Zone1 The War In Heaven

[Slade3200]

You asked him to withdraw his spirit from you. He just gave you what you asked for

True but I might change my mind. Why wouldn’t he forgive me and give me another chance?

 

[Slade3200]

No. It’s your judgment. You judge yourself. It’s your choice. I’m pretty sure you’ll recognize the gravity of the moment. I’m not sure you will be able to accept God though.

Ok, well let me reverse my question. What if I accept God and make it to heaven, is that for eternity or can I be sent to hell if I change my mind?

 

[ding]

Ok, well let me reverse my question. What if I accept God and make it to heaven, is that for eternity or can I be sent to hell if I change my mind?

Sure. But again, you aren’t being sent to hell. You are asking him to remove his spirit from you.

 

[ding]

True but I might change my mind. Why wouldn’t he forgive me and give me another chance?

Didn’t I already answer this?

He gave you every chance possible. It was your choice. Consequences are what they are. You can’t pick and choose what you want them to be.

 

[onefour1]

Angels are spirit beings. All dwelling in heaven( Gods dwelling place) are spirit beings.
Adam was perfect and sinned, he doesnt have a chance at redemption with God.

What I believe about angels:

Doctrine and Covenants 129
1 There are two kinds of beings in heaven, namely: Angels, who are resurrected personages, having bodies of flesh and bones—
2 For instance, Jesus said: Handle me and see, for a spirit hath not flesh and bones, as ye see me have.
3 Secondly: the spirits of just men made perfect, they who are not resurrected, but inherit the same glory.
4 When a messenger comes saying he has a message from God, offer him your hand and request him to shake hands with you.
5 If he be an angel he will do so, and you will feel his hand.
6 If he be the spirit of a just man made perfect he will come in his glory; for that is the only way he can appear—
7 Ask him to shake hands with you, but he will not move, because it is contrary to the order of heaven for a just man to deceive; but he will still deliver his message.
8 If it be the devil as an angel of light, when you ask him to shake hands he will offer you his hand, and you will not feel anything; you may therefore detect him.
9 These are three grand keys whereby you may know whether any administration is from God.

Just men made perfect can be spirits who have not yet come to the earth or spirits that have come to the earth but are not yet resurrected. Resurrected beings are those who have received an immortal body of flesh and bones and are as tangible as you or I.

Adam was not perfect or else he would not have sinned. Adam and Eve were given the opportunity to repent and thus were given the opportunity through the atoning sacrifice of Jesus Christ to return unto our Father in heaven with a clean slate.

Moses 5:1-12
1 And it came to pass that after I, the Lord God, had driven them out, that Adam began to till the earth, and to have dominion over all the beasts of the field, and to eat his bread by the sweat of his brow, as I the Lord had commanded him. And Eve, also, his wife, did labor with him.
2 And Adam knew his wife, and she bare unto him sons and daughters, and they began to multiply and to replenish the earth.
3 And from that time forth, the sons and daughters of Adam began to divide two and two in the land, and to till the land, and to tend flocks, and they also begat sons and daughters.
4 And Adam and Eve, his wife, called upon the name of the Lord, and they heard the voice of the Lord from the way toward the Garden of Eden, speaking unto them, and they saw him not; for they were shut out from his presence.
5 And he gave unto them commandments, that they should worship the Lord their God, and should offer the firstlings of their flocks, for an offering unto the Lord. And Adam was obedient unto the commandments of the Lord.
6 And after many days an angel of the Lord appeared unto Adam, saying: Why dost thou offer sacrifices unto the Lord? And Adam said unto him: I know not, save the Lord commanded me.
7 And then the angel spake, saying: This thing is a similitude of the sacrifice of the Only Begotten of the Father, which is full of grace and truth.
8 Wherefore, thou shalt do all that thou doest in the name of the Son, and thou shalt repent and call upon God in the name of the Son forevermore.
9 And in that day the Holy Ghost fell upon Adam, which beareth record of the Father and the Son, saying: I am the Only Begotten of the Father from the beginning, henceforth and forever, that as thou hast fallen thou mayest be redeemed, and all mankind, even as many as will.
10 And in that day Adam blessed God and was filled, and began to prophesy concerning all the families of the earth, saying: Blessed be the name of God, for because of my transgression my eyes are opened, and in this life I shall have joy, and again in the flesh I shall see God.
11 And Eve, his wife, heard all these things and was glad, saying: Were it not for our transgression we never should have had seed, and never should have known good and evil, and the joy of our redemption, and the eternal life which God giveth unto all the obedient.
12 And Adam and Eve blessed the name of God, and they made all things known unto their sons and their daughters.

 

[Slade3200]

Sure. But again, you aren’t being sent to hell. You are asking him to remove his spirit from you.

Ok so post judgement I can go to heaven and then reject gods spirit and go to hell… but I can’t ask for Gods spirit once I’m in hell because that’s for eternity. Is that right?

Hell is forever and heaven is stay if you want. Right?

 

[ding]

Ok so post judgement I can go to heaven and then reject gods spirit and go to hell… but I can’t ask for Gods spirit once I’m in hell because that’s for eternity. Is that right?

Hell is forever and heaven is stay if you want. Right?

Slow down. Who is doing the judging?

 

[Slade3200]

Slow down. Who is doing the judging?

You tell me, you brought up judgement

 

[BackAgain]

It depends on how you define "war". On this mortal earth, death is a reality. In heaven amongst immortal beings, there is no death. So a war in heaven would not include death but only a war of beliefs and words.

