Socialism

[Flopper]

been listening to The Beatles too much lately.

Here is a list of the 100 largest companies that are owned by the employees. Are they socialist enterprises?

Publix Super Markets
Hy-Vee
Daymon Worldwide
CH2M Hill, Inc.
Lifetouch
Nypro
Houchens Industries
Penmac
WinCo Foods
Parsons
Black & Veatch
Amsted Industries
W.L. Gore & Associates
Graybar Electric
HDR
Alliance Holdings
Burnett Staffing
Davey Tree Expert
Austin Industries
Brookshire Brothers
EmpRes Healthcare
Schreiber Foods
Piggly Wiggly Carolina
Blue Tee
McCarthy Building Company
Tharaldson Motels
EOD Technology
General Growth Management
Columbia Forest Products
Guckenheimer Enterprises
Hanson Pipe & Precast
Sammons Enterprises
HNTB
Herff Jones
Harp's Food Stores
Alion Science and Technology
Lewis Tree Service
Appleton
American Cast Iron Pipe
Terracon
Scheels All Sport
MWH Americas
Miller's Health Systems
KI
Gensler
Food Giant
Bi-Mart
Recology
Hensel-Phelps Construction
KeHe Distributors
S&C Electric
Cianbro
Schweitzer Engineering
Round Table Pizza
Acadian Ambulance
Medicalodges
Reasors
Omaha World Herald
Kleinfelder
Kinney Drugs
TRAX International
Rosendin Electric
CentiMark
Burns & McDonnell Engineering
Abt Associates
The Weitz Company
Weston Solutions
Osmose Holdings, Inc.
John Henry Company
The Sundt Companies.
Ebby Halliday Realtors
STV Group
Bureau of National Affairs Inc.
Roberts Hawaii
Woodman's Food Market
TD Industries
Cooperative Home Care Assocs
Kelly Moore Paint Co.
Dunn-Edwards Paints
Dahls Foods
JASPER Engines & Transmissions
Remke biggs Markets
Pinnacle Builders
MMC
Martin & Bayley
Brown and Caldwell
American Systems Corp.
HDOS Enterprises
Okonite
Barton Malow
Applied Research Associates
Swinerton
Charles Machine Works
Border States Electric
Zandex Health Care
Cobham Analytic Solutions
Riesbeck Food Markets
SecTec
Challenge Manufacturing
Scitor

First of all those companies do it by choice-not force. A company has the right to do as they want.

Second of all the very first company on your list-not every worker owns a part of the company. I worked there back in highschool, and they never gave me any stock. Now I had the option to buy into the stock, and only employees can buy stock-but that's not the same as socialism-as different employees own different amounts.

This is a list of large companies with over 50% ownership by employees.

 

[Flopper]

Here is a list of the 100 largest companies that are owned by the employees. Are they socialist enterprises?

