What Do They See In America?

[C_Clayton_Jones]

Yes, people wait in line years to come here. Some never get to come here. Why do you think just because you sneak across the border you should be granted rights that we didn't give to LEGAL immigrants?

How do you justify denying them due process under American refuge and asylum laws, as long as those laws are on the books?

You deny due to the fallacy of their claims. They are being told what to say, so that they are at least allowed to stay until their claims are checked out.
This is a new trick, that literally anyone from south of our borders could easily claim, since virtually every country once you get away from the tourist areas are vile dirty corrupt pig pens.

They also know that there is a sizeable percentage of the population here like you who are gullible bleeding hearts that fall for any hard luck story.

Your ignorance and hate have gotten you confused.

Allowing them “to stay until their claims are checked out” is due process.

Due process means they're allowed to apply for refugee/asylee status.

Due process means those claims are reviewed and verified in accordance with immigration law.

And due process means that they're entitled to a hearing before a judge to ensure DHS has followed the law, and when their request to remain as a refugee or asylee is denied, the court will authorize their deportation.

This is why most conservatives are wrong on the issue, the government may not 'assume' someone is 'illegal' and deport him absent due process, to seek to do so is a violation of the 14th Amendment.

This is a very wise and appropriate doctrine, keeping with the original intent of the 14th Amendment, were we do not want politicians and bureaucrats deciding who is or is not a citizen, or who will or will not be afforded his due process rights.

 

[Unkotare]

It's likely she'll get cancer and die a terrible death.

Don't be ridiculous.

Read up on Fukishima.

Don't need to, I know all about it. The only areas as dire as you suggest are in the very immediate vicinity of the reactors, and no one is allowed entry to those areas (except emergency crews) let alone 'forced' to live there. You're greatly exaggerating, likely through no fault of your own.

 

[C_Clayton_Jones]

Frankly, you complained about how long it took to become a citizen here, I can only deduce from that fact that you want the rules relaxed or completely done away with. If you can prove otherwise, let's hear it.

No I didn't. I was talking about coming to the country legally. People wait in line to become legal permanent residents. They don't just automatically become citizens. I do not advocate granting anyone that wants citizenship instant citizenship. In order to become a citizen, you generally have to be a permanent resident for 5 years.
http://www.uscis.gov/sites/default/files/USCIS/Resources/B3en.pdf

I despise voluntaryism. It is a form of anarchism I will not abide by.

Cool. Totally irrelevant though.

Yes, people wait in line years to come here. Some never get to come here. Why do you think just because you sneak across the border you should be granted rights that we didn't give to LEGAL immigrants?

This makes no sense.

No one's rights are 'granted.'

The right to due process is fundamental and inalienable, rights can be neither taken nor bestowed by any government, constitution, or man; due process is a right afforded to all persons in the United States in accordance with the 14th Amendment:

The Fourteenth Amendment provides that "[n]o State shall . . . deprive any person of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws." (Emphasis added.) Appellants argue at the outset that undocumented aliens, because of their immigration status, are not "persons within the jurisdiction" of the State of Texas, and that they therefore have no right to the equal protection of Texas law. We reject this argument. Whatever his status under the immigration laws, an alien is surely a "person" in any ordinary sense of that term. Aliens, even aliens whose presence in this country is unlawful, have long been recognized as "persons" guaranteed due process of law by the Fifth and Fourteenth Amendments. Shaughnessy v. Mezei, 345 U.S. 206, 212 (1953); Wong Wing v. United States, 163 U.S. 228, 238 (1896); Yick Wo v. Hopkins, 118 U.S. 356, 369 (1886). Indeed, we have clearly held that the Fifth Amendment protects aliens whose presence in this country is unlawful from invidious discrimination by the Federal Government. Mathews v. Diaz, 426 U.S. 67, 77 (1976). 9

FindLaw | Cases and Codes

 

[DigitalDrifter]

How do you justify denying them due process under American refuge and asylum laws, as long as those laws are on the books?

You deny due to the fallacy of their claims. They are being told what to say, so that they are at least allowed to stay until their claims are checked out.
This is a new trick, that literally anyone from south of our borders could easily claim, since virtually every country once you get away from the tourist areas are vile dirty corrupt pig pens.

They also know that there is a sizeable percentage of the population here like you who are gullible bleeding hearts that fall for any hard luck story.

