Wall Street suspects Goldman charges 'not coincidental' to financial reform effort

[Tom Clancy]

How about we just quit bailing out corporations and partnerships with Taxpayer Money?

That is in the Obama bill.

The bill makes it illegal to bail them out again.

BTW people this investigation was not timed to coincide with the push to fix the regulations.

If anything Obamas put this aside to do other things first and had an idea when these investigations might come to fruitation.

That is not illegal its smart politics.

The ****?

What do you think the Stimulus bill was intended for?

 

[Truthmatters]

link

 

[Truthmatters]

How about we just quit bailing out corporations and partnerships with Taxpayer Money?

That is in the Obama bill.

The bill makes it illegal to bail them out again.

BTW people this investigation was not timed to coincide with the push to fix the regulations.

If anything Obamas put this aside to do other things first and had an idea when these investigations might come to fruitation.

That is not illegal its smart politics.

The ****?

What do you think the Stimulus bill was intended for?

The stimulus has northing to do with this

 

[Oddball]

How about we just quit bailing out corporations and partnerships with Taxpayer Money?

That is in the Obama bill.

The bill makes it illegal to bail them out again.

BTW people this investigation was not timed to coincide with the push to fix the regulations.

If anything Obamas put this aside to do other things first and had an idea when these investigations might come to fruitation.

That is not illegal its smart politics.

Only the totally gullible would buy that crap...Which 'splains a lot.

The bill will make bailout nation a permanent part of Treasury function.

 

[Toro]

Markets work best when more people have information. The more information people have, the better decisions people generally make. You learn in the first class of econ 101 that the perfectly efficient market is the one where all information is known and everyone is a price taker. The less information people have and the more market power there is, the less efficient the market becomes and the more economic rent that is captured by people with asymmetric information.

One of the best things governments can do is to facilitate the flow of information to end-users. Governments which legislate the flow of information are decidedly pro-market.

Some extreme free market ideologues argue that everyone has perfect information, or almost perfect information, as it is in the best interests of those to release information into the market. Thus, government should not get involved. But this is flat out wrong. Insiders have every incentive to withhold information because information is power, and insiders profit from keeping information to themselves.

This is a big reason why Wall Street profits from the derivatives trade, and why they are fighting tooth and nail to stop this legislation. They make a staggering amount of money. Derivatives traders can make $10 million a year or more. Jamie Dimon said that if derivatives went to the exchanges, it would cost JP Morgan $3 billion a year. That's just one company! This is money that is being extracted from the market - you, me, everyone who isn't an insider.

 

[boedicca]

The ****?

What do you think the Stimulus bill was intended for?

TM won't give you the correct answer, so I'll provide it:

The Stimulus bill was designed to provide additional transfer payments and subsidies for State and Local Public Union employees - pay-offs to core the core Democrat base. 60%+ of it hasn't been spent yet; it's a war chest for Barry & Co. to spread around more wealth right before the 2010 election.

 

[Oddball]

Markets work best when more people have information. The more information people have, the better decisions people generally make. You learn in the first class of econ 101 that the perfectly efficient market is the one where all information is known and everyone is a price taker. The less information people have and the more market power there is, the less efficient the market becomes and the more economic rent that is captured by people with asymmetric information.

One of the best things governments can do is to facilitate the flow of information to end-users. Extreme free market ideologues argue that everyone has perfect information, or almost perfect information, as it is in the best interests of those to release information into the market. Thus, government should not get involved. But this is flat out wrong. Insiders have every incentive to withhold information because information is power, and insiders profit from keeping information to themselves.

This is a big reason why Wall Street profits from the derivatives trade, and why they are fighting tooth and nail to stop this legislation. They make a staggering amount of money. Derivatives traders can make $10 million a year or more. Jamie Dimon said that if derivatives went to the exchanges, it would cost JP Morgan $3 billion a year. That's just one company! This is money that is being extracted from the market - you, me, everyone who isn't an insider.

I'm all for that.

But the federal gubmint specializes in misinformation, disinformation, obstruction, obfuscation, bribery and sweetheart insider deals.

The LAST thing those crooks need is any more power and control.

 

[boedicca]

link

I call Shenanigans.

