Zone1 Tax the Rich! Make them Pay their Fair Share!

[JonKoch]

A rose by any other name...
After TANF benefits have timed out, individuals may still be eligible for other forms of assistance such as Supplemental Nutrition Assistance Program (SNAP), Medicaid, or local job training programs.
Wikipedia National Conference of State Legislatures

LMAOROG. You mean WORK REQUIMENTS for the poorest? NOT generational as YOU posited right?

 

[Concerned American]

How about we just decide the opposite of what the GOP policies have been for 45 years, TAX WHO HAS THE MONEY AT RATES THAT STOP US FROM CREATING THE NEXT $39+ TRILLION IN DEBT!

Yawn, check your partisanship. The national debt surpassed a trillion dollars the first time in Oct. 1981--who was POTUS prior to this point? Carter--both houses were democrat. That was 45 years ago. The executive branch has been split 24 yrs. R--20 yrs. D to the date of the last election. The debt at the end of the last admin was 36.1T. That is an average of 800 billion dollars of debt per year since. SMH. Responsibility for the debt is equally divided between parties. They are all tax and spend.

 

[Concerned American]

LMAOROG. You mean WORK REQUIMENTS for the poorest? NOT generational as YOU posited right?

I mean exactly what I said. Do you have a reading problem to go with your spelling ability?

 

[JonKoch]

Yawn, check your partisanship. The national debt surpassed a trillion dollars the first time in Oct. 1981--who was POTUS prior to this point? Carter--both houses were democrat. That was 45 years ago. The executive branch has been split 24 yrs. R--20 yrs. D to the date of the last election. The debt at the end of the last admin was 36.1T. That is an average of 800 billion dollars of debt per year since. SMH. Responsibility for the debt is equally divided between parties. They are all tax and spend.

GOP Budget Busting 101​

US debt to GDP ABOUT 119% IN 1945, THE HIGHEST EVER TO THAT TIME


US DEBT TO GDP IN 1980 was 31%

What were we hearing from the GOP at that time? Let's take a ;look at Ronnie


"During the 1980 campaign, Ronald Reagan heavily criticized Jimmy Carter for federal budget deficits, which reached roughly $59 billion to $74 billion plus "off-budget" items. Reagan termed these deficits a failure of leadership, blaming them and resulting inflation on excessive government spending and taxing, while pledging to balance the budget by 1983 through tax cuts."



Now what did Ronnie actually do as Prez? Not the mythology the right created after seeing how popular and successful Clinton was, the actual data



"During Reagan's eight year presidency, the annual deficits averaged 4.0% of GDP, compared to a 2.2% average during the preceding eight years."


WHAT? How could this be possible?


U.S. federal debt-to-GDP ratio at the end of fiscal year 1989 (September 30, 1989) was approximately 39% . Debt had increased from under $1 trillion to over $2.86 trillion in Ronnie final F/Y


But I thought tax cuts were going to bring in more revenues? Well let's look


F/Y 1980, CARTER'S FINAL F/Y - 19.2% of GDP, with total receipts of $517.1 billion. The total federal outlays (spending) for the same period was 21.2% of GDP


1981 F/Y - Carter's last year - 19.1% GDP revenues


1982- Reagan FIRST YEAR 18.6%
1983- Reagan 17%
1984- Reagan 16.9%
1985- Reagan 17.2%
1986- Reagan 17%
1987- Reagan 17.9%
1988- Reagan 17.7% (Cut taxes from top rate of 50% the US had since LBJ, to 28%, LARGEST TAX CUT FOR THE RICH TO DATE)
1989- Reagan 17.8%

Thread 'GOP Budget Busting 101'

Apr 6, 2026

OK People let's get to the topic of debt, how we got here ($39+ trillion) and how GOP policy vs Democratic policies influenced it.

If you don't want to bring actual facts or data, just stand off



From 1945 to 1980 the US debt to GDP was shrinking. Measuring the debt via GDP accounts for population growth and inflation, and it's how every credible economist or nation measures revenues and expenses



US debt to GDP ABOUT 119% IN 1945, THE HIGHEST EVER TO THAT TIME


US DEBT TO GDP IN 1980 was 31%

What were we hearing from the GOP at that time? Let's take a ;look at Ronnie...

• JonKoch
• Replies: 72
• Forum: Economy

• 
• 

 

[JonKoch]

Yawn, check your partisanship. The national debt surpassed a trillion dollars the first time in Oct. 1981--who was POTUS prior to this point? Carter--both houses were democrat. That was 45 years ago. The executive branch has been split 24 yrs. R--20 yrs. D to the date of the last election. The debt at the end of the last admin was 36.1T. That is an average of 800 billion dollars of debt per year since. SMH. Responsibility for the debt is equally divided between parties. They are all tax and spend.

