Taxation in America

[gipper]

It all boils down to the tremendously idiosyncratic definition of the word, "Fairness."

It would be manifestly fair to impose a per capita tax on all Americans; everyone should pay the same dollar amount, since we are all citizens or permanent residents and all benefit from that reality. If we all paid $4,500, that would pretty much balance the budget.

But it would also be fair if we all paid the same percentage of our taxable income. 15% would work nicely (in addition to the "payroll taxes"), and as an added advantage, The Rich would pay much more in FIT than The Poor.

The least fair of all would be to exempt half the population from paying any income taxes at all, then tax the earners according to a GRADUATED percentage, with the highest earners paying the highest percentage(!). Talk about Highway Robbery.

Bernie Sanders appeals to those who pay the least amount in Federal Income Taxes, but want the greatest amount of free goodies from the Federal government (free healthcare, free college tuition, etc.). He is LITERALLY attempting to BUY THEIR VOTES with taxpayer money.

It is the height of irony that this old Crank rails about how EVIL it is for Mike Bloomberg to be buying votes WITH HIS OWN MONEY, while Bernie seeks to buy votes WITH YOUR MONEY!

You couldn't make it up.

Some people don't like to be poor peons getting screwed by the financial system rigged to keep the rich getting richer and the poor getting poorer. The rich buy politicians to write loop-holes into tax laws to protect their wealth. Capital gains should be taxed as normal income. The income cap should be raised for SS. A VAT should be added to balance the budget. If the GOP doesn't address the budget deficit and entitlements the democrats will win and the US will devolve into something unrecognizable.
View attachment 308721

Lol, neither side gives a shit about the debt until the other side is in power.

HA!! Nancy controls the Budget and she spent 3% more!!
No one is concerned about the Debt.
The future looks not good for the US, the "Debt Bomb" is not being defused.

Yup neither side cares, I already said that.

no one wants to talk about the actual facts. Ponzi schemes fail and so will our ponzi schemes. can't dictate to people and expect everyone to hand over their money. some see the ponzi scheme for what it is. others, like the freebies.

The real Ponzi scheme is welfare for the 1%. That’s the scheme that somehow isn’t recognized by many.

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

the Chicago Chief of Police was fired, his pension will pay him 187k for the rest of his life. 100 times more money than he put in. dude, stop with the stupid.

Who gave the city retirees such outrageous pensions?
We need a federal law that limits pensions to a multiple of their salary.
Better yet, eliminate "defined benefit" pensions and only allow 401Ks, so there are no future payments.

well let's start there. I agree. Why do we still have pensions. these are what pensions are. get 100 times more than you paid in. Unions. government unions.

YAY!! We agree on limiting pensions anyway.
Most places I worked switched from defined benefit pensions to 401Ks, the government should too.

I worked with several people who retired from government jobs. They retired at the age of 55. They get a nice pension, medical coverage, and still work full-time at our place.

I have seen on the local tv news, those who worked in one government job, got their pension, went to another government job and got another. There are those that have three or more pensions. And I mean hundreds of thousands each. Can't make it up. And the joe schmoes, do their Gomer impersonations. they are clueless. it's so fking frustrating the stupid out there.

Or what some do is double dip. They retire, and continue working their job for the city or county, and get paid twice.

 

[gipper]

It all boils down to the tremendously idiosyncratic definition of the word, "Fairness."

It would be manifestly fair to impose a per capita tax on all Americans; everyone should pay the same dollar amount, since we are all citizens or permanent residents and all benefit from that reality. If we all paid $4,500, that would pretty much balance the budget.

But it would also be fair if we all paid the same percentage of our taxable income. 15% would work nicely (in addition to the "payroll taxes"), and as an added advantage, The Rich would pay much more in FIT than The Poor.

The least fair of all would be to exempt half the population from paying any income taxes at all, then tax the earners according to a GRADUATED percentage, with the highest earners paying the highest percentage(!). Talk about Highway Robbery.

Bernie Sanders appeals to those who pay the least amount in Federal Income Taxes, but want the greatest amount of free goodies from the Federal government (free healthcare, free college tuition, etc.). He is LITERALLY attempting to BUY THEIR VOTES with taxpayer money.

It is the height of irony that this old Crank rails about how EVIL it is for Mike Bloomberg to be buying votes WITH HIS OWN MONEY, while Bernie seeks to buy votes WITH YOUR MONEY!

You couldn't make it up.

When you rob Peter to pay Paul, the Paul's of your society generally have no objection. A consumption tax is the only fair way to do it. Those people that pay no income tax love spending the money of people that do. A VAT tax wouldn't work because it would still be a hidden tax.

Where I live, we have an 8 cent per dollar county tax. This also includes state tax as well. Everybody in our county pays this tax, the rich, the poor, and anyybody in between. No real problem that I can see. Democrats are constantly telling us the poor can't play income tax because they don't have the money. They have the money for big screens, smart phones, cars, and the usual amenities of a household, but not income tax.

It would control the spending problem too. You want free college, your consumption tax goes up three cents. Healthcare for all, our consumption tax would go up by 25 cents. That would stop Democrats from buying votes if everybody had a horse in the race. They would be forced to keep spending low.

A consumption tax also nails people who get around the taxation system. People who scrap metal for a living or extra money, people who work at an establishment where they earn big bucks in tips, people who are in the trades and work for cash on the side such as remodeling, concrete work, and bricklaying. People who repair cars at their homes for cash only. Everybody pays when they purchase products.

