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The only way a Libertarian gets elected is...

CrazedScotsman

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...if Romney screws up as bad as President Obama did.

I hate to say it, but it's true. If Romney gets the economy back on track and the unemployment rate down, he will get a second term. If that don't happen, then the Libertarian candidate may have a shot at bringing in 15%-20% of the vote in 2016.

If I thought a Libertarian had shot at winning the presidency, I would vote for him/her, but it's just not going to happen. The American people want the government to intervien and regulate way too much, the American people don't want maximum freedom even though they say they do.

Sad, but true.
 

buckeye45_73

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I agree...but I also thin the propoganda of the media and education establishment does that....there is a reason they dumb standards down
 

dblack

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...if Romney screws up as bad as President Obama did.
I sort of doubt it. I think we've kind of past the point of no return when it comes to democracy in America. We'll keep sucking on that 'lesser-of-two-evils' nonsense until it kills us.

To wit:

If I thought a Libertarian had shot at winning the presidency, I would vote for him/her, but it's just not going to happen. The American people want the government to intervien and regulate way too much, the American people don't want maximum freedom even though they say they do.

Sad, but true.
Here you display the core problem in flying colors! It won't happen as long as you, and the millions like you, keep falling for the same old crap.
 

Truthseeker420

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...if Romney screws up as bad as President Obama did.

I hate to say it, but it's true. If Romney gets the economy back on track and the unemployment rate down, he will get a second term. If that don't happen, then the Libertarian candidate may have a shot at bringing in 15%-20% of the vote in 2016.

If I thought a Libertarian had shot at winning the presidency, I would vote for him/her, but it's just not going to happen. The American people want the government to intervien and regulate way too much, the American people don't want maximum freedom even though they say they do.

Sad, but true.
Unemployment rate has bee dropping for the last 3 years.
 

Imnukingfutz

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...if Romney screws up as bad as President Obama did.

I hate to say it, but it's true. If Romney gets the economy back on track and the unemployment rate down, he will get a second term. If that don't happen, then the Libertarian candidate may have a shot at bringing in 15%-20% of the vote in 2016.

If I thought a Libertarian had shot at winning the presidency, I would vote for him/her, but it's just not going to happen. The American people want the government to intervien and regulate way too much, the American people don't want maximum freedom even though they say they do.

Sad, but true.
Unemployment rate has bee dropping for the last 3 years.
The only reason it has been dropping is because people are exhausting their unemployment and not being counted any more...Check the BLS numbers yourself, you will see that as fact. The labor participation rate is lower now than it has been in recent decades.

If they were to count all the people in the labor force that were in the day Obama took office, unemployment would be over 10%.
 

tinydancer

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...if Romney screws up as bad as President Obama did.

I hate to say it, but it's true. If Romney gets the economy back on track and the unemployment rate down, he will get a second term. If that don't happen, then the Libertarian candidate may have a shot at bringing in 15%-20% of the vote in 2016.

If I thought a Libertarian had shot at winning the presidency, I would vote for him/her, but it's just not going to happen. The American people want the government to intervien and regulate way too much, the American people don't want maximum freedom even though they say they do.

Sad, but true.
It's the two party system. And the parties have a lock down on it. In many ways it is excellent but the faults are also huge.

Before we decimated the" Progressive" Conservative party up here it was the same way. We found out Mr. Loser Joe Clark was literally trading off a federal seat in Edmonton to a woman who has now become known as "Landslide Annie". And the actual head of the so called conservative party was reportedly making all these back room deals to not run candidates in certain areas.

To give you a real profile of what this man did when a true conservative PM came up thru the ranks, Joe Clark, big L on his head Clark actually came out in support of the Liberal Opponent rather than backing Harper.

A two party system can be good but trust me it can also be a nightmare. Now we have three very strong parties (bless you Jack)and I am thrilled because it shakes the base and it does not allow the type of mob action from the top down.
 

Steelplate

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Hey....I'd be a Libertarian if it weren't for their position on the poor and elderly

I like the idea of scaling back the military influence over the rest of the world(playing world police), a more protectionist stance in regards to business, I am for getting rid of corporate welfare and am for reforming our social welfare system into one that is more of a "work for benefits" program....and other areas.

I believe that the huge, anti-competition conglomerates need to be broken up so real competition can take place.

But I don't believe in getting rid of welfare altogether or getting rid of....or even really changing the programs we have been paying into all our lives....SS and Medicare.....I mean...it's one thing to phase it out slowly over time...old people die...the middle age now will be old soon....in this economy, there's not enough time for most of the middle aged to prepare for their old age without SS and Medicare.

figure out ways to reasonably reduce entitlements with a long term mentality and protect the poor, but make them work for that protection? and I'd be in.
 

tinydancer

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...if Romney screws up as bad as President Obama did.
I sort of doubt it. I think we've kind of past the point of no return when it comes to democracy in America. We'll keep sucking on that 'lesser-of-two-evils' nonsense until it kills us.

To wit:

If I thought a Libertarian had shot at winning the presidency, I would vote for him/her, but it's just not going to happen. The American people want the government to intervien and regulate way too much, the American people don't want maximum freedom even though they say they do.

Sad, but true.
Here you display the core problem in flying colors! It won't happen as long as you, and the millions like you, keep falling for the same old crap.
Then change it. Get out there. Left or right or in between get out and kick some ass. It can be done.

