Using "Mental Illness" as a cop-out for Mass shootings

[Flipper]

This writer from Salon hits it spot on.

It s not about mental illness The big lie that always follows mass shootings by white males - Salon.com

“The real issue is mental illness” is a goddamn cop-out. I almost never hear it from actual mental health professionals, or advocates working in the mental health sphere, or anyone who actually has any kind of informed opinion on mental health or serious policy proposals for how to improve our treatment of the mentally ill in this country.

What I hear from people who bleat on about “The real issue is mental illness,” when pressed for specific suggestions on how to deal with said “real issue,” is terrifying nonsense designed to throw the mentally ill under the bus. Elliot Rodger’s parents should’ve been able to force risperidone down his throat. Seung-Hui Cho should’ve been forcibly institutionalized. Anyone with a mental illness diagnosis should surrender all of their constitutional rights, right now, rather than at all compromise the right to bear arms of self-declared sane people.

What’s interesting is to watch who the mentally ill people are being thrown under the bus to defend. In the wake of Sandy Hook, the NRA tells us that creating a national registry of firearms owners would be giving the government dangerously unchecked tyrannical power, but a national registry of the mentally ill would not — even though a “sane” person holding a gun is intrinsically more dangerous than a “crazy” person, no matter how crazy, without a gun.

Now, here's the thing. The sad state of our mental health system is a bipartisan issue. From Republicans who don't want to pay for outpatient programs or hospitals, to ACLU types who make it next to impossible to institutionalize a crazy person against his will.

But the main problem is, we always find out AFTER these people have gotten a gun and killed a bunch of people that they were crazy.

How about, just for the hell of it, we actually prevent crazy people from getting guns before they kill a bunch of people?

Isn't that it's a cop-out as in being mentally ill excuses it (think we should execute offenders regardless,) but the act of murder is in and of itself not the act of a sane individual. You're gonna get caught, or be hunted the rest of your life, so commiting murder is not the act of a person thinking clearly.

The problem we have when this sort of thing happens is I think, the victims are dead, today, so why isn't the perpetrator? Why once we catch them does it take 15 years or more? Why do some not get executed when their victims are still dead?

In cases like this one in Charlotte where the person's guilt isn't in question, they should be executed by gunshot THAT DAY. Not like they'll have a problem finding eager volunteers, hell I"d smile-kill this SC twat.

Fuck the constitution, take him out back and shoot him!

You stupid fucks amuse me.

Absolutely right, fuck the Constitution. Was written centuries ago with little relevance to today. Didn't have video evidence then so all this nonsense about trials and determining people's guilt is redundant. When guilt isn't in question trials to determine guilt is redundant.

Some Texan you are.

MORON ALERT!!!!

 

[SassyIrishLass]

He should realize the Constitution is more clear on gun ownership then it is on homo marriage

Yes, the Constitution says you can belong to a Well-Regulated militia if you want a gun.

Actually, I've posted a thread that shows Mexico has more restrictive gun laws than the US, and three times the murder rate.

1) Mexico is not an advanced democracy.
2) Mexico has a "right to bear arms" in their constitution, just like we do.

You might want to check the restrictive laws in Mexico and see if they are just like we have.

You mean they don't have the same interpretation of "The right to bear arms' that we have?

Our interpretation of that IS insane.

Sadly, we have a gun industry that is pouring thousands of guns into Mexico. Because they are fucking evil.

Does it bother you Obama and Holder were gun running in Mexico? Keep in mind a border patrol agent was killed with one of them

 

[2aguy]

He should realize the Constitution is more clear on gun ownership then it is on homo marriage

Yes, the Constitution says you can belong to a Well-Regulated militia if you want a gun.

Actually, I've posted a thread that shows Mexico has more restrictive gun laws than the US, and three times the murder rate.

1) Mexico is not an advanced democracy.
2) Mexico has a "right to bear arms" in their constitution, just like we do.

You might want to check the restrictive laws in Mexico and see if they are just like we have.

You mean they don't have the same interpretation of "The right to bear arms' that we have?

Our interpretation of that IS insane.

Sadly, we have a gun industry that is pouring thousands of guns into Mexico. Because they are fucking evil.

Does it bother you Obama and Holder were gun running in Mexico? Keep in mind a border patrol agent was killed with one of them

And at last count 320 innocent Mexican citizens.....way more now if you could get the count.

 

[tinydancer]

Actually, I've posted a thread that shows Mexico has more restrictive gun laws than the US, and three times the murder rate.

1) Mexico is not an advanced democracy.
2) Mexico has a "right to bear arms" in their constitution, just like we do.

You might want to check the restrictive laws in Mexico and see if they are just like we have.

You mean they don't have the same interpretation of "The right to bear arms' that we have?

Our interpretation of that IS insane.

Sadly, we have a gun industry that is pouring thousands of guns into Mexico. Because they are fucking evil.

The 90% figure of US made guns in Mexico is bullshit. They skewered the statistics.

Here ya go.

"As we discussed in a previous analysis, the 90 percent number was derived from a June 2009 U.S. Government Accountability Office (GAO) report to Congress on U.S. efforts to combat arms trafficking to Mexico (see external link).

According to the GAO report, some 30,000 firearms were seized from criminals by Mexican authorities in 2008. Of these 30,000 firearms, information pertaining to 7,200 of them (24 percent) was submitted to the U.S. Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives (ATF) for tracing. Of these 7,200 guns, only about 4,000 could be traced by the ATF, and of these 4,000, some 3,480 (87 percent) were shown to have come from the United States.

This means that the 87 percent figure relates to the number of weapons submitted by the Mexican government to the ATF that could be successfully traced and not from the total number of weapons seized by Mexican authorities or even from the total number of weapons submitted to the ATF for tracing.

