The Left Really Just Hates freedom

[Vanquish]

And so is the Right...

I mean they want to go in your bedroom and tell you who you can have sex with...(gay rights)

They want to tell you if you can have an abortion or not...

Then there's that lovely Patriot Act that was primarily conservative (lets take your privacy rights)

Dude...both sides intrude on freedom...any claims to the contrary are BULLSHIT.

I don't want to go into anybody's bedroom... and there is a difference between not wanting to acknowledge gay marriage and homosexuality. I don't care who Bob sleeps with. I do think that local communities have every right to decide whether they want to acknowledge same sex marriage or not.

And I'm still waiting for someone to show me where their 'rights" were abridged by the Patriot Act.

Finally.. go read some of the provisions of the Banking Reform... stuff like requiring banks to report ALL financial and personal data on ALL persons... without a warrant. And it gets worse.

Helloooooo....Patriot Act really fucked to hell privacy in wiretapping laws. Basically they can listen to anyone for any reason now. Furthermore, look at the presidential emergency powers. Talk about one person having too much power? Keep going to the habeas section. They can hold people on mere suspicion and for longer times without doing anything than they EVER could before.

Yeah, Patriot Act fucked us.

Of course you care what people do in their bedroom. If you didn't you'd let people marry. Simple as that. And the fucked up thing is its because of religion in most cases.

Dood, you're easy fodder right now.

 

[georgephillip]

straw for straw.....draw

It's one thing to open up the Canadian border. Nobody from north of Canada will come through.
But every country from Mexico south will be able to cross freely.
Why?
Are you really willing to hand over this country to anyone that crosses with the promise that they're only coming to work?

No one is saying that labor can't come in.
Just come through the proper channels.

It seems like expecting any meaningful immigration reform from Republicans OR Democrats amounts to a draw or stalemate at best.

From my urban perspective, the day laborers on street corners and in the Home Depot parking lot don't pose any problems. Prior to my "retirement" I often worked out of downtown hiring halls populated by recent migrants.

I'm sure if I lived along a remote rural stretch of the US-Mexico border I would have different insights, especially where drugs are involved. Since 9/11 in particular, Mexico's northern border has been militarized to such an extent the drug cartels have to warehouse their product in Mexico for a much longer period of time than before.

"...(A)nd time being money in the capitalist ethic, the drugs have leaked into the Mexican street...23,000 have died in the past three years, 2700 alone in Ciudad Juarez in 2009, about one murder every two and a half hours."

Mexico has seen two "successful" revolutions.
One in 1810.
Another in 1910.
In 2010 will we see predator drones over Yuma?

 

[SuMar]

The more I think about it the more I realize that the progressive left hates freedom more than anything. I can't think of anything they have ever done that promotes freedom in any way but I can point out what they do for power and power over others. Most conservatives are pretty content with leading their lives the way they want to without being bothered by the forced collective thinking of the left. Its sad that a country born with a new idea in this world is slowly reverting back to the old world way of thinking.

Actually, they only only hate freedom when it comes to natural born citizens, illegal aliens on the other hand they give them the keys to the nation.

 

[LibocalypseNow]

Too many people get stuck on the spending beliefs of Socialists/Progressives. While their spending beliefs are obviously insane and do not promote Freedom,it's their overall Socialist/Progressive beliefs on Government that shows they hate Freedom. They really do believe in the Government controlling every aspect of your life. This is the main difference between true Liberals & Socialists/Progressives. True Liberals do not believe in total Government domination of your life. This cannot be said of Socialists/Progressives. Freedom & Liberty isn't just about Government spending. It's about so much more than that. I really would like to see more Americans standing up for Freedom & Liberty in an overall sense. I think this is beginning to happen. I'm actually optimistic about this. Make 2010 count people.

 

[JakeStarkey]

You still don't understand Progressivism.

 

[Procrustes Stretched]

The more I think about it ...

...

"The more I think about it..."

like I've told you before...therein lies your problem.

 

[traveler52]

The more I think about it the more I realize that the progressive left hates freedom more than anything. I can't think of anything they have ever done that promotes freedom in any way but I can point out what they do for power and power over others. Most conservatives are pretty content with leading their lives the way they want to without being bothered by the forced collective thinking of the left. Its sad that a country born with a new idea in this world is slowly reverting back to the old world way of thinking.

