Toughest gun laws...record homicide...same city...

[asaratis]

So the tightening of gun laws has meant more guns on the streets?

That doesn't sound like a great piece of legislation!

More lawful guns dropped Chicago from 7th to 23rd in homicide.

No they didn't.

"Lawful" guns generally lead to more suicides by gun..and accidental shootings.

Not a drop in crime.

Do either of you have links to valid stats or are you just stating how you think it is?

 

[mudwhistle]

I think that all gun threads should be banned.

 

[Saigon]

]Do you mean to say that if all the US had the same gun rules as does Chicago, the gang members in Chicago would not be able to procure guns?

I can't speak for Joe, but I would say that if Illinois (and neighbouring states) had the same safety-based laws as are used in Canada, France, the UK or Germany, they would likely also have a homicide rate roughly similar to the mean average of those countries.

That could mean a drop of more than half.

They would have to get rid of the gang culture to be considered comparable in human behavior. Chicago is a cesspool and a Mecca for worthless punks.

I totally agree that the gang culture is at the heart of the problem, but if you make it harder for gangs to get guns, they will be less able to rob, murder and intimidate people.

Paris, Berlin and London all have gangs - but those gangs don't have a lot of guns. Hence, they don't kill a lot of people.

 

[zeke]

I think that all gun threads should be banned.

No shit. Would you tell bigrebbie that? I have read the same fuking thing said over and over and over and over.........

and not one person seems to have changed their minds.......about anything gun related.

Can't we all just agree we here in the USA don't give a flying fuk about how many preventable gun deaths there are? It's just the way the country is made.

Sure would make things easier. And less redundant. Then maybe we could argue about something less explosive.........like abortions.

 

[Sallow]

More lawful guns dropped Chicago from 7th to 23rd in homicide.

No they didn't.

"Lawful" guns generally lead to more suicides by gun..and accidental shootings.

Not a drop in crime.

Do either of you have links to valid stats or are you just stating how you think it is?

From the US?

Private organizations track gun shootings. The NRA effectively banned the CDC and the ATF from doing that tracking.

But in terms of the US and the rest of the world? From the metrics we do have, comparable nations experience far less gun violence then the US.

 

[Seawytch]

No they didn't.

"Lawful" guns generally lead to more suicides by gun..and accidental shootings.

Not a drop in crime.

Do either of you have links to valid stats or are you just stating how you think it is?

From the US?

Private organizations track gun shootings. The NRA effectively banned the CDC and the ATF from doing that tracking.

But in terms of the US and the rest of the world? From the metrics we do have, comparable nations experience far less gun violence then the US.

Yes, the good old NRA...paid for by the gun manufacturers. They made sure that there could be no valid statistics. Scary brilliant.

 

[thanatos144]

Do either of you have links to valid stats or are you just stating how you think it is?

From the US?

Private organizations track gun shootings. The NRA effectively banned the CDC and the ATF from doing that tracking.

But in terms of the US and the rest of the world? From the metrics we do have, comparable nations experience far less gun violence then the US.

Yes, the good old NRA...paid for by the gun manufacturers. They made sure that there could be no valid statistics. Scary brilliant.

Good old Barack Obama paid for by the rich trial lawyer, Corporate raiders, Mega Banks, Hedge fund brokers, Communist Rich guys, And wealthy Media....Yep....You are a damn hypocrite.

 

[Saigon]

And wealthy Media.

Um...dude, the media has never had less money than it has right now.

 

[auditor0007]

News From AP | TBO.com


Police say the homicide rate is a reflection of the city's gang problem and a proliferation of guns. Chicago has for years tried to cut off the flow of guns. It has what city officials have called the strictest handgun ordinance in the U.S.


Note that cutting the flow of guns to law abiding citizens has not affected the flow of guns to criminals. You liberal gun-grabbers try to remember that!

I really despise when people use statistics in a one sided manner, especially when they twist the statistics to meet their agenda. You see, while the homicide rate has increased a bit in the past year, it is still almost half of what it was in the early 90's. I'm talking about the city of Chicago. You see, I lived there in the early 90's and the homicide rate was pushing 1000 every year. Now it's a bit over 500 and you guys are trying to tell us that the gun control laws are to blame.

Now truthfully, I am against the Chicago gun ban. I also support bans against most semi-automatic weapons, so I guess I'm one of those wishy washy people who fall in the middle. In the end, I really don't care. I don't currently own a gun because as much as I love my two teenage sons, they are both hot heads, and I just figure we're all better off without a gun in the house. Not that I worry about them using it on me but possibly on each other. They really can't stand each other at times. Once they are gone, I'll probably buy a gun. On the other hand, my stepson owns a lot of guns. He thinks you should be permitted to own a full arsenal. Come to think of it, he scares me at times, just a little. But overall, I think I trust him.

Anyway, my point isn't to make a point about my stand on guns and/or gun control. It's to point out the fact that you, and many others, continue to use Chicago as some battle cry against gun bans. Well, the fact is that the gun bans really don't have anything to do with the murder rate in a positive or negative way. The truth is that most of the killings are gangbangers killing other gangbangers. Unfortunately, most of them are really bad shots and end up killing innocent bystanders. As for Chicago being a safe city, I lived there for 15 years, when the homicide rate was double what it is now. The people who live in fear are the poor who live in neighborhoods run by the gangs. Fortunately, that is not most of Chicago.

 

[thanatos144]

And wealthy Media.

Um...dude, the media has never had less money than it has right now.

Um dude they are still wealthy .....Try spinning elsewhere

 

[martybegan]

Meanwhile, back in Factland - Illinois now rates #23 in gun-related homicide rates by state (2012 stats). In 2004 it ranked #7.

Joe is absolutely right that local gun control is never going to work very effectively when you have other states wit more liberal gun laws right next door, but it does seem to have also had some effect.

Gun crime statistics by US state: download the data. Visualised | World news | guardian.co.uk

We had a 9 day streak of no homocides in NYC last week.

Thats part and parcel with our tough gun laws.

No, it was due to the cold weather. It was too cold for the skells to be out on the street.

NYC's gun laws do nothing to prevent criminals from using guns. All they do is make it too hard for normal people to own guns.

Unless you are a cop, or a fireman, or a friend of someone in the government, then you get whatever you want. NYC's gun laws are cronyism, nothing but.

 

[AceRothstein]

Record homicide? Is it 1991 again?

 

[asaratis]

Tale of two cities: Homicides plummet in New York, leap in Chicago - U.S. News

New York evidently runs an effective program to remove ILLEGAL guns from the streets.

Kelly, the New York police commissioner, stressed that point Friday, saying his officers had taken 8,000 weapons "out of the hands of people we stop, 800 of them illegal handguns."

I'm wondering what the owners of legal guns have to do to get theirs back. In my county, you have to produce the original receipt from the gun store where it was purchased and evidence regarding how the gun got to you (gift, private sale, inherited).