US Birthrate Continues to Decline

[Correll]

Watch out for confounding. Are families making women happier or are happier women having families? Naturally, women who chose to start families will be in a better position in life than those who chose not to.

Everything I have heard, the cause effect seems to be feminism and feminist policies seem to be leading to a serious decline in female happiness.

you know it too. That is why you tried moving the goal posts to a discussion of families.

His wife described the marriage in their divorce and substantiated the behavior with video where he berated her.

https://nymag.com/intelligencer/2023/05/steven-crowder-exposed-himself-at-work-ex-staffers-say.html

Huh. HOw strange. I clicked the link th inking to see video evidence and instead I found a link where someone talked about the video.

Very, VERY, VERY, typicial with divorces and libs.

SO, no evidence of this abuse. Just claims.

 

[Correll]

I don't exist in the manosphere like you do, so it's not something I think about a lot.

The idea that women should date a man who earns more and is more successful than her is definitely not a feminist ideal. If you think it's a problem, than we need more feminism, not less.

You claim you are not familiar with the concept, and had to look it up and yet here you are misrepresenting COMPLETELY what it is about.

And it's impact.

You are operating in bad faith.

I've heard enough to form an opinion. I don't hold these dudes in high regard.

Dude. You admit you know nothing, yet you have your mind made up.

And you think that is fine.

You are a closed minded asshole.

Cry me a river.

Said the dishonest asshole. Go **** yourself.

 

[Marener]

Everything I have heard, the cause effect seems to be feminism and feminist policies seem to be leading to a serious decline in female happiness.

you know it too. That is why you tried moving the goal posts to a discussion of families.

Maybe that's because your media bubble isn't really conducive to outside opinions and serious debate?

Or maybe you have an innate bias to blame women.

Huh. HOw strange. I clicked the link th inking to see video evidence and instead I found a link where someone talked about the video.

Very, VERY, VERY, typicial with divorces and libs.

SO, no evidence of this abuse. Just claims.

Exclusive: Video Reveals Steven Crowder Emotionally Abusing Wife. In Statement, Hilary Crowder's Family Says She Hid His Emotionally Abusive Behavior For Years

Conservative media host and commentator Steven Crowder can be seen on a Ring Camera video berating his wife Hilary, who was at the time nearly eight months pregnant, and demanding that she handle medicine for his dogs that she was concerned was toxic to pregnant women. In the video, he snaps at...

www.thereset.news

I got to it just fine, sorry if it was difficult for you. Listen to the way he talks to her and tell me it isn't emotional abuse.

 

[Marener]

You claim you are not familiar with the concept, and had to look it up and yet here you are misrepresenting COMPLETELY what it is about.

And it's impact.

You are operating in bad faith.

You're not really trying to make an argument here, just mad that I don't automatically agree with everything you say.

So why don't you try to tell me what the big deal is.

Dude. You admit you know nothing, yet you have your mind made up.

That's not true.

And you think that is fine.

You are a closed minded asshole.

I've listened to enough of the manosphere to understand that it's not a good place.

Said the dishonest asshole. Go **** yourself.

You're letting your emotions take over again.

 

[Correll]

Maybe that's because your media bubble isn't really conducive to outside opinions and serious debate?

Or maybe you have an innate bias to blame women.

Nope. We got a lot of trends and a lot of them seem to be NEGATIVE trends and the constant is FEMINISM or FEMINISTS IDEAS OR ACTIONS.

And it is hurting EVERYONE.

How many people do you know in your life, that wanted to have families adn failed?

Exclusive: Video Reveals Steven Crowder Emotionally Abusing Wife. In Statement, Hilary Crowder's Family Says She Hid His Emotionally Abusive Behavior For Years

Conservative media host and commentator Steven Crowder can be seen on a Ring Camera video berating his wife Hilary, who was at the time nearly eight months pregnant, and demanding that she handle medicine for his dogs that she was concerned was toxic to pregnant women. In the video, he snaps at...

www.thereset.news

I got to it just fine, sorry if it was difficult for you. Listen to the way he talks to her and tell me it isn't emotional abuse.

Yeah, didn't come up.

 

[Correll]

You're not really trying to make an argument here, just mad that I don't automatically agree with everything you say.

So why don't you try to tell me what the big deal is.