Remind me, who was president when people were being detained without trial, illegal search and seizure was the accepted practice.

Oh yeah, george bush, that man hated freedom.

Also, for it's talk about "Individual Freedom" and the "Right Person To Decide For Themselves." The Righties ring hollow when it comes to abortion rights.

When it comes to that issue, the Cons, The Righties, THE REPUGS are all about Government Control. They want "To put the government in the doctor's office." They demand that "The Government decide health care." They scream, yell, rant and rave that "The Government knows best." They want to "Put a Government Bureaucrat in the operating room." Repugs, Cons and Righties want the Government to mandate forced pregnancy.

Now that's freedom.

 

[code1211]

The more I think about it the more I realize that the progressive left hates freedom more than anything. I can't think of anything they have ever done that promotes freedom in any way but I can point out what they do for power and power over others. Most conservatives are pretty content with leading their lives the way they want to without being bothered by the forced collective thinking of the left. Its sad that a country born with a new idea in this world is slowly reverting back to the old world way of thinking.

Remind me, who was president when people were being detained without trial, illegal search and seizure was the accepted practice. Oh yeah, george bush, that man hated freedom.

Also, for it's talk about "Individual Freedom" and the "Right Person To Decide For Themselves." The Righties ring hollow when it comes to abortion rights.

When it comes to that issue, the Cons, The Righties, THE REPUGS are all about Government Control. They want "To put the government in the doctor's office." They demand that "The Government decide health care." They scream, yell, rant and rave that "The Government knows best." They want to "Put a Government Bureaucrat in the operating room." Repugs, Cons and Righties want the Government to mandate forced pregnancy.

Now that's freedom.

The president who suspended many rights DURING TIME OF WAR was Abraham Lincoln.

Bush was not a Convservative. He was a free spending Liberal.

That last pargraph is nonsensical.

 

[LibocalypseNow]

Yea people need to stop obsessing so much over the Socialist/Progressive spending insanity. Obviously their spending is insane but Freedom & Liberty are not just about Government spending. The Socialists/Progressives are stripping us of our Freedoms & Liberties in all aspects. Like trying to control how much salt an American Citizen can consume. There are many more examples like that. It's not only about the spending. Make 2010 count people.

 

[Procrustes Stretched]

Too many people get stuck on the spending beliefs of Socialists/Progressives. While their spending beliefs are obviously insane and do not promote Freedom,it's their overall Socialist/Progressive beliefs on Government that shows...

We don't have socialists in any number worth noting, in government, in America.

 

[Procrustes Stretched]

You still don't understand Progressivism.

Progressivism, can and does span ideological barriers. Populism and progressivism often go hand in hand to the altar of political correctness.

 

[amrchaos]

The left is the force that has moved this country forward at every step in history.

Actually, no

Ideas come from all parts of the political spectrum and even our Hawks and Doves, Big government types and small government types, Tax hikers and Tax cutters, have experienced being both right and wrong throuh out our history.

Just remember this--when some claims an ideology hates our freedom, ask "what freedom do that ideology wish to eliminate"

Sometimes it is a false claim, such as "the left want to ban guns" regardless of the fact that there are leftist that enjoy that right as much as right wingers.

On the other hand, it could be a true claim, such as "the left wants to raise taxes". But even here, the argument of what is the fastest way to tackle our mounting debt, raising taxes is one possible. Thus the so called "hate freedoms" argument is not necessarily true and the question of how to preserve our government versus "economic freedom" becomes a fundemental question on what is important. It can be either a temporary (maybe 20 years) tax hike, or the potential of letting the debt increase because Republicans have yet to demonstrate they can cut government spending to the point that we have surpluses.

Yes, I just said that.

 

[amrchaos]

You still don't understand Progressivism.

Progressivism, can and does span ideological barriers. Populism and progressivism often go hand in hand to the altar of political correctness.

You do understand what Modern Populism is.

Populism has a tendency to encourage stupid actions. I prefer an Intellectual Meritocracy over populism. That is right--I am pro-elitist and can never join the Sarah Palin bandwagon.

I prefer a heart surgeon to work on the heart and a auto mechanic to work on cars. I never wish to switch the two!

 

[Procrustes Stretched]

You still don't understand Progressivism.

Progressivism, can and does span ideological barriers. Populism and progressivism often go hand in hand to the altar of political correctness.

You do understand what Modern Populism is.