In fact, the 3,480 guns positively traced to the United States equals less than 12 percent of the total arms seized in Mexico in 2008 and less than 48 percent of all those submitted by the Mexican government to the ATF for tracing.

This means that almost 90 percent of the guns seized in Mexico in 2008 were not traced back to the United States"

It's freaking bullshit.

Mexico s Gun Supply and the 90 Percent Myth Stratfor

 

[MathewSmith]

I'm sure, it's called terrorism. There's nothing to dispute here. Mental illness is not relevant. No one asked whether lynchers, for example, were mentally ill. Only God knows, what will happen next with society .

 

[Moonglow]

Okay, no guns for you.

How about "No guns for anyone who doesn't have a damned good reason for having one".

Like every other civilized country does.

The Progressive Founding Fathers: Hitler , Stalin and Mao were all proponents of gun control

Yeah, so was Doc holiday...In the town where he help marshal, you had to surrender your guns when you was in town.....

 

[Moonglow]

I'm sure, it's called terrorism. There's nothing to dispute here. Mental illness is not relevant. No one asked whether lynchers, for example, were mentally ill. Only God knows, what will happen next with society .

Crochet would be nice

 

[SassyIrishLass]

I'm sure, it's called terrorism. There's nothing to dispute here. Mental illness is not relevant. No one asked whether lynchers, for example, were mentally ill. Only God knows, what will happen next with society .

Mental illness isn't relevant? Oh boy...

 

[Political Junky]

did the libs use logic on 911 regarding the high jackers? nope. they defended them saying it was our fault and israels fault and the militaries faul etc... everybody BUT the muslim scum!

Certainly, no one defended the 911 high jackers.

 

[SassyIrishLass]

did the libs use logic on 911 regarding the high jackers? nope. they defended them saying it was our fault and israels fault and the militaries faul etc... everybody BUT the muslim scum!

Certainly, no one defended the 911 high jackers.

Yeah they did

 

[Political Junky]

did the libs use logic on 911 regarding the high jackers? nope. they defended them saying it was our fault and israels fault and the militaries faul etc... everybody BUT the muslim scum!

Certainly, no one defended the 911 high jackers.

Yeah they did

Nope - Perhaps you can give a quote of someone defending them.

 

[Skull Pilot]

I for one do not believe in the diminished capacity defense.

The behavior is what should matters. IDGAF if a guy is a racist, crazy, depressed, drunk or on drugs when he kills someone

All that matters is he committed murder.

 

[Skull Pilot]

IMO any crime committed while in possession of a firearm should get a sentence of automatic life in federal prison without parole

If anyone is killed then the death penalty applies

 

[SassyIrishLass]

did the libs use logic on 911 regarding the high jackers? nope. they defended them saying it was our fault and israels fault and the militaries faul etc... everybody BUT the muslim scum!

Certainly, no one defended the 911 high jackers.

Yeah they did

Nope - Perhaps you can give a quote of someone defending them.

Ward Churchill:

“Let’s get a grip here, shall we? True enough, [the victims of 9/11] were civilians of a sort. But innocent? Give me a break. If there was a better, more effective, or in fact any other way of visiting some penalty befitting their participation upon the little Eichmanns inhabiting the sterile sanctuary of the twin towers, I’d really be interested in hearing about it.”

 

[Political Junky]

did the libs use logic on 911 regarding the high jackers? nope. they defended them saying it was our fault and israels fault and the militaries faul etc... everybody BUT the muslim scum!

Certainly, no one defended the 911 high jackers.

Yeah they did

Nope - Perhaps you can give a quote of someone defending them.

Ward Churchill:

“Let’s get a grip here, shall we? True enough, [the victims of 9/11] were civilians of a sort. But innocent? Give me a break. If there was a better, more effective, or in fact any other way of visiting some penalty befitting their participation upon the little Eichmanns inhabiting the sterile sanctuary of the twin towers, I’d really be interested in hearing about it.”

Ward Churchill, Really?

 

[SassyIrishLass]

did the libs use logic on 911 regarding the high jackers? nope. they defended them saying it was our fault and israels fault and the militaries faul etc... everybody BUT the muslim scum!

Certainly, no one defended the 911 high jackers.

Yeah they did

Nope - Perhaps you can give a quote of someone defending them.

Ward Churchill:

“Let’s get a grip here, shall we? True enough, [the victims of 9/11] were civilians of a sort. But innocent? Give me a break. If there was a better, more effective, or in fact any other way of visiting some penalty befitting their participation upon the little Eichmanns inhabiting the sterile sanctuary of the twin towers, I’d really be interested in hearing about it.”

Ward Churchill, Really?

Left loon, you asked, I delivered. Have a great day

 

[JWBooth]

“The real issue is mental illness” is a goddamn cop-out. I almost never hear it from actual mental health professionals, or advocates working in the mental health sphere,

The folks with skin in the game, writing the scrips for psychotropics, never bring up mental illness in mass shooting events.
Can't imagine why.

 

[LordBrownTrout]

All persons are entitled to due process, including those perceived to be insane.

This is not an issue of law and rights, it's a comprehensive mental health issue we refuse to address.

Scum knew what he was doing and he confessed.

 

[JoeB131]

No, obama and eric holder sent guns into Mexico so they would be used in drug crimes, then morons like you would support their extreme anti gun laws....

It worked.

The Gun INdustry allows a quarter million guns into Mexico every year. Fast and Furious lost track of maybe 200 of them.

Again, guy, turn off the hate radio and do some research, 'kay?

 

[JoeB131]

Colin ferguson the Long Island Train shooter.

So you came up with a whole three in 30 years? Really?

Mass shooting is mostly a white boy's game.