I'm a conservative. I helped change my party.

One of my two favorite people on the planet and that I truly admire are Jack and Olivia who are NDP. Pretty far left but so admirable. Jack's actually in the past tense because he has passed boy I have a hard time putting him that way. Sorries. Apologies for any spelling mistakes. I always start to cry over Jack because he was one man, one politician that left this world too early.

Even though polar opposites you knew Jack was honest. Rare breed these days.

These two most wonderous hands on politicians (and this is coming from a hard core conservative:eusa_angel:) revamped their party.

And they did it from the ground up. They just started as councillors. And they served their people well.

You can do it. You really can.

ETA: Never give up the fight. Never. You can change things.
 
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TakeAStepBack

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Hey....I'd be a Libertarian if it weren't for their position on the poor and elderly
I like the idea of scaling back the military influence over the rest of the world(playing world police), a more protectionist stance in regards to business, I am for getting rid of corporate welfare and am for reforming our social welfare system into one that is more of a "work for benefits" program....and other areas.
I believe that the huge, anti-competition conglomerates need to be broken up so real competition can take place.

But I don't believe in getting rid of welfare altogether or getting rid of....or even really changing the programs we have been paying into all our lives....SS and Medicare.....I mean...it's one thing to phase it out slowly over time...old people die...the middle age now will be old soon....in this economy, there's not enough time for most of the middle aged to prepare for their old age without SS and Medicare.

figure out ways to reasonably reduce entitlements with a long term mentality and protect the poor, but make them work for that protection? and I'd be in.
Nothing you say remotely touches on libertarian philosophy. You want ponzi schemes run by govt. Gotv. intervention/protectionist in business, welfare and are against individual liberty by default.

No liberty will return to the US. People are in love with statist rulers that fuck them left or right and they come back for another round.
 

Steelplate

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Hey....I'd be a Libertarian if it weren't for their position on the poor and elderly
I like the idea of scaling back the military influence over the rest of the world(playing world police), a more protectionist stance in regards to business, I am for getting rid of corporate welfare and am for reforming our social welfare system into one that is more of a "work for benefits" program....and other areas.
I believe that the huge, anti-competition conglomerates need to be broken up so real competition can take place.

But I don't believe in getting rid of welfare altogether or getting rid of....or even really changing the programs we have been paying into all our lives....SS and Medicare.....I mean...it's one thing to phase it out slowly over time...old people die...the middle age now will be old soon....in this economy, there's not enough time for most of the middle aged to prepare for their old age without SS and Medicare.

figure out ways to reasonably reduce entitlements with a long term mentality and protect the poor, but make them work for that protection? and I'd be in.
Nothing you say remotely touches on libertarian philosophy. You want ponzi schemes run by govt. Gotv. intervention/protectionist in business, welfare and are against individual liberty by default.

No liberty will return to the US. People are in love with statist rulers that fuck them left or right and they come back for another round.
This is why I won't come on board.....you want it all....NOW!

You don't give a shit about the ramifications of your proposals. You are inflexible and married to your ideology.....you are no different than the mutters of the Tea Party. Poor people and elderly starve....too fucking bad....they should have been prepared for the radical changing of the goal posts that you want.

Don't fuck with MY shit....no matter what's going on around me.....that's your philosophy. I can actually be OK with that to a degree....if it's implemented over time.

But that's not good enough for you, is it? You are unwilling to accept half a loaf in the short term for the entire loaf in the long. Libertarians are their own worst enemy.
 

dblack

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Hey....I'd be a Libertarian if it weren't for their position on the poor and elderly

I like the idea of scaling back the military influence over the rest of the world(playing world police), a more protectionist stance in regards to business, I am for getting rid of corporate welfare and am for reforming our social welfare system into one that is more of a "work for benefits" program....and other areas.

I believe that the huge, anti-competition conglomerates need to be broken up so real competition can take place.

But I don't believe in getting rid of welfare altogether or getting rid of....or even really changing the programs we have been paying into all our lives....SS and Medicare.....I mean...it's one thing to phase it out slowly over time...old people die...the middle age now will be old soon....in this economy, there's not enough time for most of the middle aged to prepare for their old age without SS and Medicare.

figure out ways to reasonably reduce entitlements with a long term mentality and protect the poor, but make them work for that protection? and I'd be in.
Then join up and help us make it so! Seriously, kicking grandma to the curb is the last thing libertarians want to do. Once you've moved beyond the 'stingy tea partier' you'll find that, for most of us, ripping out safety nets is very low on the priority list. We could fund solid safety nets ten times over if we weren't carrying half the world's military budget.

Libertarian opposition to the welfare state comes from a completely different place than the typical "not-on-my-dime" conservative perspective. We* don't have a chip on our shoulders about "freeloaders". We're opposed to the welfare state because we see what it is at its core - a tool to control people. Corporatists promote the welfare state because it keeps 'Apple Annie' in her place - out of the way and not undercutting the supermarkets with lower prices.

*Anyone can call themselves a libertarian. Just like anyone can call themselves conservative or liberal. Or progressive or moderate or whatever. So there are no doubt 'libertarians' who will disagree with the view I've presented here. But, after working in and around libertarian causes for most of my adult life, I can tell you from experience that core of the libertarian movement is NOT the Tea Party conservative.
 

JakeStarkey

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The only way a Libertarian is elected is if the other 95% of Americans all have frontal lobotomies.
 

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