The Arctic is already effectively ice free

[jc456]

Don't you think warmed waters might have an effect on the Arctic's ice pack? Scientists do.

And your continuing failure to understand the picture being painted here is getting a little frustrating Frank. The oceans have ALWAYS absorbed ~90% of the solar energy striking the Earth. There has been no enormous change - some changes, but it's not like it used to be 60% or 70%. It is determined by the properties of water vs air vs land. It's why firemen don't throw rocks at burning houses or bring fans to blow them out.

From undersea volcanoes, sure. Are you claiming that AGW is causing undersea volcanoes or can you show us how much of this imaginary "excess heat" was absorbed by the Arctic sea

The temperature of the ocean has risen Frank and its not from undersea volcanoes. Warmer waters mean it will be a little bit longer before the winter ice develops and it'll be a little sooner that it starts to melt.

Still spewing the 0.02 Deg C rise are we? Still within the MOE of the equipment in use.. Therefore, the probability of it being correct is very low.. IN-fact it could be quite the opposite..

You don't believe the ocean has warmed? Then you must think one hell of a lot of meltwater has runoff there that we know nothing about. The bulk of the rise in sea level is thermosteric, shit-for-brains. If you want to contend it's not getting warmer, you're going to have to also contend it's not rising. Good luck with that.

It's not rising.

 

[jc456]

Projections aren't facts dude.

Of course they're facts. They just aren't observations of nature. But I never said they were. I DID say, and I'm STILL saying, they're the best way - the only way - to get an idea of what is going to happen in the future. If you think you can predict the future by looking at the past, you're more stupid than I'd ever imagined.

We KNOW that there have been MULTIPLE droughts in California that have lasted for over 200 years. All in the last 1200 years. In other words....and I'm going to make this as simple as I possibly can given your lack of comprehension and critical thinking ability.....it's NORMAL!

Yes, you heard me. This is NORMAL. There is nothing going on that is in ANYWAY different from that which has happened before. NOTHING!

Here is some historical data that supports your contention, though there is nothing here that refutes the contended association between this drought and global warming. Similarly, historical data supports the contention that the world has been hotter than it is now and CO2 has been higher. But what all three histories have in common, was that current human infrastructure and populations was not exposed to these situations.

And unless you have some projections that say otherwise, GCMs say that this drought is due to AGW and that how long it will continue depends almost entirely on how long AGW goes on.

Are you for real? Projections are based off observed and observed is historical data collected and analyzed. And projections are not facts. No matter how many times you post such nonsense.

 

[Billy_Bob]

Projections aren't facts dude.

Of course they're facts. They just aren't observations of nature. But I never said they were. I DID say, and I'm STILL saying, they're the best way - the only way - to get an idea of what is going to happen in the future. If you think you can predict the future by looking at the past, you're more stupid than I'd ever imagined.

We KNOW that there have been MULTIPLE droughts in California that have lasted for over 200 years. All in the last 1200 years. In other words....and I'm going to make this as simple as I possibly can given your lack of comprehension and critical thinking ability.....it's NORMAL!

Yes, you heard me. This is NORMAL. There is nothing going on that is in ANYWAY different from that which has happened before. NOTHING!

Here is some historical data that supports your contention, though there is nothing here that refutes the contended association between this drought and global warming. Similarly, historical data supports the contention that the world has been hotter than it is now and CO2 has been higher. But what all three histories have in common, was that current human infrastructure and populations was not exposed to these situations.

And unless you have some projections that say otherwise, GCMs say that this drought is due to AGW and that how long it will continue depends almost entirely on how long AGW goes on.

The Stupid... It Burns....

MODELS ARE NOT EMPIRICAL EVIDENCE OF ANYTHING!

Nice to see you finally admit you dont have any facts to support your agenda... Its all fantasy land crap..

 

[mamooth]

It's not rising.