Publix Super Markets
Hy-Vee
Daymon Worldwide
CH2M Hill, Inc.
Lifetouch
Nypro
Houchens Industries
Penmac
WinCo Foods
Parsons
Black & Veatch
Amsted Industries
W.L. Gore & Associates
Graybar Electric
HDR
Alliance Holdings
Burnett Staffing
Davey Tree Expert
Austin Industries
Brookshire Brothers
EmpRes Healthcare
Schreiber Foods
Piggly Wiggly Carolina
Blue Tee
McCarthy Building Company
Tharaldson Motels
EOD Technology
General Growth Management
Columbia Forest Products
Guckenheimer Enterprises
Hanson Pipe & Precast
Sammons Enterprises
HNTB
Herff Jones
Harp's Food Stores
Alion Science and Technology
Lewis Tree Service
Appleton
American Cast Iron Pipe
Terracon
Scheels All Sport
MWH Americas
Miller's Health Systems
KI
Gensler
Food Giant
Bi-Mart
Recology
Hensel-Phelps Construction
KeHe Distributors
S&C Electric
Cianbro
Schweitzer Engineering
Round Table Pizza
Acadian Ambulance
Medicalodges
Reasors
Omaha World Herald
Kleinfelder
Kinney Drugs
TRAX International
Rosendin Electric
CentiMark
Burns & McDonnell Engineering
Abt Associates
The Weitz Company
Weston Solutions
Osmose Holdings, Inc.
John Henry Company
The Sundt Companies.
Ebby Halliday Realtors
STV Group
Bureau of National Affairs Inc.
Roberts Hawaii
Woodman's Food Market
TD Industries
Cooperative Home Care Assocs
Kelly Moore Paint Co.
Dunn-Edwards Paints
Dahls Foods
JASPER Engines & Transmissions
Remke biggs Markets
Pinnacle Builders
MMC
Martin & Bayley
Brown and Caldwell
American Systems Corp.
HDOS Enterprises
Okonite
Barton Malow
Applied Research Associates
Swinerton
Charles Machine Works
Border States Electric
Zandex Health Care
Cobham Analytic Solutions
Riesbeck Food Markets
SecTec
Challenge Manufacturing
Scitor

First of all those companies do it by choice-not force. A company has the right to do as they want.

Second of all the very first company on your list-not every worker owns a part of the company. I worked there back in highschool, and they never gave me any stock. Now I had the option to buy into the stock, and only employees can buy stock-but that's not the same as socialism-as different employees own different amounts.

This is a list of large companies with over 50% ownership by employees.

In this socialism discussion, where does a company owned by it's customers fall?

 

[ScreamingEagle]

First of all those companies do it by choice-not force. A company has the right to do as they want.

Second of all the very first company on your list-not every worker owns a part of the company. I worked there back in highschool, and they never gave me any stock. Now I had the option to buy into the stock, and only employees can buy stock-but that's not the same as socialism-as different employees own different amounts.

This is a list of large companies with over 50% ownership by employees.

In this socialism discussion, where does a company owned by it's customers fall?

It falls under the category of "opportunity for propaganda".....meaning socialists can confuse the ignorant into thinking that a private enterprise freely engaged in by many is really a "socialist" enterprise...

 

[thereisnospoon]

Socialism is an economic system in which the means of production are publicly or commonly owned and controlled co-operatively, or a political philosophy advocating such a system. As a form of social organization, socialism is based on co-operative social relations and self-management; relatively equal power-relations and the reduction or elimination of hierarchy in the management of economic and political affairs.

Socialism - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Socialism invariably falls under the control of government.
In every instance where socialism was the economic system, it was the central government which controlled all business and all wealth.
The Chavez regime in Venezuela is a perfect example.
Chavez was elected by ballot. Then under the law was permitted to nationalize all business in the country.
The regime controls all wealth and commerce. The regime collects keeps the lion's share of wealth then distributes morsels to the people.

 

[JamesInFlorida]

Here is a list of the 100 largest companies that are owned by the employees. Are they socialist enterprises?

