Trickle-Up Recession: The 1% Getting Real About the Permanent Fix for the Economy

[Andylusion]

I'm sorry you suck at your job and apparently hang out with guys who aren't good at anything. Good carpenters are methodical and careful....because they're NOT stupid. Getting hurt means you don't work, you don't work as a carpenter....you don't eat and the worst injury I ever suffered in decades of building things was I dropped a beam on my foot and lost a toenail a few days later. Hell I hurt myself worse playing golf.

And yeah, if I need a desk, I can make one, I'm going with a built-in one for my new house....which I designed btw.

So no, I don't need your useless ass, and if the farmers strike...well it's good that I'm an old country boy and know how to do many things...cause I had grandparents that taught me the old ways. And I applied some new tricks they never thought of.

Sounds like "let them eat cake"...

And, I wonder how many other people can do the things you do in the 1%? Those born into money especially? Care to speculate?

80% of Millionaires are first generation rich. They were not born into it, like the Kennedy's and other leftists that you support.

Being a Millionaire on paper is not all that tough.
In my neighborhood, it means you own a house.
And yes, when someone is defined as being a Millionaire we DON'T REALLY know what that means.

Well... yeah we do. A millionaire is defined as someone who has a million dollars net worth. Net worth, is your total assets, minus your total liabilities.

If you own less than a million in assets, you are not a millionaire. If you own $1.4 million in assets, but owe $500K in debt, you are not a millionaire.

If you have $1 Million dollars in assets, and have zero debt, you are a millionaire.

How do you not know what that really means?

 

[Silhouette]

The housing market, for example, is where a lot of millionaires were stripped of their stripes. When property values fell, equity that made them rich began evaporating like mist on a desert highway...And it isn't recovering well at all.

I heard one of the candidate talking about "lifting all the non-defense federal regulations".. "so people can get back to work". I think it was Kasich from Ohio. God help us if that is code for lifting regulations off the banks on new housing loans...because if you will remember, part of the big crash..a large part of it..was that people who had to rely on waffling jobs with no security of longterm employment (the mainstay of life after NAFTA and amnesty for illegal scabs), cannot prop up the paper that mortgages are written on. Everyone on both sides did a lot of dancing around the real issue (lack of jobs in the US) but when it came time to actually find a solution, they just ignored the problem, borrowed a crap ton of money from our enemy (Red China) and bound us beholden to them who would see us go under with a smile.. Great leadership DC!

Is it the fault of the people in our banana-republic job market that they needed and wanted a roof over their head? No. Can banks be wholly blamed for the outfall of outsourcing jobs over seas, inversions in industry locating offshores or illegals (mom, dad and the kids all) working for 1/3 of what it takes to actually pay one's bills in a single family track home? No. Americans have been undercut and stripped of opportunity all because people are greedy at the top of any company. Illegals, offshoring and inversions are all encouraged like the ivory trade, because that sweet sweet moolah at the top is just so damned enticing...enticing enough to gut America and leave her bleeding for dead..

And this is the catch-22 we are in precisely. That is the root of the weed. Yet, nobody can fault a tiny group of industrious people for practicing pure capitalism. What to do? Well, that's the question and the reason this thread was started. So far all I've seen is mud-slinging back and forth (Andylusion, I'm talking to you). Why not come up with ideas that solve the problem? Anyone avoiding solving the problem is not being patriotic.

I suggested either voluntary morality married to capitalism, or regulatory morality married to capitalism (like Canada, whose economy is kicking our ass right now and everyone gets healthcare covered without fear of losing their home...another root of the American economy's woes..)

 

[g5000]

I heard one of the candidate talking about "lifting all the non-defense federal regulations".. "so people can get back to work". I think it was Kasich from Ohio.

Kasich has called for a one year freeze on non-defense regulations, not lifting them.

"In order to get this economy moving again, I call for freezing regulations for a year except for the problem of public safety. I believe that we need to cut these taxes down, we need to be on a roadmap to balancing the budget, and we need to send power, money, and influence, the welfare department, the education department, job training, infrastructure, Medicaid, all of that out of Washington back to the states so we can run these programs from where we live to the top, not a one size fits all mentality that they have in Washington."

