The Great Socialism Gap: Socialism doesn’t freak out Democratic voters the way it freaks out other..

[cnm]

With the Deep State constructed as it is. . . . folks that think Bernie has a chance of rearranging the National Priorities are absolutely clueless.

Well, I know this is a revolutionary thought, but it's actually the people who rearrange the national priorities.

 

[jc456]

We pay for it. We pay differently, but we pay for it. And no one is ever denied care. anywhere.

Yeah, right. No gofundme pages for treatments. No way.

hey great creativity. that's how people want to spend their money, I have no issue. Sounds like you do though.

 

[jc456]

Lets talk SOCIALISM------------>

It has been projected that BERNARD's ideas will cost 60 to 90 TRILLION over 10 years by most people counting. That is over and ABOVE what we spend now, so that is an add on to our spending.

If we CONFISCATED every asset that Americans have, their 401ks, their home equity, their bank accounts, we would still come up short.

The only other ways to do this, is massively raise taxes on EVERYONE, and since at the low end, we are talking 60 TRILLION, that means that tax rates would need to go above 70% to even get close, and anyone with a brain knows our economy would collapse as the buying power of Americans would collapse.

Or, they could rev up the printing presses for money faster! That is a HIDDEN tax, as only people with hard assets would be able to even come close to holding the line. Poor people who have no assets would be left further behind with no chance of escape.

Why?

Because the money in YOUR possession and that you make would be worth far, far, less due to inflation. So only those with hard assets such as gold, machinery, plants, would even have a chance to hold on to their current wealth, which would widen the inequality gap as the poor sunk further with absolutely no chance to escape poverty, unless elected to government.

And then, let me ask, just on the issue of healthcare--------------->what does Bernie know about healthcare? Anything? That is like putting one of us in charge of healthcare ideas, isn't it?

My point isn't about socialism. It's about the fact that capitalism has been perverted enough to make people look at alternatives.

That's how Trump got elected, as we know. The system was perverted and people had had enough.
.

and that system tripled down on their perversions. amazing. Now even Bernie wants your guns. how hitlerish of him.

Trump backs 'red flag' gun laws. What do they actually do? - CNNPolitics

what's your opinion. I don't want to read someone else's, you're here, I want your opinion. what's wrong with red flag?

The complete lack of a constitutionally protected right of due process.

what happened to Carter Page, Flynn, Manafort, and Papadopolis? That's so disingenuous, it's funny.

 

[cnm]

We are the greatest country in the world.

What bullshit. What is your metric? People want to go there? People want to go to all developed countries. Have you ignored all the people going to Europe from America's fuck ups in the ME?

Perhaps greatest refers to incarcerated population, size of the armed forces and gdp. Fair enough, you win all those. Good luck to you.

 

[jc456]

Lets talk SOCIALISM------------>

It has been projected that BERNARD's ideas will cost 60 to 90 TRILLION over 10 years by most people counting. That is over and ABOVE what we spend now, so that is an add on to our spending.

If we CONFISCATED every asset that Americans have, their 401ks, their home equity, their bank accounts, we would still come up short.

The only other ways to do this, is massively raise taxes on EVERYONE, and since at the low end, we are talking 60 TRILLION, that means that tax rates would need to go above 70% to even get close, and anyone with a brain knows our economy would collapse as the buying power of Americans would collapse.

Or, they could rev up the printing presses for money faster! That is a HIDDEN tax, as only people with hard assets would be able to even come close to holding the line. Poor people who have no assets would be left further behind with no chance of escape.

Why?

Because the money in YOUR possession and that you make would be worth far, far, less due to inflation. So only those with hard assets such as gold, machinery, plants, would even have a chance to hold on to their current wealth, which would widen the inequality gap as the poor sunk further with absolutely no chance to escape poverty, unless elected to government.

And then, let me ask, just on the issue of healthcare--------------->what does Bernie know about healthcare? Anything? That is like putting one of us in charge of healthcare ideas, isn't it?

My point isn't about socialism. It's about the fact that capitalism has been perverted enough to make people look at alternatives.

That's how Trump got elected, as we know. The system was perverted and people had had enough.
.

Possibly true Mac, but if it keeps going the way it appears, you and the moderates are going to have to choose between Trump and Socialism; or the closest thing to it ever put forth in America.

