Upcoming Battle of Midway Remake

[there4eyeM]

The Japanese loss was by hazard, but that is exactly what war is. The fact is, America had more potential "next times" than Japan did, and America's industrial output guaranteed that the first next time would not be far off. The war was lost for them before it started, due to the type and extent of their war aims. The militarists were out of touch with reality.

 

[Weatherman2020]

I am guessing all those under 25 year olds in the US Navy know who Chester was

I would argue Guadalcanal was far more important than Midway as for turning the momentum in the pacific, and I am not sure how they can do a historically somewhat accurate account of Midway without making it seem like we were just damn lucky (which we were) more than anything else.

Guadalcanal was only possible because the Japanese Carrier Strike Fleet was basically eliminated at Midway.

To be fair, losing at Midway would have only probably meant the war going slower until we dropped the A bombs on them, but it was still to me the most pivotal moment in the Pacific War.

And for the love of all that is holy, may they not "Pearl Harbor-Affleck" the thing. Every time I see even a minute of that Affleck tainted hell-movie I have to take out my copy of Tora Tora Tora and watch the whole thing to get the bad taste out of my mouth.

Loss of Midway would have put Pearl under land based bomber attacks, thus ending its use as a harbor. A million variables, but a significant possibility would have been to come to an agreement to end hostilities with Japan controlling much of the Pacific. Just as if Normandy had failed, another invasion would have been next to impossible as Stalin would would negotiate peace and Hitler could then move his assets to the Western front.

Did the Japanese have a bomber that could reliably take a large bomb load from Midway to Oahu?

At this point newer US planes were becoming availible, and Pearl was basically covered in AA.

The Japanese never saw Midway as something to occupy to use, but to occupy to force the "One Big Battle" that was their Naval Strategy at the time.

The ‘big battle’ ended Dec 7, 1941. Except for 3 old carriers, every Allied Capital ship in the Pacific and Indonesia was either with Davy Jones or a smoldering wreck. The intent of the Japanese was to shatter our Navy then negotiate a peace agreement to give them Asia.

From my readings it wasn't. The idea was to cripple the Pacific Fleet, grab as much land as they could, then force the "big battle" with the US's remaining carriers and battleships before the US industry made up for the losses.

And as for the US battleships only two were total write-offs, and the Maryland and Tennessee were back in action a few months later.

Well, it was to negotiate a peace, I can dig up a link but I think we agree on that.

And yes, the Japanese were just coming out with a land based bomber with a 2900 mile range. It would have been back to San Diego for the fleet and the ship infrastructure at Pearl would have been hit.

 

[martybegan]

Guadalcanal was only possible because the Japanese Carrier Strike Fleet was basically eliminated at Midway.

To be fair, losing at Midway would have only probably meant the war going slower until we dropped the A bombs on them, but it was still to me the most pivotal moment in the Pacific War.

And for the love of all that is holy, may they not "Pearl Harbor-Affleck" the thing. Every time I see even a minute of that Affleck tainted hell-movie I have to take out my copy of Tora Tora Tora and watch the whole thing to get the bad taste out of my mouth.

Loss of Midway would have put Pearl under land based bomber attacks, thus ending its use as a harbor. A million variables, but a significant possibility would have been to come to an agreement to end hostilities with Japan controlling much of the Pacific. Just as if Normandy had failed, another invasion would have been next to impossible as Stalin would would negotiate peace and Hitler could then move his assets to the Western front.

Did the Japanese have a bomber that could reliably take a large bomb load from Midway to Oahu?

At this point newer US planes were becoming availible, and Pearl was basically covered in AA.

The Japanese never saw Midway as something to occupy to use, but to occupy to force the "One Big Battle" that was their Naval Strategy at the time.

The ‘big battle’ ended Dec 7, 1941. Except for 3 old carriers, every Allied Capital ship in the Pacific and Indonesia was either with Davy Jones or a smoldering wreck. The intent of the Japanese was to shatter our Navy then negotiate a peace agreement to give them Asia.