To get the Democrats on board, we could also make it progressive to shut them up. Standard living items 10 cents. In ground pools, boats, jewelry, 20 cent tax. High end cars, vacation homes, yachts, a 30 cent tax and so on.

You’re referring to the government robbing the poor and MC to pay the 1% right?

 

[Slade3200]

kyzr, you're off base son. most everyone's 401k is subject to capital gains. Everyone's. so if you raise the capital gains, you raise it on the middle class. son, I wish all of you would shut the fk up. you have no idea what you're talking about. shut up!

I'm way older than you kiddo. So tell me what happens if the budget deficit keeps growing and the $23T Debt goes to $30T?
Factor in that Medicare will be bankrupt in 2026 and Social Security insolvent in 2032.
Your solution is "O'wise One"???

Please correct me if I’m wrong but as long as the population is growing and GDP growing then it makes sense for the debt to grow as well. Right?

Debt is growing at a much faster rate.

agreed. The ratio needs to make sense and all needs to be managed correctly. But my point is the debt should expand with the economy, agreed?

No, we need to shrink The Debt per Trump's Budget he submitted which throttles back Government Spending, and puts us in a position to start paying off The National Debt with Surpluses in a few years.

We just need Congress to go along with it and actually approve a sensible balanced budget. They have the purse strings.

We should not take on more debt when The Economy Expands. We should pay down debt.

Liberal Policies create Debt and Deficit spending.

We spent $23 Trillion on The War on Poverty and all we got for it was making people like Schummer, Pelosi, Clinton, Waters, Obama, Sanders, and Biden Rich.

Bravo... I'm with you man, Trump has been doing so great with debt and spending that I'd be surprised if it wasn't all gone by the end of the year. Its incredible that more people don't support him and let him do whatever he wants.

I haven't checked lately but how much debt and deficit has he reduced during his 3 years? We gotta be getting close to zero by now. Post some numbers for us so we can all be very impressed!

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

It all boils down to the tremendously idiosyncratic definition of the word, "Fairness."

It would be manifestly fair to impose a per capita tax on all Americans; everyone should pay the same dollar amount, since we are all citizens or permanent residents and all benefit from that reality. If we all paid $4,500, that would pretty much balance the budget.

But it would also be fair if we all paid the same percentage of our taxable income. 15% would work nicely (in addition to the "payroll taxes"), and as an added advantage, The Rich would pay much more in FIT than The Poor.

The least fair of all would be to exempt half the population from paying any income taxes at all, then tax the earners according to a GRADUATED percentage, with the highest earners paying the highest percentage(!). Talk about Highway Robbery.

Bernie Sanders appeals to those who pay the least amount in Federal Income Taxes, but want the greatest amount of free goodies from the Federal government (free healthcare, free college tuition, etc.). He is LITERALLY attempting to BUY THEIR VOTES with taxpayer money.

It is the height of irony that this old Crank rails about how EVIL it is for Mike Bloomberg to be buying votes WITH HIS OWN MONEY, while Bernie seeks to buy votes WITH YOUR MONEY!

You couldn't make it up.

When you rob Peter to pay Paul, the Paul's of your society generally have no objection. A consumption tax is the only fair way to do it. Those people that pay no income tax love spending the money of people that do. A VAT tax wouldn't work because it would still be a hidden tax.

Where I live, we have an 8 cent per dollar county tax. This also includes state tax as well. Everybody in our county pays this tax, the rich, the poor, and anyybody in between. No real problem that I can see. Democrats are constantly telling us the poor can't play income tax because they don't have the money. They have the money for big screens, smart phones, cars, and the usual amenities of a household, but not income tax.

It would control the spending problem too. You want free college, your consumption tax goes up three cents. Healthcare for all, our consumption tax would go up by 25 cents. That would stop Democrats from buying votes if everybody had a horse in the race. They would be forced to keep spending low.

A consumption tax also nails people who get around the taxation system. People who scrap metal for a living or extra money, people who work at an establishment where they earn big bucks in tips, people who are in the trades and work for cash on the side such as remodeling, concrete work, and bricklaying. People who repair cars at their homes for cash only. Everybody pays when they purchase products.

To get the Democrats on board, we could also make it progressive to shut them up. Standard living items 10 cents. In ground pools, boats, jewelry, 20 cent tax. High end cars, vacation homes, yachts, a 30 cent tax and so on.

You’re referring to the government robbing the poor and MC to pay the 1% right?

I'm saying everybody pays into the system. The rich pay, the poor pay, everybody pays, just like all the people who spend money in our county.

 

[kyzr]

Some people don't like to be poor peons getting screwed by the financial system rigged to keep the rich getting richer and the poor getting poorer. The rich buy politicians to write loop-holes into tax laws to protect their wealth. Capital gains should be taxed as normal income. The income cap should be raised for SS. A VAT should be added to balance the budget. If the GOP doesn't address the budget deficit and entitlements the democrats will win and the US will devolve into something unrecognizable.
View attachment 308721

kyzr, you're off base son. most everyone's 401k is subject to capital gains. Everyone's. so if you raise the capital gains, you raise it on the middle class. son, I wish all of you would shut the fk up. you have no idea what you're talking about. shut up!

I'm way older than you kiddo. So tell me what happens if the budget deficit keeps growing and the $23T Debt goes to $30T?
Factor in that Medicare will be bankrupt in 2026 and Social Security insolvent in 2032.
Your solution is "O'wise One"???

