US Birthrate Continues to Decline

[candycorn]

Well, the midwives work for the NHS and it's what they know. As for you, lol, I'll stick to the midwife's information. You might chuckle, I nearly pissed my pants laughing at you.

Mmmmm...okay. More comedy.

 

[Captain Caveman]

Mmmmm...okay. More comedy.

 

[JohnDB]

Taiwan actually has the lowest birth rate of any nation.
0.78.

That's almost a third of replacement rates.

Being a parent is heavily marketed as "boring, burdensome, restrictive, and life destroying" as in career destroying or hobby destroying.

This is absolutely the opposite of anything remotely true.

Children are NEVER boring....ROFL
They are only annoying when they aren't yours.

Restrictive?
Well they do financially restrict parents from eating takeout. Dinner for 5 vx dinner for 2 does cost more. BUT....its just a matter of planning and if you work it right by having one parent keep two kids at home....one parent eats out more often than kids or other parent.
Life destroying?
Career destroying?
Let's face facts....success in your job is completely unrewarding. The boss always wants more because what you have done is never enough....and if you perform a production spike it only creates a new bar of expected production. And eventually the top brass at the company are going to make a catastrophic mistake and your job will evaporate due to nothing you could have prevented. Children are the reason you get a career....to provide for them the same way your parents provided for you.
Never be job scared.

Parenting children? You never get fired, they always return home....you got 20 years notice and even then they still return....hopefully with grandkids.

Children take your morals and attitudes and repeat them....
They are indeed little "mini-me". Not perfect copies....but definitely a repeat.
"If only more people were more like me and the way I think" is so common a thought its ridiculous.....children are the solution.

Wanna be loved? Children love their parents. (Unless abusive....dont abuse your children) parent child relationship is always solid....a bit rocky when their individualism breaks out (they are independent individuals and not just a carbon copy) but eventually at some point mom and dad become smart once again instead of just lucky.

 

[JohnDB]

This needs to change....

 

[Correll]

Why?

IMO, it is because you realize that your position advocating for lower birthrates, is clearly harmful to people and to society,


so you are an asshole, so that you can confuse the issue and obscucate the logic of your argument with personal attacks and various evasive techniques.

 

[Correll]

I will address your point. Nobody is stopping those that are looking mates from finding them. Petiod.

That seems to be the crux of the dispute between us. Let's focus on that and drop all the shit talk and personal attacks, ok.


This is my assertion, that there are ideas and practices that are stopping those that are looking for mates, from finding them.

 

[initforme]

That seems to be the crux of the dispute between us. Let's focus on that and drop all the shit talk and personal attacks, ok.


This is my assertion, that there are ideas and practices that are stopping those that are looking for mates, from finding them.

Ok...respectfully wondering what those practices are. If you are talking affordability issues without a doubt I agree. Prices are rising. Gas is getting more expensive. Health care is very pricey and deductibles are high. Thats just a start on that side of things.

 

[JohnDB]

Everyone holding out for the queen barbie wife....

 

[Correll]

Why are they failing to find mates in a timely fashion?

A number of large factors.

1. Feminist indoctrination, celebrating career over family.

2. Feminist indoctrination, demonizing men and increasing partisan divide.

3. Hypergamy, which leads to unrealistic expectations among women, as to what they can reasonable hope for in a mate.

4. Economic and trade policy that artificially elevates female earnings, and depresses male earnings, thus reducing the number of "good men" for women with jobs.

5. Misinformation about the effects of aging on fertility.

6. Unfair divorce and child custody laws.

7. This is off the top of my head. I reserve the right to add more, as I think of them, or remember them.

As far as couples having kids that's their choice and those that dont not an issue.

This is NOT what I have observed in among my peers.

ie. you present a picture of well informed couples that consider the issue seriously and reach a conclusion to not have children.

The reality is more that they want children, but for reasons often out of their control,... .... .... or even in their control, but they **** up, they fail. Often by waiting too long, thinking that they had time.


So, imo, this is still part of the problem. YOu callously dismissing their pain, is not a valid policy response. That is just you not caring about their pain.

 

[initforme]

I would add the demise of labor unions to my list as well.

 

[JoeB131]

God forbid, should we fail to become like China.

Sometimes drops in fertility or "recruitment" could be a good thing. It's all about balance. Both baby booming AND population -drops in society can be reactionary to an unhealthy degree, but they can also be healthy reactions. Its good to slow down from 80mph to 60mph in 10 seconds. But slowing from 80 to 40 in 3 seconds would be a potentially unhealthy jolt. It's all relative.

China realized they made a mistake with the One Child Policy.

But people in China have been slow to want to have a mess of kids.

 

[JoeB131]

A number of large factors.

1. Feminist indoctrination, celebrating career over family.

2. Feminist indoctrination, demonizing men and increasing partisan divide.

3. Hypergamy, which leads to unrealistic expectations among women, as to what they can reasonable hope for in a mate.

4. Economic and trade policy that artificially elevates female earnings, and depresses male earnings, thus reducing the number of "good men" for women with jobs.

5. Misinformation about the effects of aging on fertility.

6. Unfair divorce and child custody laws.

7. This is off the top of my head. I reserve the right to add more, as I think of them, or remember them.

1 & 2 are just silly. Women realize they can be more than baby dispensers is a good thing.

3) you don't think men suffer from hypergamy? The fat guy who thinks he's entitled to a supermodel?