Populism has a tendency to encourage stupid actions. I prefer an Intellectual Meritocracy over populism. That is right--I am pro-elitist and can never join the Sarah Palin bandwagon.

I prefer a heart surgeon to work on the heart and a auto mechanic to work on cars. I never wish to switch the two!

frightening how close we are in agreement on subjects like this.

 

[JakeStarkey]

The more I think about it the more I realize that the progressive left hates freedom more than anything. I can't think of anything they have ever done that promotes freedom in any way but I can point out what they do for power and power over others. Most conservatives are pretty content with leading their lives the way they want to without being bothered by the forced collective thinking of the left. Its sad that a country born with a new idea in this world is slowly reverting back to the old world way of thinking.

Remind me, who was president when people were being detained without trial, illegal search and seizure was the accepted practice. Oh yeah, george bush, that man hated freedom.

Also, for it's talk about "Individual Freedom" and the "Right Person To Decide For Themselves." The Righties ring hollow when it comes to abortion rights.

When it comes to that issue, the Cons, The Righties, THE REPUGS are all about Government Control. They want "To put the government in the doctor's office." They demand that "The Government decide health care." They scream, yell, rant and rave that "The Government knows best." They want to "Put a Government Bureaucrat in the operating room." Repugs, Cons and Righties want the Government to mandate forced pregnancy.

Now that's freedom.

The president who suspended many rights DURING TIME OF WAR was Abraham Lincoln.

Bush was not a Convservative. He was a free spending Liberal.

That last pargraph is nonsensical.

Nope, you are. The national Republican Party is right wing but big government. The party despises the average joe and jane (like you and me), and only wants our votes as social conservatives in order to maintain power.

Average joes and janes figured that out in 2006 and 2008, and voted accordingly; if the GOP does not change from its Boehner/McConnell/Rush/Sarah/Michelle format, the Republicans are going to be in the minority for a very long time.

 

[Mr. Shaman]

The more I think about it the more I realize that the progressive left hates freedom more than anything.

.....While it's the White-Wing Nut-Jobs who have no problem taking EVERYTHING from others...​

 

[AllieBaba]

Give historic examples.


Heres some on the left.

Revolution to be free from England

labor laws

ending slavery

Womens sufferage

louisaina purchase

Cumberland road

Deplomacy which Franklin used to get the frenchs help in the revolution

higher education


just off the top of my head

You are an idiot.
Please show the connection they have to the democratic party.

I can tell you right now...the Louisiana purchase, higher education (wtf? Did the left invent it?), and the end of slavery had nothing to do with the D party. Nor did the Revolution.

Lying sack.

 

[The T]

Give historic examples.


Heres some on the left.

Revolution to be free from England

labor laws

ending slavery

Womens sufferage

louisaina purchase

Cumberland road

Deplomacy which Franklin used to get the frenchs help in the revolution

higher education


just off the top of my head

You are an idiot.
Please show the connection they have to the democratic party.

I can tell you right now...the Louisiana purchase, higher education (wtf? Did the left invent it?), and the end of slavery had nothing to do with the D party. Nor did the Revolution.

Lying sack.

Ol Ralphie Wiggum sure doesn't know history at all. I see several that are outright fabrications.

 

[Old Rocks]

The left is the force that has moved this country forward at every step in history.

Yeah ok..

Forward as in? More Government intervention? Useless Social Programs that do more harm than good? Higher taxes? More Regulations?

Sounds like we're heading in the wrong direction..

The hell with regulations. After all, that is the lesson we see in the Gulf, right?

 

[maineman]

The left is the force that has moved this country forward at every step in history.

Yeah ok..

Forward as in? More Government intervention? Useless Social Programs that do more harm than good? Higher taxes? More Regulations?

Sounds like we're heading in the wrong direction..

civil rights...women's suffrage... workplace safety....child labor laws... minimum wage... 40 hour work week.... rights of workers to organize.... environmental protection.... social security.... medicare (teabagger slogan: "keep your socialist hands off my medicare!"), medicaid, ADA, etc., etc.

Progressive liberalism flat out WON the 20th century and there is no doubt we will win the 21st Century as well. Conservatives can slow our rate of progress down temporarily, but they have NEVER been able to stop the inexorable march of our cause. It must absolutely SUCK to be a conservative in this era.... your victories are so small and so fleeting.