From my readings it wasn't. The idea was to cripple the Pacific Fleet, grab as much land as they could, then force the "big battle" with the US's remaining carriers and battleships before the US industry made up for the losses.

And as for the US battleships only two were total write-offs, and the Maryland and Tennessee were back in action a few months later.

Well, it was to negotiate a peace, I can dig up a link but I think we agree on that.

And yes, the Japanese were just coming out with a land based bomber with a 2900 mile range. It would have been back to San Diego for the fleet and the ship infrastructure at Pearl would have been hit.

They would have had to fielded a lot of those bombers to sustain enough pressure to force the US Fleet out of Hawaii. Look at what the Eight Air Force and Bomber Command had to throw at Germany just to SLOW their industrial output increase. (at least in 1944 or so, by 1945 the loss of raw materials also impacted German Industry)

I don't see anything that would force the US out of Oahu short of them losing the "One Big Battle" and then the Combined fleet basically parking itself off of Pearl waiting for troop transports to arrive. I also question the Japanese ability to find enough troops at the time to take Oahu AND keep up pressure in China and New Guinea.

 

[Weatherman2020]

Loss of Midway would have put Pearl under land based bomber attacks, thus ending its use as a harbor. A million variables, but a significant possibility would have been to come to an agreement to end hostilities with Japan controlling much of the Pacific. Just as if Normandy had failed, another invasion would have been next to impossible as Stalin would would negotiate peace and Hitler could then move his assets to the Western front.

Did the Japanese have a bomber that could reliably take a large bomb load from Midway to Oahu?

At this point newer US planes were becoming availible, and Pearl was basically covered in AA.

The Japanese never saw Midway as something to occupy to use, but to occupy to force the "One Big Battle" that was their Naval Strategy at the time.

The ‘big battle’ ended Dec 7, 1941. Except for 3 old carriers, every Allied Capital ship in the Pacific and Indonesia was either with Davy Jones or a smoldering wreck. The intent of the Japanese was to shatter our Navy then negotiate a peace agreement to give them Asia.

From my readings it wasn't. The idea was to cripple the Pacific Fleet, grab as much land as they could, then force the "big battle" with the US's remaining carriers and battleships before the US industry made up for the losses.

And as for the US battleships only two were total write-offs, and the Maryland and Tennessee were back in action a few months later.

Well, it was to negotiate a peace, I can dig up a link but I think we agree on that.

And yes, the Japanese were just coming out with a land based bomber with a 2900 mile range. It would have been back to San Diego for the fleet and the ship infrastructure at Pearl would have been hit.

They would have had to fielded a lot of those bombers to sustain enough pressure to force the US Fleet out of Hawaii. Look at what the Eight Air Force and Bomber Command had to throw at Germany just to SLOW their industrial output increase. (at least in 1944 or so, by 1945 the loss of raw materials also impacted German Industry)

I don't see anything that would force the US out of Oahu short of them losing the "One Big Battle" and then the Combined fleet basically parking itself off of Pearl waiting for troop transports to arrive. I also question the Japanese ability to find enough troops at the time to take Oahu AND keep up pressure in China and New Guinea.

But you forget the US Navy at the time of the battle was 3 old carriers and 7 cruisers. The only ‘big one’ would have been the loss of all 3 carriers instead of the one. That was it.

They wouldn’t have had to take Hawaii. Just being under the threat of bombers is enough to close shop and move your remaining ships to the mainland.

 

[boedicca]

I see a lone female in the cast. If she’s got more than 2 minutes of screen time the movie is a bust.

Why Hollywood thinks it needs to try to appeal to romantic women in the theater is beyond me, it just destroys the movie.

Pearl Harbor
Top Gun
Major League
Midway

All would have been A+ movies without trying to make them chick flicks.

Midway (2019) - IMDb

NASA Announces All-Female Remake Of Staged Moon Landings!!!

https://babylonbee.com/news/nasa-announces-all-female-remake-of-staged-moon-landings

 

[Unkotare]

Woody Harrelson as Chester Nimitz

Might as well go with Woody Allen. Today's uneducated morons don't even know who Chester Nimitz was. Not to mention the importance of the Battle of Midway. Ask anyone under the age of 25 how WW2 shaped the modern world and watch the light go out of their eyes. If you can get them to look away from their smart phone long enough to have a conversation.