Please correct me if I’m wrong but as long as the population is growing and GDP growing then it makes sense for the debt to grow as well. Right?

No. Not right. As the Debt grows the interest on the Debt grows, just like only making minimum payments on your Visa bill.
Now the interest on the $23T Debt is about $450b a year. As the Debt grows to $30T and as interest rates eventually rise that interest will consume way too much of the Budget and drastic cuts will need to be made.

GDP doesn't always grow. Recessions happen now and then.
In simple terms its much better to have no Visa balance and no interest payments than to only be able to keep paying interest and not gaining on it.

One solution I heard was a "Convention of States" to force a Balanced Budget Amendment to keep the DC coxuckers from overspending.

Ok, but our national debt is very different than a credit card. Interest on debt amounts

Some people don't like to be poor peons getting screwed by the financial system rigged to keep the rich getting richer and the poor getting poorer. The rich buy politicians to write loop-holes into tax laws to protect their wealth. Capital gains should be taxed as normal income. The income cap should be raised for SS. A VAT should be added to balance the budget. If the GOP doesn't address the budget deficit and entitlements the democrats will win and the US will devolve into something unrecognizable.
View attachment 308721

kyzr, you're off base son. most everyone's 401k is subject to capital gains. Everyone's. so if you raise the capital gains, you raise it on the middle class. son, I wish all of you would shut the fk up. you have no idea what you're talking about. shut up!

I'm way older than you kiddo. So tell me what happens if the budget deficit keeps growing and the $23T Debt goes to $30T?
Factor in that Medicare will be bankrupt in 2026 and Social Security insolvent in 2032.
Your solution is "O'wise One"???

Please correct me if I’m wrong but as long as the population is growing and GDP growing then it makes sense for the debt to grow as well. Right?

No. Not right. As the Debt grows the interest on the Debt grows, just like only making minimum payments on your Visa bill.
Now the interest on the $23T Debt is about $450b a year. As the Debt grows to $30T and as interest rates eventually rise that interest will consume way too much of the Budget and drastic cuts will need to be made.

GDP doesn't always grow. Recessions happen now and then.
In simple terms its much better to have no Visa balance and no interest payments than to only be able to keep paying interest and not gaining on it.

One solution I heard was a "Convention of States" to force a Balanced Budget Amendment to keep the DC coxuckers from overspending.

Our national debt is nothing like a credit card debt. It is the mechanism in which we manage our economy and sovereign currency. The debt that we owe is largely owed to us the public (citizens, businesses, and banks) through treasury bills and bonds. If we paid it all back at once then we would be injecting Trillions of dollars back into our own Economy and inflation would wipe us out. Its a game of monopoly based on borrowing and spending.... Yes very different than a household budget or credit card bill. If you're thinking of it as a Visa bill then I suggest you do a little more research on what the national debt actually is.

Nope. You are conflating two different lumps of money.
1. The $23T National Debt what Treasury funds thru borrowing to pay for the $4T federal budget.
2. The Federal Reserve Balance Sheet, currently at $4T. Federal Reserve Board - Recent balance sheet trends

The Federal Reserve manages the interest rates and money supply to target 2% inflation and full employment.

My analogy to a Visa bill is only showing what happens when you keep borrowing and borrowing and the interest payments ruin your finances.

 

[jc456]

Bernie Sanders appeals to those who pay the least amount in Federal Income Taxes, but want the greatest amount of free goodies from the Federal government (free healthcare, free college tuition, etc.). He is LITERALLY attempting to BUY THEIR VOTES with taxpayer money.

It is the height of irony that this old Crank rails about how EVIL it is for Mike Bloomberg to be buying votes WITH HIS OWN MONEY, while Bernie seeks to buy votes WITH YOUR MONEY!

You couldn't make it up.

You don’t know what you’re talking about.

The 1% pay the least in income tax and they don’t support Bernie. BOOM! Down goes DGS49. Down he goes.

Before posting in my thread again, get informed.

you really didn't just post this? hly fk son, you're messed in the head. sorry, but I call it as I see it. the 1% pays the most of our taxes. no matter what Bernie tells you. he lies!! I bet you didn't know that.

People who buy expensive toys pay federal taxes for many different things the like of you and I never pay for. so please stop making a fool of yourself.

 

[gipper]

It all boils down to the tremendously idiosyncratic definition of the word, "Fairness."

It would be manifestly fair to impose a per capita tax on all Americans; everyone should pay the same dollar amount, since we are all citizens or permanent residents and all benefit from that reality. If we all paid $4,500, that would pretty much balance the budget.

But it would also be fair if we all paid the same percentage of our taxable income. 15% would work nicely (in addition to the "payroll taxes"), and as an added advantage, The Rich would pay much more in FIT than The Poor.

The least fair of all would be to exempt half the population from paying any income taxes at all, then tax the earners according to a GRADUATED percentage, with the highest earners paying the highest percentage(!). Talk about Highway Robbery.

Bernie Sanders appeals to those who pay the least amount in Federal Income Taxes, but want the greatest amount of free goodies from the Federal government (free healthcare, free college tuition, etc.). He is LITERALLY attempting to BUY THEIR VOTES with taxpayer money.

It is the height of irony that this old Crank rails about how EVIL it is for Mike Bloomberg to be buying votes WITH HIS OWN MONEY, while Bernie seeks to buy votes WITH YOUR MONEY!

