line.

Again, as far as my tax money going to pay for a soldier’s health insurance and health care, food, and even some entertainment, I have no objections what so ever.

The pay is actually pretty darn good if you think about it, even for a recruit out of boot camp! What I mean is,...with free housing, and food, one does not really have to spend a cent of thier earnings. Now, if one has a family, they get more allowances. (Some branches won't even enlist people who already have families to care for) With more time in the service, I will tell you the pay is much better, and I thank "Mother Navy" for taking care of me. The military takes care of each other better than any business out there does for thier people.

I also appreciate your non-objections! Thanks!