The Threat From Intelligent Design

[SpidermanTuba]

You're welcome. Seems to me that an elective course within the required humanities offerings is not out of line. ID/creationism is a belief, like buddhism of a substantial number of earth's inhabitants.

THen let them believe it on their own tax dollars, I'll not have mine spent teaching religion.

 

[manu1959]

THen let them believe it on their own tax dollars, I'll not have mine spent teaching religion.

why should your tax dollars teach what you want but not what i want.....why should the minority not be heard?

 

[SpidermanTuba]

Yea, the old liberals who are always screaming about freedom of speech and diversity on the educational campuses.

Freedom of speech does not apply when you're doing a job. I can't spend the lab classes I teach espousing my political beliefs on the students and then just plead "freedom of speech" when my boss finds out I haven't taught a lick of astronomy.

 

[SpidermanTuba]

why should your tax dollars teach what you want but not what i want.....why should the minority not be heard?

Because you want to teach kids religion, which is unconstitutional, and I want to teach them science, which is not only beneficial to their own futures but beneficial to the future of this nation.

 

[manu1959]

Because you want to teach kids religion, which is unconstitutional, and I want to teach them science, which is not only beneficial to their own futures but beneficial to the future of this nation.

where in the constitution does it say you can't teach religion in school?

how is teaching moral and ethical behavior any less benificail to the future of children and the future of this nation?

 

[SpidermanTuba]

where in the constitution does it say you can't teach religion in school?

Public school, manu, funded by public dollars. Its called the 1st amendment.

how is teaching moral and ethical behavior...

Who said anything about behavior? The topic here is intelligent design, its a idea, not a way to behave.

 

[manu1959]

Public school, manu, funded by public dollars. Its called the 1st amendment.

Who said anything about behavior? The topic here is intelligent design, its a idea, not a way to behave.

you are extrapolating that you can not teach religious morals and etchic in a public school....1st amendment was not writtent to preclude teaching religious ethics and morals in a public school it was written to preclude the church and the govt becoming one in the same.....there would be so much more power in teaching children the reilgious philosphys of the world rather than teaching them that religion is evil....children want what they can not have.....forbidding it makes it desireable

 

[SpidermanTuba]

you are extrapolating that you can not teach religious morals and etchic in a public school....1st amendment was not writtent to preclude teaching religious ethics and morals in a public school it was written to preclude the church and the govt becoming one in the same.....

The purpose of the 1st amendment is to divorce the church from the state and make our government secular.

there would be so much more power in teaching children the reilgious philosphys of the world rather than teaching them that religion is evil....children want what they can not have.....forbidding it makes it desireable

Since there is no public school class where the children are taught that religion is evil, at least not one that would be banned by the courts if a suit was brought, you have no point.

 

[manu1959]

The purpose of the 1st amendment is to divorce the church from the state and make our government secular.

Since there is no public school class where the children are taught that religion is evil, at least not one that would be banned by the courts if a suit was brought, you have no point.

i agree....what does a secular govt. have to do with what is taught in school?

if school does not aknowledge religion what message does that send? if a child asks a question about god in a science class and is told that god does not exist.....why should that be allowed? no one can prove it one way or another why should they be allowed to say it?

 

[SpidermanTuba]

i agree....what does a secular govt. have to do with what is taught in school?

The school is paid for with taxes raised by the government, that's what it has to do with it.

if school does not aknowledge religion what message does that send?

It sends no message. The DMV doesn't acknowledge religion when I go to get my licensed renewed, but I don't automatically assume they are a bunch of godless heathens trying to promote atheism.

if a child asks a question about god in a science class and is told that god does not exist.....why should that be allowed?

It shouldn't be allowed. I don't have any idea why you think it is. The correct answer from the teacher would be that science class is not a forum for discussing the existance or lack thereof of God.

no one can prove it one way or another why should they be allowed to say it?

They aren't, Manu. Either you are just making shit up or you are severely misled, I can't tell which.

 

[manu1959]

The school is paid for with taxes raised by the government, that's what it has to do with it.

It sends no message. The DMV doesn't acknowledge religion when I go to get my licensed renewed, but I don't automatically assume they are a bunch of godless heathens trying to promote atheism.