You couldn't make it up.

When you rob Peter to pay Paul, the Paul's of your society generally have no objection. A consumption tax is the only fair way to do it. Those people that pay no income tax love spending the money of people that do. A VAT tax wouldn't work because it would still be a hidden tax.

Where I live, we have an 8 cent per dollar county tax. This also includes state tax as well. Everybody in our county pays this tax, the rich, the poor, and anyybody in between. No real problem that I can see. Democrats are constantly telling us the poor can't play income tax because they don't have the money. They have the money for big screens, smart phones, cars, and the usual amenities of a household, but not income tax.

It would control the spending problem too. You want free college, your consumption tax goes up three cents. Healthcare for all, our consumption tax would go up by 25 cents. That would stop Democrats from buying votes if everybody had a horse in the race. They would be forced to keep spending low.

A consumption tax also nails people who get around the taxation system. People who scrap metal for a living or extra money, people who work at an establishment where they earn big bucks in tips, people who are in the trades and work for cash on the side such as remodeling, concrete work, and bricklaying. People who repair cars at their homes for cash only. Everybody pays when they purchase products.

To get the Democrats on board, we could also make it progressive to shut them up. Standard living items 10 cents. In ground pools, boats, jewelry, 20 cent tax. High end cars, vacation homes, yachts, a 30 cent tax and so on.

You’re referring to the government robbing the poor and MC to pay the 1% right?

I'm saying everybody pays into the system. The rich pay, the poor pay, everybody pays, just like all the people who spend money in our county.

Watch the fucking video. The poor and middle class are getting screwed.

 

[gipper]

Bernie Sanders appeals to those who pay the least amount in Federal Income Taxes, but want the greatest amount of free goodies from the Federal government (free healthcare, free college tuition, etc.). He is LITERALLY attempting to BUY THEIR VOTES with taxpayer money.

It is the height of irony that this old Crank rails about how EVIL it is for Mike Bloomberg to be buying votes WITH HIS OWN MONEY, while Bernie seeks to buy votes WITH YOUR MONEY!

You couldn't make it up.

You don’t know what you’re talking about.

The 1% pay the least in income tax and they don’t support Bernie. BOOM! Down goes DGS49. Down he goes.

Before posting in my thread again, get informed.

you really didn't just post this? hly fk son, you're messed in the head. sorry, but I call it as I see it. the 1% pays the most of our taxes. no matter what Bernie tells you. he lies!! I bet you didn't know that.

Watch the video. Then disputes it’s findings, or STFU!

 

[jc456]

YAY!! We agree on limiting pensions anyway.
Most places I worked switched from defined benefit pensions to 401Ks, the government should too.

YAY!! We agree on limiting pensions anyway.
Most places I worked switched from defined benefit pensions to 401Ks, the government should too.

The market is a creepy place. Look at the last two days...

The markets go up and down. If you're young keep putting money in and you will be rewarded when you retire.
Stay diversified and don't fall for gimmicks.
The market dropped because no one knows how the coronavirus will affect earnings.

And it goes up and down based on trump tweets. Guy has no doubt made many friends richer with his games. It’s a creepy place.

jealous I see. invest more.

Jealous of corruption? You approve of market manipulation?

what corruption? investments are investments. you're confused. If I get a tip, why can't i act on it?

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

It all boils down to the tremendously idiosyncratic definition of the word, "Fairness."

It would be manifestly fair to impose a per capita tax on all Americans; everyone should pay the same dollar amount, since we are all citizens or permanent residents and all benefit from that reality. If we all paid $4,500, that would pretty much balance the budget.

But it would also be fair if we all paid the same percentage of our taxable income. 15% would work nicely (in addition to the "payroll taxes"), and as an added advantage, The Rich would pay much more in FIT than The Poor.

The least fair of all would be to exempt half the population from paying any income taxes at all, then tax the earners according to a GRADUATED percentage, with the highest earners paying the highest percentage(!). Talk about Highway Robbery.

Bernie Sanders appeals to those who pay the least amount in Federal Income Taxes, but want the greatest amount of free goodies from the Federal government (free healthcare, free college tuition, etc.). He is LITERALLY attempting to BUY THEIR VOTES with taxpayer money.

It is the height of irony that this old Crank rails about how EVIL it is for Mike Bloomberg to be buying votes WITH HIS OWN MONEY, while Bernie seeks to buy votes WITH YOUR MONEY!

You couldn't make it up.

Some people don't like to be poor peons getting screwed by the financial system rigged to keep the rich getting richer and the poor getting poorer. The rich buy politicians to cap should be raised for SS. A VAT should be added to balance the budget. If the GOP doesn't address the budget deficit and entitlements the democrats will win and the US will devolve into something unrecognizable.
View attachment 308721

Our country depends on people investing to support a healthy economy. Increase the capital gains taxes, and people stop investing. That's why capital gains taxes are lower in the first place; to encourage investments.

Agreed but it also needs to be managed correctly. Inflation is roughly at 3% so that's what is lost if you just keep your money in a bank account. Real Estate is about about 4-5% and the market hopefully will yield 5%-15% on investment accounts. This is all good and incentivizes investing over letting your money devalue. The last few years have shown crazy gains upward of 20-30% if you played it right. This is fun and all but not sustainable and it adds volatility to the market. Stability is much preferred over boom or bust when your playing with peoples savings and retirement funds.

