The Children Of Christian Fundamentalists Are Dying ..Their Parents Think Only God Can Cure Them

[Dhara]

One dead or seriously injured child because of this stupidity is one to many. Do you agree?

I agree.

But thousands of dead children every day from abortion is thousands too many. Do you agree?

Stop hijacking the thread. This thread is not about abortion. It's about people who are abusers and should not parent.

 

[TheProgressivePatriot]

One dead or seriously injured child because of this stupidity is one to many. Do you agree?

I agree.

But thousands of dead children every day from abortion is thousands too many. Do you agree?

Fetuses and embryos are not children . Please deal with the topic or go away.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Coyote]

All rights have limits - none are unlimited, and that includes religious freedom. You don't have the freedom to abuse children and that is what this amounts to.

 

[TheProgressivePatriot]

I'm not in favor of withholding medical care but it's a tad hypocritical to be whining about "fundies" and ignore 3,700 abortions per day

Irrelevant and off topic as usual.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[SassyIrishLass]

I'm not in favor of withholding medical care but it's a tad hypocritical to be whining about "fundies" and ignore 3,700 abortions per day

Irrelevant and off topic as usual.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I'm not off topic, you just can't deal with facts....but the majority of left loons struggle with them

 

[TheProgressivePatriot]

I'm not in favor of withholding medical care but it's a tad hypocritical to be whining about "fundies" and ignore 3,700 abortions per day

Irrelevant and off topic as usual.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I'm not off topic, you just can't deal with facts....but the majority of left loons struggle with them

Do you think that there should be religious exemptions allowing the withholding of medical care for children that might result in their death or disability? Yes or no? Let's see if you have the integrity and guts to answer honestly . I don't think that you do.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[SassyIrishLass]

I'm not in favor of withholding medical care but it's a tad hypocritical to be whining about "fundies" and ignore 3,700 abortions per day

Irrelevant and off topic as usual.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I'm not off topic, you just can't deal with facts....but the majority of left loons struggle with them

Do you think that there should be religious exemptions allowing the withholding of medical care for children that might result in their death or disability? Yes or no? Let's see if you have the integrity and guts to answer honestly . I don't think that you do.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

If you were actually paying attention you would know I already said I don't favor withholding medical care.....that is why I chastised you for accusing me of being off topic. Pay attention and you won't look like a tool, tool

 

[Carla_Danger]

I'm not in favor of withholding medical care but it's a tad hypocritical to be whining about "fundies" and ignore 3,700 abortions per day

Abortion is not the topic, dingbat.

 

[TheProgressivePatriot]

I'm not in favor of withholding medical care but it's a tad hypocritical to be whining about "fundies" and ignore 3,700 abortions per day

Irrelevant and off topic as usual.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I'm not off topic, you just can't deal with facts....but the majority of left loons struggle with them

Do you think that there should be religious exemptions allowing the withholding of medical care for children that might result in their death or disability? Yes or no? Let's see if you have the integrity and guts to answer honestly . I don't think that you do.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

If you were actually paying attention you would know I already said I don't favor withholding medical care.....that is why I chastised you for accusing me of being off topic. Pay attention and you won't look like a tool, tool

You said that you are not in favor of withholding care.You did not say that you are opposed to religious exemptions. Would you push to have those laws changed to protect the already living children?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[HaShev]

This is where counter missionary work becomes important as logical arguments can be used to persuade the confused, mistaken, and deceived.
In this instance it can be shown where the Ancient Hebrews were expecting the Messiah "age"(era) to be where we cure and conquer decay and not that Moshiach would be healing first hand. Maggis and their miracle charade acts were forbidden.
Benny Hinn acts would have been dealt with severe punishment, unlike the mere chasing the guy out of the State they do today.

