Stalking is legal? If you're in a union, sure!

[Spiderman]

Just as soon as we apply the law equally to Plutocrats and business owners.

If the 1% want a pissing contest with the rest of us, we'll see who gets wet.

So are your kids fair game too? How about your wife? Can a business owner follow you around all day and shout obscenities at you?

Idiot.

Yeah, they are usually called your boss......

I never once had a business owner I worked for swear at me.

If you did and you chose to stay at the job then you have nothing to complain about

 

[WinterBorn]

[

Bullshit!!

Back in the day unions were all about making sure the workers were paid decently, weren't cheated, and that the safety was observed.

What do they do now? They got the laws changed, and I applaud them for that. But now the best they can hope to do is cause trouble to get a worker a couple of dollars an hour more pay. They are notthe noble cause anymore. In fact, I have had them fight me on safety issues because they want control, not because they want workers safe.


Those guys were picketing because they wanted every worker to be a union man. So what they were doing was trying to take work away from honest, hard working, middle class guys and give the jobs to their union cronies. They were the ones breaking in and trying to steal.

If the picket line is legit, I will honor it. But it damn sure has to be something more than wanting all the workers to be union. I have crossed those picket lines before and I will do it again. I did it in 2012 when a local union tried to shut down powerline work. The company started splitting the work between union and non-union crews after the union was caught falsifying safety training records. The union pitched a fit and called for a strike. They lost.

Right. Because the Company wouldn't try to claim they were "falsifying" documentation in order to hire scab outfits, would they. Companies being ethical paragons and all that.

You cross a picket line, you deserve a beating. Period. Because again, this is the chart.

You can slit your own throat, but when you try to slit mine, I'm going to object.

The company didn't claim anything until a couple of workers admitted they hadn't been taught a few basic courses. They were willing to work in the substation without the proper training because the union guy told them it would be ok.

The guys were risking their lives because they listened to their union guy. That kind of following in blind ignorance is not something to be proud of. Much like your insistence that a picket line is never to be crossed. I make my own choices based on facts, not on blind loyalties to groups who are not loyal to me.

Oh, and as for the "scab outfits", the non-union workers made the same hourly wage and had the same benefits. Quite a few of the non-union guys came from the union shop when they saw what had happened.

I have not claimed companies are ethical paragons. But they are certainly no worse than the unions. And at least the companies are held accountable for stalking & harassment. For the union guys it isn't illegal. And for there to be an exemption for a type of organization with such a violent past is insane.

 

[Spiderman]

[

But you have no problem lumping me in with them. Just like you had no problem lumping me in with the rightwingers. Or just like you had no problem lumping me in with whatever group you thought you could insult. YOu have ofered very little in the way of argument or debate, and plenty of attempted insults. I find it amusing that you think that counts for something.

Frankly, as long as you take the side of the enemy, that's how I'll treat you.

Working folks/ 1%ers.

Either your with us, or you're against us.

Another us or them idiot.

There is no us and them.

 

[JoeB131]

[

I never once had a business owner I worked for swear at me.

If you did sand you chose to stay at the job then you have nothing to complain about

Come on, guy, it's not like you ever really had a job...

 

[WinterBorn]

[

But you have no problem lumping me in with them. Just like you had no problem lumping me in with the rightwingers. Or just like you had no problem lumping me in with whatever group you thought you could insult. YOu have ofered very little in the way of argument or debate, and plenty of attempted insults. I find it amusing that you think that counts for something.

Frankly, as long as you take the side of the enemy, that's how I'll treat you.

Working folks/ 1%ers.

Either your with us, or you're against us.

Typical union mentality. For you it is all about class warfare. For me it is about my job and doing it well. I have no beef with the upper mgmt guys, nor do I have a beef with the line crews. We get along fine.

But if you want to call me your enemy, I am fine with that. It does not change my life one iota.

 

[JoeB131]

[

But you have no problem lumping me in with them. Just like you had no problem lumping me in with the rightwingers. Or just like you had no problem lumping me in with whatever group you thought you could insult. YOu have ofered very little in the way of argument or debate, and plenty of attempted insults. I find it amusing that you think that counts for something.

Frankly, as long as you take the side of the enemy, that's how I'll treat you.

Working folks/ 1%ers.

Either your with us, or you're against us.

Another us or them idiot.

There is no us and them.

Uh, yeah, there really is.

And frankly, here's the thing. They have a goal they are working for. Making their company as much money as humanly possible. and normally, I'm good with that, up and until they figure out the way to make money is to fuck over the people doing the actual work.