 

[Andylusion]

The housing market, for example, is where a lot of millionaires were stripped of their stripes. When property values fell, equity that made them rich began evaporating like mist on a desert highway...And it isn't recovering well at all.

I heard one of the candidate talking about "lifting all the non-defense federal regulations".. "so people can get back to work". I think it was Kasich from Ohio. God help us if that is code for lifting regulations off the banks on new housing loans...because if you will remember, part of the big crash..a large part of it..was that people who had to rely on waffling jobs with no security of longterm employment (the mainstay of life after NAFTA and amnesty for illegal scabs), cannot prop up the paper that mortgages are written on. Everyone on both sides did a lot of dancing around the real issue (lack of jobs in the US) but when it came time to actually find a solution, they just ignored the problem, borrowed a crap ton of money from our enemy (Red China) and bound us beholden to them who would see us go under with a smile.. Great leadership DC!

Is it the fault of the people in our banana-republic job market that they needed and wanted a roof over their head? No. Can banks be wholly blamed for the outfall of outsourcing jobs over seas, inversions in industry locating offshores or illegals (mom, dad and the kids all) working for 1/3 of what it takes to actually pay one's bills in a single family track home? No. Americans have been undercut and stripped of opportunity all because people are greedy at the top of any company. Illegals, offshoring and inversions are all encouraged like the ivory trade, because that sweet sweet moolah at the top is just so damned enticing...enticing enough to gut America and leave her bleeding for dead..

And this is the catch-22 we are in precisely. That is the root of the weed. Yet, nobody can fault a tiny group of industrious people for practicing pure capitalism. What to do? Well, that's the question and the reason this thread was started. So far all I've seen is mud-slinging back and forth (Andylusion, I'm talking to you). Why not come up with ideas that solve the problem? Anyone avoiding solving the problem is not being patriotic.

I suggested either voluntary morality married to capitalism, or regulatory morality married to capitalism (like Canada, whose economy is kicking our ass right now and everyone gets healthcare covered without fear of losing their home...another root of the American economy's woes..)

Classic..... "you are slinging mud" and just one line later "you are not patriotic". Implication: "You slinging mud is bad, but when I do it, it's ok".

Hypocrite. This is why no one engages with you in discussion, because you are a hypocrite. You insult others, then claim everyone else is insulting instead of discussing.

Canada's health care sucks. People come to the US for health care routinely, because their system is terrible.

Yes, Canada's economy is better than the US. I would agree. Interesting Canada's regulations on banks, are a fraction of what our regulations are. So while you claim we should follow Canada's example, you attack the idea that would make us more like Canada.

If you look up Canada's top trading partners, they are the USA of course, mainly due to us buying their oil and ore. Then China, and then Mexico.

Why isn't free-trade with Mexico and China killing Canadian jobs? Maybe, lower corporate taxes, and lower regulations? But you hate those ideas.

Moreover, you obviously have a problem with basic economics. Why does property have value? Because people want it. Why does a home generally go up in value? Because as the population increases, there are more people that want a home.

Pure and simple.

Little hint dude.... without immigration.... our population would be falling. Fast too. Want to know what happens to property values when the population falls?

That's what you get. Property worth nothing, in lonely abandoned areas.

Just completely block out all immigration, and you can have Detroits all over the country. An entire UDA, the United Detroits of America. A nation of ruin and decline.

You think housing prices fell in 2008, just wait until the population starts shrinking dramatically. Just go lookup the Japanese housing prices. Residential realestate prices, are now lower in Japan today, than they were in the 1980s.

But don't worry dude.... Their banks are highly regulated. That fixes everything, doesn't it?

And lastly, the whole 2008 crash was directly caused by banking laws and regulations and controls. Directly. Far from fixing everything, banking regulations caused the entire problem.

But hey... go for it man. Let's end immigration, end trade, and increase taxes.... and I promise you right now, the decade of the 2020s, will be so bad, the 1930s won't be called the great depression anymore.

 

[Silhouette]

I heard one of the candidate talking about "lifting all the non-defense federal regulations".. "so people can get back to work". I think it was Kasich from Ohio.