Your ignorance and hate have gotten you confused.

Allowing them “to stay until their claims are checked out” is due process.

Due process means they're allowed to apply for refugee/asylee status.

Due process means those claims are reviewed and verified in accordance with immigration law.

And due process means that they're entitled to a hearing before a judge to ensure DHS has followed the law, and when their request to remain as a refugee or asylee is denied, the court will authorize their deportation.

This is why most conservatives are wrong on the issue, the government may not 'assume' someone is 'illegal' and deport him absent due process, to seek to do so is a violation of the 14th Amendment.

This is a very wise and appropriate doctrine, keeping with the original intent of the 14th Amendment, were we do not want politicians and bureaucrats deciding who is or is not a citizen, or who will or will not be afforded his due process rights.

They'll get their "due process" and in the meantime you ******* bleeding hearts will be working day and night to prove they should be given refugee status whether there is a true need or not. We know how you feel about borders, so don't pretend the constitution is the reason they deserve their day in court. You would allow anyone in anyway, regardless of where they come from, and the whether they are suppressed or not.

What we should demand is strong borders, where children of all people cannot simply walk in with no regard to our laws. This whole ordeal should at least demonstrate to Americans how weak our border security is.
Also this is a complete slap in the face to the people that do the right thing and show respect by trying to become a citizen the legal way.

 

[Againsheila]

How do you justify denying them due process under American refuge and asylum laws, as long as those laws are on the books?

You deny due to the fallacy of their claims. They are being told what to say, so that they are at least allowed to stay until their claims are checked out.
This is a new trick, that literally anyone from south of our borders could easily claim, since virtually every country once you get away from the tourist areas are vile dirty corrupt pig pens.

They also know that there is a sizeable percentage of the population here like you who are gullible bleeding hearts that fall for any hard luck story.

Your ignorance and hate have gotten you confused.

Allowing them “to stay until their claims are checked out” is due process.

Due process means they're allowed to apply for refugee/asylee status.

Due process means those claims are reviewed and verified in accordance with immigration law.

And due process means that they're entitled to a hearing before a judge to ensure DHS has followed the law, and when their request to remain as a refugee or asylee is denied, the court will authorize their deportation.

This is why most conservatives are wrong on the issue, the government may not 'assume' someone is 'illegal' and deport him absent due process, to seek to do so is a violation of the 14th Amendment.

This is a very wise and appropriate doctrine, keeping with the original intent of the 14th Amendment, were we do not want politicians and bureaucrats deciding who is or is not a citizen, or who will or will not be afforded his due process rights.

The government never hears them. They give them an appointment and then let them lose and they never return.

 

[NYcarbineer]

Yes, people wait in line years to come here. Some never get to come here. Why do you think just because you sneak across the border you should be granted rights that we didn't give to LEGAL immigrants?

How do you justify denying them due process under American refuge and asylum laws, as long as those laws are on the books?

You deny due to the fallacy of their claims. They are being told what to say, so that they are at least allowed to stay until their claims are checked out.
This is a new trick, that literally anyone from south of our borders could easily claim, since virtually every country once you get away from the tourist areas are vile dirty corrupt pig pens.

They also know that there is a sizeable percentage of the population here like you who are gullible bleeding hearts that fall for any hard luck story.

Why are you lying about what I believe?

 

[TemplarKormac]

Strawman. I said get here legally, not be granted citizenship.

Ad hominem.

Frankly, you complained about how long it took to become a citizen here, I can only deduce from that fact that you want the rules relaxed or completely done away with. If you can prove otherwise, let's hear it.

No I didn't. I was talking about coming to the country legally. People wait in line to become legal permanent residents. They don't just automatically become citizens. I do not advocate granting anyone that wants citizenship instant citizenship. In order to become a citizen, you generally have to be a permanent resident for 5 years.
http://www.uscis.gov/sites/default/files/USCIS/Resources/B3en.pdf

I despise voluntaryism. It is a form of anarchism I will not abide by.

Cool. Totally irrelevant though.

You said and I quote "It takes 20 years to get here legally" Either you were stating useless information or you were pointing out the lengthiness of the naturalization process either as a negative or as a means to an end. I could construe it no other way.

I was talking about coming to the country legally. People wait in line to become legal permanent residents. They don't just automatically become citizens. I do not advocate granting anyone that wants citizenship instant citizenship. In order to become a citizen, you generally have to be a permanent resident for 5 years

That's not what you implied in your earlier statement. I quote:

"It could take up to 20 years for them to get here legally. In that time the U.S. war on drugs may have already killed them."

