VICTOR DAVIS HANSON: Kurdish, Syrian, and Turkish Ironies

[The Purge]

Outrage met Donald Trump’s supposedly rash decision to pull back U.S. troops from possible confrontational zones between our Kurdish friends in Syria and Recep Erdogan’s expeditionary forces.

Turkey claims that it will punish the Syrian Kurds for a variety of supposed provocations, including aiding and abetting Kurdish terrorist separatists inside Turkey. But what they say they can so easily do and what they really can do inside Syria are, of course, two different things.

~~skip~~

Otherwise, our presence in the firing line could raise the specter that we’d either refuse our Article V (collective defense) commitments to Turkey that Erdogan might cynically invoke in a larger war in Syria, or we’d find ourselves actually killing Turks to save Kurds. Either of these scenarios is theoretically quite possible, and both would be far more injurious to the spirit and cohesion of the presently composed NATO alliance than asking Germany and its followers to pony up the contributions that they had long promised.

As I understand the present outrage, the logic goes like this: It is a sellout to leave the Kurds vulnerable to the Turks, and it undermines our noble promises and our credibility in a way that ignoring our ignoble, legal commitments to Turkey do not. That may be a legitimate assumption that we all would like to embrace, but it is not yet the policy of the United States.

~~skip~~

Any current critics calling for the use of American trip-wire soldiers to protect Kurds from the Turkish military — in the current stated mission to defeat ISIS and keep it defeated — should at least make the case that de facto fighting against Turkey means that it is therefore no longer a friend and should no longer be a NATO ally, and thus, in extremis, can be opposed militarily...

(Excerpt) Read more at nationalreview.com ..

McConnel and the rest of the gopE in congress have been undermining Trump since before he was sworn in. They are no different then the dems. They just have the cowardly luxury of sitting back and letting the dems do the heavy lifting.

 

[kyzr]

Exactly right. Trump was right to get US troops away from Turkey's invasion.
US troops are not to be used to defend Syria's border, period, full-stop.
Having US troops in harms-way in Syria is moronic.

 

[Lesh]

VDH is a total nutjob

 

[flack]

It wasn't as big a deal as people were making it. 28 troops.

 

[gipper]

Truly amazing the uproar over moving out 50 soldiers. What a joke our government and media have become.

Sadly, too many Americans are easily duped.

 

[Lesh]

you can lie or minimize the numbers of troops removed...but what you can't do is lie about the EFFECT that removing them was a Kurdish invasion that will re-empower ISIS and screw our Kurdish allies

It will also destabilize the ME

And why?

To "bring home" 28 troops? Newsflash...not even THAT happened. They were re positioned...they're still there. No troops were brought home and thousands more were sent to Saudi Arabia

 

[beagle9]

Truly amazing the uproar over moving out 50 soldiers. What a joke our government and media have become.

Sadly, too many Americans are easily duped.

Just remember "anything and/or anyway" to get Trump, and get him weakened down in sight of the American voter is their ultimate plan and goal. They don't care about the troops, they just use them as political weapons when need them against their political foe.

 

[JustAGuy1]

you can lie or minimize the numbers of troops removed...but what you can't do is lie about the EFFECT that removing them was a Kurdish invasion that will re-empower ISIS and screw our Kurdish allies

It will also destabilize the ME

And why?

To "bring home" 28 troops? Newsflash...not even THAT happened. They were re positioned...they're still there. No troops were brought home and thousands more were sent to Saudi Arabia

Then what are you whining about?

 

[beagle9]

you can lie or minimize the numbers of troops removed...but what you can't do is lie about the EFFECT that removing them was a Kurdish invasion that will re-empower ISIS and screw our Kurdish allies

It will also destabilize the ME

And why?

To "bring home" 28 troops? Newsflash...not even THAT happened. They were re positioned...they're still there. No troops were brought home and thousands more were sent to Saudi Arabia

Ok repositioned then... Even better as long as they are out of harm's way, and not being used for political reasons.