Kasich has called for a one year freeze on non-defense regulations, not lifting them.

"In order to get this economy moving again, I call for freezing regulations for a year except for the problem of public safety. I believe that we need to cut these taxes down, we need to be on a roadmap to balancing the budget, and we need to send power, money, and influence, the welfare department, the education department, job training, infrastructure, Medicaid, all of that out of Washington back to the states so we can run these programs from where we live to the top, not a one size fits all mentality that they have in Washington."

Look, I'm not saying Kasich would be bad for the US. Because all the people running for POTUS slather their party's agenda all over reality so that the real cures aren't found. Cures hurt. Medicine hurts. The next POTUS HAS to be willing to swallow non-party bitter pills in an effort to save the patient. The US is sick and this next four years is for realsies....make or break.... We'd do well to send a message to the best candidate (the one most willing to swallow bitter pills) that a deep introspection into the root problem (greed without morality in capitalism) is what is killing jobs...which in turn is killing the entire US economy.

Kasich naively dropping that he would lift regulations (for a year or whatever) without saying how this will affect other teetering aspects of the interdependent economies in the US that make up the whole, is foolish. These people need to get honest. That's why Christie is so appealing to me and always has been. His no-BS approach without narcissism (sorry Trump) is the right combination. I would be thrilled with a more honest and humble and bold Kasich delivery and Christie. Kasich/Christie ticket. Unfortunately, people with Canadian birth certificates cannot run for president so...that other guy and the blathering Rubio are right out of the picture.

Sanders and Clinton are sellouts to the Rainbow Reicht which is making frightening advances towards children, stripping them of the necessities of life (a mother or father), FOR life..and teaching them to like and enjoy anal sex, right in their schools. People who hold to or sympathize with such agendas should not only not be running for Office or expecting votes, they should be in jail for attempting to aid and abet child endangerment..

 

[g5000]

I heard one of the candidate talking about "lifting all the non-defense federal regulations".. "so people can get back to work". I think it was Kasich from Ohio.

Kasich has called for a one year freeze on non-defense regulations, not lifting them.

"In order to get this economy moving again, I call for freezing regulations for a year except for the problem of public safety. I believe that we need to cut these taxes down, we need to be on a roadmap to balancing the budget, and we need to send power, money, and influence, the welfare department, the education department, job training, infrastructure, Medicaid, all of that out of Washington back to the states so we can run these programs from where we live to the top, not a one size fits all mentality that they have in Washington."

Look, I'm not saying Kasich would be bad for the US.

You said you thought Kasich wanted to lift all non-defense regulations. That is inaccurate. I corrected your inaccuracy.

If you want to fix things, you have to start from the truth.

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

I heard one of the candidate talking about "lifting all the non-defense federal regulations".. "so people can get back to work". I think it was Kasich from Ohio.

Kasich has called for a one year freeze on non-defense regulations, not lifting them.

"In order to get this economy moving again, I call for freezing regulations for a year except for the problem of public safety. I believe that we need to cut these taxes down, we need to be on a roadmap to balancing the budget, and we need to send power, money, and influence, the welfare department, the education department, job training, infrastructure, Medicaid, all of that out of Washington back to the states so we can run these programs from where we live to the top, not a one size fits all mentality that they have in Washington."

Look, I'm not saying Kasich would be bad for the US. Because all the people running for POTUS slather their party's agenda all over reality so that the real cures aren't found. Cures hurt. Medicine hurts. The next POTUS HAS to be willing to swallow non-party bitter pills in an effort to save the patient. The US is sick and this next four years is for realsies....make or break.... We'd do well to send a message to the best candidate (the one most willing to swallow bitter pills) that a deep introspection into the root problem (greed without morality in capitalism) is what is killing jobs...which in turn is killing the entire US economy.

Kasich naively dropping that he would lift regulations (for a year or whatever) without saying how this will affect other teetering aspects of the interdependent economies in the US that make up the whole, is foolish. These people need to get honest. That's why Christie is so appealing to me and always has been. His no-BS approach without narcissism (sorry Trump) is the right combination. I would be thrilled with a more honest and humble and bold Kasich delivery and Christie. Kasich/Christie ticket. Unfortunately, people with Canadian birth certificates cannot run for president so...that other guy and the blathering Rubio are right out of the picture.