So, I can only deduce you want the rules relaxed or the process sped up. Is there anything else you wish to backtrack from, my friend?

 

[NoTeaPartyPleez]

Those here who have lived under extreme poverty, threat of violence by drug cartels, lost a relative or loved one to aforementioned violence and DID NOT take the opportunity to change and save yourself and your children, let those CAST THE FIRST ******* STONE.

It's always....always Amateur Hour on this board with the sheer myopic assessments of those who don't know a goddamn thing about living anywhere outside American borders. Just go collectively **** yourselves.

 

[Againsheila]

Those here who have lived under extreme poverty, threat of violence by drug cartels, lost a relative or loved one to aforementioned violence and DID NOT take the opportunity to change and save yourself and your children, let those CAST THE FIRST ******* STONE.

It's always....always Amateur Hour on this board with the sheer myopic assessments of those who don't know a goddamn thing about living anywhere outside American borders. Just go collectively **** yourselves.

Have you seen what's happening in Detroit and Chicago? Shouldn't we be taking care of our own FIRST?

Oh, and FYI, I lived in Mexico for awhile. My Senora's biggest complaint was that she couldn't get a maid because they all went to my country to work because they made more money. Not that they didn't have jobs, or were starving, they wanted more money. Well, don't we all?

 

[NoTeaPartyPleez]

Those here who have lived under extreme poverty, threat of violence by drug cartels, lost a relative or loved one to aforementioned violence and DID NOT take the opportunity to change and save yourself and your children, let those CAST THE FIRST ******* STONE.

It's always....always Amateur Hour on this board with the sheer myopic assessments of those who don't know a goddamn thing about living anywhere outside American borders. Just go collectively **** yourselves.

Have you seen what's happening in Detroit and Chicago? Shouldn't we be taking care of our own FIRST?

Oh, and FYI, I lived in Mexico for awhile. My Senora's biggest complaint was that she couldn't get a maid because they all went to my country to work because they made more money. Not that they didn't have jobs, or were starving, they wanted more money. Well, don't we all?

I lived in the Frontera/Baja near La Paz, and where I was there were no senoras with maid problems, so I will let you off easy here.

Yes, we should take care of Detroit, too. We could do that if we simply stopped sending $3,000,000,000 to Israel every year. And $1,500,000,000 to Egypt. And so on.

 

[Unkotare]

It's always....always Amateur Hour on this board with the sheer myopic assessments of those who don't know a goddamn thing about living anywhere outside American borders. Just go collectively **** yourselves.

Cut the self-indulgent, pretentious crap. It adds nothing to any discussion of the topic.

 

[Unkotare]

Yes, we should take care of Detroit, too. We could do that if we simply stopped sending $3,000,000,000 to Israel every year. And $1,500,000,000 to Egypt. And so on.

Go cook your red herring somewhere else.

 

[NYcarbineer]

Yes, people wait in line years to come here. Some never get to come here. Why do you think just because you sneak across the border you should be granted rights that we didn't give to LEGAL immigrants?

How do you justify denying them due process under American refuge and asylum laws, as long as those laws are on the books?

Read the paragraph above yours. THAT's how I justify it. Why do you think someone who sneaks across our border deserves more than those that come here legally or those who are denied entry? WHY? My family took in a couple who fled Hungary after the communists took over. We were living in England at the time and my father, career Air Force, couldn't get our friends into this country. They lived their lives out in Canada. How is that fair? My brother tried for 20 years to get his mother in law here from Thailand, just to visit and was denied. How is it fair for someone to sneak across our border to get to stay? It's not. It's a slap in the fact to every LEGAL immigrant in this country and much worse to those who were denied entry and didn't come here illegally.

I wasn't aware that denying due process was justifiable.

 

[Againsheila]

How do you justify denying them due process under American refuge and asylum laws, as long as those laws are on the books?

Read the paragraph above yours. THAT's how I justify it. Why do you think someone who sneaks across our border deserves more than those that come here legally or those who are denied entry? WHY? My family took in a couple who fled Hungary after the communists took over. We were living in England at the time and my father, career Air Force, couldn't get our friends into this country. They lived their lives out in Canada. How is that fair? My brother tried for 20 years to get his mother in law here from Thailand, just to visit and was denied. How is it fair for someone to sneak across our border to get to stay? It's not. It's a slap in the fact to every LEGAL immigrant in this country and much worse to those who were denied entry and didn't come here illegally.

