Should hospitals be free to dump penniless emergencies.

[xsited1]

NO, sbsolutely NOT....any emergency must be treated immediately by the hospital, with no concern or thought on whether you have insurance or can pay for it.

not to do such hurts all of our medical treatment and care....i want NO DOCTOR OR HOSPITAL to wait till my husband can get there with my insurance card when my leg has been severed!

it is also INHUMANE to require money to save ones life in an emergency! SHAME ON all of you that said YES! the supposed religious ones saying yes, is mind boggling!

As long as we can send you the bill, I have no problem with it.

 

[Centrism'sVoice]

I think what is being forgotten here is that hospitals are a business. The doctors, nurses and all the diagnostic machines down to the cafeteria are all run on a profit. Without that profit, they would not exist. Even the emergency staff and the machines are costing the hospital staff a lot of money. How do you propose all of that is to be paid for? It just doesn't fall out of the heavens. Yes, we American tax payers are paying for it. Aren't you angered that the illegal aliens from Mexico are sucking off our taxpayer money for care in the emergency room, and that you must wait for hours to receive emergency care while waiting in the emergency room because of these leeches? I am.....

Well, the triage people can always ask the patients who look Latino if they're here legally, and shoot them if they can't answer yes in English. That seem fair enough for you?

Yes, because the only other option is to shoot them.
For somebody that claims to be centrist, how come your only other alternative is an extreme?
I grow weary of people like you that only want to insinuate that other people's post's come from an extreme perspective when it is you that is the extremist.

So, if you don't want to risk having taxpayer money fund the emergency treatment of some illegal immigrant, how do YOU propose to accomplish it? I haven't seen any other answer.

 

[KittenKoder]

More Wicrapedia? Damn, people will type anything won't they.

So if its such crap, please specify exactly what information that was posted was false.

Otherwise shut the **** up, and avoid the constant ad hominems, eh?

You only agree with Wicrapedia when it's something you like. I always call it Wicrapedia because that's what it is.

 

[KittenKoder]

NO, sbsolutely NOT....any emergency must be treated immediately by the hospital, with no concern or thought on whether you have insurance or can pay for it.

not to do such hurts all of our medical treatment and care....i want NO DOCTOR OR HOSPITAL to wait till my husband can get there with my insurance card when my leg has been severed!

it is also INHUMANE to require money to save ones life in an emergency! SHAME ON all of you that said YES! the supposed religious ones saying yes, is mind boggling!

As long as we can send you the bill, I have no problem with it.

Not until after they finish paying mine.

 

[alan1]

Well, the triage people can always ask the patients who look Latino if they're here legally, and shoot them if they can't answer yes in English. That seem fair enough for you?

Yes, because the only other option is to shoot them.
For somebody that claims to be centrist, how come your only other alternative is an extreme?
I grow weary of people like you that only want to insinuate that other people's post's come from an extreme perspective when it is you that is the extremist.

So, if you don't want to risk having taxpayer money fund the emergency treatment of some illegal immigrant, how do YOU propose to accomplish it? I haven't seen any other answer.

And nobody said anything about shooting them either (except for you). You are going to make a stupid statement like that, then expect reasonable debate? If you really wanted to debate, you wouldn't be so intellectually dishonest.

 

[Emma]

Fact is hospitals DONT and WONT do what your suggesting. Anyone who enters an ER in this country is treated. Even immigrants! But this is a problem now that you mention it. Clearly, the problem is worsening, which proves a lack of success on the part of government intervention and the EMTALA.

Centrism, I consider myself a libertarian, in part, and your judgement is incorrect in regards to my position on this issue.

First of all, you did not answer my first question. Should hospitals be free to dump penniless emergencies?

Second of all, if hospitals don't technically dump emergency patients then they come close to it.

L.A. Hospitals Dumps Paraplegic Patient in Street Gutter

A Los Angeles hospital is being sued by a mentally ill paraplegic man who claims that he was dumped in a gutter and abandoned by hospital employees after being discharged.

Approximately 50 cases were reported in 2007 of homeless, sick or mentally confused patients being dropped off by ambulances in the 50-block area known as Skid Row, where an estimated 12,000 homeless people are believed to live and sleep.

In response to the lawsuit, Hollywood Presbyterian announced that it had conducted a thorough review of its patient discharge policies to make sure that such dumping would not occur in the future. The hospital said that it hopes to reach an out-of-court settlement.