Sanders and Clinton are sellouts to the Rainbow Reicht which is making frightening advances towards children, stripping them of the necessities of life (a mother or father), FOR life..and teaching them to like and enjoy anal sex, right in their schools. People who hold to or sympathize with such agendas should not only not be running for Office or expecting votes, they should be in jail for attempting to aid and abet child endangerment..

Unfortunately, people with Canadian birth certificates cannot run for president so...that other guy and the blathering Rubio are right out of the picture.

Yeah, Cruz would be great.

Why don't you tell me 3 things you most like about Cruz, aside from the birth issue?

 

[Silhouette]

So Kasich or "Things I like about Cruz". These are diversions. Let's look for solutions to our economic woes people (jobs that can sustain new housing loans realistically, with good security and protection from foreclosures due to even minor family health emergencies)...

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

So Kasich or "Things I like about Cruz". These are diversions. Let's look for solutions to our economic woes people (jobs that can sustain new housing loans realistically, with good security and protection from foreclosures due to even minor family health emergencies)...

"Things I like about Cruz". These are diversions.

So take a minute to answer and it will no longer be a diversion.

 

[Andylusion]

I heard one of the candidate talking about "lifting all the non-defense federal regulations".. "so people can get back to work". I think it was Kasich from Ohio.

Kasich has called for a one year freeze on non-defense regulations, not lifting them.

"In order to get this economy moving again, I call for freezing regulations for a year except for the problem of public safety. I believe that we need to cut these taxes down, we need to be on a roadmap to balancing the budget, and we need to send power, money, and influence, the welfare department, the education department, job training, infrastructure, Medicaid, all of that out of Washington back to the states so we can run these programs from where we live to the top, not a one size fits all mentality that they have in Washington."

Look, I'm not saying Kasich would be bad for the US. Because all the people running for POTUS slather their party's agenda all over reality so that the real cures aren't found. Cures hurt. Medicine hurts. The next POTUS HAS to be willing to swallow non-party bitter pills in an effort to save the patient. The US is sick and this next four years is for realsies....make or break.... We'd do well to send a message to the best candidate (the one most willing to swallow bitter pills) that a deep introspection into the root problem (greed without morality in capitalism) is what is killing jobs...which in turn is killing the entire US economy.

Kasich naively dropping that he would lift regulations (for a year or whatever) without saying how this will affect other teetering aspects of the interdependent economies in the US that make up the whole, is foolish. These people need to get honest. That's why Christie is so appealing to me and always has been. His no-BS approach without narcissism (sorry Trump) is the right combination. I would be thrilled with a more honest and humble and bold Kasich delivery and Christie. Kasich/Christie ticket. Unfortunately, people with Canadian birth certificates cannot run for president so...that other guy and the blathering Rubio are right out of the picture.

Sanders and Clinton are sellouts to the Rainbow Reicht which is making frightening advances towards children, stripping them of the necessities of life (a mother or father), FOR life..and teaching them to like and enjoy anal sex, right in their schools. People who hold to or sympathize with such agendas should not only not be running for Office or expecting votes, they should be in jail for attempting to aid and abet child endangerment..

The problem is, everything that you have indicated you support in this thread thus far.... is like claiming that the solution to polio, is to infect them with ebola.

You haven't even made the case yet, that America is sick. The US GDP is higher than it's ever been. The tax revenue is higher than it's ever been. The US manufacturing output, is higher this year, than it has ever been.

Now could it be better? Sure. But I would argue the solution is to go back to what was working before, not adopt more of the policies that got us where we are.

 

[Silhouette]

I heard one of the candidate talking about "lifting all the non-defense federal regulations".. "so people can get back to work". I think it was Kasich from Ohio.

Kasich has called for a one year freeze on non-defense regulations, not lifting them.