 

[JustAGuy1]

VDH is a total nutjob

Of course he is, just ask you. The truth is that he is a highly educated rational, reasonable men. You just don't like the truth that he writes.

 

[occupied]

Truly amazing the uproar over moving out 50 soldiers. What a joke our government and media have become.

Sadly, too many Americans are easily duped.

Too many Americans see betrayal as a bad thing apparently. Trump sold the Kurds to Turkey. I am wondering what he thought was worth it.

 

[Lesh]

you can lie or minimize the numbers of troops removed...but what you can't do is lie about the EFFECT that removing them was a Kurdish invasion that will re-empower ISIS and screw our Kurdish allies

It will also destabilize the ME

And why?

To "bring home" 28 troops? Newsflash...not even THAT happened. They were re positioned...they're still there. No troops were brought home and thousands more were sent to Saudi Arabia

Ok repositioned then... Even better as long as they are out of harm's way, and not being used for political reasons.

Don't pretend naivete. Troops are ALWAYS used for "political reasons". They are an arm of foreign policy...even in war

 

[Lesh]

VDH is a total nutjob

Of course he is, just ask you. The truth is that he is a highly educated rational, reasonable men. You just don't like the truth that he writes.

He's a dishonest neocon...regardless of what degrees he holds

Hanson is a conservative who voted for George W. Bush in the 2000 and 2004 elections.[16] He defended George W. Bush and his policies,[17] especially the Iraq War.[18] He vocally supported Bush's Secretary of Defense Donald Rumsfeld, describing him as "a rare sort of secretary of the caliber of George Marshall" and a "proud and honest-speaking visionary" whose "hard work and insight are bringing us ever closer to victory".[19]

Hanson is a supporter of Donald Trump, authoring a 2019 book The Case for Trump.[20] Trump praised the book.[20] In the book, Hanson defends Trump's demeanor as "uncouth authenticity", and praises Trump for "an uncanny ability to troll and create hysteria among his media and political critics."[20] According to Washington Post book critic Carlos Lozada, the book "focuses less on the case for Trump than on the case against everyone else," in particular attacking Hillary Clinton.[20] According to Lozada, Hanson indulges "in casual sexism, criticizing Clinton’s “shrill” voice and her “signature off-putting laugh,” and inexplicably suggesting that while “Trump’s bulk fueled a monstrous energy; Hillary’s girth sapped her strength.”"[20] Hanson praises the Trump administration for its "inspired" and "impressive" Cabinet members.[20] In the book, Hanson blamed Barack Obama for "deliberately [whipping up]" "much of the current division in the country".[20] The book likens Trump to a hero of ancient literature, sacrificing himself for the greater good.[20] Hanson expressed support for Trump's proposed border wall on the Southern border, saying that walls around houses deter criminals.[20]

Neoconservative views[edit]
He has been described as a neoconservative by some commentators, for his views on the Iraq War,[21][22] and has stated, "I came to support neocon approaches first in the wars against the Taliban and Saddam, largely because I saw little alternative."[23] Hanson's 2002 volume An Autumn of War called for going to war "hard, long, without guilt, apology or respite until our enemies are no more."[24] In the context of the Iraq War, Hanson wrote, "In an era of the greatest affluence and security in the history of civilization, the real question before us remains whether the United States— indeed any Western democracy—still possesses the moral clarity to identify evil as evil, and then the uncontested will to marshal every available resource to fight and eradicate it."[25]

 

[beagle9]

you can lie or minimize the numbers of troops removed...but what you can't do is lie about the EFFECT that removing them was a Kurdish invasion that will re-empower ISIS and screw our Kurdish allies

It will also destabilize the ME

And why?

To "bring home" 28 troops? Newsflash...not even THAT happened. They were re positioned...they're still there. No troops were brought home and thousands more were sent to Saudi Arabia

Ok repositioned then... Even better as long as they are out of harm's way, and not being used for political reasons.