YOu said you had to look up hypergamy. Why don't you give us the link you used to define it, instead of misrepreseting it.

That's not true.

I've listened to enough of the manosphere to understand that it's not a good place.

You're letting your emotions take over again.

Nope. When you are being an asshole, I will treat you as such.

THat is not me being "emotional" that is me treating you like you deserve.

STOP DESERVING IT, and you will stop getting it.

 

[candycorn]

In 2025, 710,000 fewer babies were born as compared to 2005.

Women are delaying motherhood into their 30's and 40's it seems.

https://www.npr.org/2026/04/09/nx-s1-5779627/birthrate-united-states-babies-immigration

From the piece:

"Whatever the causes, many demographers and economists see the apparent shift toward smaller families and fewer children as a significant concern for the nation and its labor force, especially as immigration into the U.S. has also plunged under the Trump administration." Yeah the price of labor is going to go way up (no pun intended).

Frankly, I don't see it. Our maternity ward is as busy as ever it seems. It should make people think twice about wanting to limit birthright citizenship; but it won't.

Then there’s this:

if you’re a white person of a certain mindset...these are troubling numbers indeed.

 

[Marener]

Nope. We got a lot of trends and a lot of them seem to be NEGATIVE trends and the constant is FEMINISM or FEMINISTS IDEAS OR ACTIONS.

Seems pretty simplistic logic, perhaps motivated by an already deep seated hatred of feminism and a desire to blame it for anything you can.

And it is hurting EVERYONE.

How many people do you know in your life, that wanted to have families adn failed?

A few, but it wasn't because of feminism.

Yeah, didn't come up.

If that link doesn't work for you, here's yet another.



The shit coming out of Crowder's mouth is straight up garbage.

 

[candycorn]

I think there are multiple causes.

I don't think girls are devaluing family so much. Although you're probably right.

Young women are looking at their stagnant wages--multiple years without a raise--and wonder how they could fit a child into their budget.

Government cut-backs are another thing. Not only have programs been cut but those who are still around have been reduced. I'll give you a real life example. Mine. When I worked public health, the Title X and Title XX grants were what kept the health department afloat. Once I became immersed in the operation, I saw that a girl could get birth control pills, condoms, and other family planning counseling/medications from the government. I went to public high school (around the turn of the century). Nobody ever pulled me aside and told me about what was available free of charge/reduced price. Why? Because the programs--even at that time--were reduced and the first thing that goes bye-bye is outreach. Thusly, we had a whole section of our HS annual that featured mothers; something that the previous generation would have never thought would happen I'm sure. You do outreach in the 8th grade and maybe you don't have 8-12 moms in a class of 500 students like we had in my senior year. You'll probably have 4-8.

Kids today really follow celebs. When you see celebs who have kids pull back from what made them celebs...it registers with girls. Remember Jessica Alba? Yeah...she essentially gave up her career to have kids. Her choice. Many can't afford that decision since they didn't pocket six figures from acting/modeling.

Also, have you seen how angry most dudes are? Say what you want about the blob and politics but ass-hole-ism has to be at an all time high. Why would a young woman want to marry into that?

I heard on NPR this morning that there were 29,000 positions in non-profits that have been elimininated since summer of last year. While there is no direct link between a non-profit and public assistance/afterbirth support services, it doesn’t take a social scientists to understand that fewer shoulders at the wheel means less support.

 

[Correll]

Then there’s this:

View attachment 1255647
if you’re a white person of a certain mindset...these are troubling numbers indeed.

Is it wrong that hte Japanese are trying to improve their numbers?

 

[Marener]

YOu said you had to look up hypergamy. Why don't you give us the link you used to define it, instead of misrepreseting it.

I wasn't familiar with the word.

Nope. When you are being an asshole, I will treat you as such.

THat is not me being "emotional" that is me treating you like you deserve.

STOP DESERVING IT, and you will stop getting it.

Grow up. I've treated you with more respect and consideration than you deserve and far more than you've treated me.

You're yet again playing the victim card. That's all you're capable of.

 

[Correll]

Seems pretty simplistic logic, perhaps motivated by an already deep seated hatred of feminism and a desire to blame it for anything you can.

No. When we see women following feminism paths and then see increasing unhappiness as a result,

that is not about me or what I want, that is the obvious conclusion. That the choice of following the feminist path was a bad choice.