Kaiser Faces Charges for Dumping Homeless Patient : NPR

The Los Angeles city attorney's office has filed criminal charges against hospital giant Kaiser Permanente for endangering a former patient. The charges allege Kaiser dumped a homeless patient on the city's downtown Skid Row.

Cops: Another Hospital Dumps Patient On Skid Row - cbs2.com

A man in his 70s who was wearing a hospital gown, pants and an identification bracelet was dropped off in front of the Los Angeles Mission Wednesday in what police described as another case of Skid Row "patient dumping."

"The man could barely walk, and he told me that he was still very sick and needed medical attention," said Los Angeles police Officer Deon Joseph. "What we have here is a classic case of patient dumping, where a person who can't defend or care for himself was left alone in Skid Row. It's a disgusting situation."

Now, are you going to answer my question or not?

That is a different issue than what EMTALA addresses.

There are homeless people who refuse placement and/or offers of living arrangements and demand to be discharged back to the street. For a hospital to refuse to do so would be false imprisonment and is illegal. In fact if a patient decides they're going to leave, unless they are under court-ordered guardianship of the state, we can't prevent them from going no matter what their medical condition or where they eventually end up after discharge.

Also, should a hospital be forced to keep a patient who refuses to leave upon discharge?

Ever heard of Sarah Nome?

Woman refuses to leave the hospital - Health care- msnbc.com

Former stubborn Kaiser patient Sarah Nome's home to be auctioned - Marin Independent Journal

 

[Chris]

Should hospitals be free to dump penniless emergencies.

Yes. And whoever passed a law stating otherwise should be required to pay for their care.

The cruelty of the right in a nutshell.

 

[Nik]

More Wicrapedia? Damn, people will type anything won't they.

So if its such crap, please specify exactly what information that was posted was false.

Otherwise shut the **** up, and avoid the constant ad hominems, eh?

You only agree with Wicrapedia when it's something you like. I always call it Wicrapedia because that's what it is.

Really?

Please cite where I've ever said that Wikipedia isn't reliable because I didn't like what it said. Or are you just lying again?

 

[Harry Dresden]

First of all, you did not answer my first question. Should hospitals be free to dump penniless emergencies?

Second of all, if hospitals don't technically dump emergency patients then they come close to it.

L.A. Hospitals Dumps Paraplegic Patient in Street Gutter

A Los Angeles hospital is being sued by a mentally ill paraplegic man who claims that he was dumped in a gutter and abandoned by hospital employees after being discharged.

Approximately 50 cases were reported in 2007 of homeless, sick or mentally confused patients being dropped off by ambulances in the 50-block area known as Skid Row, where an estimated 12,000 homeless people are believed to live and sleep.

In response to the lawsuit, Hollywood Presbyterian announced that it had conducted a thorough review of its patient discharge policies to make sure that such dumping would not occur in the future. The hospital said that it hopes to reach an out-of-court settlement.

Kaiser Faces Charges for Dumping Homeless Patient : NPR

The Los Angeles city attorney's office has filed criminal charges against hospital giant Kaiser Permanente for endangering a former patient. The charges allege Kaiser dumped a homeless patient on the city's downtown Skid Row.

Cops: Another Hospital Dumps Patient On Skid Row - cbs2.com

A man in his 70s who was wearing a hospital gown, pants and an identification bracelet was dropped off in front of the Los Angeles Mission Wednesday in what police described as another case of Skid Row "patient dumping."

"The man could barely walk, and he told me that he was still very sick and needed medical attention," said Los Angeles police Officer Deon Joseph. "What we have here is a classic case of patient dumping, where a person who can't defend or care for himself was left alone in Skid Row. It's a disgusting situation."

Now, are you going to answer my question or not?

LA Hospitals have done that every now and then.....lowlife practice by some shitty people who have no business being in the healthcare business....

 

[xotoxi]

I was surprised that there was so much hemming and hawing and ducking and dodging such a straight forward question: Should hospitals be free to dump penniless emergency patients?

I think what is being forgotten here is that hospitals are a business. The doctors, nurses and all the diagnostic machines down to the cafeteria are all run on a profit. Without that profit, they would not exist. Even the emergency staff and the machines are costing the hospital staff a lot of money. How do you propose all of that is to be paid for? It just doesn't fall out of the heavens. Yes, we American tax payers are paying for it. Aren't you angered that the illegal aliens from Mexico are sucking off our taxpayer money for care in the emergency room, and that you must wait for hours to receive emergency care while waiting in the emergency room because of these leeches? I am.....