 

[SassyIrishLass]

I'm not in favor of withholding medical care but it's a tad hypocritical to be whining about "fundies" and ignore 3,700 abortions per day

Irrelevant and off topic as usual.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I'm not off topic, you just can't deal with facts....but the majority of left loons struggle with them

Do you think that there should be religious exemptions allowing the withholding of medical care for children that might result in their death or disability? Yes or no? Let's see if you have the integrity and guts to answer honestly . I don't think that you do.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

If you were actually paying attention you would know I already said I don't favor withholding medical care.....that is why I chastised you for accusing me of being off topic. Pay attention and you won't look like a tool, tool

You said that you are not in favor of withholding care.You did not say that you are opposed to religious exemptions. Would you push to have those laws changed to protect the already living children?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

You're trying to build a straw man, I am not a fundie, I am a Catholic, we don't agree with any child being harmed or denied care.....that includes unborn children and I find your faux concern comical, you are simply trying to attack religion with your nonsense

 

[TheProgressivePatriot]

Irrelevant and off topic as usual.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I'm not off topic, you just can't deal with facts....but the majority of left loons struggle with them

Do you think that there should be religious exemptions allowing the withholding of medical care for children that might result in their death or disability? Yes or no? Let's see if you have the integrity and guts to answer honestly . I don't think that you do.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

If you were actually paying attention you would know I already said I don't favor withholding medical care.....that is why I chastised you for accusing me of being off topic. Pay attention and you won't look like a tool, tool

You said that you are not in favor of withholding care.You did not say that you are opposed to religious exemptions. Would you push to have those laws changed to protect the already living children?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

You're trying to build a straw man, I am not a fundie, I am a Catholic, we don't agree with any child being harmed or denied care.....that includes unborn children and I find your faux concern comical, you are simply trying to attack religion with your nonsense

Do not dare suggest that my concern is not real. I had a career protecting children . I am attacking medical neglect. Not religion.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[SassyIrishLass]

I'm not off topic, you just can't deal with facts....but the majority of left loons struggle with them

Do you think that there should be religious exemptions allowing the withholding of medical care for children that might result in their death or disability? Yes or no? Let's see if you have the integrity and guts to answer honestly . I don't think that you do.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

If you were actually paying attention you would know I already said I don't favor withholding medical care.....that is why I chastised you for accusing me of being off topic. Pay attention and you won't look like a tool, tool

You said that you are not in favor of withholding care.You did not say that you are opposed to religious exemptions. Would you push to have those laws changed to protect the already living children?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

You're trying to build a straw man, I am not a fundie, I am a Catholic, we don't agree with any child being harmed or denied care.....that includes unborn children and I find your faux concern comical, you are simply trying to attack religion with your nonsense

Do not dare suggest that my concern is not real. I had a career protecting children . I am attacking medical neglect. Not religion.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Then why do you keep yapping about religious exemptions? The answer is no I don't support anything that harms/neglects a child in need. Religious or otherwise so therefore I do not support abortion either.

 

[Coyote]

Let's get back on topic now.

 

[RodISHI]

All rights have limits - none are unlimited, and that includes religious freedom. You don't have the freedom to abuse children and that is what this amounts to.

The following was posted in a comment section concerning vaccines. It looked like it would fit in perfect here as the subject matter is about purportedly someone denying treatment to their child. I try to generally check and double check any sources of things that peak my interest. Things are not always what they appear on the surface.

This story is making the rounds, and it needs to end. Now.

A bunch of internet trolls are claiming that a toddler died of meningitis in Canada recently because the parents knew that he had meningitis, and decided to treat him at home with maple syrup and natural remedies instead of getting real medical help. Of course, this means they should go to prison for medical neglect.

This isn’t even close to the real story. But trolls don’t care. Anything they can do to make someone look bad, and further destroy an already hurting family. They’re terrible human beings for this. They’re frankly the ones who should be locked up, for using one family’s tragedy to further a completely bull crap agenda.

But I digress.

No, a Toddler Did Not Die of Meningitis After Treatment with Maple Syrup
This is the real story.

About four years ago, a young boy — 18 months — got sick. He had a slight cough and fever, that came and went for about a month. Some days he seemed sick; some days he was playing and acting fairly normal. The parents had a friend, who was a nurse, come in to check him over (they could not get into see a doctor because it’s hard to get appointments in some areas of Canada, due to socialized medicine, and this wasn’t an emergency). The nurse said she didn’t see anything serious.

They knew to look for things like high fevers, stiff neck, screaming for meningitis, but the boy never had any of these symptoms.

Then, one night in March, he suddenly spiked a higher fever and was having trouble breathing. They immediately called emergency services. They lived fairly far out in the country, so they decided to drive towards town and have the ambulance meet them.

Unfortunately, the ambulance that was dispatched was not the closest one, so it took longer to meet them than it should have. When it did arrive, it wasn’t equipped with the correct intubation equipment — which the child needed to save his life. He was taken to the hospital and placed on life support, but after five days was declared brain-dead.