Depicted as pitched battles between angels with swords and spears and shields?

I’m not very religious. And symbology makes little sense to me. But it all seems contradictory.

 

[ding]

You tell me, you brought up judgement

But you are using it to make a point. So in the point you are making who is doing the judging? The distinction is important.

 

[Slade3200]

But you are using it to make a point. So in the point you are making who is doing the judging? The distinction is important.

Well I would say God and I think you would say that I’d be judging myself… I think both are the same thing.

The conditions are set by God so in the end it comes down to his will and his rules, right?

 

[onefour1]

So what do you believe? Can one’s fate be changed after judgement?

My personal belief is that the punishment of God will be something we would all wish we had avoided by repenting here on earth. However there is what is known as the unpardonable sin. I think those who commit the unpardonable sin will pay a very heavy price, ie the full price of their sins which may be for an endless duration. With others I think it may be possible to progress further after suffering a punishment from God for their unrepentant sins. But as my last post to you says, Endless and Eternal punishment does not necessarily mean that it is without end but that it is merely God's punishment. I think what this means is that if God feels that you have suffered enough, you may be allowed to progress further in the eternal scheme of things if God allows it. I think that God may be saying that it does not necessarily equate to a never ending punishment but it is still left as a mystery as to how great the punishment will be.

 

[ding]

Well I would say God and I think you would say that I’d be judging myself… I think both are the same thing.

The conditions are set by God so in the end it comes down to his will and his rules, right?

Actually I suspect your first hurdle would be to judge God. That shouldn’t be too hard because you’ve judged him most of your adult life. After that I would suspect you would judge yourself stripped of your ego such that you would see how you really were without the rose colored glasses you wear daily. Then I would suspect you would without a doubt choose God and then God would share more of himself and whether or not you could take it would depend upon how hard your heart really is. At that point you’ll know if you can stand the goodness and not ask him to take it away. Cause you are kind of screwed at that point because if you can’t stand the goodness so he takes it all away just like you wished for. That’s when you realize it really sucks to be devoid of goodness but changing your mind won’t help because you can’t take the goodness either.

 

[onefour1]

Depicted as pitched battles between angels with swords and spears and shields?
View attachment 737128

I’m not very religious. And symbology makes little sense to me. But it all seems contradictory.

One must ask, "How inspired is this picture?". No mention of any swords in the war in heaven and no mention of physical death either in scripture. This is simply the imagination of someone equating war in heaven with war on earth. Which I do not believe is the same.

 

[Slade3200]

My personal belief is that the punishment of God will be something we would all wish we had avoided by repenting here on earth. However there is what is known as the unpardonable sin. I think those who commit the unpardonable sin will pay a very heavy price, ie the full price of their sins which may be for an endless duration. With others I think it may be possible to progress further after suffering a punishment from God for their unrepentant sins. But as my last post to you says, Endless and Eternal punishment does not necessarily mean that it is without end but that it is merely God's punishment. I think what this means is that if God feels that you have suffered enough, you may be allowed to progress further in the eternal scheme of things if God allows it. I think that God may be saying that it does not necessarily equate to a never ending punishment but it is still left as a mystery as to how great the punishment will be.

Thanks for sharing. Do you get these ideas from a written doctrine or is it just and expression of what you think might happen?

 

[Slade3200]

My personal belief is that the punishment of God will be something we would all wish we had avoided by repenting here on earth. However there is what is known as the unpardonable sin. I think those who commit the unpardonable sin will pay a very heavy price, ie the full price of their sins which may be for an endless duration. With others I think it may be possible to progress further after suffering a punishment from God for their unrepentant sins. But as my last post to you says, Endless and Eternal punishment does not necessarily mean that it is without end but that it is merely God's punishment. I think what this means is that if God feels that you have suffered enough, you may be allowed to progress further in the eternal scheme of things if God allows it. I think that God may be saying that it does not necessarily equate to a never ending punishment but it is still left as a mystery as to how great the punishment will be.

Why would God want to be a part of making anybody suffer?

 

[Slade3200]

Actually I suspect your first hurdle would be to judge God. That shouldn’t be too hard because you’ve judged him most of your adult life. After that I would suspect you would judge yourself stripped of your ego such that you would see how you really were without the rose colored glasses you wear daily. Then I would suspect you would without a doubt choose God and then God would share more of himself and whether or not you could take it would depend upon how hard your heart really is. At that point you’ll know if you can stand the goodness and not ask him to take it away. Cause you are kind of screwed at that point because you can’t stand the goodness so he takes it all away just like you wished for. That’s when you realize it really sucks to be devoid of goodness but changing your mind won’t help because you can’t take the goodness either.

Doesn’t sound like God is very nice and forgiving in your scenario. Some people come with a lot of baggage… maybe a person just needs a few centuries of therapy in hell so they can work through their issues and then be ready to accept god

 

[onefour1]

Thanks for sharing. Do you get these ideas from a written doctrine or is it just and expression of what you think might happen?

I get my beliefs primarily from the Scriptures of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints. They can be found online at:

Scriptures

 

[ding]

Doesn’t sound like God is very nice and forgiving in your scenario. Some people come with a lot of baggage… maybe a person just needs a few centuries of therapy in hell so they can work through their issues and then be ready to accept god

Sounds like you have an external locus of control. You are being given every chance.

 

[ding]

Why would God want to be a part of making anybody suffer?

Not being genuine definitely plays a part in hardening a heart to God. God is spirit and must be worshipped in spirit and truth.