"In order to get this economy moving again, I call for freezing regulations for a year except for the problem of public safety. I believe that we need to cut these taxes down, we need to be on a roadmap to balancing the budget, and we need to send power, money, and influence, the welfare department, the education department, job training, infrastructure, Medicaid, all of that out of Washington back to the states so we can run these programs from where we live to the top, not a one size fits all mentality that they have in Washington."

Look, I'm not saying Kasich would be bad for the US. Because all the people running for POTUS slather their party's agenda all over reality so that the real cures aren't found. Cures hurt. Medicine hurts. The next POTUS HAS to be willing to swallow non-party bitter pills in an effort to save the patient. The US is sick and this next four years is for realsies....make or break.... We'd do well to send a message to the best candidate (the one most willing to swallow bitter pills) that a deep introspection into the root problem (greed without morality in capitalism) is what is killing jobs...which in turn is killing the entire US economy.

Kasich naively dropping that he would lift regulations (for a year or whatever) without saying how this will affect other teetering aspects of the interdependent economies in the US that make up the whole, is foolish. These people need to get honest. That's why Christie is so appealing to me and always has been. His no-BS approach without narcissism (sorry Trump) is the right combination. I would be thrilled with a more honest and humble and bold Kasich delivery and Christie. Kasich/Christie ticket. Unfortunately, people with Canadian birth certificates cannot run for president so...that other guy and the blathering Rubio are right out of the picture.

Sanders and Clinton are sellouts to the Rainbow Reicht which is making frightening advances towards children, stripping them of the necessities of life (a mother or father), FOR life..and teaching them to like and enjoy anal sex, right in their schools. People who hold to or sympathize with such agendas should not only not be running for Office or expecting votes, they should be in jail for attempting to aid and abet child endangerment..

The problem is, everything that you have indicated you support in this thread thus far.... is like claiming that the solution to polio, is to infect them with ebola....You haven't even made the case yet, that America is sick. The US GDP is higher than it's ever been. The tax revenue is higher than it's ever been. The US manufacturing output, is higher this year, than it has ever been....Now could it be better? Sure. But I would argue the solution is to go back to what was working before, not adopt more of the policies that got us where we are.

That's part of the beauty of being one of the 99%. We are all in the same lot so I don't need to prove what is pinching their pocketbook right into their pelvic bone every time they move. The pain is a daily reminder. And, we vote in the majority. Though you did try to give the 1% a supermajority with Citizen's United..one of the most unpatriotic and seditious Court Rulings since the dawn of our nation.

America is a notion conceived of not lightly. The strict parameters put in place in the beginning here were to keep the very types of mentalities and coups for power from taking democracy away from a People. You think you're being clever; or, your greed has blinded you...or...you're posting from an office in Moscow...either way, your seditious spin is the seed of what's destroying our economy, and thereby, our nation. Destroying a nation isn't a light thing. It's a very serious and grave offense.

 

[Andylusion]

I heard one of the candidate talking about "lifting all the non-defense federal regulations".. "so people can get back to work". I think it was Kasich from Ohio.

Kasich has called for a one year freeze on non-defense regulations, not lifting them.

"In order to get this economy moving again, I call for freezing regulations for a year except for the problem of public safety. I believe that we need to cut these taxes down, we need to be on a roadmap to balancing the budget, and we need to send power, money, and influence, the welfare department, the education department, job training, infrastructure, Medicaid, all of that out of Washington back to the states so we can run these programs from where we live to the top, not a one size fits all mentality that they have in Washington."

Look, I'm not saying Kasich would be bad for the US. Because all the people running for POTUS slather their party's agenda all over reality so that the real cures aren't found. Cures hurt. Medicine hurts. The next POTUS HAS to be willing to swallow non-party bitter pills in an effort to save the patient. The US is sick and this next four years is for realsies....make or break.... We'd do well to send a message to the best candidate (the one most willing to swallow bitter pills) that a deep introspection into the root problem (greed without morality in capitalism) is what is killing jobs...which in turn is killing the entire US economy.