So, this family did what any normal family would do. Their kid seemed to be a little sick, but had no serious symptoms. The most concerning thing was that he seemed to keep relapsing, and not recovering fully. That’s something to call the doctor about (which they did), but it’s not an emergency.

Until it was an emergency — unpredictably. At that point, they did call for help. Just like any normal parent would.

It’s easy to say, in hindsight, “He clearly was really sick, there were red flags, why didn’t they take him in sooner?” But there really weren’t. We only see red flags because we know the unfortunate outcome.

Finally, we don’t know that the boy actually died of meningitis. There was bacteria in his system that could have been meningitis on the autopsy, but he showed no classic signs of it. It’s just being assumed that that’s what it was.

No, a Toddler Did Not Die of Meningitis After Treatment with Maple Syrup pinterest

Charged By the Government

Now, the government has indicted them for ‘failing to provide the basic necessities of life’ and they are facing a trial (which began on Feb. 29) and possible jail time, as well as the removal of their other children. The government is alleging that they knew that the child was seriously ill, and refused to get him medical care. This is completely wrong.

Interestingly, extended family members have a successful supplement company, that the Canadian government tried to shut down — but the family won a lawsuit against the Canadian government. Some suspect that this current trial is just a way to ‘get back at’ the family for that situation.

The family reached out to the media and asked for help. They need it, now more than ever. They’re facing a very serious threat to their family, massive legal bills, and the potential loss of their children.

So of course, trolls had to jump all over this, twist it, and try to make it into something it’s not.

Stop Supporting the Smear Campaign

We have people, now, who believe that the family really did know their child was seriously sick, that they treated him with random natural remedies, that they refused medical care. People who prefer natural remedies, who don’t vaccinate, who would support this family if they knew the truth, are now re-posting the trolls’ words and saying things like “I prefer alternatives, but I’m not stupid like them — I know medicine has its place!” So did they.

Stop playing into the trolls. This is what they want. They want the family to have no support, for everyone to turn against them, to believe that they were negligent. They want especially their own community to believe that the family was in the wrong, so they can hold them up and make an example of them.

They want people to believe: vaccinate without question, and don’t use natural remedies, or you’ll face prosecution.

If this case is ruled against the parents, and they end up in jail, it sets a dangerous precedent.

There is currently no law on the books that you have to vaccinate in Canada. This would erase need for the law. Basically, if your child developed a ‘ vaccine preventable’ disease, or worse, died from one, you could be held criminally responsible for it. Parents would vaccinate just to try to prevent these lawsuits (which is a terrible reason to make a medical decision).

And, the medical system in Canada, which is already quite busy, would be slammed by parents bringing their children in for every little sniffle. That is how this boy started out…and unfortunately, he died. Most children with a little sniffle have a cold, and will be better in a few days. But if parents think their child could have something serious, and that they will be prosecuted if it is serious, they will not take a chance to ‘wait and see.’ They will not allow the government to think they didn’t do everything they could to provide medical care. They will need it documented that they had early and frequent contact with medical professionals. So, they will take their children to the doctor for anything and everything to cover their backs.

Is this what we want?

Do we want to rip apart a family that has already faced an unspeakable, unfortunate, unpredictable tragedy? Do we want to charge parents who couldn’t have known what the outcome would be? Do we want to force parents to vaccinate or face lawsuits? Do we want to overburden an already-busy medical system with cases of the sniffles — so that people with real needs end up slipping through the cracks?

I don’t think so.

Please support this family, and speak out against this smear campaign. They need your help right now.

Sources:

http://www.news1130.com/.../alberta-couple-charged-in.../
https://medicalkidnap.com/.../family-faces-criminal.../

admin http://www.modernalternativehealth.com/.../no-toddler.../...
Alberta couple charged in child's death targeted over natural medicine: family - NEWS 1130
RAYMOND, Alta. – A relative of an Alberta couple charged after a toddler died of meningitis thinks the family’s belief in nutritional supplements is behind an “overzealous” prosecution. David and Collet Stephan have been charged with failing to provide the necessities of life for their 19-month-old…
news1130.com
[quote/]

 

[TheProgressivePatriot]

All rights have limits - none are unlimited, and that includes religious freedom. You don't have the freedom to abuse children and that is what this amounts to.