Well, the triage people can always ask the patients who look Latino if they're here legally, and shoot them if they can't answer yes in English. That seem fair enough for you?

Why shoot them? That's messy and loud.

Instead, just strap them down with leather restraints and push a bolus of potassium. Then wheel them directly to the morgue.

 

[Centrism'sVoice]

And nobody said anything about shooting them either (except for you). You are going to make a stupid statement like that, then expect reasonable debate? If you really wanted to debate, you wouldn't be so intellectually dishonest.

Sarcasm is lost on you, isn't it? Ask Xotoxi; he got it.

 

[auditor0007]

NO, sbsolutely NOT....any emergency must be treated immediately by the hospital, with no concern or thought on whether you have insurance or can pay for it.

not to do such hurts all of our medical treatment and care....i want NO DOCTOR OR HOSPITAL to wait till my husband can get there with my insurance card when my leg has been severed!

it is also INHUMANE to require money to save ones life in an emergency! SHAME ON all of you that said YES! the supposed religious ones saying yes, is mind boggling!

I was surprised that there was so much hemming and hawing and ducking and dodging such a straight forward question: Should hospitals be free to dump penniless emergency patients?

I think what is being forgotten here is that hospitals are a business. The doctors, nurses and all the diagnostic machines down to the cafeteria are all run on a profit. Without that profit, they would not exist. Even the emergency staff and the machines are costing the hospital staff a lot of money. How do you propose all of that is to be paid for? It just doesn't fall out of the heavens. Yes, we American tax payers are paying for it. Aren't you angered that the illegal aliens from Mexico are sucking off our taxpayer money for care in the emergency room, and that you must wait for hours to receive emergency care while waiting in the emergency room because of these leeches? I am.....

It seems to me that we should treat these illegals, but require proof of citizenship or residency before releasing them. If they are illegal, then they could be deported immediately after receiving their emergency care.

 

[Chris]

I was surprised that there was so much hemming and hawing and ducking and dodging such a straight forward question: Should hospitals be free to dump penniless emergency patients?

I think what is being forgotten here is that hospitals are a business. The doctors, nurses and all the diagnostic machines down to the cafeteria are all run on a profit. Without that profit, they would not exist. Even the emergency staff and the machines are costing the hospital staff a lot of money. How do you propose all of that is to be paid for? It just doesn't fall out of the heavens. Yes, we American tax payers are paying for it. Aren't you angered that the illegal aliens from Mexico are sucking off our taxpayer money for care in the emergency room, and that you must wait for hours to receive emergency care while waiting in the emergency room because of these leeches? I am.....

It seems to me that we should treat these illegals, but require proof of citizenship or residency before releasing them. If they are illegal, then they could be deported immediately after receiving their emergency care.

Interesting idea.

The problem is there are 11 million illegals in America. We literally don't have the resources to deport them all. And the do all the dirty and dangerous jobs Americans won't do, so they do contribute to the economy.

 

[auditor0007]

I think what is being forgotten here is that hospitals are a business. The doctors, nurses and all the diagnostic machines down to the cafeteria are all run on a profit. Without that profit, they would not exist. Even the emergency staff and the machines are costing the hospital staff a lot of money. How do you propose all of that is to be paid for? It just doesn't fall out of the heavens. Yes, we American tax payers are paying for it. Aren't you angered that the illegal aliens from Mexico are sucking off our taxpayer money for care in the emergency room, and that you must wait for hours to receive emergency care while waiting in the emergency room because of these leeches? I am.....

It seems to me that we should treat these illegals, but require proof of citizenship or residency before releasing them. If they are illegal, then they could be deported immediately after receiving their emergency care.

Interesting idea.

The problem is there are 11 million illegals in America. We literally don't have the resources to deport them all. And the do all the dirty and dangerous jobs Americans won't do, so they do contribute to the economy.

Yes they do contribute to the economy. But the fact is that they are eating up more in taxpayer dollars than they are contributing, and this seems to be by a fairly wide margin. Deporting them after giving them medical care really wouldn't be that difficult, and it wouldn't mean deporting 11 million of them at once. With such a policy, at least they'd stop going to the emergency room for every little cut they got. Most would be smart enough to find a doctor or clinic to go to and would only use the emergency room when it really was an emergency. Just an idea anyway. Emergency room treatment of non-emergency patients is just one issue that needs to be dealt with.