Kasich naively dropping that he would lift regulations (for a year or whatever) without saying how this will affect other teetering aspects of the interdependent economies in the US that make up the whole, is foolish. These people need to get honest. That's why Christie is so appealing to me and always has been. His no-BS approach without narcissism (sorry Trump) is the right combination. I would be thrilled with a more honest and humble and bold Kasich delivery and Christie. Kasich/Christie ticket. Unfortunately, people with Canadian birth certificates cannot run for president so...that other guy and the blathering Rubio are right out of the picture.

Sanders and Clinton are sellouts to the Rainbow Reicht which is making frightening advances towards children, stripping them of the necessities of life (a mother or father), FOR life..and teaching them to like and enjoy anal sex, right in their schools. People who hold to or sympathize with such agendas should not only not be running for Office or expecting votes, they should be in jail for attempting to aid and abet child endangerment..

The problem is, everything that you have indicated you support in this thread thus far.... is like claiming that the solution to polio, is to infect them with ebola....You haven't even made the case yet, that America is sick. The US GDP is higher than it's ever been. The tax revenue is higher than it's ever been. The US manufacturing output, is higher this year, than it has ever been....Now could it be better? Sure. But I would argue the solution is to go back to what was working before, not adopt more of the policies that got us where we are.

That's part of the beauty of being one of the 99%. We are all in the same lot so I don't need to prove what is pinching their pocketbook right into their pelvic bone every time they move. The pain is a daily reminder. And, we vote in the majority. Though you did try to give the 1% a supermajority with Citizen's United..one of the most unpatriotic and seditious Court Rulings since the dawn of our nation.

America is a notion conceived of not lightly. The strict parameters put in place in the beginning here were to keep the very types of mentalities and coups for power from taking democracy away from a People. You think you're being clever; or, your greed has blinded you...or...you're posting from an office in Moscow...either way, your seditious spin is the seed of what's destroying our economy, and thereby, our nation. Destroying a nation isn't a light thing. It's a very serious and grave offense.

You say you are not a left-winger, and yet in every post you make arguments that are hallmark of leftist ideology. Don't you see what you said there? "We don't need facts. We have opinion! Trust is determined by opinion in our world!"

And isn't it interesting....

Your most 20K a year explains quite a bit why you are so extreme right. I guess you may very well be a convicted felon since they are the most vocal and make the least money for a job.

Then you:

That's part of the beauty of being one of the 99%. We are all in the same lot so I don't need to prove what is pinching their pocketbook right into their pelvic bone every time they move.

So one left-wing idiot tells me that because I earn so little, my opinion doesn't matter. Then another left-wing idiot tells me that only his opinion matters, because he earns less.

I make $20,000 a year. I wager you earn a heck of a lot more. Therefore my opinion matters more than yours.

So far all I've seen is mud-slinging back and forth (Andylusion, I'm talking to you).

Then you say

your greed has blinded you...or...you're posting from an office in Moscow...either way, your seditious spin is the seed of what's destroying our economy, and thereby, our nation. Destroying a nation isn't a light thing. It's a very serious and grave offense

Whose slinging mud now? Do as you say, not as you do, huh? Lead by example preacher. Doctor, heal yourself.

Hypocrites. All of you on the left, all hypocrites.

If you don't need facts, then nor does anyone else, and all your blaw blaw blaw, is all BS, because we had an opinion poll, and the vote was against you. So, you are wrong. The poll determines truth now. We don't need to prove anything. So you are just wrong. Period. You can leave now. Have a nice day.

 

[Silhouette]

Hypocrites. All of you on the left, all hypocrites.

If you don't need facts, then nor does anyone else, and all your blaw blaw blaw, is all BS, because we had an opinion poll, and the vote was against you. So, you are wrong. The poll determines truth now. We don't need to prove anything. So you are just wrong. Period. You can leave now. Have a nice day.

I'm not a leftist. I'm a centrist. Might want to read a few of my threads to figure that out.

 

[Indeependent]

Hypocrites. All of you on the left, all hypocrites.

If you don't need facts, then nor does anyone else, and all your blaw blaw blaw, is all BS, because we had an opinion poll, and the vote was against you. So, you are wrong. The poll determines truth now. We don't need to prove anything. So you are just wrong. Period. You can leave now. Have a nice day.