I sure as hell wouldn't want to be you people who actually have to argue with themselves to choose between such stark choices.

Lets talk SOCIALISM------------>

It has been projected that BERNARD's ideas will cost 60 to 90 TRILLION over 10 years by most people counting. That is over and ABOVE what we spend now, so that is an add on to our spending.

If we CONFISCATED every asset that Americans have, their 401ks, their home equity, their bank accounts, we would still come up short.

The only other ways to do this, is massively raise taxes on EVERYONE, and since at the low end, we are talking 60 TRILLION, that means that tax rates would need to go above 70% to even get close, and anyone with a brain knows our economy would collapse as the buying power of Americans would collapse.

Or, they could rev up the printing presses for money faster! That is a HIDDEN tax, as only people with hard assets would be able to even come close to holding the line. Poor people who have no assets would be left further behind with no chance of escape.

Why?

Because the money in YOUR possession and that you make would be worth far, far, less due to inflation. So only those with hard assets such as gold, machinery, plants, would even have a chance to hold on to their current wealth, which would widen the inequality gap as the poor sunk further with absolutely no chance to escape poverty, unless elected to government.

And then, let me ask, just on the issue of healthcare--------------->what does Bernie know about healthcare? Anything? That is like putting one of us in charge of healthcare ideas, isn't it?

My point isn't about socialism. It's about the fact that capitalism has been perverted enough to make people look at alternatives.

That's how Trump got elected, as we know. The system was perverted and people had had enough.
.

Possibly true Mac, but if it keeps going the way it appears, you and the moderates are going to have to choose between Trump and Socialism; or the closest thing to it ever put forth in America.

I sure as hell wouldn't want to be you people who actually have to argue with themselves to choose between such stark choices.

Trump supports socialism. The only differences is who benefits from it.

explain. don't just throw shit out and see how it sticks. give your example. come on man, grow the fk up.

The arguments have been made over and over.

not here, so what are they?

 

[jc456]

We are the greatest country in the world.

What bullshit. What is your metric? People want to go there? People want to go to all developed countries. Have you ignored all the people going to Europe from America's fuck ups in the ME?

They are going because of exodus from Middle Eastern fear. anywhere but a battlefield is better. People want to come here for the value within the borders. As it is today. Not your fked up unicorn valley.

 

[cnm]

hey great creativity. that's how people want to spend their money, I have no issue. Sounds like you do though.

No, that's people begging for money for treatment to save their lives, your bullshit notwithstanding.

 

[pknopp]

My point isn't about socialism. It's about the fact that capitalism has been perverted enough to make people look at alternatives.

That's how Trump got elected, as we know. The system was perverted and people had had enough.
.

and that system tripled down on their perversions. amazing. Now even Bernie wants your guns. how hitlerish of him.

Trump backs 'red flag' gun laws. What do they actually do? - CNNPolitics

what's your opinion. I don't want to read someone else's, you're here, I want your opinion. what's wrong with red flag?

The complete lack of a constitutionally protected right of due process.

what happened to Carter Page, Flynn, Manafort, and Papadopolis? That's so disingenuous, it's funny.

Did they have their due process ignored? If you can make that argument, I would listen to it.

 

[jc456]

Stop perverting capitalism and you'll see less interest in socialism.

Unless it's too late.

well socialism owns the MSM. There's your perversion.

 

[cnm]

They are going because of exodus from Middle Eastern fear. anywhere but a battlefield is better. People want to come here for the value within the borders. As it is today. Not your fked up unicorn valley.

Like from the battlefields of Guatemala and Venezuela, etc., etc., where the US has also fucked up their governments.

 

[jc456]

hey great creativity. that's how people want to spend their money, I have no issue. Sounds like you do though.

No, that's people begging for money for treatment to save their lives, your bullshit notwithstanding.

so what? still don't understand your issue. It's creative. no mandatory spending, no government official approving it. shut the fk up, you're lost.

 

[jc456]

and that system tripled down on their perversions. amazing. Now even Bernie wants your guns. how hitlerish of him.

Trump backs 'red flag' gun laws. What do they actually do? - CNNPolitics

what's your opinion. I don't want to read someone else's, you're here, I want your opinion. what's wrong with red flag?