That's why ours is invested in a reputable investment company. They know how to manage money reasonably. No, I've never seen 20% gains. The more you make, the higher risk you take. It's also why the government doesn't allow us to invest in our own retirement account exclusively. Some people don't have the intelligence to handle money. They wrote books on lottery winners about this. They hit the lottery, and it ended up being the most disastrous thing that happened in their lives.

 

[jc456]

It all boils down to the tremendously idiosyncratic definition of the word, "Fairness."

It would be manifestly fair to impose a per capita tax on all Americans; everyone should pay the same dollar amount, since we are all citizens or permanent residents and all benefit from that reality. If we all paid $4,500, that would pretty much balance the budget.

But it would also be fair if we all paid the same percentage of our taxable income. 15% would work nicely (in addition to the "payroll taxes"), and as an added advantage, The Rich would pay much more in FIT than The Poor.

The least fair of all would be to exempt half the population from paying any income taxes at all, then tax the earners according to a GRADUATED percentage, with the highest earners paying the highest percentage(!). Talk about Highway Robbery.

Bernie Sanders appeals to those who pay the least amount in Federal Income Taxes, but want the greatest amount of free goodies from the Federal government (free healthcare, free college tuition, etc.). He is LITERALLY attempting to BUY THEIR VOTES with taxpayer money.

It is the height of irony that this old Crank rails about how EVIL it is for Mike Bloomberg to be buying votes WITH HIS OWN MONEY, while Bernie seeks to buy votes WITH YOUR MONEY!

You couldn't make it up.

When you rob Peter to pay Paul, the Paul's of your society generally have no objection. A consumption tax is the only fair way to do it. Those people that pay no income tax love spending the money of people that do. A VAT tax wouldn't work because it would still be a hidden tax.

Where I live, we have an 8 cent per dollar county tax. This also includes state tax as well. Everybody in our county pays this tax, the rich, the poor, and anyybody in between. No real problem that I can see. Democrats are constantly telling us the poor can't play income tax because they don't have the money. They have the money for big screens, smart phones, cars, and the usual amenities of a household, but not income tax.

It would control the spending problem too. You want free college, your consumption tax goes up three cents. Healthcare for all, our consumption tax would go up by 25 cents. That would stop Democrats from buying votes if everybody had a horse in the race. They would be forced to keep spending low.

A consumption tax also nails people who get around the taxation system. People who scrap metal for a living or extra money, people who work at an establishment where they earn big bucks in tips, people who are in the trades and work for cash on the side such as remodeling, concrete work, and bricklaying. People who repair cars at their homes for cash only. Everybody pays when they purchase products.

To get the Democrats on board, we could also make it progressive to shut them up. Standard living items 10 cents. In ground pools, boats, jewelry, 20 cent tax. High end cars, vacation homes, yachts, a 30 cent tax and so on.

You’re referring to the government robbing the poor and MC to pay the 1% right?

so the poor don't have to pay for the services we all do? why?

 

[Slade3200]

kyzr, you're off base son. most everyone's 401k is subject to capital gains. Everyone's. so if you raise the capital gains, you raise it on the middle class. son, I wish all of you would shut the fk up. you have no idea what you're talking about. shut up!

I'm way older than you kiddo. So tell me what happens if the budget deficit keeps growing and the $23T Debt goes to $30T?
Factor in that Medicare will be bankrupt in 2026 and Social Security insolvent in 2032.
Your solution is "O'wise One"???

Please correct me if I’m wrong but as long as the population is growing and GDP growing then it makes sense for the debt to grow as well. Right?

No. Not right. As the Debt grows the interest on the Debt grows, just like only making minimum payments on your Visa bill.
Now the interest on the $23T Debt is about $450b a year. As the Debt grows to $30T and as interest rates eventually rise that interest will consume way too much of the Budget and drastic cuts will need to be made.

GDP doesn't always grow. Recessions happen now and then.
In simple terms its much better to have no Visa balance and no interest payments than to only be able to keep paying interest and not gaining on it.

One solution I heard was a "Convention of States" to force a Balanced Budget Amendment to keep the DC coxuckers from overspending.

Ok, but our national debt is very different than a credit card. Interest on debt amounts

kyzr, you're off base son. most everyone's 401k is subject to capital gains. Everyone's. so if you raise the capital gains, you raise it on the middle class. son, I wish all of you would shut the fk up. you have no idea what you're talking about. shut up!

I'm way older than you kiddo. So tell me what happens if the budget deficit keeps growing and the $23T Debt goes to $30T?
Factor in that Medicare will be bankrupt in 2026 and Social Security insolvent in 2032.
Your solution is "O'wise One"???

Please correct me if I’m wrong but as long as the population is growing and GDP growing then it makes sense for the debt to grow as well. Right?

No. Not right. As the Debt grows the interest on the Debt grows, just like only making minimum payments on your Visa bill.
Now the interest on the $23T Debt is about $450b a year. As the Debt grows to $30T and as interest rates eventually rise that interest will consume way too much of the Budget and drastic cuts will need to be made.

GDP doesn't always grow. Recessions happen now and then.
In simple terms its much better to have no Visa balance and no interest payments than to only be able to keep paying interest and not gaining on it.

One solution I heard was a "Convention of States" to force a Balanced Budget Amendment to keep the DC coxuckers from overspending.

