The conservative mind

[Flopper]

Once again, the problem isn't liberal vs conservative. This is what happens when the partisans get all the attention. They bicker back and forth, and are the loudest conversation going on. Pretty soon it looks like that's where most people are at. Fortunately most people I know have a mix of those views.

Very true

 

[Dante]

Freedom is just another word for **** You

The mind of a conservative is difficult thing to understand. Just when you think that it is totally selfish, self centered and greedy you come to an issue such as healthcare and the world is stood on its head.

The mind that supposedly prides itself in the appreciation of good value and service at a competitive price suddenly goes into a tailspin and comes to worship inneficiency and downright price gouging. All in the name of freedom, although what that has to do healthcare is a bit dim.

It is common sense that doing something differently is not necessarily a bad thing, in some cases it may be innovative or even revolutionary. It is also common sense that if you are the only one in the world using a system that is more expensive with poorer outcomes than any other, the chances of that system being the best approach zero.

This is the system the conservative mind embraces. It costs more than twice as much as the next most expensive. The outcomes rank with the bottom half of the third world countries. It denies care to from 20 to 30 percent of the population. When that 20 to 30 percent do get care, publically funded, it is are rates suitable for royalty. Twenty to forty percent of the total money spent buys no healthcare at all.

Why would a sane mind favor such a system? They can’t ALL work for insurance companies. They are always talking about “freedom”. Looking at this logically it is the freedom to be ripped off, denied good care or perhaps any care at all while paying an outrageous price. Logically it makes no sense.

It would appear the only answer that explains the situation is the immersion of the right wing mind in viscous ideology. According to this mind set the government simply cannot perform a function better than private industry. To hell with all evidence that proves this to be untrue. It is simply a fact that government does many things better than the private sector. The public sector starts out with an immense advantage of not requiring profit. That alone assures better value in many areas such as law enforcement, infrastructure and education. That is simply a fact, proven over and over again.

To admit this would require the conservative to think. At best this is difficult and thinking about public policy is almost impossible. No, it is better to run around shouting buzzwords like “socialism”. Again it will not do to point out that single payer healthcare has nothing to do with socialism. That is simply by definition.

The end result is the conservative offers up the worst of all possible worlds in service to their ideology. Expensive, wasteful, poor quality and unavailable. Why do they do this?

Beats me!

Freedom is just another word for **** You

 

[Dante]

Once again, the problem isn't liberal vs conservative. This is what happens when the partisans get all the attention. They bicker back and forth, and are the loudest conversation going on. Pretty soon it looks like that's where most people are at. Fortunately most people I know have a mix of those views.

you just ain't all dat smaht.

of course it is about conservative philosophy v liberal philosophy.

stop confusing party partisanship for ideological battles.


most people have a mix because most people are not one-dimensional Tea Party types or party hacks (from a former party hack)

 

[Dot Com]

Why would a sane mind favor such a system? They can’t ALL work for insurance companies. They are always talking about “freedom”. Looking at this logically it is the freedom to be ripped off, denied good care or perhaps any care at all while paying an outrageous price. Logically it makes no sense.

Whatever kool aid Boehner, McConnell, Bachmann, Ru$h, and Levin are selling, their sheeple are gulping it down. It defies logic.

 

[Dot Com]

That's not my problem. Asking an incompetent government to solve complex problems is downright absurd. I'd laugh non stop if I didn't live here.

Like building the Hoover Dam and sending people to the moon?

 

[LordBrownTrout]

That's not my problem. Asking an incompetent government to solve complex problems is downright absurd. I'd laugh non stop if I didn't live here.

Like building the Hoover Dam and sending people to the moon?

Back when our government was still somewhat competent. I'll clap with you.

 

[Flopper]

The mind of a conservative is difficult thing to understand. Just when you think that it is totally selfish, self centered and greedy you come to an issue such as healthcare and the world is stood on its head.

The mind that supposedly prides itself in the appreciation of good value and service at a competitive price suddenly goes into a tailspin and comes to worship inneficiency and downright price gouging. All in the name of freedom, although what that has to do healthcare is a bit dim.

It is common sense that doing something differently is not necessarily a bad thing, in some cases it may be innovative or even revolutionary. It is also common sense that if you are the only one in the world using a system that is more expensive with poorer outcomes than any other, the chances of that system being the best approach zero.

This is the system the conservative mind embraces. It costs more than twice as much as the next most expensive. The outcomes rank with the bottom half of the third world countries. It denies care to from 20 to 30 percent of the population. When that 20 to 30 percent do get care, publically funded, it is are rates suitable for royalty. Twenty to forty percent of the total money spent buys no healthcare at all.

Why would a sane mind favor such a system? They can’t ALL work for insurance companies. They are always talking about “freedom”. Looking at this logically it is the freedom to be ripped off, denied good care or perhaps any care at all while paying an outrageous price. Logically it makes no sense.