US DEBT TO GDP FELL UNDER CLINTON, THEN THE GOP TOOK FULL CONTROL IN 2001, $34+ TRILLION DEBT SINCE. GOP STARVE THE BEAST POLICIES, GUTTING REVENUES AS THEY BLOW UP SPENDING

Thread 'GOP Budget Busting 101'

Apr 6, 2026

OK People let's get to the topic of debt, how we got here ($39+ trillion) and how GOP policy vs Democratic policies influenced it.

If you don't want to bring actual facts or data, just stand off



From 1945 to 1980 the US debt to GDP was shrinking. Measuring the debt via GDP accounts for population growth and inflation, and it's how every credible economist or nation measures revenues and expenses



US debt to GDP ABOUT 119% IN 1945, THE HIGHEST EVER TO THAT TIME


US DEBT TO GDP IN 1980 was 31%

What were we hearing from the GOP at that time? Let's take a ;look at Ronnie...

• JonKoch
• Replies: 72
• Forum: Economy

• 
• 

 

[JonKoch]

I mean exactly what I said. Do you have a reading problem to go with your spelling ability?

So you lied since it's not, can't be generational. FIVE YEAR LIFETIME LIMIT


Got it

 

[JonKoch]

Yawn, check your partisanship. The national debt surpassed a trillion dollars the first time in Oct. 1981--who was POTUS prior to this point? Carter--both houses were democrat. That was 45 years ago. The executive branch has been split 24 yrs. R--20 yrs. D to the date of the last election. The debt at the end of the last admin was 36.1T. That is an average of 800 billion dollars of debt per year since. SMH. Responsibility for the debt is equally divided between parties. They are all tax and spend.

LMAOROG. One party gutted taxes (Ronnie, Dubya, Cheeto) WHILE increasing spending


One party (Clinton, Obama, Sleepy Joe) INCREASED taxes (though not enough, but paid for the programs they wanted and passed)


HONESTY shows about 80% of the current debt can be traced to UNFUNDED policies like tax cuts (reducing spending), wars and exploding spending under the GOP OR FOR RESPONSES TO BAD GOP GOVERNANCE (DUBYA'S HOME OWNERSHIP SOCIETY PONZI SCHEME, CHEETO'S FAILED COVID RESPONSE)

 

[JonKoch]

Yawn, check your partisanship. The national debt surpassed a trillion dollars the first time in Oct. 1981--who was POTUS prior to this point? Carter--both houses were democrat. That was 45 years ago. The executive branch has been split 24 yrs. R--20 yrs. D to the date of the last election. The debt at the end of the last admin was 36.1T. That is an average of 800 billion dollars of debt per year since. SMH. Responsibility for the debt is equally divided between parties. They are all tax and spend.

The U.S. national debt officially surpassed $1 trillion for the first time on October 22, 1981, early in President Ronald Reagan’s first term.


1981 F/Y - Carter's last year - 19.1% GDP revenues (Ronnie gutted taxes August 1981)


1982- Reagan FIRST YEAR 18.6%
1983- Reagan 17%
1984- Reagan 16.9% GDP REVENUES

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

So no nothing on the built up equity of the building, so not a penny of taxes on that FREE MONEY. Got it dummy?

Property taxes hit that higher value every year.

Built up equity is free money? Damn, you stupid.

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

GOP Budget Busting 101​

US debt to GDP ABOUT 119% IN 1945, THE HIGHEST EVER TO THAT TIME


US DEBT TO GDP IN 1980 was 31%

What were we hearing from the GOP at that time? Let's take a ;look at Ronnie


"During the 1980 campaign, Ronald Reagan heavily criticized Jimmy Carter for federal budget deficits, which reached roughly $59 billion to $74 billion plus "off-budget" items. Reagan termed these deficits a failure of leadership, blaming them and resulting inflation on excessive government spending and taxing, while pledging to balance the budget by 1983 through tax cuts."



Now what did Ronnie actually do as Prez? Not the mythology the right created after seeing how popular and successful Clinton was, the actual data



"During Reagan's eight year presidency, the annual deficits averaged 4.0% of GDP, compared to a 2.2% average during the preceding eight years."


WHAT? How could this be possible?