Publix Super Markets
Hy-Vee
Daymon Worldwide
CH2M Hill, Inc.
Lifetouch
Nypro
Houchens Industries
Penmac
WinCo Foods
Parsons
Black & Veatch
Amsted Industries
W.L. Gore & Associates
Graybar Electric
HDR
Alliance Holdings
Burnett Staffing
Davey Tree Expert
Austin Industries
Brookshire Brothers
EmpRes Healthcare
Schreiber Foods
Piggly Wiggly Carolina
Blue Tee
McCarthy Building Company
Tharaldson Motels
EOD Technology
General Growth Management
Columbia Forest Products
Guckenheimer Enterprises
Hanson Pipe & Precast
Sammons Enterprises
HNTB
Herff Jones
Harp's Food Stores
Alion Science and Technology
Lewis Tree Service
Appleton
American Cast Iron Pipe
Terracon
Scheels All Sport
MWH Americas
Miller's Health Systems
KI
Gensler
Food Giant
Bi-Mart
Recology
Hensel-Phelps Construction
KeHe Distributors
S&C Electric
Cianbro
Schweitzer Engineering
Round Table Pizza
Acadian Ambulance
Medicalodges
Reasors
Omaha World Herald
Kleinfelder
Kinney Drugs
TRAX International
Rosendin Electric
CentiMark
Burns & McDonnell Engineering
Abt Associates
The Weitz Company
Weston Solutions
Osmose Holdings, Inc.
John Henry Company
The Sundt Companies.
Ebby Halliday Realtors
STV Group
Bureau of National Affairs Inc.
Roberts Hawaii
Woodman's Food Market
TD Industries
Cooperative Home Care Assocs
Kelly Moore Paint Co.
Dunn-Edwards Paints
Dahls Foods
JASPER Engines & Transmissions
Remke biggs Markets
Pinnacle Builders
MMC
Martin & Bayley
Brown and Caldwell
American Systems Corp.
HDOS Enterprises
Okonite
Barton Malow
Applied Research Associates
Swinerton
Charles Machine Works
Border States Electric
Zandex Health Care
Cobham Analytic Solutions
Riesbeck Food Markets
SecTec
Challenge Manufacturing
Scitor

First of all those companies do it by choice-not force. A company has the right to do as they want.

Second of all the very first company on your list-not every worker owns a part of the company. I worked there back in highschool, and they never gave me any stock. Now I had the option to buy into the stock, and only employees can buy stock-but that's not the same as socialism-as different employees own different amounts.

This is a list of large companies with over 50% ownership by employees.

And your point is?

 

[ScreamingEagle]

Socialism is an economic system in which the means of production are publicly or commonly owned and controlled co-operatively, or a political philosophy advocating such a system. As a form of social organization, socialism is based on co-operative social relations and self-management; relatively equal power-relations and the reduction or elimination of hierarchy in the management of economic and political affairs.

Socialism - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Socialism invariably falls under the control of government.
In every instance where socialism was the economic system, it was the central government which controlled all business and all wealth.
The Chavez regime in Venezuela is a perfect example.
Chavez was elected by ballot. Then under the law was permitted to nationalize all business in the country.
The regime controls all wealth and commerce. The regime collects keeps the lion's share of wealth then distributes morsels to the people.

exactomundo....government control is the key....

of course one can always argue that "commonly-owned and controlled co-operatetively" means something is a "socialist" enterprise....one can point to co-ops or monasteries or hippie subcultures as prime examples (or even try to point to shared ownership of private companies)...but that is usually done to derail the truth....this is a political discussion board and government (especially grasping-for-power government like that with BO) has always been the key factor in forming a socialist nation....

 

[bripat9643]

The US military is a prime example of Socialism. So is TARP. And government contracts.

It that be the case then so is:
Home Land Security
Local Police and Fire Protection
Government operated prisons
FBI
FDIC Insurance
SBA loans to small businesses
etc, etc....

yes, those are all examples of socialism.

 

[bripat9643]

They aren't government owned, so they aren't socialist. If that makes a company socialist, then every corporation is socialist, since the are owned communally by their share holders.

Here is a list of the 100 largest companies that are owned by the employees. Are they socialist enterprises?