A few, but it wasn't because of feminism.

Give me the top three reasons. And let's look at them.

If that link doesn't work for you, here's yet another.



The shit coming out of Crowder's mouth is straight up garbage.

Sounds like they are having a fight over the car and who get's stuck at home.

NOt really abuse. So.... she broke up their family over THAT?

 

[Marener]

No. When we see women following feminism paths and then see increasing unhappiness as a result,

that is not about me or what I want, that is the obvious conclusion. That the choice of following the feminist path was a bad choice.

You have to admit it's at least in part what you want, considering you want higher fertility rates.

Give me the top three reasons. And let's look at them.

The two I'm closest to couldn't have kids because of health reasons. One adopted. One didn't.

Sounds like they are having a fight over the car and who get's stuck at home.

NOt really abuse. So.... she broke up their family over THAT?

It's obviously about a lot more than the car. It's about complete lack of respect and autonomy as well as an entitlement mindset. This permeates the manosphere.

 

[Correll]

You have to admit it's at least in part what you want, considering you want higher fertility rates.

I don't see the connection. If women were HAPPIER to have careers and not families, that would be a fact that I would have to address in my policy positions....

but, that that is NOT the case, then I have to address THAT in my policy positions.

My negative opinon on feminism is based not on.... you haven't really given anything.

You seem to just assert this, without... any supporting argument.

What are you even trying to say here?

The two I'm closest to couldn't have kids because of health reasons. One adopted. One didn't.

Did the health reasons come up, because they waited too long? Common feminism based mistake.

It's obviously about a lot more than the car. It's about complete lack of respect and autonomy as well as an entitlement mindset. This permeates the manosphere.

You mean Crowder feels entitled to his own car? WHAT A MONSTER.

 

[Marener]

I don't see the connection. If women were HAPPIER to have careers and not families, that would be a fact that I would have to address in my policy positions....

but, that that is NOT the case, then I have to address THAT in my policy positions.

Again, you have to be careful about what you're measuring. Happier people tend to have families. Are you sure it's the families that are making them happy or is it that they're happy so they make families?

My negative opinon on feminism is based not on.... you haven't really given anything.

You seem to just assert this, without... any supporting argument.

What are you even trying to say here?

I believe there is a widespread male reaction against feminism because they want women to be dependent on them. It makes it easier to get what they want, as Crowder put it, to make sure they do their "wifely duties".

Did the health reasons come up, because they waited too long? Common feminism based mistake.

One woman had birth defects. Another woman had a long history of autoimmune diseases and couldn't maintain a pregnancy. Doesn't seem like it had anything to do with age.

You mean Crowder feels entitled to his own car? WHAT A MONSTER.

There's that entitlement. What makes it "his own car"? They're supposed to be married.

 

[Correll]

Again, you have to be careful about what you're measuring. Happier people tend to have families. Are you sure it's the families that are making them happy or is it that they're happy so they make families?

And again, you try to pivot away from my point.

We see generations of women, operating under feminist ideas and policies, and their happiness has gone DOWN.

I'm NOT just talking about "Families" but careers, not marrying, considering men to be bad, ect. ect. ect.

The results have not been IMPROVEMENTS.

IF the results were MIXED, so that the women were happy, but men were unhappy, that would be one discussion.

But the actual reality is that it seems to have been a negative experience for EVERYONE.

Would you like to address that now, or try to pivot away from my point again?

I believe there is a widespread male reaction against feminism because they want women to be dependent on them. It makes it easier to get what they want, as Crowder put it, to make sure they do their "wifely duties".

So, instead of addressing my point, you wish to find an excuse to dismiss it?

What a shock. I've never seen that behavior from a leftard before.

One woman had birth defects. Another woman had a long history of autoimmune diseases and couldn't maintain a pregnancy. Doesn't seem like it had anything to do with age.

Surprised. The women I've seen with similar issues, could have had children, if they had done it in their twenties. But they fell for the feminist lie that they had plenty of time. And they got fucked.

There has always been a certain percentage of people that for some reason, just lose out. Some poor sap, who falls off a ladder and ends up without testicules or the woman who marries young but her husband falls off a ladder.

But, today, we are seeing those numbers increased terribly by bad advice and bad ideas.