It would appear the only answer that explains the situation is the immersion of the right wing mind in viscous ideology. According to this mind set the government simply cannot perform a function better than private industry. To hell with all evidence that proves this to be untrue. It is simply a fact that government does many things better than the private sector. The public sector starts out with an immense advantage of not requiring profit. That alone assures better value in many areas such as law enforcement, infrastructure and education. That is simply a fact, proven over and over again.

To admit this would require the conservative to think. At best this is difficult and thinking about public policy is almost impossible. No, it is better to run around shouting buzzwords like “socialism”. Again it will not do to point out that single payer healthcare has nothing to do with socialism. That is simply by definition.

The end result is the conservative offers up the worst of all possible worlds in service to their ideology. Expensive, wasteful, poor quality and unavailable. Why do they do this?

Beats me!

The only disagreement I have with this piece is the designation, Conservative.

I was a Conservative, as well as a registered Republican, going all the way back to Barry Goldwater. But I have watched the nature of political conservatism gradually degenerate over the years into an ugly distortion of what it once was. Which is why I re-registered as a Democrat soon after George W. Bush was appointed President by the corrupted Supreme Court and I saw what his agenda was. For me, that was the straw that broke the camel's back. The social and political changes I've watched take place in America during the past half century are not at all unlike the changes that took place in Germany in the twenties and thirties. Not quite as severe but too uncomfortably similar to be ignored.

I should mention that I do not think of myself as a typical Democrat. The only reason I registered in that category is there is no Independent Party in New Jersey and I wish to vote in primaries (which requires voter registration).

Bottom line is today's Conservatives bear little to no resemblance to what Conservatism once stood for. In fact a significant percentage of todays neo-Conservatives might correctly be called neo-fascists because they emulate the ideololgy and many of the primary objectives of Benito Mussolini's fanatical (and essentially ignorant) followers.

I beat you by some years. I was a Republican until Reagan's second term. I just couldn't swallow self regulation. It made no sense then and certainly makes less sense today.

 

[Ragnar]

When we have 100% of Americans making a living wage that will happen. That won't be soon.

What should a man who does five dollars worth of work per hour deserve?


Hint: $5/hr!

 

[Wry Catcher]

The mind of a conservative is difficult thing to understand. Just when you think that it is totally selfish, self centered and greedy you come to an issue such as healthcare and the world is stood on its head.

The mind that supposedly prides itself in the appreciation of good value and service at a competitive price suddenly goes into a tailspin and comes to worship inneficiency and downright price gouging. All in the name of freedom, although what that has to do healthcare is a bit dim.

It is common sense that doing something differently is not necessarily a bad thing, in some cases it may be innovative or even revolutionary. It is also common sense that if you are the only one in the world using a system that is more expensive with poorer outcomes than any other, the chances of that system being the best approach zero.

This is the system the conservative mind embraces. It costs more than twice as much as the next most expensive. The outcomes rank with the bottom half of the third world countries. It denies care to from 20 to 30 percent of the population. When that 20 to 30 percent do get care, publically funded, it is are rates suitable for royalty. Twenty to forty percent of the total money spent buys no healthcare at all.

Why would a sane mind favor such a system? They can’t ALL work for insurance companies. They are always talking about “freedom”. Looking at this logically it is the freedom to be ripped off, denied good care or perhaps any care at all while paying an outrageous price. Logically it makes no sense.

It would appear the only answer that explains the situation is the immersion of the right wing mind in viscous ideology. According to this mind set the government simply cannot perform a function better than private industry. To hell with all evidence that proves this to be untrue. It is simply a fact that government does many things better than the private sector. The public sector starts out with an immense advantage of not requiring profit. That alone assures better value in many areas such as law enforcement, infrastructure and education. That is simply a fact, proven over and over again.

To admit this would require the conservative to think. At best this is difficult and thinking about public policy is almost impossible. No, it is better to run around shouting buzzwords like “socialism”. Again it will not do to point out that single payer healthcare has nothing to do with socialism. That is simply by definition.

The end result is the conservative offers up the worst of all possible worlds in service to their ideology. Expensive, wasteful, poor quality and unavailable. Why do they do this?

Beats me!

Now you've done it. Stirring up the echo chamber is sure to result in ad hominem attacks and idiotgrams. Watch what is posted and who posts. Using logic by offering a premise ("the public sector does not require a profit") creates cognitive dissonance in the conservative and is sure to result in a brain freeze and a host of non sequiturs.

Other than that, good thread. Now, stay tuned for the red herrings, appeals to ignorance, ad hominem attacks and accusations of being a Fabian Socialist.

 

[Wry Catcher]

When we have 100% of Americans making a living wage that will happen. That won't be soon.

What should a man who does five dollars worth of work per hour deserve?


Hint: $5/hr!