The complete lack of a constitutionally protected right of due process.

what happened to Carter Page, Flynn, Manafort, and Papadopolis? That's so disingenuous, it's funny.

Did they have their due process ignored? If you can make that argument, I would listen to it.

certainly they did. each and everyone. The fact that others who did exactly the same thing weren't arrested like them is that evidence. for Manafort, there's Podesta. why isn't he in jail. They did the same exact thing. the same exact thing.

 

[cnm]

well socialism owns the MSM. There's your perversion.

JFC.

 

[The Purge]

...Americans. That’s a problem.

And an article from of all places...
Slate ^ | February 24, 2020 | William Saletan

For the past month, the centrist Democrats running against Sen. Bernie Sanders have begged Democratic voters not to nominate him. Former Vice President Joe Biden, former New York City Mayor Michael Bloomberg, and Sen. Amy Klobuchar have argued that putting a socialist atop the ticket would help President Donald Trump and hurt Democratic candidates down the ballot. These warnings are well-founded, but they haven’t worked. Sanders has won the popular vote in Iowa, New Hampshire, and Nevada.

Why, despite the warnings, is Sanders still winning? One reason is that a lot of people like him and what he stands for. Another reason is that other candidates are splitting the votes of moderate Democrats, leaving him with a plurality on the left. But there’s a third reason: Socialism doesn’t freak out Democratic voters the way it freaks out other Americans. On this subject, Democrats are very different not just from Republicans, but also from independents, who represent about 40 percent of Americans and about 30 percent of the electorate. Socialism is a loser among independents, and this makes it a liability in a general election. But Democrats don’t feel an aversion to socialism. So perhaps they don’t see the extent of the political danger.

The detachment starts with Sanders voters. In a September poll taken by Data for Progress, 37 percent of them identified themselves not as progressives or liberals, but as socialists, democratic socialists, or communists. Nearly all of them endorsed democratic socialism. In a January NBC/Wall Street Journal poll, most Sanders voters endorsed socialism even without the word “democratic” in front of it. Only 4 percent of them opposed it. These people aren’t likely to buy the argument that nominating a socialist is an unnecessary risk. For them, electing a socialist is the ballgame.

------------

There's a very interesting novel written in 1888 by Edward Bellamy regarding the perfect (socialist) Utopian world in the year 2000.

In the 1930s, it was declared by a number of magazines to be the most important novel of the previous 50 years.

Check out the plot summary in the Wikipedia article below.

Looking Backward (Wikipedia)

In a Gallup poll taken last month, Democrats didn’t differ much from independents in their stated willingness to vote for a black, female, gay, or atheist presidential nominee. For a Muslim nominee, the gap was more then 30 net percentage points. For a socialist, it was more than 60 points.

Stop perverting capitalism and you'll see less interest in socialism.

Unless it's too late.

As pointed out many times that is NOT what has happened in every other first world country. Their health care costs are lower than ours.

What is their energy costs?
what is the doctor's availability?
Do they make pharmaceuticals? or get deals from us?
Can you be honest?
or not?

I always chuckle at defenses like this. Their costs are cheaper because we charge them less for their pharmaceuticals than we charge ourselves. And you support this? "Do they make pharmaceuticals"? How does one address a generalization like this? Germany has UHC. They have access to doctors. They create pharmaceuticals.......all for less money than us.

They pay 5 dollars a gallon for fuel to fill their vehicles, they have mandatory wages. There is nothing close to what our country is. choice of doctor and current availability. Our country is much bigger than example country you wish to use. Any. China and India are the two poorest mthr fking countries, and they are jealous of us. Each government. There is no example per capita you can choose. But hey, go for it, let's discuss.

Gas here has approached $5 at times. Again, you are arguing we are the greatest country in the world but we can not do what every other first world country has done. Provide coverage for everyone at a lower cost.

Their costs are lower because we (the U.S.A.) subsidize Europe and Canada's drug prices.
It's why ours is so much higher and theirs are lower.

There is not a company in the world that sells a product at a loss. The reason Europe and Canada have cheaper drug prices is because in those countries the government negotiate prices directly with the drug companies. A government has tools to keep those prices down. For instance making prescribing generic medicine mandatory for doctors if available. It creates a system where drug companies know that they have to charge reasonable prices.