It shouldn't be allowed. I don't have any idea why you think it is. The correct answer from the teacher would be that science class is not a forum for discussing the existance or lack thereof of God.

They aren't, Manu. Either you are just making shit up or you are severely misled, I can't tell which.

how is teaching a child moral and ethical decissions of religion a bad thing?

when you are asked why the money says in god we trusts, which is what you pay you taxes with they pay the tearcher that diss your kid but you cant say one nation under god in the pledge all that is cool

nice straw man.

you are right my son and i did not experince this .... thank you so much for telling me that your rights and opinions outweigh mine.....thanks so much for supporting the plight of the minority

 

[SpidermanTuba]

how is teaching a child moral and ethical decissions of religion a bad thing?

Because moral questions are personal choices. I don't want to pay to have my children, or anyone else's children, taught that some things are morally right when I think they are morally wrong, or vice versa.

Its also, like I said, unconstitutional.

when you are asked why the money says in god we trusts, which is what you pay you taxes with they pay the tearcher that diss your kid but you cant say one nation under god in the pledge all that is cool

nice straw man.

Why are you talking to yourself? Yes, nice straw man, I agree, thanks for debunking your own argument.

Personally, I'd rather see "In God We Trust" taken off then money. No inconsistency in my viewpoints.

you are right my son and i did not experince this .... thank you so much for telling me that your rights and opinions outweigh mine.....thanks so much for supporting the plight of the minority

Teaching of science has nothing to do with your opinions. It has to do with the opinions of those who do the science. If you don't want your kids to be taught science, which is secular in nature and hence Constitutional, take them out of public school. Feel free to make them grow up dumb, its your choice.

 

[manu1959]

Because moral questions are personal choices. I don't want to pay to have my children, or anyone else's children, taught that some things are morally right when I think they are morally wrong, or vice versa.

Its also, like I said, unconstitutional.

Why are you talking to yourself? Yes, nice straw man, I agree, thanks for debunking your own argument.

Personally, I'd rather see "In God We Trust" taken off then money. No inconsistency in my viewpoints.

Teaching of science has nothing to do with your opinions. It has to do with the opinions of those who do the science. If you don't want your kids to be taught science, which is secular in nature and hence Constitutional, take them out of public school. Feel free to make them grow up dumb, its your choice.

you are hopeless....your struggle to be right at the expense of being correct is alarming

 

[Abbey Normal]

 

[SpidermanTuba]

you are hopeless....your struggle to be right at the expense of being correct is alarming

How so?

 

[rtwngAvngr]

Because moral questions are personal choices..

Moral questions are personal choices? So if I want to kill people and take their money, that's ok because it's my personal choice?

 

[LuvRPgrl]

It's still called a theory, not fact. It is being treated as the predominant theory because based on available evidence, it makes the most sense.


What proof can you offer that it's impossible? Hmmmmm?

Sometimes we just have to use our rational mind and think about possibilities. Some things just cant happen.
Take the components of a house, plumbing, electrical, etc. etc. throw them in a lake. Do you think the house will ever miraculously float together and form a house?
If you take what is required in primordial soup to float all the chemicals together and form a living cell, is even less likely.

 

[LuvRPgrl]

Evolution is taught as a science. It is a theory supported by massive amounts of factual evidence. It is equally as valid as any other theory supported by massive amounts of factual evidence, from special relativity to thermodynamics.



That's like saying gravity is impossible without matter. DUH. Evolution deals with the evolution of life, obviously, if life isn't around yet, you can't have evolution.

There are two seperate stages of evolution. It is possible for one to exist without the other. Many think God created life then let evolution bring things to their present form. The idea that chemicals could have been accidentally floating around in some primordial soup and a single living cell accidentally came into form is absurd at best.

 

[LuvRPgrl]

THen let them believe it on their own tax dollars, I'll not have mine spent teaching religion.

You dont get to pick and choose where your tax dollars go. I dont want my money paying for abortions, but it does.

 

[LuvRPgrl]

Freedom of speech does not apply when you're doing a job. I can't spend the lab classes I teach espousing my political beliefs on the students and then just plead "freedom of speech" when my boss finds out I haven't taught a lick of astronomy.

Non sequitor. How does that apply to teaching ID in an ID class?