The following was posted in a comment section concerning vaccines. It looked like it would fit in perfect here as the subject matter is about purportedly someone denying treatment to their child. I try to generally check and double check any sources of things that peak my interest. Things are not always what they appear on the surface.

This story is making the rounds, and it needs to end. Now.

A bunch of internet trolls are claiming that a toddler died of meningitis in Canada recently because the parents knew that he had meningitis, and decided to treat him at home with maple syrup and natural remedies instead of getting real medical help. Of course, this means they should go to prison for medical neglect.

This isn’t even close to the real story. But trolls don’t care. Anything they can do to make someone look bad, and further destroy an already hurting family. They’re terrible human beings for this. They’re frankly the ones who should be locked up, for using one family’s tragedy to further a completely bull crap agenda.

But I digress.

No, a Toddler Did Not Die of Meningitis After Treatment with Maple Syrup
This is the real story.

About four years ago, a young boy — 18 months — got sick. He had a slight cough and fever, that came and went for about a month. Some days he seemed sick; some days he was playing and acting fairly normal. The parents had a friend, who was a nurse, come in to check him over (they could not get into see a doctor because it’s hard to get appointments in some areas of Canada, due to socialized medicine, and this wasn’t an emergency). The nurse said she didn’t see anything serious.

They knew to look for things like high fevers, stiff neck, screaming for meningitis, but the boy never had any of these symptoms.

Then, one night in March, he suddenly spiked a higher fever and was having trouble breathing. They immediately called emergency services. They lived fairly far out in the country, so they decided to drive towards town and have the ambulance meet them.

Unfortunately, the ambulance that was dispatched was not the closest one, so it took longer to meet them than it should have. When it did arrive, it wasn’t equipped with the correct intubation equipment — which the child needed to save his life. He was taken to the hospital and placed on life support, but after five days was declared brain-dead.

So, this family did what any normal family would do. Their kid seemed to be a little sick, but had no serious symptoms. The most concerning thing was that he seemed to keep relapsing, and not recovering fully. That’s something to call the doctor about (which they did), but it’s not an emergency.

Until it was an emergency — unpredictably. At that point, they did call for help. Just like any normal parent would.

It’s easy to say, in hindsight, “He clearly was really sick, there were red flags, why didn’t they take him in sooner?” But there really weren’t. We only see red flags because we know the unfortunate outcome.

Finally, we don’t know that the boy actually died of meningitis. There was bacteria in his system that could have been meningitis on the autopsy, but he showed no classic signs of it. It’s just being assumed that that’s what it was.

No, a Toddler Did Not Die of Meningitis After Treatment with Maple Syrup pinterest

Charged By the Government

Now, the government has indicted them for ‘failing to provide the basic necessities of life’ and they are facing a trial (which began on Feb. 29) and possible jail time, as well as the removal of their other children. The government is alleging that they knew that the child was seriously ill, and refused to get him medical care. This is completely wrong.

Interestingly, extended family members have a successful supplement company, that the Canadian government tried to shut down — but the family won a lawsuit against the Canadian government. Some suspect that this current trial is just a way to ‘get back at’ the family for that situation.

The family reached out to the media and asked for help. They need it, now more than ever. They’re facing a very serious threat to their family, massive legal bills, and the potential loss of their children.

So of course, trolls had to jump all over this, twist it, and try to make it into something it’s not.

Stop Supporting the Smear Campaign

We have people, now, who believe that the family really did know their child was seriously sick, that they treated him with random natural remedies, that they refused medical care. People who prefer natural remedies, who don’t vaccinate, who would support this family if they knew the truth, are now re-posting the trolls’ words and saying things like “I prefer alternatives, but I’m not stupid like them — I know medicine has its place!” So did they.

Stop playing into the trolls. This is what they want. They want the family to have no support, for everyone to turn against them, to believe that they were negligent. They want especially their own community to believe that the family was in the wrong, so they can hold them up and make an example of them.

They want people to believe: vaccinate without question, and don’t use natural remedies, or you’ll face prosecution.

If this case is ruled against the parents, and they end up in jail, it sets a dangerous precedent.

There is currently no law on the books that you have to vaccinate in Canada. This would erase need for the law. Basically, if your child developed a ‘ vaccine preventable’ disease, or worse, died from one, you could be held criminally responsible for it. Parents would vaccinate just to try to prevent these lawsuits (which is a terrible reason to make a medical decision).