 

[Spiderman]

[

I never once had a business owner I worked for swear at me.

If you did sand you chose to stay at the job then you have nothing to complain about

Come on, guy, it's not like you ever really had a job...

Says the guy too fucking stupid not to get fired multiple times.

 

[WinterBorn]

[

But you have no problem lumping me in with them. Just like you had no problem lumping me in with the rightwingers. Or just like you had no problem lumping me in with whatever group you thought you could insult. YOu have ofered very little in the way of argument or debate, and plenty of attempted insults. I find it amusing that you think that counts for something.

Frankly, as long as you take the side of the enemy, that's how I'll treat you.

Working folks/ 1%ers.

Either your with us, or you're against us.

Another us or them idiot.

There is no us and them.

Some people need someone to blame for their problems.

 

[Spiderman]

Frankly, as long as you take the side of the enemy, that's how I'll treat you.

Working folks/ 1%ers.

Either your with us, or you're against us.

Another us or them idiot.

There is no us and them.

Uh, yeah, there really is.

And frankly, here's the thing. They have a goal they are working for. Making their company as much money as humanly possible. and normally, I'm good with that, up and until they figure out the way to make money is to fuck over the people doing the actual work.

If you agree to work for the pay being offered and you think it's not enough then you are fucking yourself over.

If you accept a job with the offered salary then by definition you agreed that it was fair.

 

[Spiderman]

Frankly, as long as you take the side of the enemy, that's how I'll treat you.

Working folks/ 1%ers.

Either your with us, or you're against us.

Another us or them idiot.

There is no us and them.

Some people need someone to blame for their problems.

Joe is the poster child for that particular group

 

[WinterBorn]

Frankly, as long as you take the side of the enemy, that's how I'll treat you.

Working folks/ 1%ers.

Either your with us, or you're against us.

Another us or them idiot.

There is no us and them.

Uh, yeah, there really is.

And frankly, here's the thing. They have a goal they are working for. Making their company as much money as humanly possible. and normally, I'm good with that, up and until they figure out the way to make money is to fuck over the people doing the actual work.

The companies I have worked for typically see the employees as assets. Not sure where you have been working, but it sounds very different from my time in the working world.

I have also had the opportunity to work for some excellent upper mgmt and business owners. The bigger companies were run by men who saw what they wanted and built it. Most of the time the hourly guys were chomping at the bit to leave at 5pm. The men who started the company were there long after that. Each one made sure I had what I needed to make sure the crews work safe. They made sure the crews knew they were appreciated and valued. They all gave out good bonuses and had profit sharing. None of them were the enemy.

In fact, one of those former company owners saw an old friend of mine a few weeks ago. I haven't worked for him in 6 years, but he still asked about me. Rich business owner? You bet! Enemy? lol Not even close.

 

[JoeB131]

[

If you agree to work for the pay being offered and you think it's not enough then you are fucking yourself over.

If you accept a job with the offered salary then by definition you agreed that it was fair.

And if they kept their promises, I'd have no issue with that.

Oh, wait, they totally didn't do that.

 

[Spiderman]

[

If you agree to work for the pay being offered and you think it's not enough then you are fucking yourself over.

If you accept a job with the offered salary then by definition you agreed that it was fair.

And if they kept their promises, I'd have no issue with that.

Oh, wait, they totally didn't do that.

OH BOO fucking HOO.

For all we know you're the one who didn't hold up his end and you're blaming everyone else as usual.

 

[JoeB131]

[

The companies I have worked for typically see the employees as assets. Not sure where you have been working, but it sounds very different from my time in the working world.

I have also had the opportunity to work for some excellent upper mgmt and business owners. The bigger companies were run by men who saw what they wanted and built it. Most of the time the hourly guys were chomping at the bit to leave at 5pm. The men who started the company were there long after that. Each one made sure I had what I needed to make sure the crews work safe. They made sure the crews knew they were appreciated and valued. They all gave out good bonuses and had profit sharing. None of them were the enemy.

In fact, one of those former company owners saw an old friend of mine a few weeks ago. I haven't worked for him in 6 years, but he still asked about me. Rich business owner? You bet! Enemy? lol Not even close.

Oh, here we go. The whole "THe Boss puts in so much time, he's such a wonderful man".

Seriously, it's like fucking Stockholm Syndrome...

Yeah, how dare those hourly guys want to go home at 5 and spend time with their families.

Incidently, "The Douchebag" also put in lots and lots of hours. He was still a horrible manager and a horrible person and he made horrible decisions.

