Solar panels failing after 2 years!

[kiwiman127]

Well, Andy, ever read about the wheat grains and the chessboard? Perhaps you should look into that. Solar doubled it's capacity last year, and now accounts for about 1% of our electricity. A decade of that kind of growth, and there will be no coal mines in the US.

Yeah, Solar doubled it's capacity. No, it's not 1%

What is U.S. electricity generation by energy source - FAQ - U.S. Energy Information Administration EIA

Solar is 0.4%.

No, there will always be coal mines in the US. We are already exporting coal, and the demand will only increase, driving up price, making coal mining profitable.

Capacity is irrelevant. We could cover the artic poll with trillions of gigawatts in solar panels, and produce barely 1% of that in actual power.

This is why in Germany, despite having tons of wind power capacity, produces a tiny fraction of that.

Capacity is irrelevant. What matters is actual production.

So solar capacity doubled, and it now *produces* 0.4% of our national power consumption.



Whooo hooo...

"well if the expansion of capacity continues"

Theoretically.... yes. I lost 10 lbs over the past 6 months. In theory in about 10 years, I should be lighter than air. My sister gained 20 lbs in the past 6 months. In 30 years, she'll be heavier than Shamu. (she's pregnant)

What's my point? You are making a fairly large assumption that a short term pattern will continue indefinitely. That's never the case. Global temperatures have been falling since 2002. If that keeps up, we're on the verge of an ice age.

Not only is the current trends not automatically going to continue, but it is entirely likely that they will not.

The massive cost of government spending on renewable energy, is very likely to be ended. When it happens, is completely unknown, but we do know that on a state level, it's already started.

Ohio recently 'paused' green energy subsidies. The cost was getting high, and thus to maintain a solid budget, the green-energy push was paused.

If the renewable energy field was truly viable, then it wouldn't need subsidies from the government.

Spain recently had to cut renewable energy subsidies, simply because they could no longer afford them.

Spain s solar industry to collapse as govt introduces draconian profit caps RT Business

Without government taxing the poor, to pay the rich solar corporations, they go broke. Solar, and wind both, are simply not economically viable without government dishing out tax money to rich corporations.

"If the renewable energy field was truly viable, then it wouldn't need subsidies from the government."-Andylusion

The oil and coal industries received over $20 billion in government subsides in 2013.
Thoughts?

 

[NoNukes]

Mine are still in excellent shape after 8 years.

Is your place enjoying shade a part of the day?

No

 

[Andylusion]

Well, Andy, ever read about the wheat grains and the chessboard? Perhaps you should look into that. Solar doubled it's capacity last year, and now accounts for about 1% of our electricity. A decade of that kind of growth, and there will be no coal mines in the US.

Yeah, Solar doubled it's capacity. No, it's not 1%

What is U.S. electricity generation by energy source - FAQ - U.S. Energy Information Administration EIA

Solar is 0.4%.

No, there will always be coal mines in the US. We are already exporting coal, and the demand will only increase, driving up price, making coal mining profitable.

Capacity is irrelevant. We could cover the artic poll with trillions of gigawatts in solar panels, and produce barely 1% of that in actual power.

This is why in Germany, despite having tons of wind power capacity, produces a tiny fraction of that.

Capacity is irrelevant. What matters is actual production.

So solar capacity doubled, and it now *produces* 0.4% of our national power consumption.



Whooo hooo...

"well if the expansion of capacity continues"

Theoretically.... yes. I lost 10 lbs over the past 6 months. In theory in about 10 years, I should be lighter than air. My sister gained 20 lbs in the past 6 months. In 30 years, she'll be heavier than Shamu. (she's pregnant)

What's my point? You are making a fairly large assumption that a short term pattern will continue indefinitely. That's never the case. Global temperatures have been falling since 2002. If that keeps up, we're on the verge of an ice age.

Not only is the current trends not automatically going to continue, but it is entirely likely that they will not.

The massive cost of government spending on renewable energy, is very likely to be ended. When it happens, is completely unknown, but we do know that on a state level, it's already started.

Ohio recently 'paused' green energy subsidies. The cost was getting high, and thus to maintain a solid budget, the green-energy push was paused.

If the renewable energy field was truly viable, then it wouldn't need subsidies from the government.

Spain recently had to cut renewable energy subsidies, simply because they could no longer afford them.

Spain s solar industry to collapse as govt introduces draconian profit caps RT Business

Without government taxing the poor, to pay the rich solar corporations, they go broke. Solar, and wind both, are simply not economically viable without government dishing out tax money to rich corporations.

"If the renewable energy field was truly viable, then it wouldn't need subsidies from the government."-Andylusion

The oil and coal industries received over $20 billion in government subsides in 2013.
Thoughts?

Great question. This is a long answer, because it's a deep question.

Most right-leaning people, are against ALL subsidies. As in all subsidies. Every single subsidy in the entire country should be eliminated.

In any other context, that should be the ultimate answer. Unfortunately people have decided to screw with the meaning of words, until it means something completely different.

If you look up the word "subsidize", you will get this meaning:

sub·si·dize
ˈsəbsəˌdīz/
verb
verb: subsidize; 3rd person present: subsidizes; past tense: subsidized; past participle: subsidized; gerund or present participle: subsidizing; verb: subsidise; 3rd person present: subsidises; past tense: subsidised; past participle: subsidised; gerund or present participle: subsidising

1. support (an organization or activity) financially.
   "it was beyond the power of a state to subsidize a business"
   synonyms: give money to, pay a subsidy to, contribute to, invest in, sponsor, support, fund, finance, underwrite;More
   informalshell out for, fork out for, cough up for;
   bankroll
   "they have agreed to subsidize the after-school program"
   • pay part of the cost of producing (something) to reduce prices for the buyer.
     "the government subsidizes basic goods including sugar, petroleum, and wheat"

When we on the right talk about 'subsidies'... we are talking specifically about taxing one group of people, and giving that money to another.

Ethanol is a perfect example. The government pays the Ethanol producers, so that the cost of a gallon of E85 is somewhat lower than that of regular gasoline. No one would ever buy E85, if not for this subsidy, because the price would be much higher.

When people talk about coal and oil subsidies, such as the $20 Billion figure you mentioned, that is actually not a subsidy.

Most of that is all tax breaks. A tax break is not a subsidy.

Say I came to your home, like a Mafia deal, and required you to pay me $100 every week, "for protection". Then after several months of this, I decided to cut my rate to only $75 a week.... would you feel "subsidized" by me? Would I go around telling everyone how benevolent I am subsidizing you?

Of course not. The concept is ridiculous. The entire logic of the claim, implies that all money that anyone anywhere earns, is really owned by the government, and if they allow you the privilege to keep a little of 'their' money, then they are subsidizing you.

We on the right, obviously reject that notion. I want everyone to pay as little in taxes as possible. The fewer dollars government gets, the better it is for everyone.

But even with the tax breaks, all industries enjoy the same tax breaks.

For example, oil companies get to deduct depreciation of oil wells. But wait... don't solar panel and wind mills also get to deduct depreciation of their capital as well? Yes they do. In fact, everyone does. The hot dog vendor at the park, can deduct the capital depreciation of his hot dog cart.

In fact, nearly all the tax breaks given to oil and coal, apply to absolutely everyone. I get a tax dedication myself. Am I being subsidized? I don't think so.