And they keep walking on your lawn!

 

[Dekster]

Woody Harrelson as Chester Nimitz

Might as well go with Woody Allen. Today's uneducated morons don't even know who Chester Nimitz was. Not to mention the importance of the Battle of Midway. Ask anyone under the age of 25 how WW2 shaped the modern world and watch the light go out of their eyes. If you can get them to look away from their smart phone long enough to have a conversation.

I am guessing all those under 25 year olds in the US Navy know who Chester was

I would argue Guadalcanal was far more important than Midway as for turning the momentum in the pacific, and I am not sure how they can do a historically somewhat accurate account of Midway without making it seem like we were just damn lucky (which we were) more than anything else.

Guadalcanal was only possible because the Japanese Carrier Strike Fleet was basically eliminated at Midway.

To be fair, losing at Midway would have only probably meant the war going slower until we dropped the A bombs on them, but it was still to me the most pivotal moment in the Pacific War.

And for the love of all that is holy, may they not "Pearl Harbor-Affleck" the thing. Every time I see even a minute of that Affleck tainted hell-movie I have to take out my copy of Tora Tora Tora and watch the whole thing to get the bad taste out of my mouth.

How can they not Pearl Harbor--Affleck the thing....a movie which should have been called Doolittle Raid but nobody would have gone to see it....and be historically accurate in the time allotted for for-profit theater these days?

 

[williepete]

And they keep walking on your lawn!

Damn straight!

 

[martybegan]

Did the Japanese have a bomber that could reliably take a large bomb load from Midway to Oahu?

At this point newer US planes were becoming availible, and Pearl was basically covered in AA.

The Japanese never saw Midway as something to occupy to use, but to occupy to force the "One Big Battle" that was their Naval Strategy at the time.

The ‘big battle’ ended Dec 7, 1941. Except for 3 old carriers, every Allied Capital ship in the Pacific and Indonesia was either with Davy Jones or a smoldering wreck. The intent of the Japanese was to shatter our Navy then negotiate a peace agreement to give them Asia.

From my readings it wasn't. The idea was to cripple the Pacific Fleet, grab as much land as they could, then force the "big battle" with the US's remaining carriers and battleships before the US industry made up for the losses.

And as for the US battleships only two were total write-offs, and the Maryland and Tennessee were back in action a few months later.

Well, it was to negotiate a peace, I can dig up a link but I think we agree on that.

And yes, the Japanese were just coming out with a land based bomber with a 2900 mile range. It would have been back to San Diego for the fleet and the ship infrastructure at Pearl would have been hit.

They would have had to fielded a lot of those bombers to sustain enough pressure to force the US Fleet out of Hawaii. Look at what the Eight Air Force and Bomber Command had to throw at Germany just to SLOW their industrial output increase. (at least in 1944 or so, by 1945 the loss of raw materials also impacted German Industry)

I don't see anything that would force the US out of Oahu short of them losing the "One Big Battle" and then the Combined fleet basically parking itself off of Pearl waiting for troop transports to arrive. I also question the Japanese ability to find enough troops at the time to take Oahu AND keep up pressure in China and New Guinea.

But you forget the US Navy at the time of the battle was 3 old carriers and 7 cruisers. The only ‘big one’ would have been the loss of all 3 carriers instead of the one. That was it.

They wouldn’t have had to take Hawaii. Just being under the threat of bombers is enough to close shop and move your remaining ships to the mainland.

I doubt they would haul off and move out. The production of land based fighters had increased at that point. They could have flooded Oahu with them.

Plus you forget that the Japanese had no fighters that could range that far out. They would have to have stationed carriers by Hawaii to cover any land based bombers.

 

[g5000]

Here is an outstanding primer on the Battle of Midway, as seen from the Japanese perspective:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bd8_vO5zrjo