Our national debt is nothing like a credit card debt. It is the mechanism in which we manage our economy and sovereign currency. The debt that we owe is largely owed to us the public (citizens, businesses, and banks) through treasury bills and bonds. If we paid it all back at once then we would be injecting Trillions of dollars back into our own Economy and inflation would wipe us out. Its a game of monopoly based on borrowing and spending.... Yes very different than a household budget or credit card bill. If you're thinking of it as a Visa bill then I suggest you do a little more research on what the national debt actually is.

Nope. You are conflating two different lumps of money.
1. The $23T National Debt what Treasury funds thru borrowing to pay for the $4T federal budget.
2. The Federal Reserve Balance Sheet, currently at $4.8T. Federal Reserve Board - Recent balance sheet trends
View attachment 308746

The Federal Reserve manages the interest rates and money supply to target 2% inflation and full employment.

My analogy to a Visa bill is only showing what happens when you keep borrowing and borrowing and the interest payments ruin your finances.

So what exactly are you comparing to the VISA bill?

 

[jc456]

Bernie Sanders appeals to those who pay the least amount in Federal Income Taxes, but want the greatest amount of free goodies from the Federal government (free healthcare, free college tuition, etc.). He is LITERALLY attempting to BUY THEIR VOTES with taxpayer money.

It is the height of irony that this old Crank rails about how EVIL it is for Mike Bloomberg to be buying votes WITH HIS OWN MONEY, while Bernie seeks to buy votes WITH YOUR MONEY!

You couldn't make it up.

You don’t know what you’re talking about.

The 1% pay the least in income tax and they don’t support Bernie. BOOM! Down goes DGS49. Down he goes.

Before posting in my thread again, get informed.

you really didn't just post this? hly fk son, you're messed in the head. sorry, but I call it as I see it. the 1% pays the most of our taxes. no matter what Bernie tells you. he lies!! I bet you didn't know that.

Watch the video. Then disputes it’s findings, or STFU!

what video?

 

[gipper]

It all boils down to the tremendously idiosyncratic definition of the word, "Fairness."

It would be manifestly fair to impose a per capita tax on all Americans; everyone should pay the same dollar amount, since we are all citizens or permanent residents and all benefit from that reality. If we all paid $4,500, that would pretty much balance the budget.

But it would also be fair if we all paid the same percentage of our taxable income. 15% would work nicely (in addition to the "payroll taxes"), and as an added advantage, The Rich would pay much more in FIT than The Poor.

The least fair of all would be to exempt half the population from paying any income taxes at all, then tax the earners according to a GRADUATED percentage, with the highest earners paying the highest percentage(!). Talk about Highway Robbery.

Bernie Sanders appeals to those who pay the least amount in Federal Income Taxes, but want the greatest amount of free goodies from the Federal government (free healthcare, free college tuition, etc.). He is LITERALLY attempting to BUY THEIR VOTES with taxpayer money.

It is the height of irony that this old Crank rails about how EVIL it is for Mike Bloomberg to be buying votes WITH HIS OWN MONEY, while Bernie seeks to buy votes WITH YOUR MONEY!

You couldn't make it up.

When you rob Peter to pay Paul, the Paul's of your society generally have no objection. A consumption tax is the only fair way to do it. Those people that pay no income tax love spending the money of people that do. A VAT tax wouldn't work because it would still be a hidden tax.

Where I live, we have an 8 cent per dollar county tax. This also includes state tax as well. Everybody in our county pays this tax, the rich, the poor, and anyybody in between. No real problem that I can see. Democrats are constantly telling us the poor can't play income tax because they don't have the money. They have the money for big screens, smart phones, cars, and the usual amenities of a household, but not income tax.

It would control the spending problem too. You want free college, your consumption tax goes up three cents. Healthcare for all, our consumption tax would go up by 25 cents. That would stop Democrats from buying votes if everybody had a horse in the race. They would be forced to keep spending low.

A consumption tax also nails people who get around the taxation system. People who scrap metal for a living or extra money, people who work at an establishment where they earn big bucks in tips, people who are in the trades and work for cash on the side such as remodeling, concrete work, and bricklaying. People who repair cars at their homes for cash only. Everybody pays when they purchase products.

To get the Democrats on board, we could also make it progressive to shut them up. Standard living items 10 cents. In ground pools, boats, jewelry, 20 cent tax. High end cars, vacation homes, yachts, a 30 cent tax and so on.

You’re referring to the government robbing the poor and MC to pay the 1% right?

so the poor don't have to pay for the services we all do? why?

? WTF.

WATCH THE FUCKING VIDEO AND IF YOU CAN, DISPUTE ITS FINDINGS...OR PLEASE STFU!!!

 

[jc456]

It all boils down to the tremendously idiosyncratic definition of the word, "Fairness."

It would be manifestly fair to impose a per capita tax on all Americans; everyone should pay the same dollar amount, since we are all citizens or permanent residents and all benefit from that reality. If we all paid $4,500, that would pretty much balance the budget.

But it would also be fair if we all paid the same percentage of our taxable income. 15% would work nicely (in addition to the "payroll taxes"), and as an added advantage, The Rich would pay much more in FIT than The Poor.

The least fair of all would be to exempt half the population from paying any income taxes at all, then tax the earners according to a GRADUATED percentage, with the highest earners paying the highest percentage(!). Talk about Highway Robbery.

Bernie Sanders appeals to those who pay the least amount in Federal Income Taxes, but want the greatest amount of free goodies from the Federal government (free healthcare, free college tuition, etc.). He is LITERALLY attempting to BUY THEIR VOTES with taxpayer money.