Publix Super Markets
Hy-Vee
Daymon Worldwide
CH2M Hill, Inc.
Lifetouch
Nypro
Houchens Industries
Penmac
WinCo Foods
Parsons
Black & Veatch
Amsted Industries
W.L. Gore & Associates
Graybar Electric
HDR
Alliance Holdings
Burnett Staffing
Davey Tree Expert
Austin Industries
Brookshire Brothers
EmpRes Healthcare
Schreiber Foods
Piggly Wiggly Carolina
Blue Tee
McCarthy Building Company
Tharaldson Motels
EOD Technology
General Growth Management
Columbia Forest Products
Guckenheimer Enterprises
Hanson Pipe & Precast
Sammons Enterprises
HNTB
Herff Jones
Harp's Food Stores
Alion Science and Technology
Lewis Tree Service
Appleton
American Cast Iron Pipe
Terracon
Scheels All Sport
MWH Americas
Miller's Health Systems
KI
Gensler
Food Giant
Bi-Mart
Recology
Hensel-Phelps Construction
KeHe Distributors
S&C Electric
Cianbro
Schweitzer Engineering
Round Table Pizza
Acadian Ambulance
Medicalodges
Reasors
Omaha World Herald
Kleinfelder
Kinney Drugs
TRAX International
Rosendin Electric
CentiMark
Burns & McDonnell Engineering
Abt Associates
The Weitz Company
Weston Solutions
Osmose Holdings, Inc.
John Henry Company
The Sundt Companies.
Ebby Halliday Realtors
STV Group
Bureau of National Affairs Inc.
Roberts Hawaii
Woodman's Food Market
TD Industries
Cooperative Home Care Assocs
Kelly Moore Paint Co.
Dunn-Edwards Paints
Dahls Foods
JASPER Engines & Transmissions
Remke biggs Markets
Pinnacle Builders
MMC
Martin & Bayley
Brown and Caldwell
American Systems Corp.
HDOS Enterprises
Okonite
Barton Malow
Applied Research Associates
Swinerton
Charles Machine Works
Border States Electric
Zandex Health Care
Cobham Analytic Solutions
Riesbeck Food Markets
SecTec
Challenge Manufacturing
Scitor

 

[ScreamingEagle]

The US military is a prime example of Socialism. So is TARP. And government contracts.

It that be the case then so is:
Home Land Security
Local Police and Fire Protection
Government operated prisons
FBI
FDIC Insurance
SBA loans to small businesses
etc, etc....

yes, those are all examples of socialism.

and look how many curb your Freedom in various ways...or are grasping for control...

 

[Flopper]

First of all those companies do it by choice-not force. A company has the right to do as they want.

Second of all the very first company on your list-not every worker owns a part of the company. I worked there back in highschool, and they never gave me any stock. Now I had the option to buy into the stock, and only employees can buy stock-but that's not the same as socialism-as different employees own different amounts.

This is a list of large companies with over 50% ownership by employees.

And your point is?

I was replying to a post that stated Socialism essentially is when all the producers of a product are the owners. I really don't think employee ownership is socialism but I guess that depends on definition.

 

[Flopper]

Socialism is an economic system in which the means of production are publicly or commonly owned and controlled co-operatively, or a political philosophy advocating such a system. As a form of social organization, socialism is based on co-operative social relations and self-management; relatively equal power-relations and the reduction or elimination of hierarchy in the management of economic and political affairs.

Socialism - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Socialism invariably falls under the control of government.
In every instance where socialism was the economic system, it was the central government which controlled all business and all wealth.
The Chavez regime in Venezuela is a perfect example.
Chavez was elected by ballot. Then under the law was permitted to nationalize all business in the country.
The regime controls all wealth and commerce. The regime collects keeps the lion's share of wealth then distributes morsels to the people.

I think the only countries where the economy is predominantly socialistic is Venezuela, Cuba, and North Korea and maybe a few African countries. Russia is moving away from state owned enterprise but it is still a significant part of the economy. China seems to be mixed bag that is becoming very capitalist. In the rest of the world, private ownership of business seems to dominate state owned.

 

[ScreamingEagle]

Socialism is an economic system in which the means of production are publicly or commonly owned and controlled co-operatively, or a political philosophy advocating such a system. As a form of social organization, socialism is based on co-operative social relations and self-management; relatively equal power-relations and the reduction or elimination of hierarchy in the management of economic and political affairs.

Socialism - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Socialism invariably falls under the control of government.
In every instance where socialism was the economic system, it was the central government which controlled all business and all wealth.
The Chavez regime in Venezuela is a perfect example.
Chavez was elected by ballot. Then under the law was permitted to nationalize all business in the country.
The regime controls all wealth and commerce. The regime collects keeps the lion's share of wealth then distributes morsels to the people.