Don't pretend naivete. Troops are ALWAYS used for "political reasons". They are an arm of foreign policy...even in war

Ok, and who is attempting to use them now ?? How about the Democrats quit with their fake outrage about groups thousands of miles away, while they sit back and watch American's killing American's in Chicago etc without so much as a blinking of an eye. How can we say that we love those for whom we can't see standing before us, yet hate our brother for whom we can see standing before us ? For if we say we do, then are we not liars and/or rather the truth does not abide within us ?

 

[gipper]

Truly amazing the uproar over moving out 50 soldiers. What a joke our government and media have become.

Sadly, too many Americans are easily duped.

Too many Americans see betrayal as a bad thing apparently. Trump sold the Kurds to Turkey. I am wondering what he thought was worth it.

We have the world’s largest military, by a country mile. Our criminal government can put boots on the ground anywhere in the world, in a moments notice. They can bomb any location they so wish, within minutes. Yet, you think this tiny troop movement is the end of the world.

How is this possible?

Where did the anti war Left go? It’s as if only neolibs and neocons run the world.

 

[occupied]

you can lie or minimize the numbers of troops removed...but what you can't do is lie about the EFFECT that removing them was a Kurdish invasion that will re-empower ISIS and screw our Kurdish allies

It will also destabilize the ME

And why?

To "bring home" 28 troops? Newsflash...not even THAT happened. They were re positioned...they're still there. No troops were brought home and thousands more were sent to Saudi Arabia

Ok repositioned then... Even better as long as they are out of harm's way, and not being used for political reasons.

Don't pretend naivete. Troops are ALWAYS used for "political reasons". They are an arm of foreign policy...even in war

Ok, and who is attempting to use them now ?? How about the Democrats quit with their fake outrage about groups thousands of miles away, while they sit back and watch American's killing American's in Chicago etc without so much as a blinking of an eye. How can we say that we love those for whom we can't see standing before us, yet hate our brother for whom we can see standing before us ? For if we say we do, then are we not liars and/or rather the truth does not abide within us ?

The president is terribly weak on Russia. This is what that looks like.

 

[JustAGuy1]

VDH is a total nutjob

Of course he is, just ask you. The truth is that he is a highly educated rational, reasonable men. You just don't like the truth that he writes.

He's a dishonest neocon...regardless of what degrees he holds

Hanson is a conservative who voted for George W. Bush in the 2000 and 2004 elections.[16] He defended George W. Bush and his policies,[17] especially the Iraq War.[18] He vocally supported Bush's Secretary of Defense Donald Rumsfeld, describing him as "a rare sort of secretary of the caliber of George Marshall" and a "proud and honest-speaking visionary" whose "hard work and insight are bringing us ever closer to victory".[19]

Hanson is a supporter of Donald Trump, authoring a 2019 book The Case for Trump.[20] Trump praised the book.[20] In the book, Hanson defends Trump's demeanor as "uncouth authenticity", and praises Trump for "an uncanny ability to troll and create hysteria among his media and political critics."[20] According to Washington Post book critic Carlos Lozada, the book "focuses less on the case for Trump than on the case against everyone else," in particular attacking Hillary Clinton.[20] According to Lozada, Hanson indulges "in casual sexism, criticizing Clinton’s “shrill” voice and her “signature off-putting laugh,” and inexplicably suggesting that while “Trump’s bulk fueled a monstrous energy; Hillary’s girth sapped her strength.”"[20] Hanson praises the Trump administration for its "inspired" and "impressive" Cabinet members.[20] In the book, Hanson blamed Barack Obama for "deliberately [whipping up]" "much of the current division in the country".[20] The book likens Trump to a hero of ancient literature, sacrificing himself for the greater good.[20] Hanson expressed support for Trump's proposed border wall on the Southern border, saying that walls around houses deter criminals.[20]