America doesn't subsidize anyone. US citizens simply overpay in the name of the idea that the government shouldn't involve itself in anything to do with Capitalism.

Lets talk SOCIALISM------------>

It has been projected that BERNARD's ideas will cost 60 to 90 TRILLION over 10 years by most people counting. That is over and ABOVE what we spend now, so that is an add on to our spending.

If we CONFISCATED every asset that Americans have, their 401ks, their home equity, their bank accounts, we would still come up short.

The only other ways to do this, is massively raise taxes on EVERYONE, and since at the low end, we are talking 60 TRILLION, that means that tax rates would need to go above 70% to even get close, and anyone with a brain knows our economy would collapse as the buying power of Americans would collapse.

Or, they could rev up the printing presses for money faster! That is a HIDDEN tax, as only people with hard assets would be able to even come close to holding the line. Poor people who have no assets would be left further behind with no chance of escape.

Why?

Because the money in YOUR possession and that you make would be worth far, far, less due to inflation. So only those with hard assets such as gold, machinery, plants, would even have a chance to hold on to their current wealth, which would widen the inequality gap as the poor sunk further with absolutely no chance to escape poverty, unless elected to government.

And then, let me ask, just on the issue of healthcare--------------->what does Bernie know about healthcare? Anything? That is like putting one of us in charge of healthcare ideas, isn't it?

My point isn't about socialism. It's about the fact that capitalism has been perverted enough to make people look at alternatives.

That's how Trump got elected, as we know. The system was perverted and people had had enough.
.

Yeah idiot, how many people you see running to Venezuela, Cuba or any other socialist hole...BECAYSE CAPITALISM'Sis so bad....you guys need to think before you oost... OR. are you leaving because the Caoitalist system is so bad here?.....pathetic!

 

[jc456]

They are going because of exodus from Middle Eastern fear. anywhere but a battlefield is better. People want to come here for the value within the borders. As it is today. Not your fked up unicorn valley.

Like from the battlefields of Guatemala and Venezuela, etc., etc., where the US has also fucked up their governments.

when did the middle east end up in Guatemala and Venezuela? What happened in Cuba?

 

[cnm]

so what?

So, you said everyone gets treated. So, you bullshit.

 

[pknopp]

Trump backs 'red flag' gun laws. What do they actually do? - CNNPolitics

what's your opinion. I don't want to read someone else's, you're here, I want your opinion. what's wrong with red flag?

The complete lack of a constitutionally protected right of due process.

what happened to Carter Page, Flynn, Manafort, and Papadopolis? That's so disingenuous, it's funny.

Did they have their due process ignored? If you can make that argument, I would listen to it.

certainly they did. each and everyone. The fact that others who did exactly the same thing weren't arrested like them is that evidence. for Manafort, there's Podesta. why isn't he in jail. They did the same exact thing. the same exact thing.

There are a ton of people who should be in jail. Clapper and Blankfein for two. That they are not is not an issue with due process. It's an issue with an unjust justice system.

 

[jc456]

so what?

So, you said everyone gets treated. So, you bullshit.

everyone does get treated. it's called an expense for treatment. you're confused. See, if they need the money, then they know the price because they received treatment.

 

[cnm]

when did the middle east end up in Guatemala and Venezuela?

Are you pretending immigrants to the US from south of the border are not trying to escape violence in their own countries?

 

[jc456]

what's your opinion. I don't want to read someone else's, you're here, I want your opinion. what's wrong with red flag?

The complete lack of a constitutionally protected right of due process.

what happened to Carter Page, Flynn, Manafort, and Papadopolis? That's so disingenuous, it's funny.

Did they have their due process ignored? If you can make that argument, I would listen to it.

certainly they did. each and everyone. The fact that others who did exactly the same thing weren't arrested like them is that evidence. for Manafort, there's Podesta. why isn't he in jail. They did the same exact thing. the same exact thing.

There are a ton of people who should be in jail. Clapper and Blankfein for two. That they are not is not an issue with due process. It's an issue with an unjust justice system.

yes, it's an issue with equal protection under the law, which is due process.