And, the medical system in Canada, which is already quite busy, would be slammed by parents bringing their children in for every little sniffle. That is how this boy started out…and unfortunately, he died. Most children with a little sniffle have a cold, and will be better in a few days. But if parents think their child could have something serious, and that they will be prosecuted if it is serious, they will not take a chance to ‘wait and see.’ They will not allow the government to think they didn’t do everything they could to provide medical care. They will need it documented that they had early and frequent contact with medical professionals. So, they will take their children to the doctor for anything and everything to cover their backs.

Is this what we want?

Do we want to rip apart a family that has already faced an unspeakable, unfortunate, unpredictable tragedy? Do we want to charge parents who couldn’t have known what the outcome would be? Do we want to force parents to vaccinate or face lawsuits? Do we want to overburden an already-busy medical system with cases of the sniffles — so that people with real needs end up slipping through the cracks?

I don’t think so.

Please support this family, and speak out against this smear campaign. They need your help right now.

Sources:

http://www.news1130.com/.../alberta-couple-charged-in.../
https://medicalkidnap.com/.../family-faces-criminal.../

admin http://www.modernalternativehealth.com/.../no-toddler.../...
Alberta couple charged in child's death targeted over natural medicine: family - NEWS 1130
RAYMOND, Alta. – A relative of an Alberta couple charged after a toddler died of meningitis thinks the family’s belief in nutritional supplements is behind an “overzealous” prosecution. David and Collet Stephan have been charged with failing to provide the necessities of life for their 19-month-old…
news1130.com
[quote/]

Let me see if I'm getting this right. You are presenting a muddled account of a situation where parents-who believe in natural remedies- may or may not have acted responsibly and were subsequently subjected to what is described as a smear campaign.....to prove what exactly? That the premise of my OP -that children are being harmed and killed by a reliance on faith healing is false? Even if this was an unfair and inappropriate smear campaign, it in no way invalidates ANYTHING that I presented.

To begin wit, if that is your argument, it is a Non-Sequitur
In Latin this term translates to “doesn’t follow”. This refers to an argument in which the conclusion does not necessarily follow from the premises. In other words, a logical connection is implied where none exists.

Secondly, it is a False Analogy
Analogies are very useful as they allow us to draw lessons from the familiar and apply them to the unfamiliar. Life is like a box of chocolate – you never know what you’re going to get.

A false analogy is an argument based upon an assumed similarity between two things, people, or situations when in fact the two things being compared are not similar in the manner invoked

 

[Stephanie]

some people just can't keep THEIR NOSE out of other people's lives. typical of a liberal

 

[TheProgressivePatriot]

some people just can't keep THEIR NOSE out of other people's lives. typical of a liberal

So in other words, we secular, rational, liberals should let the fundies kill their children and shut up about it?

 

[TheProgressivePatriot]

I'm not in favor of withholding medical care but it's a tad hypocritical to be whining about "fundies" and ignore 3,700 abortions per day

By the way, by calling me a hypocrite for supporting a woman's right to chose, you are employing my most favorite logical fallacy:

tu quoque (To kwok we )(Latin for "you, too" or "you, also") or the appeal to hypocrisy, is a logical fallacy that attempts to discredit the opponent's position by asserting the opponent's failure to act consistently in accordance with that position; it attempts to show that a criticism or objection applies equally to the person making it. This dismisses someone's point of view based on criticism of the person's inconsistency and not the position presented whereas a person's inconsistency should not discredit the position. Thus, it is a form of the ad hominem argument. To clarify, although the person being attacked might indeed be acting inconsistently or hypocritically, this does not invalidate their argument."

 

[SassyIrishLass]

I'm not in favor of withholding medical care but it's a tad hypocritical to be whining about "fundies" and ignore 3,700 abortions per day

By the way, by calling me a hypocrite for supporting a woman's right to chose, you are employing my most favorite logical fallacy:

tu quoque (To kwok we )(Latin for "you, too" or "you, also") or the appeal to hypocrisy, is a logical fallacy that attempts to discredit the opponent's position by asserting the opponent's failure to act consistently in accordance with that position; it attempts to show that a criticism or objection applies equally to the person making it. This dismisses someone's point of view based on criticism of the person's inconsistency and not the position presented whereas a person's inconsistency should not discredit the position. Thus, it is a form of the ad hominem argument. To clarify, although the person being attacked might indeed be acting inconsistently or hypocritically, this does not invalidate their argument."

Yawn....now run along