 

[WinterBorn]

[

The companies I have worked for typically see the employees as assets. Not sure where you have been working, but it sounds very different from my time in the working world.

I have also had the opportunity to work for some excellent upper mgmt and business owners. The bigger companies were run by men who saw what they wanted and built it. Most of the time the hourly guys were chomping at the bit to leave at 5pm. The men who started the company were there long after that. Each one made sure I had what I needed to make sure the crews work safe. They made sure the crews knew they were appreciated and valued. They all gave out good bonuses and had profit sharing. None of them were the enemy.

In fact, one of those former company owners saw an old friend of mine a few weeks ago. I haven't worked for him in 6 years, but he still asked about me. Rich business owner? You bet! Enemy? lol Not even close.

Oh, here we go. The whole "THe Boss puts in so much time, he's such a wonderful man".

Seriously, it's like fucking Stockholm Syndrome...

Yeah, how dare those hourly guys want to go home at 5 and spend time with their families.

Incidently, "The Douchebag" also put in lots and lots of hours. He was still a horrible manager and a horrible person and he made horrible decisions.

Here is the difference between you and me (among many). You want to claim that every employer is like the douchebag. I let each employer show me who they are.

Yeah, the bosses I have had, for the most part, have been great guys. We have not always seen eye to eye and I have argued with most of them at one time or another. But I argued specific points. I didn't pretend they were the enemy.

 

[Spiderman]

[

The companies I have worked for typically see the employees as assets. Not sure where you have been working, but it sounds very different from my time in the working world.

I have also had the opportunity to work for some excellent upper mgmt and business owners. The bigger companies were run by men who saw what they wanted and built it. Most of the time the hourly guys were chomping at the bit to leave at 5pm. The men who started the company were there long after that. Each one made sure I had what I needed to make sure the crews work safe. They made sure the crews knew they were appreciated and valued. They all gave out good bonuses and had profit sharing. None of them were the enemy.

In fact, one of those former company owners saw an old friend of mine a few weeks ago. I haven't worked for him in 6 years, but he still asked about me. Rich business owner? You bet! Enemy? lol Not even close.

Oh, here we go. The whole "THe Boss puts in so much time, he's such a wonderful man".

Seriously, it's like fucking Stockholm Syndrome...

Yeah, how dare those hourly guys want to go home at 5 and spend time with their families.

Incidently, "The Douchebag" also put in lots and lots of hours. He was still a horrible manager and a horrible person and he made horrible decisions.

Yeah all we have is your dubious word on that.

But your questionable veracity aside you can't see that you are projecting your perception of this one guy onto everyone because you're an idiot.

 

[JoeB131]

[

OH BOO fucking HOO.

For all we know you're the one who didn't hold up his end and you're blaming everyone else as usual.

FOr all we know you weigh 400 lbs and are collecting a disability check.

What's your point?

 

[JoeB131]

[

Yeah all we have is your dubious word on that.

But your questionable veracity aside you can't see that you are projecting your perception of this one guy onto everyone because you're an idiot.

No, I j ust point out that we need unions and strong worker protections because douchebags like this become managers and no one wants to admit they made a mistake by promoting him to start with.

And this wasn't even the worst manager I worked for.

 

[WinterBorn]

[

OH BOO fucking HOO.

For all we know you're the one who didn't hold up his end and you're blaming everyone else as usual.

FOr all we know you weigh 400 lbs and are collecting a disability check.

What's your point?

I can tell you what one issue you have that may have been a root cause of some of your employment problems.

If you see the employer as the enemy, that will show. You don't have to say it. But your hatred of the 1%ers and your willingness to lump everyone together would mean your attitude would show how you feel. I doubt any employer wants to cultivate an employee that hates him. It is counterproductive. Also, the attitude can poison the workplace. It doesn't take many people with that sort of attitude to ruin it for everyone. I have seen it happen.

So take at least a little responsibility for what happened in your life. After all, it IS your life.

 

[JoeB131]

[

Here is the difference between you and me (among many). You want to claim that every employer is like the douchebag. I let each employer show me who they are.

Yeah, the bosses I have had, for the most part, have been great guys. We have not always seen eye to eye and I have argued with most of them at one time or another. But I argued specific points. I didn't pretend they were the enemy.

Um, guy, the difference between you and me is I don't let people piss on my leg and tell me it's raining.

I used to argue points with these idiots, now I don't even bother to do that. Just get the job done.

But I don't pretend they are brilliant, and I don't pretend they are my friend.