THAT'S SAD.

We should stop doing that.

There's that entitlement. What makes it "his own car"? They're supposed to be married.

She wanted to take it and not even give an expected time back.

That's her being entitled.

You are a fool.

 

[Marener]

And again, you try to pivot away from my point.

We see generations of women, operating under feminist ideas and policies, and their happiness has gone DOWN.

I'm NOT just talking about "Families" but careers, not marrying, considering men to be bad, ect. ect. ect.

The results have not been IMPROVEMENTS.

IF the results were MIXED, so that the women were happy, but men were unhappy, that would be one discussion.

But the actual reality is that it seems to have been a negative experience for EVERYONE.

Would you like to address that now, or try to pivot away from my point again?

Well, a lot of other things have happened in the country since that time too, so perhaps you shouldn't just assume it's because of feminism. Economic and political instability. Cost of living. Social isolation. Internet addiction. These are all highly influential and important issues that have nothing to do with feminism.

Maybe women aren't getting married and considering men bad because a lot of men are genuinely bad. Of course you haven't thought of that. It's gotta be someone else's fault.

You rely solely on this one metric of women's happiness. I'm not pivoting away from the point, I'm trying to get you to consider that maybe there's not a causation here. If you want to blame feminism, you need to make a more convincing argument rather than just saying feminism up, happiness down.

So, instead of addressing my point, you wish to find an excuse to dismiss it?

What a shock. I've never seen that behavior from a leftard before.

I have addressed your point. You won't address mine.

Surprised. The women I've seen with similar issues, could have had children, if they had done it in their twenties. But they fell for the feminist lie that they had plenty of time. And they got fucked.

There has always been a certain percentage of people that for some reason, just lose out. Some poor sap, who falls off a ladder and ends up without testicules or the woman who marries young but her husband falls off a ladder.

But, today, we are seeing those numbers increased terribly by bad advice and bad ideas.

THAT'S SAD.

We should stop doing that.

Whether they could have kids in their 20s is speculative.

When I look at it, the biggest factor that stops people from having kids is lack of economic and social stability.

She wanted to take it and not even give an expected time back.

That's her being entitled.

You are a fool.

The issue clearly started well before that since she felt the need to escape the situation and be away from him. You already showed your cards when you declared it was HIS OWN CAR which he never indicated he had an actual need for.

She needed space, and he refused to allow her to have it. That's entitled, controlling and abusive.

 

[Correll]

Well, a lot of other things have happened in the country since that time too, so perhaps you shouldn't just assume it's because of feminism. Economic and political instability. Cost of living. Social isolation. Internet addiction. These are all highly influential and important issues that have nothing to do with feminism.

There are always lots of things going on. But the basis of society, was always people forming families and raising families.

Economic instability? At least part could be related the relatively sudden DOUBLING of the labor pool. Ie FEMINISM.

Political instability? FEMINISM is a strong political force. How is that having NOTHING to do with it?

Maybe women aren't getting married and considering men bad because a lot of men are genuinely bad. Of course you haven't thought of that. It's gotta be someone else's fault.

We have been blaming men for stuff and going after men as a solution for a long time now, with marriage, divorce, child custody, ect.

It does not seem to be fixing anything. If anything, those efforts seem to be makin matters WORSE, not better.

You rely solely on this one metric of women's happiness. I'm not pivoting away from the point, I'm trying to get you to consider that maybe there's not a causation here. If you want to blame feminism, you need to make a more convincing argument rather than just saying feminism up, happiness down.

What metric do you want to use, to measure feminism's impact? And explain why it would be better than women's happiness.

I have addressed your point. You won't address mine.

Whether they could have kids in their 20s is speculative.

When I look at it, the biggest factor that stops people from having kids is lack of economic and social stability.

The economy is a result of policy choices. And social stability is too. IF those are theproblems, then let's fix them.

Or are you against economic and social stability?

The issue clearly started well before that since she felt the need to escape the situation and be away from him. You already showed your cards when you declared it was HIS OWN CAR which he never indicated he had an actual need for.

She needed space, and he refused to allow her to have it. That's entitled, controlling and abusive.

You claimed this showed verbal abuse. It showed a fairly low key argument.

This does not justify divorce. NOr your claim of abuse.


NOr your smear of conservative men.