I'm not a leftist. I'm a centrist. Might want to read a few of my threads to figure that out.

You're not a centrist by any means.
Or you're too young to remember how many people became multi-millionaires before cheap labor.

 

[Silhouette]

You're not a centrist by any means.
Or you're too young to remember how many people became multi-millionaires before cheap labor.

I absolutely am a centrist. Are you aware of my position on gay marriage and all the other LGBT cult dogma/issues?

I have one grandparent born in the 1800s, so I heard about things back in the day.

 

[hadit]

Automation is inevitable. It simply doesn't make sense to pay a human worker more to get less quality, fewer hours worked, and adversarial work relations.

The Canadian "solution" is the true band-aid that merely preserves artificially high wages a little longer. Forcing companies to pay human workers more than it costs to run automated systems is thinly disguised welfare. How is it different from government make-work projects where people are paid to sweep sidewalks, pick up trash and remove graffiti?

The future reality is this. Manual labor jobs, and those not requiring much creativity or complex decision making, WILL be replaced by automated systems. Heck, even computer programming is heading that direction. You used to have to able to write low-level functions to move data around on the computer and display it, which resulted in a lot of programmers getting paid a lot of money to do things that the OS does automatically today. Just like the buggy manufacturers of yesteryear bewailed the loss of their craft and could not envision the auto industry, there are vast opportunities ahead that we can't really grasp today.

 

[Silhouette]

Automation is inevitable. It simply doesn't make sense to pay a human worker more to get less quality, fewer hours worked, and adversarial work relations.

.

Wrong. Take a look at the title of this thread and meditate on it. If you strip the masses of jobs, they don't shop for your product anymore. Automation isn't inevitable in Canada. They put a legal cap on it because they know how to do the simple math of trickle-up recession. Older countries that have been around the block of brinksmanship enough to know, have figured out that if you let small numbers of greedy people manipulate the masses out of jobs and a share in the pie, it always comes back to haunt this tiny group of super rich people. Always. You can hang your hat on that.

So the mess we're in now will not be made better by stripping even more jobs away from people who need them. You need them to consume. So how the hell are they going to do that without a decent income? The reality of their month to month lives means they can't buy your frivolous products anymore. So if you're a capitalist, I suggest switching over to maximum necessities or get ready to file for bankruptcy along with the masses.

How many of these "workers" will take a cruise this year? Go shopping at Walmart? Buy a new Ford car? Get a new set of clothes? A new Iphone? Buy a new house? ....

 

[hadit]

Automation is inevitable. It simply doesn't make sense to pay a human worker more to get less quality, fewer hours worked, and adversarial work relations.

.

Wrong. Take a look at the title of this thread and meditate on it. If you strip the masses of jobs, they don't shop for your product anymore. Automation isn't inevitable in Canada. They put a legal cap on it because they know how to do the simple math of trickle-up recession. Older countries that have been around the block of brinksmanship enough to know, have figured out that if you let small numbers of greedy people manipulate the masses out of jobs and a share in the pie, it always comes back to haunt this tiny group of super rich people. Always. You can hang your hat on that.

So the mess we're in now will not be made better by stripping even more jobs away from people who need them. You need them to consume. So how the hell are they going to do that without a decent income? The reality of their month to month lives means they can't buy your frivolous products anymore. So if you're a capitalist, I suggest switching over to maximum necessities or get ready to file for bankruptcy along with the masses.

Okay, and while we're at it, jack the price of gasoline by 20 cents a gallon so we can hire people to pump our gas for us, raise banking fees to cover hiring more tellers so we can get rid of ATM's and outlaw residential kitchens so we can hire more fast food workers. Face it, every single time you use a washing machine, you're robbing someone of a job. Every time you cook a meal at home, you're robbing someone of a job. See where it ends up? We didn't take that approach when we came up with those devices and as a result, created many new industries and jobs. When the first cars came out, the owner had to know how to almost literally strip it down and rebuild it. Not so much now. The same will happen again as new technologies create opportunities unforeseen. Would you have denied customers access to GPS systems because map publishers were crying that their jobs would be eliminated? Every technological advance has brought with it change. Old jobs and industries are eliminated and new ones replace them. Assuming a static model where things don't change and new opportunities don't arise is fallacious.