You posted what you claim is in the bill without providing a link.

So you first, dearie.

(I know I can provide my source data - let's see if you can do the same.)

 

[saveliberty]

If anyone thinks this is a coincidence, I've got some great swampland to sell you. Did Obama hire Karl Rove?

Having said that, I support much of the new bill.

Oh, c'mon...Have you actually seen the bill?

In any case, if the Marxocrats remain true to form, there will be at least one completely unrelated power grab (i.e. nationalizing of student loans) stuffed into that incomprehensible legislative Frankenstein's monster-to-be.

Much of it.

I'm sure there is some stupid stuff in there but it will increase the regulation and transparency of the derivatives market. Derivatives will be put on the same footing as stocks, bonds, futures, options, commodities, etc. Why anyone would argue that there should be less transparency in any market - particularly those who believe in the free market - is beyond me, let alone in a $700 trillion market which contributed to the financial crisis. You know, apart from those who massively profit from opaqueness and controlling information and the market at the expense of everyone else.

I'm agreeing with Toro and Truthmatters in the same day. It is a mad mad world. Derivatives were being abused and need more guidance through rules and regulation. The market works best when it is most transparent to what is occurring. Those who champion a free economy need to consider this. This is incremental change and should not be a move to control the markets in a socialist sense.

 

[Toro]

Markets work best when more people have information. The more information people have, the better decisions people generally make. You learn in the first class of econ 101 that the perfectly efficient market is the one where all information is known and everyone is a price taker. The less information people have and the more market power there is, the less efficient the market becomes and the more economic rent that is captured by people with asymmetric information.

One of the best things governments can do is to facilitate the flow of information to end-users. Extreme free market ideologues argue that everyone has perfect information, or almost perfect information, as it is in the best interests of those to release information into the market. Thus, government should not get involved. But this is flat out wrong. Insiders have every incentive to withhold information because information is power, and insiders profit from keeping information to themselves.

This is a big reason why Wall Street profits from the derivatives trade, and why they are fighting tooth and nail to stop this legislation. They make a staggering amount of money. Derivatives traders can make $10 million a year or more. Jamie Dimon said that if derivatives went to the exchanges, it would cost JP Morgan $3 billion a year. That's just one company! This is money that is being extracted from the market - you, me, everyone who isn't an insider.

I'm all for that.

But the federal gubmint specializes in misinformation, disinformation, obstruction, obfuscation, bribery and sweetheart insider deals.

The LAST thing those crooks need is any more power and control.

Perhaps but the Federal government has little to do with corporate governance. The articles of incorporation are written at the state level. The state with the highest number large incorporated companies is Delaware, which is not only very friendly to corporations, it is friendly to managements since it is more difficult to bring legal actions in Delaware.

The SEC affects governance because it regulates the exchanges. Companies that want to trade on the exchanges must abide by the rules on the exchange, including governance. Carl Icahn's proposals, which are good ideas, are being opposed by many companies because they threaten managements ability to pay themselves. People have to separate out agency problems, meaning managements will do what is best for themselves before they will do what is best for shareholders. Many managements are good but many are not.

 

[boedicca]

Perhaps but the Federal government has little to do with corporate governance. The articles of incorporation are written at the state level. The state with the highest number large incorporated companies is Delaware, which is not only very friendly to corporations, it is friendly to managements since it is more difficult to bring legal actions in Delaware.

The SEC affects governance because it regulates the exchanges. Companies that want to trade on the exchanges must abide by the rules on the exchange, including governance. Carl Icahn's proposals, which are good ideas, are being opposed by many companies because they threaten managements ability to pay themselves. People have to separate out agency problems, meaning managements will do what is best for themselves before they will do what is best for shareholders. Many managements are good but many are not.

That's pretty typical anti-business pablum.

Most companies incorporate in Delaware because it is far cheaper from a filing and compliance standpoint - and litigation is handled by a judge instead of in a jury trial.

 

[AllieBaba]

Wall Street suspects Goldman charges 'not coincidental' to financial reform effort

Legit move by Barry, or wag the dog for another of his 'takeovers' of the private sector...you decide.

Wag the dog.

Nothing that Barry's merry band of Marxist goons does is designed to do anything but cripple the private sector.