 

[Chris]

It seems to me that we should treat these illegals, but require proof of citizenship or residency before releasing them. If they are illegal, then they could be deported immediately after receiving their emergency care.

Interesting idea.

The problem is there are 11 million illegals in America. We literally don't have the resources to deport them all. And the do all the dirty and dangerous jobs Americans won't do, so they do contribute to the economy.

Yes they do contribute to the economy. But the fact is that they are eating up more in taxpayer dollars than they are contributing, and this seems to be by a fairly wide margin. Deporting them after giving them medical care really wouldn't be that difficult, and it wouldn't mean deporting 11 million of them at once. With such a policy, at least they'd stop going to the emergency room for every little cut they got. Most would be smart enough to find a doctor or clinic to go to and would only use the emergency room when it really was an emergency. Just an idea anyway. Emergency room treatment of non-emergency patients is just one issue that needs to be dealt with.

Sorry, they are not eating up more tax dollars than they contribute. They contribute a lot.

And when you get down to it, we are all illegal immigrants except for the Native Americans.

 

[Nik]

It seems to me that we should treat these illegals, but require proof of citizenship or residency before releasing them. If they are illegal, then they could be deported immediately after receiving their emergency care.

Interesting idea.

The problem is there are 11 million illegals in America. We literally don't have the resources to deport them all. And the do all the dirty and dangerous jobs Americans won't do, so they do contribute to the economy.

Yes they do contribute to the economy. But the fact is that they are eating up more in taxpayer dollars than they are contributing, and this seems to be by a fairly wide margin. Deporting them after giving them medical care really wouldn't be that difficult, and it wouldn't mean deporting 11 million of them at once. With such a policy, at least they'd stop going to the emergency room for every little cut they got. Most would be smart enough to find a doctor or clinic to go to and would only use the emergency room when it really was an emergency. Just an idea anyway. Emergency room treatment of non-emergency patients is just one issue that needs to be dealt with.

Its a fact that they eat up more in taxpayer dollars than they contribute? Really? Can you point to links that prove that "fact"?

 

[Harry Dresden]

Sorry, they are not eating up more tax dollars than they contribute. They contribute a lot.

And when you get down to it, we are all illegal immigrants except for the Native Americans.

get them to start paying taxes on the money they earn....THEN they are adding to the pot they take from....

 

[editec]

Sorry, they are not eating up more tax dollars than they contribute. They contribute a lot.

And when you get down to it, we are all illegal immigrants except for the Native Americans.

get them to start paying taxes on the money they earn....THEN they are adding to the pot they take from....

I suspect a LOT of them do.

The exceptions will be those ad hoc jobs that they pick up as homeowers and fly-by-night contractors hire them on the cheap.

I want the illegals out, too.

But I suspect that most of them who work at legitimate businesses pay taxes, just like most of us do.

 

[chanel]

Interesting idea.

The problem is there are 11 million illegals in America. We literally don't have the resources to deport them all. And the do all the dirty and dangerous jobs Americans won't do, so they do contribute to the economy.

Yes they do contribute to the economy. But the fact is that they are eating up more in taxpayer dollars than they are contributing, and this seems to be by a fairly wide margin. Deporting them after giving them medical care really wouldn't be that difficult, and it wouldn't mean deporting 11 million of them at once. With such a policy, at least they'd stop going to the emergency room for every little cut they got. Most would be smart enough to find a doctor or clinic to go to and would only use the emergency room when it really was an emergency. Just an idea anyway. Emergency room treatment of non-emergency patients is just one issue that needs to be dealt with.

Sorry, they are not eating up more tax dollars than they contribute. They contribute a lot.

And when you get down to it, we are all illegal immigrants except for the Native Americans.

My grandparents came from Europe - LEGALLY, as I suspect most of ours did.

 

[Gudrid]

Sorry, they are not eating up more tax dollars than they contribute. They contribute a lot.

And when you get down to it, we are all illegal immigrants except for the Native Americans.

get them to start paying taxes on the money they earn....THEN they are adding to the pot they take from....

They pay sales taxes, among other things. I agree with the basic premise; however, I think there should be a system in place for granting asylum. Some of those illegal aliens are people who are here to take advantage of the system; others, however, came over under the understanding they were doing so legally, only to end up slaves in a sex house. Or were running from a tyrannical government. Those sorts of people should be put on the road to citizenship, in my opinion. But the ones who are here to make money off our economy and then go home - deport them if ya find them. Including if you find them in a hospital emergency room. But treat them first.