What should a man or a woman earning $10 Million or more each year produce?

 

[Ragnar]

When we have 100% of Americans making a living wage that will happen. That won't be soon.

What should a man who does five dollars worth of work per hour deserve?


Hint: $5/hr!

What should a man or a woman earing $10 Million or more each year produce?

Ten million dollars worth of widgets.

 

[Wicked Jester]

The mind of a conservative is difficult thing to understand. Just when you think that it is totally selfish, self centered and greedy you come to an issue such as healthcare and the world is stood on its head.

The mind that supposedly prides itself in the appreciation of good value and service at a competitive price suddenly goes into a tailspin and comes to worship inneficiency and downright price gouging. All in the name of freedom, although what that has to do healthcare is a bit dim.

It is common sense that doing something differently is not necessarily a bad thing, in some cases it may be innovative or even revolutionary. It is also common sense that if you are the only one in the world using a system that is more expensive with poorer outcomes than any other, the chances of that system being the best approach zero.

This is the system the conservative mind embraces. It costs more than twice as much as the next most expensive. The outcomes rank with the bottom half of the third world countries. It denies care to from 20 to 30 percent of the population. When that 20 to 30 percent do get care, publically funded, it is are rates suitable for royalty. Twenty to forty percent of the total money spent buys no healthcare at all.

Why would a sane mind favor such a system? They can’t ALL work for insurance companies. They are always talking about “freedom”. Looking at this logically it is the freedom to be ripped off, denied good care or perhaps any care at all while paying an outrageous price. Logically it makes no sense.

It would appear the only answer that explains the situation is the immersion of the right wing mind in viscous ideology. According to this mind set the government simply cannot perform a function better than private industry. To hell with all evidence that proves this to be untrue. It is simply a fact that government does many things better than the private sector. The public sector starts out with an immense advantage of not requiring profit. That alone assures better value in many areas such as law enforcement, infrastructure and education. That is simply a fact, proven over and over again.

To admit this would require the conservative to think. At best this is difficult and thinking about public policy is almost impossible. No, it is better to run around shouting buzzwords like “socialism”. Again it will not do to point out that single payer healthcare has nothing to do with socialism. That is simply by definition.

The end result is the conservative offers up the worst of all possible worlds in service to their ideology. Expensive, wasteful, poor quality and unavailable. Why do they do this?

Beats me!

The only disagreement I have with this piece is the designation, Conservative.

I was a Conservative, as well as a registered Republican, going all the way back to Barry Goldwater. But I have watched the nature of political conservatism gradually degenerate over the years into an ugly distortion of what it once was. Which is why I re-registered as a Democrat soon after George W. Bush was appointed President by the corrupted Supreme Court and I saw what his agenda was. For me, that was the straw that broke the camel's back. The social and political changes I've watched take place in America during the past half century are not at all unlike the changes that took place in Germany in the twenties and thirties. Not quite as severe but too uncomfortably similar to be ignored.

I should mention that I do not think of myself as a typical Democrat. The only reason I registered in that category is there is no Independent Party in New Jersey and I wish to vote in primaries (which requires voter registration).

Bottom line is today's Conservatives bear little to no resemblance to what Conservatism once stood for. In fact a significant percentage of todays neo-Conservatives might correctly be called neo-fascists because they emulate the ideololgy and many of the primary objectives of Benito Mussolini's fanatical (and essentially ignorant) followers.

Yeah, says the douchebag who called for a republican Wisconsin senator to be dragged from his home and tortured.

You're a liberal fuckin' idiot, nothing more.......Stop with your lies, COWARD!

 

[Wicked Jester]

When we have 100% of Americans making a living wage that will happen. That won't be soon.

What should a man who does five dollars worth of work per hour deserve?


Hint: $5/hr!

What should a man or a woman earning $10 Million or more each year produce?

More personal wealth if possible.......After all Wry my friend, it ain't YOUR ******* money!

 

[Avatar4321]

When we have 100% of Americans making a living wage that will happen. That won't be soon.

Maybe you should be less focused on money. You'll be alot happier.

 

[Ragnar]

When we have 100% of Americans making a living wage that will happen. That won't be soon.

Maybe you should be less focused on money. You'll be alot happier.

"Living wage" is another way to say "something for nothing".

It's an anti-concept, like "social justice" or "small government extremist".

 

[Blagger]

The conservative's mind set, mentality and overall conscience is generally more in tune with necessity, human instinct but most importantly, reality. The liberal is more concerned with what others think about their unfeasible social experiments and what the current, socially fashionable trend in social science is most prevelent. In short, liberalism is a daft concept that history has proved will always be doomed to fail in every instance. It's bitter pill to swallow, but well intentioned fallacies are still fallacies.

 

[Wicked Jester]

When we have 100% of Americans making a living wage that will happen. That won't be soon.