U.S. federal debt-to-GDP ratio at the end of fiscal year 1989 (September 30, 1989) was approximately 39% . Debt had increased from under $1 trillion to over $2.86 trillion in Ronnie final F/Y


But I thought tax cuts were going to bring in more revenues? Well let's look


F/Y 1980, CARTER'S FINAL F/Y - 19.2% of GDP, with total receipts of $517.1 billion. The total federal outlays (spending) for the same period was 21.2% of GDP


1981 F/Y - Carter's last year - 19.1% GDP revenues


1982- Reagan FIRST YEAR 18.6%
1983- Reagan 17%
1984- Reagan 16.9%
1985- Reagan 17.2%
1986- Reagan 17%
1987- Reagan 17.9%
1988- Reagan 17.7% (Cut taxes from top rate of 50% the US had since LBJ, to 28%, LARGEST TAX CUT FOR THE RICH TO DATE)
1989- Reagan 17.8%

Thread 'GOP Budget Busting 101'

Apr 6, 2026

OK People let's get to the topic of debt, how we got here ($39+ trillion) and how GOP policy vs Democratic policies influenced it.

If you don't want to bring actual facts or data, just stand off



From 1945 to 1980 the US debt to GDP was shrinking. Measuring the debt via GDP accounts for population growth and inflation, and it's how every credible economist or nation measures revenues and expenses



US debt to GDP ABOUT 119% IN 1945, THE HIGHEST EVER TO THAT TIME


US DEBT TO GDP IN 1980 was 31%

What were we hearing from the GOP at that time? Let's take a ;look at Ronnie...

• JonKoch
• Replies: 72
• Forum: Economy

• 
• 

Now what did Ronnie actually do as Prez?

Killed Carter's stagflation. Beat the Evil Empire.
Gave us an awesome economy.

Other than that, hardly anything.

DURR

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

US DEBT TO GDP FELL UNDER CLINTON, THEN THE GOP TOOK FULL CONTROL IN 2001, $34+ TRILLION DEBT SINCE. GOP STARVE THE BEAST POLICIES, GUTTING REVENUES AS THEY BLOW UP SPENDING

Thread 'GOP Budget Busting 101'

Apr 6, 2026

OK People let's get to the topic of debt, how we got here ($39+ trillion) and how GOP policy vs Democratic policies influenced it.

If you don't want to bring actual facts or data, just stand off



From 1945 to 1980 the US debt to GDP was shrinking. Measuring the debt via GDP accounts for population growth and inflation, and it's how every credible economist or nation measures revenues and expenses



US debt to GDP ABOUT 119% IN 1945, THE HIGHEST EVER TO THAT TIME


US DEBT TO GDP IN 1980 was 31%

What were we hearing from the GOP at that time? Let's take a ;look at Ronnie...

• JonKoch
• Replies: 72
• Forum: Economy

• 
• 

US DEBT TO GDP FELL UNDER CLINTON, THEN THE GOP TOOK FULL CONTROL IN 2001, $34+ TRILLION DEBT SINCE.


And about $18 trillion of that was Obama and Biden. Nice!

 

[leftwinger]

So no nothing on the built up equity of the building, so not a penny of taxes on that FREE MONEY. Got it dummy?

Tax every yr based on equity but for CA homes? Prop q3.

 

[Woodznutz]

So you have nothing to refute it. Got it

Post #468

Using Amazon as an example,

Annual expenses-$637Billion
Even though there are likely many very rich people receiving a paycheck (money) most of the expenses, which translate to paychecks (money) goes to middle class workers. Many wealthy CEO's take small or no salaries at all. Jeff Bezos took $80K/yr., Steve Jobs took $1.

 

[JonKoch]

Property taxes hit that higher value every year.

Built up equity is free money? Damn, you stupid.

Property taxes huh? LOL


If they've never paid a penny of taxes on that equity when it passes to the kids, See Cheeto and his family as examples, yeah it's free money

 

[JonKoch]

Now what did Ronnie actually do as Prez?

Killed Carter's stagflation. Beat the Evil Empire.
Gave us an awesome economy.

Other than that, hardly anything.

DURR

Sure, more right wing myths

Carter 9+ million jobs in 4 years to 14 million to Ronnie in 8, the US went into a recession AFTER Ronnie gutted taxes on the richest, the opposite of what he said would happen, unemployment hit a post GOP great depression high of 10.8% under Ronnie, and I believe it was 28 months before it dropped to under 8%


THE MYTH OF RONNIE WAS CREATED

The "Reagan Myth"—the idealized image of Ronald Reagan as a transformative, fiscally conservative giant who single-handedly won the Cold War and saved the American economy—was consciously developed and promoted by conservative activists starting in the mid-1990s, particularly in response to Bill Clinton's political success.
Key elements and context of this creation, often associated with activist Grover Norquist, include:

• The Catalyst: Clinton’s Success and Historiographical Lows: By 1997, after Bill Clinton was re-elected and a 1996 Arthur Schlesinger Jr. survey rated Reagan’s presidency as "below average," conservative thinkers felt Reagan’s legacy was slipping away.