Neoconservative views[edit]
He has been described as a neoconservative by some commentators, for his views on the Iraq War,[21][22] and has stated, "I came to support neocon approaches first in the wars against the Taliban and Saddam, largely because I saw little alternative."[23] Hanson's 2002 volume An Autumn of War called for going to war "hard, long, without guilt, apology or respite until our enemies are no more."[24] In the context of the Iraq War, Hanson wrote, "In an era of the greatest affluence and security in the history of civilization, the real question before us remains whether the United States— indeed any Western democracy—still possesses the moral clarity to identify evil as evil, and then the uncontested will to marshal every available resource to fight and eradicate it."[25]

LOL, NONE of that makes him a "nut job". The problem you have is that you see EVERYTHING through abjectly partisan lenses.

 

[Tijn Von Ingersleben]

Having US troops in harms-way in Syria is moronic.

That applies to everywhere outside of the US where we have troops stationed.

 

[occupied]

Truly amazing the uproar over moving out 50 soldiers. What a joke our government and media have become.

Sadly, too many Americans are easily duped.

Too many Americans see betrayal as a bad thing apparently. Trump sold the Kurds to Turkey. I am wondering what he thought was worth it.

We have the world’s largest military, by a country mile. Our criminal government can put boots on the ground anywhere in the world, in a moments notice. They can bomb any location they so wish, within minutes. Yet, you think this tiny troop movement is the end of the world.

How is this possible?

Where did the anti war Left go? It’s as if only neolibs and neocons run the world.

There are many scenarios that can arise from our sudden retreat from the fight against ISIS, none if them are good. The left is not anti-war, they are anti-stupid war.

 

[Jitss617]

VDH is a total nutjob

Of course he is, just ask you. The truth is that he is a highly educated rational, reasonable men. You just don't like the truth that he writes.

He's a dishonest neocon...regardless of what degrees he holds

Hanson is a conservative who voted for George W. Bush in the 2000 and 2004 elections.[16] He defended George W. Bush and his policies,[17] especially the Iraq War.[18] He vocally supported Bush's Secretary of Defense Donald Rumsfeld, describing him as "a rare sort of secretary of the caliber of George Marshall" and a "proud and honest-speaking visionary" whose "hard work and insight are bringing us ever closer to victory".[19]

Hanson is a supporter of Donald Trump, authoring a 2019 book The Case for Trump.[20] Trump praised the book.[20] In the book, Hanson defends Trump's demeanor as "uncouth authenticity", and praises Trump for "an uncanny ability to troll and create hysteria among his media and political critics."[20] According to Washington Post book critic Carlos Lozada, the book "focuses less on the case for Trump than on the case against everyone else," in particular attacking Hillary Clinton.[20] According to Lozada, Hanson indulges "in casual sexism, criticizing Clinton’s “shrill” voice and her “signature off-putting laugh,” and inexplicably suggesting that while “Trump’s bulk fueled a monstrous energy; Hillary’s girth sapped her strength.”"[20] Hanson praises the Trump administration for its "inspired" and "impressive" Cabinet members.[20] In the book, Hanson blamed Barack Obama for "deliberately [whipping up]" "much of the current division in the country".[20] The book likens Trump to a hero of ancient literature, sacrificing himself for the greater good.[20] Hanson expressed support for Trump's proposed border wall on the Southern border, saying that walls around houses deter criminals.[20]

Neoconservative views[edit]
He has been described as a neoconservative by some commentators, for his views on the Iraq War,[21][22] and has stated, "I came to support neocon approaches first in the wars against the Taliban and Saddam, largely because I saw little alternative."[23] Hanson's 2002 volume An Autumn of War called for going to war "hard, long, without guilt, apology or respite until our enemies are no more."[24] In the context of the Iraq War, Hanson wrote, "In an era of the greatest affluence and security in the history of civilization, the real question before us remains whether the United States— indeed any Western democracy—still possesses the moral clarity to identify evil as evil, and then the uncontested will to marshal every available resource to fight and eradicate it."[25]

Ummmm TDS