 

[Silhouette]

Okay, and while we're at it, jack the price of gasoline by 20 cents a gallon so we can hire people to pump our gas for us, raise banking fees to cover hiring more tellers so we can get rid of ATM's and outlaw residential kitchens so we can hire more fast food workers. Face it, every single time you use a washing machine, you're robbing someone of a job. Every time you cook a meal at home, you're robbing someone of a job. See where it ends up? We didn't take that approach when we came up with those devices and as a result, created many new industries and jobs. When the first cars came out, the owner had to know how to almost literally strip it down and rebuild it. Not so much now. The same will happen again as new technologies create opportunities unforeseen. Would you have denied customers access to GPS systems because map publishers were crying that their jobs would be eliminated?

We wouldn't need to if the top 1% were happy with less obscene wealth. I'm old enough to have seen how the routine goes. At first, the budding entrepreneur starts up a business and treats his employees fairly well. Pays them well and they do well for him in exchange so that the product is a success and everyone benefits. Then begins the shaving. I've known several entrepreneurs over the decades and have seen this played out in exactly the same way with almost no exceptions. At first it's 'we can't afford a pay raise right now' (translation, my wife wants a second home by the lake and it's costing me a fortune). Then it's I'm sorry, we have to cut you to part time (translation, your health insurance premiums are forcing me to not take my third European vacation this year). Then it's "sorry, we have to lay you off" (translation: because you're accruing too much retirement and if I pay you for not working after you retire, I can't send my lazy, spoiled, underachieving sons to Harvard later on).

Finally it's "well we're installing robots and the few jobs that are left we're giving to Mexicans" (translation: I've lost all touch with why I started my business in the first place and now I'm just addicted to outdoing the neighbors in our gated community).

 

[hadit]

Okay, and while we're at it, jack the price of gasoline by 20 cents a gallon so we can hire people to pump our gas for us, raise banking fees to cover hiring more tellers so we can get rid of ATM's and outlaw residential kitchens so we can hire more fast food workers. Face it, every single time you use a washing machine, you're robbing someone of a job. Every time you cook a meal at home, you're robbing someone of a job. See where it ends up? We didn't take that approach when we came up with those devices and as a result, created many new industries and jobs. When the first cars came out, the owner had to know how to almost literally strip it down and rebuild it. Not so much now. The same will happen again as new technologies create opportunities unforeseen. Would you have denied customers access to GPS systems because map publishers were crying that their jobs would be eliminated?

We wouldn't need to if the top 1% were happy with less obscene wealth. I'm old enough to have seen how the routine goes. At first, the budding entrepreneur starts up a business and treats his employees fairly well. Pays them well and they do well for him in exchange so that the product is a success and everyone benefits. Then begins the shaving. I've known several entrepreneurs over the decades and have seen this played out in exactly the same way with almost no exceptions. At first it's 'we can't afford a pay raise right now' (translation, my wife wants a second home by the lake and it's costing me a fortune). Then it's I'm sorry, we have to cut you to part time (translation, your health insurance premiums are forcing me to not take my third European vacation this year). Then it's "sorry, we have to lay you off" (translation: because you're accruing too much retirement and if I pay you for not working after you retire, I can't send my lazy, spoiled, underachieving sons to Harvard later on).

Finally it's "well we're installing robots and the few jobs that are left we're giving to Mexicans" (translation: I've lost all touch with why I started my business in the first place and now I'm just addicted to outdoing the neighbors in our gated community).

Since you know these entrepreneurs, have you asked them what it is like to work for very little, sometimes nothing, for years or decades just to get a company off the ground? Have you asked them what it's like to sacrifice time with their family, miss children's birthdays and anniversaries because there were things they had to do or their company would fail and all their employees would be out of a job? If starting and running a successful business was easy, everyone would be doing it. There's a reason they're not.

What you're seeing is the final result of a successful company and the person who made all the sacrifices and took all the risks finally enjoying some of the rewards. I would posit that those original employees that stuck with him are likely enjoying a lot of that success as well.