I think the only countries where the economy is predominantly socialistic is Venezuela, Cuba, and North Korea and maybe a few African countries. Russia is moving away from state owned enterprise but it is still a significant part of the economy. China seems to be mixed bag that is becoming very capitalist. In the rest of the world, private ownership of business seems to dominate state owned.

many countries moved away from socialism because it was a miserable failure...why don't liberals and leaders like BO realize that and stop moving toward it...?

in any case today socialists are still quite active around the world....and they are influential in the political workings of many countries....just take a look at the members of Socialist International.....
http://www.socialistinternational.org/viewArticle.cfm?ArticlePageID=931

SI logo

Canada, for example, has socialists represented by the New Democrat Party...

 

[Flopper]

Socialism invariably falls under the control of government.
In every instance where socialism was the economic system, it was the central government which controlled all business and all wealth.
The Chavez regime in Venezuela is a perfect example.
Chavez was elected by ballot. Then under the law was permitted to nationalize all business in the country.
The regime controls all wealth and commerce. The regime collects keeps the lion's share of wealth then distributes morsels to the people.

I think the only countries where the economy is predominantly socialistic is Venezuela, Cuba, and North Korea and maybe a few African countries. Russia is moving away from state owned enterprise but it is still a significant part of the economy. China seems to be mixed bag that is becoming very capitalist. In the rest of the world, private ownership of business seems to dominate state owned.

many countries moved away from socialism because it was a miserable failure...why don't liberals and leaders like BO realize that and stop moving toward it...?

in any case today socialists are still quite active around the world....and they are influential in the political workings of many countries....just take a look at the members of Socialist International.....
Socialist International - Progressive Politics For A Fairer World

SI logo

Canada, for example, has socialists represented by the New Democrat Party...

The mistake these countries made is not regulation of free enterprise but rather ownership and operation.

As long as capitalism is providing a solution to our problems, people will reject a government solutions. I have no doubt that the vast majority of people in this country see government solutions to problems as expensive and inefficient. However, when private enterprise does not provide what people want they look to government for a solution. For example:

Before government regulated banks, most people were reluctant to trust banks with their savings. They might put a bit of money in a bank, spread it around to different, banks, or just bury it in the backyard. I know my great grandmother had money buried in the backyard and hidden around the house. Banking regulations that established reserve requirements, bank audits, inspections, and finality the Federal Depositor's Insurance convinced America that banks were safe. This resulted in a huge increase in deposits over the years. The banking industry benefited as much as the public.

Prior to government regulation of Wall Street, buying stocks and bonds was at best a speculation best left to those with money and connections. Boiler room operations, insider trading, bear runs, churning, pooling, and roomer mills were a major driving force behind the market. Businesses that turned to Wall Street for capital would often loose control of their business. Small investors without inside information were likely to loose their shirt. The Securities Exchange Act and the investment acts that followed brought regulation. Insider trading was made illegal. Full disclosure was required. All new public stock and bond offerings had to be made by prospectus and most activities designed to deceive investors were made illegal. In the 1940’s and 50’s, the public began to see the stock market as a safe place to invest. Small investors started entering the market and soon became the lifeblood of the market.

In the late 1950’s seat beats started to appear in foreign cars. Legislation that required auto manufactures to provide seat belts and later other safety devices lead to bitter fights in congress with automakers condemning the legislation as not just socialist but a communist plot that would lead to more government intrusion that would destroy the industry. Automakers warned that the public would rebel at having to pay more money for this unwanted safety device. Today safety is one of the major concerns of car buyers. Safety devices are estimated to have increase auto manufacture’s revenue by as much as 20% and saved over 100,000 lives; not bad for a communist inspired plot.

 

[editec]

Socialism is the political refutation of the theory that the theories and outcomes of the system of private property serves the commonweal.