• The Reagan Legacy Project (1997): Grover Norquist, a prominent anti-tax crusader, launched this initiative to combat the prevailing historical view of Reagan as mediocre. The project’s goal was to name a public site or monument—such as airports, roads, or buildings—after Reagan in every U.S. county.

• Contending for the Past: Norquist explicitly stated that to win future political battles, conservatives needed to win the fight for public perception of the past.

• The "Myth" vs. The "Man": Critics, such as author Will Bunch ("Tear Down This Myth"), argue that the manufactured, heroic figure of Reagan does not match the actual, more complex president who significantly increased government spending, ballooned the national debt, and raised taxes when necessary.

 

[JonKoch]

US DEBT TO GDP FELL UNDER CLINTON, THEN THE GOP TOOK FULL CONTROL IN 2001, $34+ TRILLION DEBT SINCE.


And about $18 trillion of that was Obama and Biden. Nice!

Yep, GOP policies don't just die because the other party becomes president

NOW show me POLICIES they created that CAUSED the debt?

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  In eight years, President Obama signed legislation that cumulatively added $4,988 billion in budget deficits over 2009–19.
  
  
  
  
  
  https://media4.manhattan-institute.org/sites/default/files/R-BR-0917.pdf
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• Biden
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• • Net New Ten-Year Debt: The Committee for a Responsible Federal Budget (CRFB) estimated $4.7 trillion in new, legislatively approved debt.
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• The $4.7 trillion in net new ten-year debt approved by President Biden includes $6.6 trillion of deficit-increasing actions and $1.9 trillion of deficit-reducing actions. Excluding the $2.1 trillion from the American Rescue Plan (ARP), which was enacted in March 2021 to further provide broad economic relief during the COVID-19 pandemic, President Biden approved $4.5 trillion of new gross ten-year debt and over $2.6 trillion in new net ten-year debt.
  
  
  
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• How Much Did President Biden Add to the Debt? | Committee for a Responsible Federal Budget.
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[JonKoch]

Post #468

Using Amazon as an example,

Annual expenses-$637Billion
Even though there are likely many very rich people receiving a paycheck (money) most of the expenses, which translate to paychecks (money) goes to middle class workers. Many wealthy CEO's take small or no salaries at all. Jeff Bezos took $80K/yr., Steve Jobs took $1.

LMAOROG. True they take STOCK which they pay MUCH lower taxes on and generally aren't taxed until they exercise the options, generally under 20%

Since Ronnie and the ability to pay via options, executive pay has skyrocketed



Executive pay has skyrocketed largely due to compensation packages being increasingly tied to stock options and equity-based awards, with realized compensation for top CEOs growing over 1,000% since 1978. As of 2024, realized compensation—what CEOs take home after selling stock-based pay—averaged nearly $23 million at the top 350 U.S. firms, making them 281 times better paid than the typical worker.

 

[Woodznutz]

Property taxes huh? LOL


If they've never paid a penny of taxes on that equity when it passes to the kids, See Cheeto and his family as examples, yeah it's free money

Except that the house they inherit is the same one that their parents bought years ago. What changed is the price, the value remains the same. In fact, the house probably needs a new roof.

 

[Woodznutz]

LMAOROG. True they take STOCK which they pay MUCH lower taxes on and generally aren't taxed until they exercise the options, generally under 20%

Since Ronnie and the ability to pay via options, executive pay has skyrocketed



Executive pay has skyrocketed largely due to compensation packages being increasingly tied to stock options and equity-based awards, with realized compensation for top CEOs growing over 1,000% since 1978. As of 2024, realized compensation—what CEOs take home after selling stock-based pay—averaged nearly $23 million at the top 350 U.S. firms, making them 281 times better paid than the typical worker.

That is offset by the fact that there are many times more workers than CEOs, thus more total money is in the hands of the workers than the CEOs.

 

[JonKoch]

Except that the house they inherit is the same one that their parents bought years ago. What changed is the price, the value remains the same. In fact, the house probably needs a new roof.

And increased 200%-500% or more in value. BUT we aren't talking about that ($15 million EXEMPTION per person in the US), IT'S THE WEALTHY WE ARE TALKING ABOT. Keep up


Starting January 1, 2026, the federal estate and gift tax exemption rises to $15 million per individual ($30 million for married couples), as mandated by the One Big Beautiful Bill Act (OBBBA). This record-high, inflation-adjusted limit allows taxpayers to transfer up to this amount tax-free during life or at death. The exemption applies to both federal estate and generation-skipping transfer (GST) taxes.