It is the height of irony that this old Crank rails about how EVIL it is for Mike Bloomberg to be buying votes WITH HIS OWN MONEY, while Bernie seeks to buy votes WITH YOUR MONEY!

You couldn't make it up.

When you rob Peter to pay Paul, the Paul's of your society generally have no objection. A consumption tax is the only fair way to do it. Those people that pay no income tax love spending the money of people that do. A VAT tax wouldn't work because it would still be a hidden tax.

Where I live, we have an 8 cent per dollar county tax. This also includes state tax as well. Everybody in our county pays this tax, the rich, the poor, and anyybody in between. No real problem that I can see. Democrats are constantly telling us the poor can't play income tax because they don't have the money. They have the money for big screens, smart phones, cars, and the usual amenities of a household, but not income tax.

It would control the spending problem too. You want free college, your consumption tax goes up three cents. Healthcare for all, our consumption tax would go up by 25 cents. That would stop Democrats from buying votes if everybody had a horse in the race. They would be forced to keep spending low.

A consumption tax also nails people who get around the taxation system. People who scrap metal for a living or extra money, people who work at an establishment where they earn big bucks in tips, people who are in the trades and work for cash on the side such as remodeling, concrete work, and bricklaying. People who repair cars at their homes for cash only. Everybody pays when they purchase products.

To get the Democrats on board, we could also make it progressive to shut them up. Standard living items 10 cents. In ground pools, boats, jewelry, 20 cent tax. High end cars, vacation homes, yachts, a 30 cent tax and so on.

You’re referring to the government robbing the poor and MC to pay the 1% right?

so the poor don't have to pay for the services we all do? why?

? WTF.

WATCH THE FUCKING VIDEO AND IF YOU CAN, DISPUTE ITS FINDINGS...OR PLEASE STFU!!!

what video again?

 

[Slade3200]

It all boils down to the tremendously idiosyncratic definition of the word, "Fairness."

It would be manifestly fair to impose a per capita tax on all Americans; everyone should pay the same dollar amount, since we are all citizens or permanent residents and all benefit from that reality. If we all paid $4,500, that would pretty much balance the budget.

But it would also be fair if we all paid the same percentage of our taxable income. 15% would work nicely (in addition to the "payroll taxes"), and as an added advantage, The Rich would pay much more in FIT than The Poor.

The least fair of all would be to exempt half the population from paying any income taxes at all, then tax the earners according to a GRADUATED percentage, with the highest earners paying the highest percentage(!). Talk about Highway Robbery.

Bernie Sanders appeals to those who pay the least amount in Federal Income Taxes, but want the greatest amount of free goodies from the Federal government (free healthcare, free college tuition, etc.). He is LITERALLY attempting to BUY THEIR VOTES with taxpayer money.

It is the height of irony that this old Crank rails about how EVIL it is for Mike Bloomberg to be buying votes WITH HIS OWN MONEY, while Bernie seeks to buy votes WITH YOUR MONEY!

You couldn't make it up.

Some people don't like to be poor peons getting screwed by the financial system rigged to keep the rich getting richer and the poor getting poorer. The rich buy politicians to cap should be raised for SS. A VAT should be added to balance the budget. If the GOP doesn't address the budget deficit and entitlements the democrats will win and the US will devolve into something unrecognizable.
View attachment 308721

Our country depends on people investing to support a healthy economy. Increase the capital gains taxes, and people stop investing. That's why capital gains taxes are lower in the first place; to encourage investments.

Agreed but it also needs to be managed correctly. Inflation is roughly at 3% so that's what is lost if you just keep your money in a bank account. Real Estate is about about 4-5% and the market hopefully will yield 5%-15% on investment accounts. This is all good and incentivizes investing over letting your money devalue. The last few years have shown crazy gains upward of 20-30% if you played it right. This is fun and all but not sustainable and it adds volatility to the market. Stability is much preferred over boom or bust when your playing with peoples savings and retirement funds.

That's why ours is invested in a reputable investment company. They know how to manage money reasonably. No, I've never seen 20% gains. The more you make, the higher risk you take. It's also why the government doesn't allow us to invest in our own retirement account exclusively. Some people don't have the intelligence to handle money. They wrote books on lottery winners about this. They hit the lottery, and it ended up being the most disastrous thing that happened in their lives.

You won't make 20-30% with a mutual fund but if you follow the market and actively buy sell equities in a smart way you can make tremendous gains... of course that comes with more risks. Thats a bit of a side track so perhaps a discussion for another time.

 

[kyzr]

I'm way older than you kiddo. So tell me what happens if the budget deficit keeps growing and the $23T Debt goes to $30T?
Factor in that Medicare will be bankrupt in 2026 and Social Security insolvent in 2032.
Your solution is "O'wise One"???

Please correct me if I’m wrong but as long as the population is growing and GDP growing then it makes sense for the debt to grow as well. Right?

No. Not right. As the Debt grows the interest on the Debt grows, just like only making minimum payments on your Visa bill.
Now the interest on the $23T Debt is about $450b a year. As the Debt grows to $30T and as interest rates eventually rise that interest will consume way too much of the Budget and drastic cuts will need to be made.

GDP doesn't always grow. Recessions happen now and then.
In simple terms its much better to have no Visa balance and no interest payments than to only be able to keep paying interest and not gaining on it.