 

[Marener]

There are always lots of things going on. But the basis of society, was always people forming families and raising families.

Economic instability? At least part could be related the relatively sudden DOUBLING of the labor pool. Ie FEMINISM.

Political instability? FEMINISM is a strong political force. How is that having NOTHING to do with it?

You are constantly finding a way to blame feminism.

The labor pool didn't "suddenly" double. Women in the workforce grew slowly over the course of 40-50 years. We had relatively normal rates of fertility through the 80s to 2000s, and had a steady decline after the financial crisis of 2008.

Political instability has a lot to do with the rise of illiberal democracies, social discohesion, lack of trust and changing power structures. I don’t see what it has to do with feminism.

We have been blaming men for stuff and going after men as a solution for a long time now, with marriage, divorce, child custody, ect.

It does not seem to be fixing anything. If anything, those efforts seem to be makin matters WORSE, not better.

Expectations for men are changing. They’re expected to be emotionally mature and communicative. I think that’s a good thing, but it’s been a hard adjustment.

What metric do you want to use, to measure feminism's impact? And explain why it would be better than women's happiness.

I don’t see a need to measure feminisms impact. The concept should stand on its own. You still have a causation problem.

The economy is a result of policy choices. And social stability is too. IF those are theproblems, then let's fix them.

Or are you against economic and social stability?

Ha! Good luck. The economy isn’t run by the government, so it only has limited ability to influence it. More and more, it’s run by oligarchs detached from reality and accountability.

People want stable jobs and the thought that they have stable futures. We lost that feeling of predictable progress in the financial crisis.

You claimed this showed verbal abuse. It showed a fairly low key argument.

This does not justify divorce. NOr your claim of abuse.


NOr your smear of conservative men.

I said it was emotional abuse. It’s very telling that you can’t see that. You just see an argument about a car. Reality is that it’s over entitlement, control, and complete disinterest about the wellbeing and emotional state of his partner.

 

[Correll]

You are constantly finding a way to blame feminism.

This thread is about teh decline in birthrate. Feminism is an ideology that attacks the Ideal of Motherhood and tried to replace it with CAREER.

I see cause and effect. You, naturally, don't.

The labor pool didn't "suddenly" double. Women in the workforce grew slowly over the course of 40-50 years.

"slowly" in that context, has no meaning. You are just dismissing the point, without actually addressing the point.

We had relatively normal rates of fertility through the 80s to 2000s, and had a steady decline after the financial crisis of 2008.

"normal" has no meaning in that context.

The financial crisis of 2008, is long over. Any remaining trend is SOMETHING ELSE.

Political instability has a lot to do with the rise of illiberal democracies, social discohesion, lack of trust and changing power structures. I don’t see what it has to do with feminism.

Feminism is a major part of modern liberalism. Which is a huge part of the rise of illiberal democracies and social discohesion.

So, not sure of your point here.

Expectations for men are changing. They’re expected to be emotionally mature and communicative. I think that’s a good thing, but it’s been a hard adjustment.

That's nonsense.

I don’t see a need to measure feminisms impact. The concept should stand on its own. You still have a causation problem.

This thread is about teh declining birthrate. WOmen naturally have a large role in that. FEMINISM is an ideology that has been attacking the IDEAL of MOTHERHOOD,a and trying to replace it with CAREER.

Discussing the impact of that, on the lives of women AND MEN, is certainly called for.

If it has been good, then let's celebrate that, and keep going.

If it has been BAD, then let's stop doing it, and try to fix the damage.

Ha! Good luck. The economy isn’t run by the government, so it only has limited ability to influence it. More and more, it’s run by oligarchs detached from reality and accountability.

Agreed. So, you with us, or are you with the oligarchs who want low labor costs and globalism and women in the workplace and men being treated like scum of the earth and unrestricted third world immigration.

Which side are you on? US, or the OLIGARCHS?

People want stable jobs and the thought that they have stable futures. We lost that feeling of predictable progress in the financial crisis.

We lost that feeling due to globalization back in the 70s.

Looking back, i think that was a mistake. We should fix that.

I said it was emotional abuse. It’s very telling that you can’t see that. You just see an argument about a car. Reality is that it’s over entitlement, control, and complete disinterest about the wellbeing and emotional state of his partner.

Why couldn't she take an uber?