4) I think you are close, like a blind squirrel with a nut here. Yes, 50 years of Republicans making war on the middle class on trade, union-busting, and driving down wages HAS had an effect on people's ability to start families. But women still make less then men for the same work and that's not good.

5) Women aren't confused on the fertility issue and aging. They know 40 is usually a hard stop.

6) Custody laws really haven't changed that much. Women usually get preference in custody and alimony.

 

[initforme]

A number of large factors.

1. Feminist indoctrination, celebrating career over family.

2. Feminist indoctrination, demonizing men and increasing partisan divide.

3. Hypergamy, which leads to unrealistic expectations among women, as to what they can reasonable hope for in a mate.

4. Economic and trade policy that artificially elevates female earnings, and depresses male earnings, thus reducing the number of "good men" for women with jobs.

5. Misinformation about the effects of aging on fertility.

6. Unfair divorce and child custody laws.

7. This is off the top of my head. I reserve the right to add more, as I think of them, or remember them.





This is NOT what I have observed in among my peers.

ie. you present a picture of well informed couples that consider the issue seriously and reach a conclusion to not have children.

The reality is more that they want children, but for reasons often out of their control,... .... .... or even in their control, but they **** up, they fail. Often by waiting too long, thinking that they had time.


So, imo, this is still part of the problem. YOu callously dismissing their pain, is not a valid policy response. That is just you not caring about their pain.

Im not discussing those who want kids and cannot have them. I feel bad for them. I just speaking to those who have made the choice not to have them. Thats the growing trend that I am observing. Lots of people are having one and that's it as well. Small families are another societal shift due to whatever reason perhaps finances being the biggest factor.

 

[Correll]

Im not discussing those who want kids and cannot have them. I feel bad for them. I just speaking to those who have made the choice not to have them. Thats the growing trend that I am observing. Lots of people are having one and that's it as well. Small families are another societal shift due to whatever reason perhaps finances being the biggest factor.

Why not? If the reasons for their failure are not effected by policy, such as life long infertility, then they are part of the... base fertility rate, ie there have always been some poeple that did not breed.


BUT, if the reason for their failure IS even partially based on policy, than it is a valid issue for political discussion.

 

[SweetTea]

They have 94% of the wealth, and the only way you get to that number is if you count income taxes only, and not all the other taxes that impact the working class.

What is rich to you? At one point should people start paying a huge percentage(60%+) of their income to the government? What is poor to you? At what point should people not have to pay any income tax?

 

[JoeB131]

What is rich to you? At one point should people start paying a huge percentage(60%+) of their income to the government? What is poor to you? At what point should people not have to pay any income tax?

Anything over seven figures should get a 60% tax rate.

Anyone below 40K should pay no tax at all.

 

[JohnDB]

When Henry Ford was running in Detroit....
He paid workers $30/wk for 6 day workweek. ($5/day)
The equivalent of a $200,000/yr salary today.....for low skill work.

Cars sold for $800 ea.

IOW 3.75% of a cost of a vehicle was equal to a day's wages.

(Henry tried to pay more but the stockholders stopped him)

Today a $160/day wage is not the same percentage of the price of a new car. Roughly 10% of what it was. Today its 0.004 or 0.4% of the price of a car. And chances are you are not going to get $20/hr for unskilled labor. Might get $14 or $15.

 

[SweetTea]

Anything over seven figures should get a 60% tax rate.

Anyone below 40K should pay no tax at all.

60% federal income tax rate on top of property taxes, state taxes, sales taxes, etc.? Are we still taking about a progressive rate, meaning all money above 1 million is taxed at 60% and money below is progressively taxed less down to 40k?

 

[JohnDB]

60% federal income tax rate on top of property taxes, state taxes, sales taxes, etc.? Are we still taking about a progressive rate, meaning all money above 1 million is taxed at 60% and money below is progressively taxed less down to 40k?

If wealth redistribution worked.....it would have already. It has not ever worked......not even the ten millionth time its been tried.

Government Financial incentives for couples having children has not proven to be successful either. Birth rates have continued to decline in spite of the subsidies.

 

[JohnDB]

A number of large factors.

1. Feminist indoctrination, celebrating career over family.

2. Feminist indoctrination, demonizing men and increasing partisan divide.

3. Hypergamy, which leads to unrealistic expectations among women, as to what they can reasonable hope for in a mate.

4. Economic and trade policy that artificially elevates female earnings, and depresses male earnings, thus reducing the number of "good men" for women with jobs.

5. Misinformation about the effects of aging on fertility.

6. Unfair divorce and child custody laws.

7. This is off the top of my head. I reserve the right to add more, as I think of them, or remember them.





This is NOT what I have observed in among my peers.

ie. you present a picture of well informed couples that consider the issue seriously and reach a conclusion to not have children.

The reality is more that they want children, but for reasons often out of their control,... .... .... or even in their control, but they **** up, they fail. Often by waiting too long, thinking that they had time.


So, imo, this is still part of the problem. YOu callously dismissing their pain, is not a valid policy response. That is just you not caring about their pain.

The Jean Carrol and other lawsuits like this are DEFINITE pauses for men to get anywhere near a woman. It doesn't matter if sex was consensual or not....she can change her mind and claim now it wasn't 20 years ago. Several high profile cases like this will definitely curb any amorous feelings any guy might have.

As far as hypergamy.....
Rumor has it that Erica Kirk's kids are not actually Charlie's.....and if proven she gets cut off from everything. So far she has refused to participate in DNA testing of the children.