One solution I heard was a "Convention of States" to force a Balanced Budget Amendment to keep the DC coxuckers from overspending.

Ok, but our national debt is very different than a credit card. Interest on debt amounts

I'm way older than you kiddo. So tell me what happens if the budget deficit keeps growing and the $23T Debt goes to $30T?
Factor in that Medicare will be bankrupt in 2026 and Social Security insolvent in 2032.
Your solution is "O'wise One"???

Please correct me if I’m wrong but as long as the population is growing and GDP growing then it makes sense for the debt to grow as well. Right?

No. Not right. As the Debt grows the interest on the Debt grows, just like only making minimum payments on your Visa bill.
Now the interest on the $23T Debt is about $450b a year. As the Debt grows to $30T and as interest rates eventually rise that interest will consume way too much of the Budget and drastic cuts will need to be made.

GDP doesn't always grow. Recessions happen now and then.
In simple terms its much better to have no Visa balance and no interest payments than to only be able to keep paying interest and not gaining on it.

One solution I heard was a "Convention of States" to force a Balanced Budget Amendment to keep the DC coxuckers from overspending.

Our national debt is nothing like a credit card debt. It is the mechanism in which we manage our economy and sovereign currency. The debt that we owe is largely owed to us the public (citizens, businesses, and banks) through treasury bills and bonds. If we paid it all back at once then we would be injecting Trillions of dollars back into our own Economy and inflation would wipe us out. Its a game of monopoly based on borrowing and spending.... Yes very different than a household budget or credit card bill. If you're thinking of it as a Visa bill then I suggest you do a little more research on what the national debt actually is.

Nope. You are conflating two different lumps of money.
1. The $23T National Debt what Treasury funds thru borrowing to pay for the $4T federal budget.
2. The Federal Reserve Balance Sheet, currently at $4.8T. Federal Reserve Board - Recent balance sheet trends
View attachment 308746

The Federal Reserve manages the interest rates and money supply to target 2% inflation and full employment.

My analogy to a Visa bill is only showing what happens when you keep borrowing and borrowing and the interest payments ruin your finances.

So what exactly are you comparing to the VISA bill?

1. The $23T Debt is analogous to a maxed out Visa card balance where all you can afford to pay is the interest, you can never pay down the debt.
2. A much better financial situation is "pay as you go" every month so you are not paying interest on the borrowed money balance.

 

[BrokeLoser]

Back in the day, when America was great, we had tax brackets as high as 90%.

Was that before the 100 million beaners came?

Do you ever just give it a rest loser? Your act is getting really predictable and boring

That’s good...that’s my thing. I’m not really into trying to entertain the filth among us...I’m more into exposing the facts and keeping the truth on the table. Sucks huh?

 

[gipper]

It all boils down to the tremendously idiosyncratic definition of the word, "Fairness."

It would be manifestly fair to impose a per capita tax on all Americans; everyone should pay the same dollar amount, since we are all citizens or permanent residents and all benefit from that reality. If we all paid $4,500, that would pretty much balance the budget.

But it would also be fair if we all paid the same percentage of our taxable income. 15% would work nicely (in addition to the "payroll taxes"), and as an added advantage, The Rich would pay much more in FIT than The Poor.

The least fair of all would be to exempt half the population from paying any income taxes at all, then tax the earners according to a GRADUATED percentage, with the highest earners paying the highest percentage(!). Talk about Highway Robbery.

Bernie Sanders appeals to those who pay the least amount in Federal Income Taxes, but want the greatest amount of free goodies from the Federal government (free healthcare, free college tuition, etc.). He is LITERALLY attempting to BUY THEIR VOTES with taxpayer money.

It is the height of irony that this old Crank rails about how EVIL it is for Mike Bloomberg to be buying votes WITH HIS OWN MONEY, while Bernie seeks to buy votes WITH YOUR MONEY!

You couldn't make it up.

When you rob Peter to pay Paul, the Paul's of your society generally have no objection. A consumption tax is the only fair way to do it. Those people that pay no income tax love spending the money of people that do. A VAT tax wouldn't work because it would still be a hidden tax.

Where I live, we have an 8 cent per dollar county tax. This also includes state tax as well. Everybody in our county pays this tax, the rich, the poor, and anyybody in between. No real problem that I can see. Democrats are constantly telling us the poor can't play income tax because they don't have the money. They have the money for big screens, smart phones, cars, and the usual amenities of a household, but not income tax.

It would control the spending problem too. You want free college, your consumption tax goes up three cents. Healthcare for all, our consumption tax would go up by 25 cents. That would stop Democrats from buying votes if everybody had a horse in the race. They would be forced to keep spending low.

A consumption tax also nails people who get around the taxation system. People who scrap metal for a living or extra money, people who work at an establishment where they earn big bucks in tips, people who are in the trades and work for cash on the side such as remodeling, concrete work, and bricklaying. People who repair cars at their homes for cash only. Everybody pays when they purchase products.

To get the Democrats on board, we could also make it progressive to shut them up. Standard living items 10 cents. In ground pools, boats, jewelry, 20 cent tax. High end cars, vacation homes, yachts, a 30 cent tax and so on.

You’re referring to the government robbing the poor and MC to pay the 1% right?

so the poor don't have to pay for the services we all do? why?

? WTF.

WATCH THE FUCKING VIDEO AND IF YOU CAN, DISPUTE ITS FINDINGS...OR PLEASE STFU!!!

what video again?

See the OP