Have you noticed that there has been a pattern whenever Barry wants major changes?

First stories are flaoted to the media months in advance (that is when we heard wall street would be a target) they the justice department makes arrests or files charges (just happened with Goldman) followed by Barry saying MAJOR changes are need to avert disaster?

Another example of this is the attacks on free speech, first the department of homeland security floats that 'right wing extremist groups' are THE major threat (While ignoring islamic extremists, who actually have set up camps in the USA), then we see arrests (the Huteree militia in this case) followed in this case by Bill Clinton claiming there are 'links' to the oklamahoma bomber, talk radio and the protests movements against reckless spending and overtaxation, and that something 'has to be done.'

All the while they ignore the damage their own reckless spending did to the economy the last year or the fact they have done nothing to get people back to work, (of course they claimed they did with 'stimulous' but only obamatrons believe that lie at this point).

Yup, yup, yup.

 

[Ravi]

So...we have those that are for transparency suddenly against it because the Obama administration is about to make it happen.

Fascinating.

 

[georgephillip]

The biggest problem that capitalists in the FIRE sector (Finance, Insurance, Real estate) face in their class war to maximize property prices and volume of debt relative to what labor and industry can afford to pay is political.

Far more debtors make their way to the voting booth than do creditors.

Bribes to politicians in the form of campaign contributions are the principle balancing factor, and governments are "privatized," turning democracies into oligarchies.

As de-industrialization becomes synonymous with financialization, voters are conned into believing they are getting rich when actually they are being painted into a debt corner along with their employers, local government, and the federal government too.

"For a while the bad-debt overhead can be bailed out by creating yet more debt, backed by public guarantees in what even The Wall Street Journal acknowledges is 'socialism for the rich,' that is, privatizing the profits and socializing the losses.

"But when has government been anything else, for thousands of years before anyone coined the term "socialism?"

 

[Oddball]

So...we have those that are for transparency suddenly against it because the Obama administration is about to make it happen.

Fascinating.

Yeah, right....The most opaque and obfuscating empire since, well, the last opaque and obfuscating empire, is suddenly now going to be all about transparency.

Rube.

 

[Ravi]

So...we have those that are for transparency suddenly against it because the Obama administration is about to make it happen.

Fascinating.

Yeah, right....The most opaque and obfuscating empire since, well, the last opaque and obfuscating empire, is suddenly now going to be all about transparency.

Rube.

Strawman.

 

[CrusaderFrank]

Will they investigate Timmy Geithner role in helping Goldman during the AIG meltdown?

Who did the Fed lend $2 Trillion to off books?

 

[Oddball]

So...we have those that are for transparency suddenly against it because the Obama administration is about to make it happen.

Fascinating.

Yeah, right....The most opaque and obfuscating empire since, well, the last opaque and obfuscating empire, is suddenly now going to be all about transparency.

Rube.

Strawman.

Strawman nothing.

You're jumping up and down with glee that there's suddenly going to be transparency, from a bunch of goombahs who haven't yet been transparent, other than for the fact that those who will look can see right through them.

And you're still a rube.

 

[Toro]

That's pretty typical anti-business pablum.

Dude, don't be an idiot. I've analyzed hundreds and hundreds of companies in my career and help manage a multi-billion portfolio of investments.

Most companies incorporate in Delaware because it is far cheaper from a filing and compliance standpoint - and litigation is handled by a judge instead of in a jury trial.

They also file in Delaware because it is easier to enact anti-shareholder bylaws, such as staggered boards, poison pills, etc.

 

[Ravi]

Yeah, right....The most opaque and obfuscating empire since, well, the last opaque and obfuscating empire, is suddenly now going to be all about transparency.

Rube.

Strawman.

Strawman nothing.

You're jumping up and down with glee that there's suddenly going to be transparency, from a bunch of goombahs who haven't yet been transparent, other than for the fact that those who will look can see right through them.

And you're still a rube.

Yet another strawman.

Making this bit of the banking system transparent corrects a lot of stupidity...and in fact it is possible the economy wouldn't have crashed with this sort of transparency.

But since Obama's administration came up with it, in your eyes it is BAD.

Hack.