Congratulations. You're the most extreme denier here. None of the others are crazy enough to deny sea level is rising. Even Westwall only make the reality-defying claim that the current rate of sea level rise is decreasing. You alone are willing to completely deny that sea level is increasing.

 

[CrusaderFrank]

Since the AGWCult is obsessed with averages, the annual average temperature of the Arctic is never above freezing.

 

[CrusaderFrank]

It's not rising.

Congratulations. You're the most extreme denier here. None of the others are crazy enough to deny sea level is rising. Even Westwall only make the reality-defying claim that the current rate of sea level rise is decreasing. You alone are willing to completely deny that sea level is increasing.

Denier is a kook cult word, its not a term of science

 

[skookerasbil]

It's not rising.

Congratulations. You're the most extreme denier here. None of the others are crazy enough to deny sea level is rising. Even Westwall only make the reality-defying claim that the current rate of sea level rise is decreasing. You alone are willing to completely deny that sea level is increasing.

But people like you tend to get hysterical about irrelevant shit. Nobody else is caring about losing a couple of inches of beach.


When will they care?


[URL='http://s42.photobucket.com/user/baldaltima/media/chris-butler-artwork-of-a-tsunami-destroying-a-small-harbour_1.jpg.html'][/URL]

 

[skookerasbil]

 

[jc456]

It's not rising.

Congratulations. You're the most extreme denier here. None of the others are crazy enough to deny sea level is rising. Even Westwall only make the reality-defying claim that the current rate of sea level rise is decreasing. You alone are willing to completely deny that sea level is increasing.

well dude/dudette, when you can actually post any evidence of sea rise, I'll reconsider my position. At the moment, I read from folks who live on the ocean and they have seen no sea rise in over 20 years. so, produce some facts if you wish to have credibility with me. And to date? nadda, nothing zippola.

Edit: oh and a tsunami is sea rise, but it goes back where it came from minus what it deposited on land. High tide is sea rise, but not due to ice melt, and sea surges are due to storms. So is that your sea rise? I'm sure it isn't often the sea water just settles in and let's your fake scientists read gauges.

 

[Old Rocks]

Sea Levels Rising Fast on U.S. East Coast


Calling the heavily populated region a sea level rise hot spot, researchers warn that cities such as Boston, New York, Philadelphia, and Baltimore could face a more flood-prone future.


Sea level rise on the U.S. East Coast has accelerated much faster than in other parts of the world—roughly three to four times the global average, a new study says.


http://www.nature.com/nclimate/journal/v2/n12/full/nclimate1597.html

Climate warming does not force sea-level rise (SLR) at the same rate everywhere. Rather, there are spatial variations of SLR superimposed on a global average rise. These variations are forced by dynamic processes1, 2, 3, 4, arising from circulation and variations in temperature and/or salinity, and by static equilibrium processes5, arising from mass redistributions changing gravity and the Earth’s rotation and shape. These sea-level variations form unique spatial patterns, yet there are very few observations verifying predicted patterns or fingerprints6. Here, we present evidence of recently accelerated SLR in a unique 1,000-km-long hotspot on the highly populated North American Atlantic coast north of Cape Hatteras and show that it is consistent with a modelled fingerprint of dynamic SLR. Between 1950–1979 and 1980–2009, SLR rate increases in this northeast hotspot were ~ 3–4 times higher than the global average. Modelled dynamic plus steric SLR by 2100 at New York City ranges with Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change scenario from 36 to 51cm (ref. 3); lower emission scenarios project 24–36cm (ref. 7). Extrapolations from data herein range from 20 to 29cm. SLR superimposed on storm surge, wave run-up and set-up will increase the vulnerability of coastal cities to flooding, and beaches and wetlands to deterioration.

Of course, jc just knows so much more than the scientists who publish in the National Geographic and Nature.

 

[Uncensored2008]

A whole bunch of real scientists that say there is, unlike certain poseurs on the internet.

Lying is not the foundation of valid science.

You cultists are incapable of coming to grips with this.. The fact that AGW priests lie as a matter of course, as the standard means of communication, shows that AGW has nothing to do with science.