Like capitalism, socialism can be a very flexible system.

Our nation has elements of both socialistic and capitalistic systems in place.

Our military is, for one example, a socialistic policy.

 

[Sallow]

That does give it all more sense, for sure.

The US military is a prime example of Socialism. So is TARP. And government contracts.

Yes they are. So?

Well..it seems you hate socialism..right?

So you'd like to see an end to the US military as it exists and government contracts.

It's a little extreme..but one has to admire your principles.

 

[bripat9643]

Socialism is the political refutation of the theory that the theories and outcomes of the system of private property serves the commonweal.

Like capitalism, socialism can be a very flexible system.

Our nation has elements of both socialistic and capitalistic systems in place.

Our military is, for one example, a socialistic policy.

Socialism is a lie, a colossal swindle, a scam.

Anyone who defends socialism is the enemy of society.

 

[bripat9643]

Well..it seems you hate socialism..right?

So you'd like to see an end to the US military as it exists and government contracts.

It's a little extreme..but one has to admire your principles.

There are some situations where we have no other choice than resorting to socialism, but that doesn't make socialism good. Whey your appendix bursts, doctors have to perform surgery. That doesn't make surgery something you should do every day.

 

[Sallow]

Well..it seems you hate socialism..right?

So you'd like to see an end to the US military as it exists and government contracts.

It's a little extreme..but one has to admire your principles.

There are some situations where we have no other choice than resorting to socialism, but that doesn't make socialism good. Whey your appendix bursts, doctors have to perform surgery. That doesn't make surgery something you should do every day.

Oh..so you like Socialism that's used to kill people..like the military..but hate it when it's used to help people..like Medicare.

This is just what I thought. And it's at the Core of Conservatism.

 

[Steelplate]

many countries moved away from socialism because it was a miserable failure...why don't liberals and leaders like BO realize that and stop moving toward it...?

in any case today socialists are still quite active around the world....and they are influential in the political workings of many countries....just take a look at the members of Socialist International.....
Socialist International - Progressive Politics For A Fairer World

SI logo

Canada, for example, has socialists represented by the New Democrat Party...

What you aren't getting is that almost every one of our global competitors have Socialist properties that we do not... which gives their corporations and manufacturing sector a distinct advantage over us. In almost every one of those countries they have Health Care provided. That's a huge advantage if Private Businesses don't have to supply their employees with Health Care Coverage. Sure... they Collectively pay for it in taxes... but the working people do too.

Europe has Health Care... Education... and a guaranteed retirement.... all paid for by taxpayer dollars. Sure, there are a few countries in Europe Struggling. But most are thriving. What the European Union has to do... if they want a real union... is to work with Greece and Ireland to boost their abilities to produce.

Personally... I am not sold on Capitalism OR Socialism. I prefer a Hybrid system of the two. Where one side provides the checks and balances for the other. Which is kind of what we have. The only problem is that monied interests have swung the pendulum way to the right. Obama ran on a platform that would try to correct that and bring it back into the middle. But the money people of our country already had so much power, influence and Politicians in their pocket that it was impossible to happen...so instead, we have gotten half measures that aren't good for anyone.

I blame Obama, I blame the scatterbrained ideology of my own party... and I also blame the Corporatist Republican Party and their Pit Bull subspecies, the Tea Party. The saddest thing is that the Tea Party are just too damned dumb to realize they are being manipulated by those at the top that do not want the money train to slow down.

 

[bripat9643]

Oh..so you like Socialism that's used to kill people..like the military..but hate it when it's used to help people..like Medicare.

This is just what I thought. And it's at the Core of Conservatism.

ROFL! Are you saying you think we shouldn't have a military? On the other hand, if you think we should have a military, that means you want to kill people?

Which is it: do you want to abolish the military, or do you want to kill people?

Medicare doesn't help people. When you total the costs, they don't equal the benefits. That's always the case with government programs (i.e., socialism)