Maybe you should be less focused on money. You'll be alot happier.

"Living wage" is another way to say "something for nothing".

It's an anti-concept, like "social justice" or "small government extremist".

Don't ya' just love the liberals and their lil' "code words"?

Lets just do the right thing, and give the true definition of their "code words"

Liberal Code words:

Living wage

Actual definitions of above liberal code words:

Free load...Something for Nothing...Free Ride...Welfare checks for everybody...No job necessary, besides the job of hauling my ass to the mailbox once a month...Sit around and watch Spongebob all day.

 

[rdean]

The mind of a conservative is difficult thing to understand. Just when you think that it is totally selfish, self centered and greedy you come to an issue such as healthcare and the world is stood on its head.

The mind that supposedly prides itself in the appreciation of good value and service at a competitive price suddenly goes into a tailspin and comes to worship inneficiency and downright price gouging. All in the name of freedom, although what that has to do healthcare is a bit dim.

It is common sense that doing something differently is not necessarily a bad thing, in some cases it may be innovative or even revolutionary. It is also common sense that if you are the only one in the world using a system that is more expensive with poorer outcomes than any other, the chances of that system being the best approach zero.

This is the system the conservative mind embraces. It costs more than twice as much as the next most expensive. The outcomes rank with the bottom half of the third world countries. It denies care to from 20 to 30 percent of the population. When that 20 to 30 percent do get care, publically funded, it is are rates suitable for royalty. Twenty to forty percent of the total money spent buys no healthcare at all.

Why would a sane mind favor such a system? They can’t ALL work for insurance companies. They are always talking about “freedom”. Looking at this logically it is the freedom to be ripped off, denied good care or perhaps any care at all while paying an outrageous price. Logically it makes no sense.

It would appear the only answer that explains the situation is the immersion of the right wing mind in viscous ideology. According to this mind set the government simply cannot perform a function better than private industry. To hell with all evidence that proves this to be untrue. It is simply a fact that government does many things better than the private sector. The public sector starts out with an immense advantage of not requiring profit. That alone assures better value in many areas such as law enforcement, infrastructure and education. That is simply a fact, proven over and over again.

To admit this would require the conservative to think. At best this is difficult and thinking about public policy is almost impossible. No, it is better to run around shouting buzzwords like “socialism”. Again it will not do to point out that single payer healthcare has nothing to do with socialism. That is simply by definition.

The end result is the conservative offers up the worst of all possible worlds in service to their ideology. Expensive, wasteful, poor quality and unavailable. Why do they do this?

Beats me!

There is a difference between having a "brain" and having a "mind".

The CEO of Cigna receives a paycheck of over a hundred million. Cigna has two private jets. Their other executives also are very well paid. This only comes from "skimming" the policies of their holders. That's it. Include what they spend on fancy buildings and advertisement and purchasing Republican politicians, of course, they pay much, much more than what government care would cost. It's only common sense, not so common after all.

 

[Ragnar]

Maybe you should be less focused on money. You'll be alot happier.

"Living wage" is another way to say "something for nothing".

It's an anti-concept, like "social justice" or "small government extremist".

Don't ya' just love the liberals and their lil' "code words"?

Lets just do the right thing, and give the true definition of their "code words"

Liberal Code words:

Living wage

Actual definitions of above liberal code words:

Free load...Something for Nothing...Free Ride...Welfare checks for everybody...No job necessary, besides the job of hauling my ass to the mailbox once a month...Sit around and watch Spongebob all day.

“Anti-Conceptual Mentality” — Ayn Rand Lexicon

This mentality is not the product of ignorance (nor is it caused by lack of intelligence): it is self-made, i.e., self-arrested.

In the brain of an anti-conceptual person, the process of integration is largely replaced by a process of association. What his subconscious stores and automatizes is not ideas, but an indiscriminate accumulation of sundry concretes, random facts, and unidentified feelings, piled into unlabeled mental file folders. This works, up to a certain point—i.e., so long as such a person deals with other persons whose folders are stuffed similarly, and thus no search through the entire filing system is ever required. Within such limits, the person can be active and willing to work hard . . . .

A person of this mentality may uphold some abstract principles or profess some intellectual convictions (without remembering where or how he picked them up). But if one asks him what he means by a given idea, he will not be able to answer. If one asks him the reasons of his convictions, one will discover that his convictions are a thin, fragile film floating over a vacuum, like an oil slick in empty space—and one will be shocked by the number of questions it had never occurred to him to ask.

Ayn Rand “The Age of Envy,”
Return of the Primitive: The Anti-Industrial Revolution

To be fair the anti-conceptual mentality is not a phenomenon exclusively made up of the American progressive. Anyone can suffer from it. I'm not claiming the above description represents "the liberal mind" or every progressive American of any foolish thing like that. I've simplu encountered it there more than anywhere else.