Science is a process to find facts - AGW is a process to hide facts and spread deceit. The two conflict. AGW eschews science and offers only dogma.

 

[Old Rocks]

So the many thousands of scientists that have published thousands of papers are all lying. Do you realize just how stupid your sound?

 

[Uncensored2008]

So the many thousands of scientists that have published thousands of papers are all lying. Do you realize just how stupid your sound?

Lying is openly condoned in AGW circles. The Himalayan fraud was known widely in the AGW church, yet continued for a decade until the lie simply couldn't be maintained. The East Angola emails showed that lying is simply part of your religion - it is the standard for AGW affairs. This thread is started on an outrageous lie.

Again, lying is not science. You of the AGW religion use lying as a foundational basis - which excludes you from legitimate science.

 

[jc456]

So the many thousands of scientists that have published thousands of papers are all lying. Do you realize just how stupid your sound?

old socks, What uncensored said. If you think you have evidence that supports your dogma, please, feel free to submit. However, every link and graph you or any of your peer review posts, is all garbage and lies. The skeptics here explain why daily.

 

[mamooth]

Repeating a paranoid cult conspiracy theory multiple times won't make it look any less crazy.

Now, let's get away from all the denier deflections and back to the topic of Arctic sea ice.

Charctic Interactive Sea Ice Graph Arctic Sea Ice News and Analysis

Ice extent is below 2013 and 2014 for this date, but above the record low year of 2012. However, 2015 effectively has 200K "banked" for melt compared to recent years, due to the later melt this year of Hudson and Baffin.

That is, the trend is still down. There's no Arctic sea ice "recovery", contrary to the weird denier claims.

 

[Uncensored2008]

Repeating a paranoid cult conspiracy theory multiple times won't make it look any less crazy.

Now, let's get away from all the denier deflections and back to the topic of Arctic sea ice.

Charctic Interactive Sea Ice Graph Arctic Sea Ice News and Analysis

Ice extent is below 2013 and 2014 for this date, but above the record low year of 2012. However, 2015 effectively has 200K "banked" for melt compared to recent years, due to the later melt this year of Hudson and Baffin.

That is, the trend is still down. There's no Arctic sea ice "recovery", contrary to the weird denier claims.

You lied that the arctic is "ice free."

it is not, nor is it anywhere close.

If you have something legitimate to say - why do you lie? In any report from the Church of AGW, lies will be a major part of it. Why is it that your church embraces the dissemination of false information?

Lying is not science.

 

[mamooth]

You lied that the arctic is "ice free."

Given how on this thread I specifically stated the exact opposite at length, you would appear to owe me an apology.

Being a generous soul, I'll assume for the moment you were just mistaken, and that you simply jumped into the thread without reading it.

In any case, as the rest of your argument is based on a false statement, it's all senseless cult jabber.

 

[jc456]

So the many thousands of scientists that have published thousands of papers are all lying. Do you realize just how stupid your sound?

Hey socks, what is scientific about changing temperature sets from the past? What pray tel is that science? Give me some example of the science behind those changes.

 

[Uncensored2008]

Given how on this thread I specifically stated the exact opposite at length, you would appear to owe me an apology.

Being a generous soul, I'll assume for the moment you were just mistaken, and that you simply jumped into the thread without reading it.

In any case, as the rest of your argument is based on a false statement, it's all senseless cult jabber.

Yep, it was Crick. Sorry I named you.

Still, it doesn't change the fact that lying is the basis of the AGW cult. Peer reviewed outright lies are still lies.

The entire church is utterly and irrefutably corrupt. We knew this when East Angola was leaked - and the problem has only gotten worse.

 

[mamooth]

And back in the real world, the scientists have been getting everything correct for decades running now. That's why they have such credibility. You've been bamboozled by a fringe cult, so you don't understand that. So be it. You'll keep screaming, and you'll keep being ignored.