I wasn't aware that denying due process was justifiable.

Actually, we should just deny them entry. If we protected our borders, this wouldn't be a problem, they'd still be on the OTHER side.

 

[Tank]

Pretty soon there won't be much difference between Mexico and America

 

[Skull Pilot]

What illegal immigrants see in the us:

 

[ShackledNation]

Frankly, you complained about how long it took to become a citizen here, I can only deduce from that fact that you want the rules relaxed or completely done away with. If you can prove otherwise, let's hear it.

No I didn't. I was talking about coming to the country legally. People wait in line to become legal permanent residents. They don't just automatically become citizens. I do not advocate granting anyone that wants citizenship instant citizenship. In order to become a citizen, you generally have to be a permanent resident for 5 years.
http://www.uscis.gov/sites/default/files/USCIS/Resources/B3en.pdf

Cool. Totally irrelevant though.

You said and I quote "It takes 20 years to get here legally" Either you were stating useless information or you were pointing out the lengthiness of the naturalization process either as a negative or as a means to an end. I could construe it no other way.

Saying you despise voluntarism is irrelevant to my point that taking 20 years to get here legally is a negative. Hence why I quoted you saying you despise voluntarism, and pointed that out.

I was talking about coming to the country legally. People wait in line to become legal permanent residents. They don't just automatically become citizens. I do not advocate granting anyone that wants citizenship instant citizenship. In order to become a citizen, you generally have to be a permanent resident for 5 years

That's not what you implied in your earlier statement. I quote:

"It could take up to 20 years for them to get here legally. In that time the U.S. war on drugs may have already killed them."

So, I can only deduce you want the rules relaxed or the process sped up. Is there anything else you wish to backtrack from, my friend?

[/quote]
You do realize there is a difference between coming to the U.S. legally and being granted citizenship, do you not? I was complaining about the former, not the latter as you wrongly assumed. What I said has been completely consistent all a long. Please quote when I said it takes too long for them to become citizens.

 

[Friends]

I just thought of something. Is it because America is exceptional that those immigrants are coming here in the first place? So, what do they see in America that Obama doesn't? It's sad that foreigners and illegal aliens have more pride in America that the President does right now. Frankly, they see more promise in this nation than Obama does.

Think about that one, long and hard.

The people who immigrate to the United States come to the United States from poor countries. Those who come from China and India usually bring high IQ's and good educations. The rest are fleeing poverty and crime in their own countries.

There is not an influx of Europeans fleeing the presumed horrors of democratic socialism. Europeans tend to see the United States as a violent, vulgar uncouth country, run for the rich with the support of a white proletariat and peasantry that is too stupid, too ignorant, and too bigoted to understand that by voting Republican they are voting against their economic interests.

 

[Stephanie]

What Do They See In America?

What they see in America is what you and most others on the right fear and despise: diversity, dissent, and the right to individual liberty.

really, only the "right" fear that huh?
Is that because the "left" is so much more Enlightened, superior human beings?
sheeesh

 

[Againsheila]

I just thought of something. Is it because America is exceptional that those immigrants are coming here in the first place? So, what do they see in America that Obama doesn't? It's sad that foreigners and illegal aliens have more pride in America that the President does right now. Frankly, they see more promise in this nation than Obama does.

Think about that one, long and hard.

The people who immigrate to the United States come to the United States from poor countries. Those who come from China and India usually bring high IQ's and good educations. The rest are fleeing poverty and crime in their own countries.

There is not an influx of Europeans fleeing the presumed horrors of democratic socialism. Europeans tend to see the United States as a violent, vulgar uncouth country, run for the rich with the support of a white proletariat and peasantry that is too stupid, too ignorant, and too bigoted to understand that by voting Republican they are voting against their economic interests.

A lot of Europeans want to come here, but they can't. It's almost impossible for a European to come here unless they marry an American citizen. That's thanks to Teddy Kennedy's changes in the immigration law in the 60's. In fact, most of our problems with immigration today can be traced directly to Teddy and his immigration bill which made it easy for people from 3rd world countries to come here while simultaneously making it almost impossible for people from first world nations to come here.